Loan Window

[47er]

Didn't TM state that he wanted another keeper to keep Raya on his toes? What happened to that?

[Torgeir]

30 minutes ago, ben_the_beast said:

I think the Rodwell signing may have freed up a little cash set aside for Bauer. Might help us to get one or two of the cash buys over the line 

How so?

[islander200]

Seen on Twitter that Jim white said on talkshite that Rovers willing to pay up to 14million for Brereton and a deal will be done next week.14 million yeah right, how can they come out with that crap.

Nixon said we are still working on it but nothing near those numbers 

[Valois]

31 minutes ago, islander200 said:

My point with Reed was if we are struggling to get that one over the line which should be a pretty straight forward deal to do then I'm losing hope in us getting the attacking additions that are badly needed in.

Not sure what's happening with Brereton 

These things can get held up for all kinds of reasons. Fully expect the reed deal to be announced on Monday or Tuesday. 

As for attacking additions, who knows where we are with that. 

 

[Red]

Hey guys, not sure how you receive opposition fans, so could be my first and last post... 

I'm a Forest fan.  Just came along to see your thoughts on Ben Brereton.

 

Allegedly Jim Whyte of SSN has said today on TalkSport you're now willing to pay up to £14m for Brereton and are confident of it being done this week.

So thought i'd give you my thoughts on BB.

 

He's a very mature player for 19yrs.  He's a strong lad, he is a very willing runner and his movement gives centre-backs a tough time.  He is much better centrally than out wide (can also play wide in a 3) where he moves into channels to win balls and drags players out of position.  He is not afraid to go up against defenders and can beat them when facing them up.  He is also very good at picking the ball up a bit deeper and driving at defenders, cutting inside/outside and going past them.  His movement finds him in good positions to score. He's not particularly fast, but the way he likes to run at people means he is usually facing them up so he knocks it by them and goes, he moves as quickly with the ball than without it. In a straight sprint off the ball he's not the quickest. But he loves to run with the ball at defenders.

 

What he needs to develop still.. Is his finishing/composure.  He was our main man the second half of last season and the pressure didn't help him as a then 18yr old. He missed quite a few very good chances where he seemed to lose his composure.  He has previously scored a lot of goals at youth level with calm finishes, but he couldn't really get it together at first team level yet.  He also struggles with his back to goal, he's not mastered his first touch yet with someone up his backside, and it can bounce off him, or he tries to win a lot of free kicks and gets in some trouble for diving.  I think it's just a bit of naivety and if he can learn to not get occupied with a battle with stronger players, he can focus on winning the ball more than beating the man.   

 

In the main, I think most Forest fans would be sad to see him go, because he is a talented young lad who can come off the bench and change the dynamic of a game.  Not sure he's totally ready to be the leading man just yet, as he has some important parts of the game to learn, but he sure has the potential to be a very good no.9 with development.  Not sure he's ever going to be a 20+ goal man, but he can contribute more than just that.  

 

In terms of a fee, we don't sell too cheaply nowadays.  It's been mentioned we won't accept less than £12m.  Which is probably right, wouldn't expect it to be all up front, but if he goes you can expect it to be a deal worth over 8 digits in total, with a sell-on included.   Not sure what your financial situation is, or how true Jim Whyte's £14m rumour is.  But we do currently hold the record for biggest fee between Champ clubs (£15m for Assombalonga to Boro & biggest teen received fee £13m for Burke - that was too cheap too as Fawaz was desperate to recoup a fee all up front).

I think whilst he'd cost quite a bit for what he has done in the game so far, he does have potential and he could be someone who'd be a great foil for Bradley Dack, as he moves defenders around very well when on song, which could earn Dack some more space.

 

Be interesting to see how it all plays out none-the-less ! 

 

 

 

[islander200]

Just now, Valois said:

These things can get held up for all kinds of reasons. Fully expect the reed deal to be announced on Monday or Tuesday. 

As for attacking additions, who knows where we are with that. 

 

It probably will get done but still being told Wednesday night to expect a couple in on Thursday only for just Rodwell to come in doesn't make me rest easy.

The clock is ticking and with the injuries we have suffered we might really need ti get some additions in.

[Lancaster Rover]

Thanks for that, really informative post and makes me think even more that he is potentially the right player at the wrong time. Sounds like someone that would be great to bring on around a stable of quality forwards, unfortunately we're not blessed in that department and whoever we bring will need to hit the ground running and be the leading man. 

[Ricky]

5 minutes ago, Red said:

Hey guys, not sure how you receive opposition fans, so could be my first and last post... 

I'm a Forest fan.  Just came along to see your thoughts on Ben Brereton.

 

Allegedly Jim Whyte of SSN has said today on TalkSport you're now willing to pay up to £14m for Brereton and are confident of it being done this week.

