Ben Brereton Diaz

[islander200]

Just now, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

What has any bodies thoughts on Dack got to do with the signing of Brererton ?

I was asking Mercer a question if it doesn't interest you then skip past it?

Fair enough its off topic so il reign it in but pretty obvious i was'nt i wasn't talking about Brererton so no need for your smart arse reply

[Bigdoggsteel]

37 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

Marcus Maddison. 

He didn't move during the summer, so no guarantee we would have got him for 2 million or that he would improve us 

[Bigdoggsteel]

24 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Not that one again. How are we supposed to know who was available and who wasn't ? If you come around with a cheque for £1mill Joe Bloggs won't be available, come around with a cheque for £3mill and it can be another story.

Because they moved clubs, so therefore they were available. Pretty simple to understand 

[den]

We’ve had loads of players making a first team position their own at the age of 19 or even younger. Playing up front basically comes down to natural ability.  I also don’t think it’s too early yet to make some kind of judgement. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

Because they moved clubs, so therefore they were available. Pretty simple to understand 

Only if you're simple to start with. Are you seriously telling me that only the players that actually changed clubs were the only ones available for transfer ?

[47er]

43 minutes ago, Mercer said:

'Bright young things' stand out a mile.

If you've got it and you are good enough then you are old enough.

Yep, likes of Mbappe, Ampadu and Alexander-Arnold are exceptional talents but I haven't seen a shred of evidence to suggest Brereton is even going to be a decent Championship player, and certainly not worth a £7millionish deal, never mind blossoming into an exceptional talent.  I just don't get it and I'm totally bemused with his signing.

 

I said at the time (and was criticised for it) that it was odd that no other club seemed to have any interest in him at all.

I worry they were right.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

1 hour ago, Mercer said:

We've squandered some money on poor strikers over the years going back to the likes of Gilliver, O'Mara, Grabbi, Davies and now, in my opinion Brereton.

Think we paid £7million for Davies but at least he did have a record in the PL.  What has this lad Brereton done?  Can't recall the lad doing anything of note in our shirt.  A hugely strange signing.

That could be a very, very long list. You can add Ashley Ward and Dahlin to it.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Only if you're simple to start with. Are you seriously telling me that only the players that actually changed clubs were the only ones available for transfer ?

Are you following the conversation at all? 

JHrover said we should have spent £2 million each on 4 players instead of signing Brereton. I then asked who moved for £2 million that would have improved our squad. I don't think the question can be anymore straight forward. I am keeping it even more straight forward for you by not including payers who didn't move

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

2 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Are you following the conversation at all? 

JHrover said we should have spent £2 million each on 4 players instead of signing Brereton. I then asked who moved for £2 million that would have improved our squad. I don't think the question can be anymore straight forward. I am keeping it even more straight forward for you by not including payers who didn't move

I can't answer that because I haven't got the access to the scouting network we are supposed to have. Basically I don't watch football for a living, Why have a dog and bark yourself ?

[Crimpshrine]

3 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Are you following the conversation at all? 

JHrover said we should have spent £2 million each on 4 players instead of signing Brereton. I then asked who moved for £2 million that would have improved our squad. I don't think the question can be anymore straight forward. I am keeping it even more straight forward for you by not including payers who didn't move

JHRover also stated that he didn't think 4 x £2million would have been authorised.

Maybe we should be asking which available £6/7 million player would have been a good signing and an immediate impact at Rovers? 

[chaddyrovers]

4 hours ago, JHRover said:

Two problems here.

The first is that there's no way we've coughed up or committed to cough up £7 million on him. It will be half of that or maybe slightly more with addons and bonuses taking it up to £7 million in years to come.

The second is that I think a very particular set of criteria would have had to be matched for Venkys to sanction that sort of outlay. It isn't going to be as simple as giving Mowbray 3,4,5,6 million for a striker and he's picked Brereton out of all those available. They would only have put that money on the table for a particular player if certain boxes were ticked, one being that the player had to be young with plenty of time and potential to improve and increase in value.

Mowbray's language around the signing and spending the money was strange. Seems he felt under some pressure to get it spent because he doubted whether it would be available again if not.

Early days for the lad but he's not exactly had opportunity galore coming on in the last 20 minutes either as we're trying to see a game out and hold on or as we're chasing a game and he's the lone striker.

Mowbray has always said he prefers to work young players with few experience players aswell. Most signings was young players

Mowbray has always said he had the money from the Venkys meeting in May. 

2 hours ago, arbitro said:

I understood it as we only bid for Brereton in the last hour of the transfer window when Forest circulated his name. As it was far too late to get a deal done the pursuit carried over into the loan window. If he was a summer target why wouldn't a bid have been placed early in the window?

My impression is that he was a panic buy when other targets didn't materialise.

Forest circulated his name the day before deadline day. 

