Ben Brereton Diaz

[roversfan99]

9 minutes ago, Atko's Engine said:

My own take on Brereton.

He needs to be given time by us all , all the skating he's getting you'd think he was a seasoned pro. He's 19 and has been here for barely longer than 6 weeks, of which 1 of those was away with England. He's here for what, 4 or 5 years? I don't think we'll start to see the real player for a few months yet, needs to get his feet under the table.

What I saw from him on Wednesday night was something different to what Graham offers. He's tall but not as strong or game savvy as Graham, but he clearly has pace and intelligence. He looks like he wants to play off the shoulder of his defender, and made 3 or 4 arching runs but wasn't picked out by the man on the ball, meaning his contribution was worthless. If he keeps making those runs, he'll get played in eventually and can chase the ball down the channels or in towards goal, leaving space behind for others (Bennett, Dack, Rothwell, Palmer, whoever) to fill and support. I think once this approach becomes embedded in the team it will prove very fruitful, and add to our variety of play.

As for the lace tying, he'd had his foot trodden on in a challenge, which seemed to dislodge his boot. So he had to take the boot off, then untie the laces in order to put the boot back on again and then tie it up. It took him about a minute whilst play went on around him. I think too much is being made of it by some who seem keen to knock him whenever & however they can.  That's not going to help anyone, so I urge everyone not to prejudge him, expect too much too soon & just give the boy a chance.

People are just commenting on his performances like anyone else. And unfortunately, his price will always be part of the discussion, it has to be.

People arent writing him off, but his cameos thus far have been poor, theres no way of dressing it up, and thats all people are saying. The ball repeatedly bounced off him, especially on Wednesday and it led to our attack breaking down numerous times.

[tomphil]

If Bolton, Preston, Wigan or any club of our similar ilk had made this signing when the first team badly needed investment he'd be under the same levels of scrutiny and provoke the same debates amongst fans.

If he can't live with it ( I'd suggest he can ) then he's in the wrong job and someone's made a very bad judgement call. Yet again there seems some confusion between what's actually happening like with a few other players i'e he's being discussed on fans forums not howled at or booed in the ground and he won't be.

For what it's worth I've got faith in TM so I think he'll come good although not sure it'll be 7 million good but he'll probably make a player of some sort. My biggest issue is how he's being handled and that in itself provokes the debates and questions, I think they should've had another more seasoned striker from somewhere so this lad could be eased in a few mins here and there a bit more under the radar for now. That might have happened had Samuels been fit but now we are down to this lad and Nuttall as back up strikers / utility strikers.

We need / needed another proper goal scorer in the squad end of !

[Stuart]

£7m is the problem here. The market has caused that value but Rovers still went and committed it. On Brereton. The view presumably being that he is young enough to provide a return on that investment in resale value. The daft thing is £7m could probably have bought a much better finished article at this level with the return on investment being promotion.

Imagine how much worse it will be if he is still a flop come January and we have to sell Dack to pay for him! Here’s hoping not.

For us to get back any value, either resale or PL cash, he needs to start finding the back of the net. Maybe in the next two windows we will buy a couple of wingers and a centre back and all will be well but I’m yet to be convinced.

This might just have to go down as Mowbray’s Grabbi or Davies or Ward. Better managers than he have made expensive mistakes - no matter how much In Mowbray We Trust™️.

[Butty]

If anyone needs a goal tomorrow it’s this lad. Hopefully he’s been practicing tying his laces in training.

[USABlue]

On 04/10/2018 at 04:38, rigger said:

I got the impression last night that no one wanted to pass to Brereton, he made loads of runs pointing to where he wanted the ball, only to see it end up with someone else.

That's a real worry.  If so why?  My concern from the iff is that the lad does not look like he really wants to be here.  Regardless of the words coming out of his mouth his demeanor looks anything but happy, smiles look forced and fake.

  I really really hope this works out but my gut tells me, if fans start getting on him it could all end badly.  Good kuck to him but if we don't give him the ball mot much he can do is there?

[DE.]

11 hours ago, Stuart said:

£7m is the problem here. The market has caused that value but Rovers still went and committed it.