So thought i'd give you my thoughts on BB.

 

He's a very mature player for 19yrs.  He's a strong lad, he is a very willing runner and his movement gives centre-backs a tough time.  He is much better centrally than out wide (can also play wide in a 3) where he moves into channels to win balls and drags players out of position.  He is not afraid to go up against defenders and can beat them when facing them up.  He is also very good at picking the ball up a bit deeper and driving at defenders, cutting inside/outside and going past them.  His movement finds him in good positions to score. He's not particularly fast, but the way he likes to run at people means he is usually facing them up so he knocks it by them and goes, he moves as quickly with the ball than without it. In a straight sprint off the ball he's not the quickest. But he loves to run with the ball at defenders.

 

What he needs to develop still.. Is his finishing/composure.  He was our main man the second half of last season and the pressure didn't help him as a then 18yr old. He missed quite a few very good chances where he seemed to lose his composure.  He has previously scored a lot of goals at youth level with calm finishes, but he couldn't really get it together at first team level yet.  He also struggles with his back to goal, he's not mastered his first touch yet with someone up his backside, and it can bounce off him, or he tries to win a lot of free kicks and gets in some trouble for diving.  I think it's just a bit of naivety and if he can learn to not get occupied with a battle with stronger players, he can focus on winning the ball more than beating the man.   

 

In the main, I think most Forest fans would be sad to see him go, because he is a talented young lad who can come off the bench and change the dynamic of a game.  Not sure he's totally ready to be the leading man just yet, as he has some important parts of the game to learn, but he sure has the potential to be a very good no.9 with development.  Not sure he's ever going to be a 20+ goal man, but he can contribute more than just that.  

 

In terms of a fee, we don't sell too cheaply nowadays.  It's been mentioned we won't accept less than £12m.  Which is probably right, wouldn't expect it to be all up front, but if he goes you can expect it to be a deal worth over 8 digits in total, with a sell-on included.   Not sure what your financial situation is, or how true Jim Whyte's £14m rumour is.  But we do currently hold the record for biggest fee between Champ clubs (£15m for Assombalonga to Boro & biggest teen received fee £13m for Burke - that was too cheap too as Fawaz was desperate to recoup a fee all up front).

I think whilst he'd cost quite a bit for what he has done in the game so far, he does have potential and he could be someone who'd be a great foil for Bradley Dack, as he moves defenders around very well when on song, which could earn Dack some more space.

 

Be interesting to see how it all plays out none-the-less ! 

 

 

 

Opposing fans are always welcome and it’s good to get a view from someone who’s actually seen him play. The fee worries me as I can’t see why he’s not getting on your bench if he’s worth £12m+. I can’t see us paying that for him. Wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a fair bit less but with a big weighting on add ons and sell on. 

[Blue blood]

Not sure we can afford 14 million, and am equally sure that if we could we shouldn't be spending it all on one player!

Let's say the budget is 8 or 9 million, given the cost of the likes of Dack and Rothwell, surely this money would be better spent on improving the whole squad rather than 1 player in 1 position. Very much an all the eggs in one basket.

By my reckoning we need at the very least we need a couple of wide players, a striker and a good right back (as cover and competition). Spread "even" £8 million on those players, say deals of £2 million per place, and you can get some very decent players in and a very competitive looking squad.

[Lancaster Rover]

12 million quid would be criminal, we're getting into the Afobe, Assombalonga territory there, players who have long track records of banging goals in at this level. 

I doubt very much it will get anywhere near that but even so that's a terrifying prospect. If the lad struggled with the pressure of being Forests man up front last season then banging that price tag on in a newly promoted team who need to stay in the division could be crippling.

[Red]

Karanka does rate him.  However he is very big on experience.  We have Grabban as our main man now and then Daryl Murphy on the bench. (bit of contention for the fans after he had a poor send half of the season after an injury and some personal issues).  

Lots would like him to be coming off the bench for us right now, but I don't think he will be in a squad until this matter is over.  He also played in the u19 tournament for England so a break will do him good, he's had a lot of football the past 18 months for a young lad.

Re: The fee.  I agree, it is a lot.  However, English youth international striker, for some reason is costs a premium.  The market is crazy in my opinion.  But as a club, we don't sell our young lads cheaply.  I am not saying for a minute I expect the fee to be anything like £12m up front.  But I am certain it would be 8 figures in total with the appropriate add-ons and a sell-on clause.   We rejected a deal worth up to £12m for Joe Worrall from Burnley last season.  We don't sell our young lads cheaply.  

[Leonard Venkhater]

Just now, Lancaster Rover said:

12 million quid would be criminal, we're getting into the Afobe, Assombalonga territory there, players who have long track records of banging goals in at this level. 