I think Waghorn was a Mowbray target. But Mowbray chosen for Brereton after that deal didn't happen. 

wouldn't say it was panic buy at all as Rovers and Mowbray would know all about him

[arbitro]

4 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Mowbray has always said he prefers to work young players with few experience players aswell. Most signings was young players

Mowbray has always said he had the money from the Venkys meeting in May. 

Forest circulated his name the day before deadline day. 

I think Waghorn was a Mowbray target. But Mowbray chosen for Brereton after that deal didn't happen. 

wouldn't say it was panic buy at all as Rovers and Mowbray would know all about him

But he couldn't possibly have been a target could he given that he only became available so late in the window? His sudden availability must have made him the main target st the expense of other.

I would have thought if Mowbray rated him so highly he would have enquired about his availability before Forest circulated his name so late in the window.

[Bigdoggsteel]

39 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I can't answer that because I haven't got the access to the scouting network we are supposed to have. Basically I don't watch football for a living, Why have a dog and bark yourself ?

You can't say which players moved for £2 million or under that would have improved our squad? That's poor now. See it's easy to say we should have spent the Brereton money differently, but to actually back that up with concrete examples of how seems beyond some of you 

 

[Bigdoggsteel]

38 minutes ago, Crimpshrine said:

JHRover also stated that he didn't think 4 x £2million would have been authorised.

Maybe we should be asking which available £6/7 million player would have been a good signing and an immediate impact at Rovers? 

Ya, lets do that so. Fire away 

[tomphil]

Forest hired an agent to try and sell him, we bought him for a possible 7 million after going in at 5 million.

A lot of Forest fans were unhappy to see him go but plenty were happy taking 7 million for him as it would've been daft to turn it down.  Many would have felt similar if good money in comparative terms had been offered for Gallagher, Derbyshire and even Mahonney when they were cameo kids in the first team at Ewood.

This will run and run....

[Hasta]

7 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

You can't say which players moved for £2 million or under that would have improved our squad? That's poor now. See it's easy to say we should have spent the Brereton money differently, but to actually back that up with concrete examples of how seems beyond some of you 

 

You constantly ignore the fact that it's not our jobs to know players when we have this argument.

However, if you listed all of the players who moved clubs for £2million or less over the summer, plus all of the loan signings, plus all of the forwards who were linked with moves, either permanent or loan, in those price brackets then I would gladly point out some signings that may have been better.

From what we have seen so far, it can't be difficult to find someone for £2million or less that would have contributed more than what Brereton has so far. However I'll reserve judgement until he has played more minutes in his preferred position but £7million is seeming massively over priced on what we have seen so far and his current professional statistics.

Edited October 4, 2018 by Hasta

[Dreams of 1995]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

He didn't move during the summer, so no guarantee we would have got him for 2 million or that he would improve us 

Well his release clause of £2.5m is a pretty good guarantee

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Hasta said:

You constantly ignore the fact that it's not our jobs to know players when we have this argument.

However, if you listed all of the players who moved clubs for £2million or less over the summer, plus all of the loan signings, plus all of the forwards who were linked with moves, either permanent or loan, in those price brackets then I would gladly point out some signings that may have been better.

 

No,it's not your job, but you are able to run the rule over Brereton and say we should have spent the money differently. Asking for examples of how we should have spent it is a pretty simple and straight forward request. 

The "it's not my job" brigade are able to say we we could have spent the money better, yet can't back this up with examples. I find it odd. 

How can you say we could have spent the money better, if you don't have an alternative in mind? 

[Bigdoggsteel]

3 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

Well his release clause of £2.5m is a pretty good guarantee

Which nobody met. Interesting, no? Not sure what that came down to for a finish, but it was surprising he didn't move. 

Well , at least you offered a suggestion anyway. 

Suspect there may be some attitude problems at play, but part of me agrees with you about him, going off what I saw of him last season, ability wise he may have been a better option this season than Armstrong. 

Edited October 4, 2018 by Bigdoggsteel

[Dreams of 1995]

55 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Which nobody met. Interesting, no? Not sure what that came down to for a finish, but it was surprising he didn't move. 

Well , at least you offered a suggestion anyway. 

Suspect there may be some attitude problems at play, but part of me agrees with you about him, going off what I saw of him last season, ability wise he may have been a better option this season than Armstrong. 

There are lots of options out there in varying positions. It's of no doubt that, at this moment in time, there is an argument to be had that the £6m could have been spent better. Brereton may kick on and become the multi million pound player he's meant to be. However, you can't help but look around and see the business teams like Brentford, Norwich, Derby, Boro, Villa etc have done and be envious we spent such huge sums of money on a player that hasn't made an impact.

Most may be loan signings but they are certainly loan with fees attached (Mount, Wilson at Derby or Kalas at Bristol City to name a few) they have certainly made better use of available funds.