Alternatively in January Leeds bought Tyler Roberts for £2.5m (rising to £4m) and he's managed 3 goals and 1 assist in 5 appearances so far this season. Also 19 years old. So the market is there to get decent young prospects at a reasonable price. 

[tomphil]

Yep the market is definitely there all this 'who else could we have got' is utter nonsense otherwise how the hell do other clubs with limited means prosper ?

Who else could we have got via the channels that mostly seem to supply us may be more to the point. 

Dack for an initial fee of less than a million from a league 1 club.

7 mill for a 19 year old just because he's had a few games in a higher league etc,  who may or may not cut the mustard. I know where i'd have been looking again this summer.

Each to their own I hope it's part of a long term plan but we aren't thinking outside the box imo.

[rigger]

11 hours ago, USABlue said:

That's a real worry.  If so why?  My concern from the iff is that the lad does not look like he really wants to be here.  Regardless of the words coming out of his mouth his demeanor looks anything but happy, smiles look forced and fake.

  I really really hope this works out but my gut tells me, if fans start getting on him it could all end badly.  Good kuck to him but if we don't give him the ball mot much he can do is there?

 I am not saying it is a fact, but just the impression I got.

[47er]

If TM knew we had roughly 9M to spend at the start of the window and he chose to spend 7M of it on Brereton as a future prospect then it absolutely beggars belief.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

34 minutes ago, 47er said:

If TM knew we had roughly 9M to spend at the start of the window and he chose to spend 7M of it on Brereton as a future prospect then it absolutely beggars belief.

That's why the whole deal has got me scratching my head. It's totally out of character. Mowbray is nothing if not cautious.

[chaddyrovers]

17 hours ago, Atko's Engine said:

My own take on Brereton.

He needs to be given time by us all , all the skating he's getting you'd think he was a seasoned pro. He's 19 and has been here for barely longer than 6 weeks, of which 1 of those was away with England. He's here for what, 4 or 5 years? I don't think we'll start to see the real player for a few months yet, needs to get his feet under the table.

What I saw from him on Wednesday night was something different to what Graham offers. He's tall but not as strong or game savvy as Graham, but he clearly has pace and intelligence. He looks like he wants to play off the shoulder of his defender, and made 3 or 4 arching runs but wasn't picked out by the man on the ball, meaning his contribution was worthless. If he keeps making those runs, he'll get played in eventually and can chase the ball down the channels or in towards goal, leaving space behind for others (Bennett, Dack, Rothwell, Palmer, whoever) to fill and support. I think once this approach becomes embedded in the team it will prove very fruitful, and add to our variety of play.

As for the lace tying, he'd had his foot trodden on in a challenge, which seemed to dislodge his boot. So he had to take the boot off, then untie the laces in order to put the boot back on again and then tie it up. It took him about a minute whilst play went on around him. I think too much is being made of it by some who seem keen to knock him whenever & however they can.  That's not going to help anyone, so I urge everyone not to prejudge him, expect too much too soon & just give the boy a chance.

great post and I agree 100%. On Wednesday, he was making good runs but we weren't passing to him. 

 

[Armchair supporter supremo]

sorry if this has been covered already but do we know if we are contractually obliged to complete the deal for brereton in january, is there not a chance that we could just say thanks but no thanks now?

 

it does(and did to me) seem ridiculous to spend so much on such an unknown quantity when we could probably have spent less for a player that's already proven at this level OR we could have just left the money in the transfer kitty and waited until Jan to spend it if He's only going to be a bit part player, Nuttall currently offers more on the pitch than Brereton seems to

[Stuart]

11 hours ago, DE. said:

Alternatively in January Leeds bought Tyler Roberts for £2.5m (rising to £4m) and he's managed 3 goals and 1 assist in 5 appearances so far this season. Also 19 years old. So the market is there to get decent young prospects at a reasonable price. 

Tyler Roberts doesn’t have the “England Premium” mark up.

[DE.]

