Loan Window

[USABlue]

54 minutes ago, Mark45 said:

Why Tony now have 9m Euros budget ? Venky have taken money but never given for players in past ?

Why snap decision now?

 

IMHO someone has sold Venkies on the Forest lad being a sure thing triple your money sort of player.

[OJRovers]

Re: Chapman

Given that we haven't signed any proper wingers yet and the window shuts in 9 days, i'd definitely take him on loan, even with his injury issues. He would be a great option off the bench as an impact sub. We haven't got a pacey winger in the squad and I can't see Mowbray magically finding someone else who would fit the bill.

[AllRoverAsia]

8 minutes ago, USABlue said:

Mischief making?

Perhaps, I had thought HITC a site run by Agents to sell their wares until they belittled Brereton and us, cheeky buggers!

[gumboots]

7 minutes ago, Biz said:

@JHRover -  at least I got my answer. Being so obsessed with the Rao’s necessity to be “liked” when the reality is they probably don’t give two shiny shits about what you or I think, astounds me. After all this time. 

You see Mowbrays words as a con job. I see it as an ambitious manager trying to put an exciting team together. The point you’re lacking, he’s already achieved 3 quarters of it in most people’s eyes, yet you’d seemingly mistrust and hold every wish, like and “expectation” to account.

 

I don't think it's Mowbray trying to con us. I think he'd like 3 or 4 at least and expects those who deals with contracts and finances to get it sorted. He knows we need at least a couple more to cover potential injuries where a make do player won't be good enough, even for a couple of matches. 

Where the more sceptical among us differ from some other posters is that we don't necessarily trust Cheston the money man to get deals done, or our owners not to have put limitations on the budget like how much they'll put in now so therefore how much we can offer up front. Waggott I don't know about so I'll reserve judgement totally on him, but I  do know the history with Cheston and Venkys of not getting doable deals done. 

[JHRover]

 

3 minutes ago, Biz said:

@JHRover -  at least I got my answer. Being so obsessed with the Rao’s necessity to be “liked” when the reality is they probably don’t give two shiny shits about what you or I think, astounds me. After all this time. 

You see Mowbrays words as a con job. I see it as an ambitious manager trying to put an exciting team together. The point you’re lacking, he’s already achieved 3 quarters of it in most people’s eyes, yet you’d seemingly mistrust and hold every wish, like and “expectation” to account.

 

I don't think ive gone as far as to suggest it is coming from the Rao's necessity to be 'liked'. I agree they couldn't care less about any of it. I'm not going as far as to suggest this is some elaborate ploy from them to win fans over. I also believe there is some money available (though not at the levels reported).

But it doesn't do anyone any harm to tell people we've got a good budget thanks to the owners generosity even if it doesn't get us anywhere. We've heard all that talk since the day they arrived - supposedly billionaires who will pay whatever the club needs - 100 companies - never refuse to write a cheque - shame about FFP as without it they'd have spent more - then once FFP is lifted there's money there to spend yet we've not spent it etc. Its a running theme.

But once again - none of it actually matters if we cannot get deals over the line

Whether we've £1 million or £10 million is irrelevant if we cannot get the number and calibre of players in that are needed, that the manager expects or wants.

I don't see Mowbray's words as a con job. I've taken his words at face value - which is the exact reason I am concerned as to why we're so far short of what he said. I've no doubt he's ambitious and trying to put an exciting team together. I've no doubt he's working very hard behind the scenes.

There are other components to a transfer than what Mowbray wants - the owners, their advisor, Cheston, Waggott - all sorts of reasons that don't involve Mowbray leading us a merry dance. They might well have a big chunk of cash available to buy players but if we're unable or unwilling to pay the rate on wages or other fees then again, it won't get us what we need.

[AllRoverAsia]

2 minutes ago, OJRovers said:

Re: Chapman

Given that we haven't signed any proper wingers yet and the window shuts in 9 days, i'd definitely take him on loan, even with his injury issues. He would be a great option off the bench as an impact sub. We haven't got a pacey winger in the squad and I can't see Mowbray magically finding someone else who would fit the bill.

At the right fee, I do agree

I'm a poet, just didn't know it. 