I doubt very much it will get anywhere near that but even so that's a terrifying prospect. If the lad struggled with the pressure of being Forests man up front last season then banging that price tag on in a newly promoted team who need to stay in the division could be crippling.

I agree. I don't believe TM would go for this anyway.

Only one worry-at the back of my mind: what if someone else- outside the local team management structure -has decided to invest in this "asset"?

I seem to remember SK didn't have anything to do with signing Rhodes.

I know we have only got snippets, glimpses and partial analysis of what is going on here, but something doesn't feel right...

[rigger]

17 minutes ago, Red said:

Hey guys, not sure how you receive opposition fans, so could be my first and last post... 

I'm a Forest fan.  Just came along to see your thoughts on Ben Brereton.

 

Allegedly Jim Whyte of SSN has said today on TalkSport you're now willing to pay up to £14m for Brereton and are confident of it being done this week.

So thought i'd give you my thoughts on BB.

 

He's a very mature player for 19yrs.  He's a strong lad, he is a very willing runner and his movement gives centre-backs a tough time.  He is much better centrally than out wide (can also play wide in a 3) where he moves into channels to win balls and drags players out of position.  He is not afraid to go up against defenders and can beat them when facing them up.  He is also very good at picking the ball up a bit deeper and driving at defenders, cutting inside/outside and going past them.  His movement finds him in good positions to score. He's not particularly fast, but the way he likes to run at people means he is usually facing them up so he knocks it by them and goes, he moves as quickly with the ball than without it. In a straight sprint off the ball he's not the quickest. But he loves to run with the ball at defenders.

 

What he needs to develop still.. Is his finishing/composure.  He was our main man the second half of last season and the pressure didn't help him as a then 18yr old. He missed quite a few very good chances where he seemed to lose his composure.  He has previously scored a lot of goals at youth level with calm finishes, but he couldn't really get it together at first team level yet.  He also struggles with his back to goal, he's not mastered his first touch yet with someone up his backside, and it can bounce off him, or he tries to win a lot of free kicks and gets in some trouble for diving.  I think it's just a bit of naivety and if he can learn to not get occupied with a battle with stronger players, he can focus on winning the ball more than beating the man.   

 

In the main, I think most Forest fans would be sad to see him go, because he is a talented young lad who can come off the bench and change the dynamic of a game.  Not sure he's totally ready to be the leading man just yet, as he has some important parts of the game to learn, but he sure has the potential to be a very good no.9 with development.  Not sure he's ever going to be a 20+ goal man, but he can contribute more than just that.  

 

In terms of a fee, we don't sell too cheaply nowadays.  It's been mentioned we won't accept less than £12m.  Which is probably right, wouldn't expect it to be all up front, but if he goes you can expect it to be a deal worth over 8 digits in total, with a sell-on included.   Not sure what your financial situation is, or how true Jim Whyte's £14m rumour is.  But we do currently hold the record for biggest fee between Champ clubs (£15m for Assombalonga to Boro & biggest teen received fee £13m for Burke - that was too cheap too as Fawaz was desperate to recoup a fee all up front).

I think whilst he'd cost quite a bit for what he has done in the game so far, he does have potential and he could be someone who'd be a great foil for Bradley Dack, as he moves defenders around very well when on song, which could earn Dack some more space.

 

Be interesting to see how it all plays out none-the-less ! 

 

 

 

Slightly off at a tangent here, but to let you know when you play us in September the trains from Preston to Blackburn are being run on a very limited service due to industrial action. 

[Red]

Cheers buddy!

[tomphil]

So he needs to develop his composure/finishing....the very things that you want from an expensive striker and the very things that you pay premium money for. 8-12 million is very much premium money for this kid !!!!

We already have Domonic Samuel who you could probably say the exact same things about. There's no getting away from it paying anything over 5/6 million for this lad is genuinely bonkers and straight out of the Venky handbook of football ownership particularly when they are rooting around scrimping and saving on virtually everything else.

Odd times again.

[chaddyrovers]

Rodwell in, but TM says the free agent market isn't one #Rovers are looking to use further https://t.co/IN443j0aey

[LDRover]

25 minutes ago, islander200 said:

Seen on Twitter that Jim white said on talkshite that Rovers willing to pay up to 14million for Brereton and a deal will be done next week.14 million yeah right, how can they come out with that crap.

Nixon said we are still working on it but nothing near those numbers 

Must've got that from Venky's when he 'was coming for them'

[Pedro]

There are still people out there prepared to believe bullshitters Jim White and Alan Nixon? That's why those clowns manage to make a living. 

[Lancaster Rover]

Bugger, I was hoping Yaya Toure and Hatem Ben Arfa would be pitching up at Ewood

[Red]

I can't stand either, particularly Alan Nixon who is a complete moron and can't stand anyone questioning him.  He does get fed info by agents and clubs though, they use him to promote articles/stories that benefit them and in return he gets information. 