Just now, Armchair supporter supremo said:

sorry if this has been covered already but do we know if we are contractually obliged to complete the deal for brereton in january, is there not a chance that we could just say thanks but no thanks now?

it does(and did to me) seem ridiculous to spend so much on such an unknown quantity when we could probably have spent less for a player that's already proven at this level OR we could have just left the money in the transfer kitty and waited until Jan to spend it if He's only going to be a bit part player, Nuttall currently offers more on the pitch than Brereton seems to

It's been pretty much confirmed that we are obliged to buy him in January, so, that £7m is coming out of the coffers no matter what.

Just now, Stuart said:

Tyler Roberts doesn’t have the “England Premium” mark up.

Indeed. Hopefully it'll work in our favour in the future.

[Tom]

My worry isn’t about his ability or lack of it’s that we may have signed a player that just doesn’t fit our approach. 

Not sure if he’s involved with the England set up this time but if not at least Tony has two weeks to work with him before the next game.

[roversfan99]

8 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

great post and I agree 100%. On Wednesday, he was making good runs but we weren't passing to him. 

 

When we did pass to him, the ball never stuck to him and repeatedly bounced off him, thats probably why.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

39 minutes ago, DE. said:

It's been pretty much confirmed that we are obliged to buy him in January, so, that £7m is coming out of the coffers no matter what.

Indeed. Hopefully it'll work in our favour in the future.

He's our player now. We start paying for him later.

[47er]

1 hour ago, Armchair supporter supremo said:

sorry if this has been covered already but do we know if we are contractually obliged to complete the deal for brereton in january, is there not a chance that we could just say thanks but no thanks now?

 

it does(and did to me) seem ridiculous to spend so much on such an unknown quantity when we could probably have spent less for a player that's already proven at this level OR we could have just left the money in the transfer kitty and waited until Jan to spend it if He's only going to be a bit part player, Nuttall currently offers more on the pitch than Brereton seems to

Yes Saxo, it has been mentioned.

[chaddyrovers]

31 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

When we did pass to him, the ball never stuck to him and repeatedly bounced off him, thats probably why.

Disagree. He had some decent touches but his movement was good/decent. We need to learn how to use him. His game is about movement and playing on the defender shoulder. 

[roversfan99]

4 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Disagree. He had some decent touches but his movement was good/decent. We need to learn how to use him. His game is about movement and playing on the defender shoulder. 

Maybe you have a point about using him in a different way. We have to at some point due to the massive money spent on him. But lets call a spade a spade. He was crap on Wednesday and the ball bounced off him a few times.

[chaddyrovers]

7 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Maybe you have a point about using him in a different way. We have to at some point due to the massive money spent on him. But lets call a spade a spade. He was crap on Wednesday and the ball bounced off him a few times.

He wasnt crap at all tho. His movement was good and if found at times we might have seen the true player. 

He isnt a Graham type but plays on the last defender shoulder. But if Mowbray is after changing the team to more passing style then Brereton will be ideal for that. 

[blueboy3333]

2 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Disagree. He had some decent touches but his movement was good/decent. We need to learn how to use him. His game is about movement and playing on the defender shoulder. 

You haven't seen him enough to know what his game is all about. Mowbray plays with a target man or else AA would be playing every week 'off the shoulder'. Brereton quite obviously shows for the ball and did ok at times when it was played up to him the other night. I'm sure with his supposed pace he can also run in behind. You don't have to do one or the other. Strikers can do both. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

6 hours ago, blueboy3333 said:

You haven't seen him enough to know what his game is all about. Mowbray plays with a target man or else AA would be playing every week 'off the shoulder'. Brereton quite obviously shows for the ball and did ok at times when it was played up to him the other night. I'm sure with his supposed pace he can also run in behind. You don't have to do one or the other. Strikers can do both. 

I agree with you. For that sort of money he should be able to make things happen on his own account and not just be relying on perfect service from the midfield. Craig Bellamy could make any pass into a good pass.

Edited October 7, 2018 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[47er]

All I know is that we started the season knowing we needed another striker because Graham's getting on and can't play 2 games in a week and we are are still in that same position after spending 7M!!

How daft is that?

[Roverthechimp]

Have we actually spent 7m or have we agreed to pay 7m if certain criteria are met? (Games, goals, time at club, England caps at different levels etc)