Ben Brereton Diaz

[roversfan99]

Just now, Biz said:

I don’t think it would be far off.

You've also got to take into account the relative “pull” of clubs in regards to recent stature and wage bill. I know some here cannot accept that we aren’t going to be seen by players (and agents) as a favourite to get into the premier league.

Signing a new player on 25k a week when the rest of your key players are on 15/20 will also cost you a dollop in renewals.

Deep

Straight off question. Do you think that the finance used on the Ben Brereton could have been used better in retrospect? Yes or no.

[Ewood Ace]

5 minutes ago, Biz said:

I don’t think it would be far off.

You've also got to take into account the relative “pull” of clubs in regards to recent stature and wage bill. I know some here cannot accept that we aren’t going to be seen by players (and agents) as a favourite to get into the premier league.



Signing a new player on 25k a week when the rest of your key players are on 15/20 will also cost you a dollop in renewals.

Deep



Not far off so at least you acknowledge now that over a 4 year period with wages and transfer fee combined that someone like Celina would have worked out cheaper than Brereton. I would also be surprised if Swansea were giving 25K a week to new signings considering they spent most the summer and winter windows trying to offload high earners.

Edited April 14, 2019 by Ewood Ace

[Stuart]

Just now, Biz said:

Deep

?? 

[AllRoverAsia]

2 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

What car does he drive ? That'll be a clue.

and has he bought a new house recently

[blueboy3333]

 

3 hours ago, Biz said:

 

I’m not wasting more time on this thread talking about assumed figures. Like I said, I don’t think he’s one of the top earners. 

 

It doesn't normally stop you. You wasted months arguing BB didn't cost £7m.  

[Bigdoggsteel]

33 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

It made no sense to prioritise a number 10 considering our best player plays there, but your figures are totally pie in the sky estimates. Swansea have been heavily cost cutting, selling all their assets and leaving Graham Potter with a very modest budget, so I have big doubts that your estimates are correct.

No one is saying that player recruitment is easy, but to suggest that we couldnt have done better with 7m and a competitive wage than signing a striker who has not scored, who has not offered the tiniest bit of competition to our excellent but veteran striker, who has not offered any glimpses of any attributes or talent that can be nurtured and who has looked quite frankly embarrassingly out of his depth every time he has stepped onto the pitch is absolute bullshit, (Im not saying you are suggesting that btw, just a general point)

He is a young lad I get that, but hes not a Championship novice, and many seem insistent on removing any room for him to be criticised. 

My estimate is as good as any and very realistic. Write it off to suit your argument if you want. Swansea have parachute payments so pretty sure they arent broke. Kept most of their squad together. He is on at least 25,000. Most of their squad are on more than that. True or false? 

As for your second and third paragraphs, you are answering somehting I didn't say 

Edited April 14, 2019 by Bigdoggsteel

[JBiz]

23 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

 

No one is saying that player recruitment is easy, but to suggest that we couldnt have done better with 7m and a competitive wage than signing a striker who has not scored, who has not offered the tiniest bit of competition to our excellent but veteran striker, who has not offered any glimpses of any attributes or talent that can be nurtured and who has looked quite frankly embarrassingly out of his depth every time he has stepped onto the pitch is absolute bullshit, (Im not saying you are suggesting that btw, just a general point)

 

First of all nobody is saying that different routes couldn’t have been taken. My own perspective is the criticism of BB and the club on this was premature, and continues to be OTT. There’s room for criticism - but not much of it is warranted/fair imo.

Fantastic example to say he has not shown any potential at all. We both know that is subjective, and from my perspective “bull shit”. If the standard answer is “when?” Just read through the thread, we’ve been at this part of the circle a few times already.

22 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Straight off question. Do you think that the finance used on the Ben Brereton could have been used better in retrospect? Yes or no.

In hindsight I think everyone knows the answer to that question.

The difference of opinion lies upon my reluctance to completely write off a prospect as early as many did in this thread, and to suggest this is an utter distaster of a move, making little sense or potential to be “the worst transfer in 20 years” (or words thereabouts)

Thats not in anyway suggesting there aren’t obvious signs of this being a panic buying, or legs in the young / English / capital investment directive from the board/owners. 

I do also think there are reasonable reasons to see why we’d end up with a punt like Ben, in our scenario - wage, current stature / promotion prospects / his availability et al - whereas many do not.

Many see transfers as cost alone, not wages, taxes, personality, interest in club - so the idea nobody thinks transfer business is simple, is more on brand “Bullshit”

Just now, blueboy3333 said:

 

It doesn't normally stop you. You wasted months arguing BB didn't cost £7m.  