[AllRoverAsia]

4 minutes ago, JHRover said:

 

I don't think ive gone as far as to suggest it is coming from the Rao's necessity to be 'liked'. I agree they couldn't care less about any of it. I'm not going as far as to suggest this is some elaborate ploy from them to win fans over. I also believe there is some money available (though not at the levels reported).

But it doesn't do anyone any harm to tell people we've got a good budget thanks to the owners generosity even if it doesn't get us anywhere. We've heard all that talk since the day they arrived - supposedly billionaires who will pay whatever the club needs - 100 companies - never refuse to write a cheque - shame about FFP as without it they'd have spent more - then once FFP is lifted there's money there to spend yet we've not spent it etc. Its a running theme.

But once again - none of it actually matters if we cannot get deals over the line

Whether we've £1 million or £10 million is irrelevant if we cannot get the number and calibre of players in that are needed, that the manager expects or wants.

I don't see Mowbray's words as a con job. I've taken his words at face value - which is the exact reason I am concerned as to why we're so far short of what he said. I've no doubt he's ambitious and trying to put an exciting team together. I've no doubt he's working very hard behind the scenes.

There are other components to a transfer than what Mowbray wants - the owners, their advisor, Cheston, Waggott - all sorts of reasons that don't involve Mowbray leading us a merry dance. They might well have a big chunk of cash available to buy players but if we're unable or unwilling to pay the rate on wages or other fees then again, it won't get us what we need.

If we have bid £8 milllion for Brereton then surely his Agent wants wages at a level that would be out of synch with our aim of a 'happy' dressing room. Money is after all the root of all evil.

Have terms even been discussed by Rovers with this player?

[Hi Mack]

21 minutes ago, USABlue said:

Mischief making?

Nothing but......verging on fraud ?

[Bigdoggsteel]

11 minutes ago, OJRovers said:

Re: Chapman

Given that we haven't signed any proper wingers yet and the window shuts in 9 days, i'd definitely take him on loan, even with his injury issues. He would be a great option off the bench as an impact sub. We haven't got a pacey winger in the squad and I can't see Mowbray magically finding someone else who would fit the bill.

He is injured again, his 3rd in less than a year. I would be very cautious about signing him now at this stage. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

10 minutes ago, gumboots said:

I don't think it's Mowbray trying to con us. I think he'd like 3 or 4 at least and expects those who deals with contracts and finances to get it sorted. He knows we need at least a couple more to cover potential injuries where a make do player won't be good enough, even for a couple of matches. 

Where the more sceptical among us differ from some other posters is that we don't necessarily trust Cheston the money man to get deals done, or our owners not to have put limitations on the budget like how much they'll put in now so therefore how much we can offer up front. Waggott I don't know about so I'll reserve judgement totally on him, but I  do know the history with Cheston and Venkys of not getting doable deals done. 

Is Cheston the main transfer negotiator or how does it work? 

[islander200]

16 minutes ago, USABlue said:

IMHO someone has sold Venkies on the Forest lad being a sure thing triple your money sort of player.

Yeah Mowbray.

I don't believe Mowbray is the sort to have a player forced on him.

[islander200]

3 minutes ago, AllRoverAsia said:

If we have bid £8 milllion for Brereton then surely his Agent wants wages at a level that would be out of synch with our aim of a 'happy' dressing room. Money is after all the root of all evil.

Have terms even been discussed by Rovers with this player?

I don't think Brereton or his Agent are in any position to demand large wages. 

I take yours and others points that if he comes in for the price being reported then it looks unlikely that he wouldn't be amongst our higher wages.

But in this instance the player or Brereton's Agent don't have much bargaining power. What' his alternative, stay at Forest, don't play and watch his value decrease?

He is only 19,pure speculation on my part but I can see him signing for a weekly wage of between 10-15k, heard he was on 5k a week at Forest so will double or triple his pay,possible clauses in his contract that will see his wage rise. 

Sharpe and Nixon both suggest that his wages wouldn't be earth shattering. 

[Leonard Venkhater]

14 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Is Cheston the main transfer negotiator or how does it work? 

Gawd, I hope not!!