I hope Brereton kicks on and proves the doubters wrong. My only fear is that the first big outlay we've had in years under the Venkys may turn out to be a flop. It's far too early to be judging as such though. 

 

[JHRover]

3 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

In your opinion what players would have improved us who moved for 2 million during the summer? 

There were plenty of rumours of other targets

Yannick Wildschut, Harry Wilson, Mason Mount, Chris Martin, Andreas Weimann, Oliver Norwood (dingle), Tomer Hemed, Nakhi Wells (dingle), Marley Watkins, Barry McKay. All moved for £2 million or thereabouts or loans. I'm sure Sam Gallagher and Harrison Reed would have been available for those sort of figures too and in my opinion would have been very decent permanent signings who would increase in value.

Plenty of others floating around too.

Just find the whole thing odd. Completely out of club character to invest big money in one player in one position whilst dealing in loans and frees elsewhere.

Conspiracy theory alert again but something not right with the Jacob Davenport signing either.

I've already said that I was satisfied with our summer business, and welcomed the Brereton signing, and I'm not daft enough to be labelling him a waste of money or a failure after 4 substitute appearances in the league. Likewise the celebrations we witnessed on here when we signed Kasey Palmer have so far shown to be misplaced.

 

[Dreams of 1995]

3 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Yannick Wildschut, Harry Wilson, Mason Mount, Chris Martin, Andreas Weimann, Oliver Norwood (dingle), Tomer Hemed, Nakhi Wells (dingle), Marley Watkins, Barry McKay. All moved for £2 million or thereabouts or loans. I'm sure Sam Gallagher and Harrison Reed would have been available for those sort of figures too and in my opinion would have been very decent permanent signings who would increase in value.

Plenty of others floating around too.

Just find the whole thing odd. Completely out of club character to invest big money in one player in one position whilst dealing in loans and frees elsewhere.

Conspiracy theory alert again but something not right with the Jacob Davenport signing either.

I've already said that I was satisfied with our summer business, and welcomed the Brereton signing, and I'm not daft enough to be labelling him a waste of money or a failure after 4 substitute appearances in the league. Likewise the celebrations we witnessed on here when we signed Kasey Palmer have so far shown to be misplaced.

 

That's taken me back a bit. What makes you think that?

And Kasey Palmer has scored 3 goals. He's not played badly.

[Mercer]

3 hours ago, islander200 said:

Where have you been?Funny no posts of praise when we were picking up results and playing well?

Also be interesting to hear your thoughts on Dack and the fact the club reportedly turned down a deal with West Brom that could have potentially netted the club 15 million?Didn't you say you were 80% sure that Dack would be sold in the summer?

I've been extremely busy!

Seen a few games this season and by and large been disappointed.  Confidence and momentum go a long way in football, especially for promoted teams, but sadly. hasn't happened for us.

Yep, I did think Dack would go - WBA bid came in late and will be interesting to see what happens in Jan. if he maintains decent form.  My main concern is that his head will be turned and I think he might get too frustrated in a Rovers' team where he's almost the sole source of inspiration / creativity.  Think Mowbray needs to find a way of getting him more involved in the game - despite his skill, flicks and intelligence, I think he is too much on the periphery of games for long periods.

 

 

Edited October 4, 2018 by Mercer

[Bigdoggsteel]

4 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Yannick Wildschut, Harry Wilson, Mason Mount, Chris Martin, Andreas Weimann, Oliver Norwood (dingle), Tomer Hemed, Nakhi Wells (dingle), Marley Watkins, Barry McKay. All moved for £2 million or thereabouts or loans. I'm sure Sam Gallagher and Harrison Reed would have been available for those sort of figures too and in my opinion would have been very decent permanent signings who would increase in value.

Plenty of others floating around too.

Just find the whole thing odd. Completely out of club character to invest big money in one player in one position whilst dealing in loans and frees elsewhere.

Conspiracy theory alert again but something not right with the Jacob Davenport signing either.

I've already said that I was satisfied with our summer business, and welcomed the Brereton signing, and I'm not daft enough to be labelling him a waste of money or a failure after 4 substitute appearances in the league. Likewise the celebrations we witnessed on here when we signed Kasey Palmer have so far shown to be misplaced.

 

I think we were in for Wilson weren't we? Mount looks a cracking player. I think the jury is very much out on whether Hehmed, Martin or Wells would be improvements on what we have. 

I would have taken Weimann and Norwood alright, good players at this level, especially Norwood. 

Not sure how much the fees were for Norwood, Watkins or Mckay though 

[chaddyrovers]

9 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I think we were in for Wilson weren't we? Mount looks a cracking player. I think the jury is very much out on whether Hehmed, Martin or Wells would be improvements on what we have. 

I would have taken Weimann and Norwood alright, good players at this level, especially Norwood. 

Not sure how much the fees were for Norwood, Watkins or Mckay though 

I mention Mackay on here. Moved for 500k to Swansea. Very good player