 

He even goes as far as pushing potential managers into the media to keep their name relevant and talk clubs/players down as he is aware media perception is king.  But unfortunately, he does get information too as to deals... etc which keeps him relevant. 

[JacknOry]

9 minutes ago, Red said:

Karanka does rate him.  However he is very big on experience.  We have Grabban as our main man now and then Daryl Murphy on the bench. (bit of contention for the fans after he had a poor send half of the season after an injury and some personal issues).  

Lots would like him to be coming off the bench for us right now, but I don't think he will be in a squad until this matter is over.  He also played in the u19 tournament for England so a break will do him good, he's had a lot of football the past 18 months for a young lad.

Re: The fee.  I agree, it is a lot.  However, English youth international striker, for some reason is costs a premium.  The market is crazy in my opinion.  But as a club, we don't sell our young lads cheaply.  I am not saying for a minute I expect the fee to be anything like £12m up front.  But I am certain it would be 8 figures in total with the appropriate add-ons and a sell-on clause.   We rejected a deal worth up to £12m for Joe Worrall from Burnley last season.  We don't sell our young lads cheaply.  

Thanks for the posts, we know very little about him - most of us hadnt even heard of him until deadline day.

This potential signing is causing some debate here for various reasons. Our owners have spent little to nothing in the final two years we were in the Championship - in fact selling up 30 million in talent and not reinvesting which led to the drop. We spent 1.5 million in league 1 and now suddenly we apparently have 8/12/14 million to spend on top of the transfers we have already brought in Armstrong for 1.75, Davenport 500k, Rothwell a few hundred k.

While it sounds great that they are seemingly funding us for some kind of push nearer the better half of the division, many are worried about using such a large chunk of it on an unproven teenager who seems to have a fairly poor goalscoring record - especially when the likes of Bamford went for a similar sum of money despite having banged goals for fun in this division previously.

If what you say that his finishing, hold-up play and composure are his biggest weaknesses, this adds a bit of concern as those are exactly what we need as whoever comes in would be direct competition (and eventual replacement) for Danny Graham who excels at most of those areas of the game. Many have argued that the money would be best spent spread around the squad as we could do with a winger, creative midfielder as well as a striker (or two).

You say young English youth international strikers cost a premium - Adam Armstrong didnt. 

[Red]

The links with yourselves surprised me at first.  I hadn't followed Rovers' fortunes intently but I was aware of issues of financial backing from the Venkys.  Although it looks like you've done some good business recently.

I'm not here to justify fees, because I think they're bonkers.  For some reason potential costs more than experience in todays world, the more untested the higher the cost.  

 

Like you said, Bamford has score plenty at this level and cost £10m, but then we paid £13m for Carvalho from Benfica who has about 40/50 pro games to his name.

 

Likewise, we paid £6m for a player who just scored 20 goals at this level last season (granted he is 30 now) but would demand twice that for a 19yr old with fewer than 10 goals in 50+ appearances.  It's madness.  It's almost a case of if you haven't had time to prove you're not as good as you may be, you have to pay just incase the player might be destined for the top.

 

I've heard of 16yr old kids moving between clubs for 7 figures, but you can buy an experienced and talented player for less that sometimes.  There's no logic to the market.

 

If you buy Brereton, it will be more money that seems logical, don't disagree.  He does have the ability to be a good player at this level already, which is impressive for a 19yr old striker.  He isn't all about goals and he does cause defenders problems and runs into channels all day long.  He has missed quite a few chances, but I guess the hope is he can turn those into goals, because if he did last year, he'd have been an 18yr old striker with 10+ in the Champ and he'd be at a Prem club now.  

 

I guess we'll see in the next week what happens!

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

I'd walk away. He's not the only deal in town.

[DanielMB]

Financially we are at a point in the world of football where youngsters just cost a lot of money. In the Danish league you see established players being sold for less than youngsters. Christian Nørgaard of Brøndby who at 24 have played 130 games for a Top 4 team have this summer been sold to Fiorentina in Serie A. That is for a transfer fee that is significantly smaller than 17 old Victor Jensen who have never played adult football or 18 year old Andreas Poulsen with 11 league games. Clubs are just willing to pay over the odds for young talents.

Edited August 24, 2018 by DanielMB

[Red]

Further to this story, our local reporter (Paul Taylor of the Nottingham Evening Post) has just stated in a live blog that the £6m bid never actually happened and it was Alan Nixon doing his usual business on behalf of agents.  However he said we did reject a bid worth £10m from an unnamed Prem club on deadline day, which was rejected.  He has also gone on to say that Blackburn do have genuine interest, but he does not know how high Rovers are willing to go.