Hence why I said more time. You’re correct that it was a waste of time though,

Almost but not as boring as reading you use this one transfer to pad out every other criticism you post.

Still waiting for you to blame Ben for ticket surcharges and then we’ve a full house  

[blueboy3333]

Just now, Biz said:

 

Hence why I said more time. You’re correct that it was a waste of time though,

Almost but not as boring as reading you use this one transfer to pad out every other criticism you post.

Still waiting for you to blame Ben for ticket surcharges and then we’ve a full house  

It was only a waste of time because you were wrong

Your last sentence is just ridiculous. It's his fault ST's are going up.

[SBlue]

Come on @Biz, we’ve had a couple of good performances and “acceptable” team selections on the trot so it’s understandable that some will have to reach for their other TM beating stick.

Wasn’t surprised to see the BB thread top of the pile today.

We’d probably be playing Champions League if it wasn’t for the Brereton signing.

[blueboy3333]

They've all come out of the Sheffield shadows now we've won a couple ?

[blueboy3333]

Just now, S8 & Blue said:

We’d probably be playing Champions League if it wasn’t for the Brereton signing.

We've no chance with him. 

[SBlue]

Just now, blueboy3333 said:

They've all come out of the Sheffield shadows now we've won a couple ?

Sorry - I’ll continue to keep my head down and try not to ruin the misery.

As you were.

[blueboy3333]

Just now, S8 & Blue said:

Sorry - I’ll continue to keep my head down and try not to ruin the misery.

As you were.

Good man. Come back and join in when we lose at QPR. 

[Ewood Ace]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

My estimate is as good as any and very realistic. Write it off to suit your argument if you want. Swansea have parachute payments so pretty sure they arent broke. Kept most of their squad together. He is in at least 25,000. Most of their squad are on more than that. True or false? 

As for your second and third paragraphs, you are answering somehting I didn't say 

Would be surprised if Swansea were giving a new signing 25K a week considering over both windows this season their priority appears to have been getting big wages of the books even if it meant selling for less than they paid in some cases. The only players who'd I'd think would be on around 25K would be players who played for them in the Premier League the likes of Routledge, Naughton, Dyer, Fer, Olsson and Narsingh (who never plays). Also I'm not sure how you can say they kept most their squad the Ayew's, Bony, Clucas, Fernandez, Fabianski, Ki, Mawson, Carroll have all left along with loans like Abraham, King and Sanches.

[SBlue]

Just now, blueboy3333 said:

Good man. Come back and join in when we lose at QPR. 

Oh I’ve been more than lurking if you hadn’t noticed - but a lot of my posts have been getting removed by mods!

Me? Offensive???

See you then where we can call each other drunken idiots.

 

If we win impressively we can just talk about how the Brereton money could have paid for free coach travel or could sort out the crap fan zone or summat ??

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Ewood Ace said:

Would be surprised if Swansea were giving a new signing 25K a week considering over both windows this season their priority appears to have been getting big wages of the books even if it meant selling for less than they paid in some cases. The only players who'd I'd think would be on around 25K would be players who played for them in the Premier League the likes of Routledge, Naughton, Dyer, Fer, Olsson and Narsingh (who never plays). Also I'm not sure how you can say they kept most their squad the Ayew's, Bony, Clucas, Fernandez, Fabianski, Ki, Mawson, Carroll have all left along with loans like Abraham, King and Sanches.

They are still getting parachute payments and I have heard no mention they are under financial pressure. Sounds like the managers choice about who left. Rhodes was on 40,000 here. He is on 25,000, possibly more, but not far off it either way. 

[Ewood Ace]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

They are still getting parachute payments and I have heard no mention they are under financial pressure. Sounds like the managers choice about who left. Rhodes was on 40,000 here. He is on 25,000, possibly more, but not far off it either way. 



https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/swansea-citys-trevor-birch-appointed-15989333

The Americans' man on the ground, chief operating officer Chris Pearlman, has admitted that finances remain extremely tight.

Pearlman said last month: "We have spoken publicly on a few occasions since relegation about the club’s current financial position. Simply stated, our current contractual commitments are higher than our expected income.

"Relegation has seen our annual income this season drop by approximately £60 million. That is inclusive of the parachute payments we received from the Premier League. Our transfer activity this past summer enabled us to address approximately half of this deficit.

"On top of the decrease in income, the club still owes some transfer fee payment instalments on players we have bought over the past few years.

"Furthermore, our financial position across all transfer windows in the past few years has shown a net loss.