[Dreams of 1995]

26 minutes ago, OJRovers said:

Re: Chapman

Given that we haven't signed any proper wingers yet and the window shuts in 9 days, i'd definitely take him on loan, even with his injury issues. He would be a great option off the bench as an impact sub. We haven't got a pacey winger in the squad and I can't see Mowbray magically finding someone else who would fit the bill.

It's a shame about Chapman's injury problems as he's an exciting player. However he's had that many injuries over the past 2 years that I'd avoid him completely. Every injury leaves fresh scar tissue - this leaves him more prone to injury. You might be able to get a good season out of him soon but unfortunately I can't see the lads career being anything but blighted by recurring injuries. Players like Sturridge can attest to that.

He needs a year or so out of football. Serious physiotherapy working on strengthening the leg muscles. In this day and age though you'd probably struggle to find a club willing to give him that and pay him for it.

[gumboots]

Bds I don't know but the manager doesn't deal with finances and so on. Whilst he identifies the targets, talks to them, etc he won't actually do the deal

Edited August 22, 2018 by gumboots

[Lancaster Rover]

I'm sure I read Chapman's current injury is a shoulder injury from impact after landing awkwardly rather than a re-occurrence of his hamstring issues he suffered last season

[deryck guyler's spoon]

[Bigdoggsteel]

8 minutes ago, Leonard Venkhater said:

Gawd, I hope not!!

 

6 minutes ago, gumboots said:

Bds I don't know but the manager doesn't deal with finances and so on. Whilst he identifies the targets, talks to them, etc he won't actually do the deal

Ya, I wonder who does the negotiations for us. Does anybody know? 

[47er]

29 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

He is injured again, his 3rd in less than a year. I would be very cautious about signing him now at this stage. 

But you wouldn't be cautious about spending 8M+ on a 19 year old who doesn't feature in Forest's first team, whom they want to get rid of and who nobody else seems interested in?

Didn't he turn us down when we made the first offer as well?

The only thing that gives me any belief in this deal having a good outcome is Dack. Can't believe we got him for so little. So hats off to TM, may be he'll pull another master stroke.

But not to have doubts about this deal? NO---can't manage that!

[47er]

1 hour ago, AAK said:

Guess would be something to do with this (http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/15289348.Venky_s_launch_Rovers_overview_by_bringing_in_accountancy_giants_KPMG_and_Deloitte/).

Deloitte come in, tell them the only way you are going to make this a profitable business and a success is by putting up a big outlay now and get back to the top flight, and within a season you'll have made all your money back and have some change. Mowbray last summer will have said, I can manage on this budget this season but next season it will need to be more and if we don't manage it we are still brining in young talent who will undoubtedly sell on for a bigger fee ala Dack, Rothwell, Davenport, Brereton, Bell and the likes of academy products Nyambe, Lenihan and Raya.

If we don't go up this season, but manage to have a relatively good season, we will have some very valuable footballers on our books;

And what did the Walker family get for a strong, regular top half Premier League team? And what would they get now?

There is a God!

[perthblue02]

42 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Is Cheston the main transfer negotiator or how does it work? 

Only until he goes on holiday then the magic happens  and the outstanding candidates appear

[Leonard Venkhater]

4 minutes ago, 47er said:

But you wouldn't be cautious about spending 8M+ on a 19 year old who doesn't feature in Forest's first team, whom they want to get rid of and who nobody else seems interested in?

Didn't he turn us down when we made the first offer as well?

The only thing that gives me any belief in this deal having a good outcome is Dack. Can't believe we got him for so little. So hats off to TM, may be he'll pull another master stroke.

But not to have doubts about this deal? NO---can't manage that!

I am the man, Thomas lol

[perthblue02]

6 minutes ago, 47er said:

 

Didn't he turn us down when we made the first offer as well?

The official line was he did not know he was being sold and wanted time to think about it, makes sense when Forest instructed an agent to sound out clubs.

[47er]

1 hour ago, JHRover said:

 

Not sure whether it is correct that I am constantly trying to find some sort of cock up or conspiracy or that our activity to date suggests that there is. I'm only going off what the manager has said compared to what has happened and now what appears to be a slow shift in his comments in the press.

 

 

No.it isn't correct, its another Biz invention!

Good post, keep it up!

[47er]

1 minute ago, Leonard Venkhater said:

I am the man, Thomas lol

The doubting or the peeping?!!