"Fans have every right to be critical about some of the transfer decisions that have added to our financial challenges.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Ewood Ace said:

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/swansea-citys-trevor-birch-appointed-15989333

The Americans' man on the ground, chief operating officer Chris Pearlman, has admitted that finances remain extremely tight.

Pearlman said last month: "We have spoken publicly on a few occasions since relegation about the club’s current financial position. Simply stated, our current contractual commitments are higher than our expected income.

"Relegation has seen our annual income this season drop by approximately £60 million. That is inclusive of the parachute payments we received from the Premier League. Our transfer activity this past summer enabled us to address approximately half of this deficit.

"On top of the decrease in income, the club still owes some transfer fee payment instalments on players we have bought over the past few years.

"Furthermore, our financial position across all transfer windows in the past few years has shown a net loss.

"Fans have every right to be critical about some of the transfer decisions that have added to our financial challenges.

They are arguably being over cautious after relegation. I'm sure their fans agree. You give promotion a good go the first year and then evaluate. Doesn't add up. They didn't spend ludicrous money in the premier league. I would say they were prudent enough. Either way, Celina is on 25,000 a week or therabouts I reckon 

Edited April 14, 2019 by Bigdoggsteel

[AAK]

19 minutes ago, S8 & Blue said:

Sorry - I’ll continue to keep my head down and try not to ruin the misery.

As you were.

Okay Liam.

[Ewood Ace]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

They are arguably being over cautious after relegation. I'm sure their fans agree. You give promotion a good go the first year and then evaluate. Doesn't add up. They didn't spend ludicrous money in the premier league. I would say they were prudent enough. Either way, Celina is on 25,000 a week or therabouts I reckon 

Ah so you know more about Swansea's finances than their Chief Operating Officer.  Swansea spent plenty of money in the Premier League the problem was it was on player who flopped. 

 

[roversfan99]

39 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

My estimate is as good as any and very realistic. Write it off to suit your argument if you want. Swansea have parachute payments so pretty sure they arent broke. Kept most of their squad together. He is on at least 25,000. Most of their squad are on more than that. True or false? 

As for your second and third paragraphs, you are answering somehting I didn't say 

Its not about suiting my argument, I dont think that we should have signed Celina either as he is not in a position we needed. Im saying your estimate is a total guess, but as has been mentioned since they are on a very strict budget.

No I tried to make clear that the last 2 paragraphs werent aimed at you.

 

[Stuart]

The obscene amounts of TV money have created this gulf between the top two divisions and it is ruining football. At the start of the Premier League, it was nowhere near as bad as this but as soon as the money was only shared between the “top” 22 (then 20) teams, the die was cast.

Burnley are looking like the big winners of the last 5-10 years and have played the system perfectly - although stumbling on Dyche was a huge stroke of luck for them.

Clubs relegated with PL infrastructures at the time of the most recent TV deals are the ones hit the hardest. Swansea are a symptom of that effect.

A reluctance to have a breakaway European Super League and/or PL Divisions 1 and 2 have cemented the financial chasm, as more and more teams need promotion to balance the books yet only three per season can get there. Points deductions will start to become more and more normal, some clubs will eventually go under after a couple of relegations and their PL plastic fans scurry off to the next nearest promoted club. The armchair fan, the “neutral” (a term presumably coined by Sky to enable them to sell PL packages containing the usual 10 clubs plus a selection of random Championship level clubs) are ambivalent anyway. So what if a club goes bust?

[Mattyblue]

The Rothwell thread is near the top, because he was very good, again.

The BB thread is up near the top because he was very poor, again.

That’s what happens on a messageboard.

 

 

[Ewood Ace]

9 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

They are arguably being over cautious after relegation. I'm sure their fans agree. You give promotion a good go the first year and then evaluate. Doesn't add up. They didn't spend ludicrous money in the premier league. I would say they were prudent enough. Either way, Celina is on 25,000 a week or therabouts I reckon 

Over the last couple seasons in the premiership they spent around £70 Million just on Bony, Mesa, Baston, Clucas and A.Ayew all of whom were flops. Also that is without mentioning wages numerous reports put Bony being on around 100K a week at Swansea. Clucas was there one season and they made around a £10 Million loss on him, Mesa was their for half a season and they made a £3 Million lose on him. You don't take those sort of loses so readily unless you are desperate for the money.

Edited April 14, 2019 by Ewood Ace

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Ewood Ace said:

Ah so you know more about Swansea's finances than their Chief Operating Officer.  Swansea spent plenty of money in the Premier League the problem was it was on player who flopped. 

 

No, I don't,but it doesn't add up that they are in this much trouble. I would say they are playing the long game and being cautious. Which is probably sensible. Doubt their fans are happy though.