Ben Brereton Diaz

[chaddyrovers]

15 minutes ago, Hasta said:

Chaddy stop quoting Mowbray to validate your opinion as he obviously isn't going to come out with something negative about Brereton. He's hardly going to come out and say "I'm disappointed with what he has shown so far"

 

I will quote who I want when I want. 

 

[JacknOry]

Kean said he didnt own a dog and I still do not believe him.

Hasta is spot on that just because TM has not come out and publicly admitted he has been disappointed so far with BB, it does not mean that he isnt. Then again, even if TM were I would place that responsibility on him anyway rather than the kid. Playing him out of position and then even putting an attacking midfielder up front instead of him when Graham goes off is hardly going to increase the lads confidence.

TM rightfully gets the plaudits for what he has done to turn around this club but this transfer really baffles me. Was he signed as a striker? If not, why didn't we get one in. Was he signed for the wing? if so, this is obviously not BB's best position and he has so far looked pretty ordinary there. 

At the end of last season it was widely accepted on here that we should be looking for a successor/backup to Graham now as he is not getting any younger and usually lasts an hour only - let alone, god forbid that he gets injured. Somebody that could have shared the workload with Graham this season and possibly the next before taking that role for himself when DGs legs finally do give up for good. 

If BB was not signed for that purpose, it means we will have to go looking for another and we know strikers of his quality do not come cheap and with the rate values are increasing year on year, they will be even more expensive. 

[unsall]

3 hours ago, K-Hod said:

Yeah, but it's part of the board rules to type in clear, legible English and it isn't the first time this has been raised, to be fair.

Can we stop with the positive vs negative as well, please? It's duller than dishwater and isn't conducive to debate. If you think someone is being too negative, or conversely too positive, explain why, put some meat on the bones. 

Seems to me like a witch-hunt against me, again, from you,what have I actually done wrong, what I wrote seemed to me,to be clear, legible English, and just explained I’m a little more positive than others, seen others come out with far worse but you never seem to mention them,you must have a problem with me.

[Bigdoggsteel]

8 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

I will quote who I want when I want. 

 

You tell em Chaddy 

[Hasta]

5 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

I will quote who I want when I want. 

 

I said "Stop quoting Mowbray to validate your opinion because ...... ".

I never said you couldn't quote Mowbray or anyone else when you wanted to did I?

However you reply as though you think I am being unfair, or bullying, or picking on you etc... Which I clearly wasn't.

 

 

[chaddyrovers]

16 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Its not about patience, the main curiosity is about how Brereton is being used by Mowbray. I dont need to hear him say anything to see that he looks poor in a wide role. You dont spend so much money to waste a player in a role he blatantly cannot play. He should either play as a 9 or not at all. He should be 2nd choice behind Graham as it stands. Palmer and Rothwell are far better suited to the role in question.

We only play 1 striker! 3 is plenty. Armstrong has prior form for excelling wide, Brereton hasnt and looks like a fish out of water there. As @Hasta touches on, just because Mowbray says it doesnt mean it is right or that we must agree with it.

sorry but patience is required. You say he cant play but Mowbray has explained why he has played wide. He has said that he like to play with one wide forward, number 9 and number 10 player with a wide midfielder on the other side. So that's why Mowbray feels short. 

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, Hasta said:

I said "Stop quoting Mowbray to validate your opinion because ...... ".

I never said you couldn't quote Mowbray or anyone else when you wanted to did I?

However you reply as though you think I am being unfair, or bullying, or picking on you etc... Which I clearly wasn't.

 

 

I posted 3 Mowbray links today and not once have I said this validate my opinion have I? maybe you jump the gun again and reading things I haven't posted again. 

1 minute ago, unsall said:

Seems to me like a witch-hunt against me, again, from you,what have I actually done wrong, what I wrote seemed to me,to be clear, legible English, and just explained I’m a little more positive than others, seen others come out with far worse but you never seem to mention them,you must have a problem with me.

K'hod and Stuart condemn me for using laughing emoji at roversfan99 post but they never seem to say anything when he has done it to others people like me or yourself. 

maybe we could do with some better emoji like agree and disagree emojis to posts or something else you others have ideas

 

[Hasta]

2 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

I posted 3 Mowbray links today and not once have I said this validate my opinion have I? maybe you jump the gun again and reading things I haven't posted again. 

It is because you keep posting links to what Mowbray says about Brereton, and have said previously when people question your views that "you need to listen to the Mowbray comments I posted yesterday"

Such as "You need to listen to Mowbray's comments from yesterday that I have just posted. "

But Mowbray, like any manager, will be playing the media game at times.

 

But regardless, you do now see that I didnt say you couldn't quote who you want when you want, but regardless you just threw a wobbler on your previous post !

 

[chaddyrovers]

2 minutes ago, Hasta said:

It is because you keep posting links to what Mowbray says about Brereton, and have said previously when people question your views that "you need to listen to the Mowbray comments I posted yesterday"

Such as "You need to listen to Mowbray's comments from yesterday that I have just posted. "

But Mowbray, like any manager, will be playing the media game at times.

 

But regardless, you do now see that I didnt say you couldn't quote who you want when you want, but regardless you just threw a wobbler on your previous post !

 

but nowhere did I say it Validate my opinion did I, just said listen to Mowbray's comments. 

cos you keep saying staff I haven't even mention FFS

[Stuart]

He quotes who he wants

He quotes when he waaaaa-aaants

@chaddyrovers

He quotes what he wants

(Usually off of Twitter)

[Ewood Ace]

Mowbray is absolutely right we are a striker short (as well as a centre back). But the reason we are a striker short is because he choses to play Brereton and Armstrong out of position on the wing.  And if Tony feels feel we are still a striker short why did he spend £7 Million on Brereton to play wide when he already had Rothwell, Palmer, Bennett, Conway and even Armstrong who can play out there. It seems to me that Mowbray is trying to overcomplicate things in a bid to ease pressure on Brereton rather than giving him a go in his preferred position to see what he has got. Surely he didn't believe that Samuel was going to be the answer as an alternative to Graham given that he wasn't the answer last season is League 1.

[K-Hod]

58 minutes ago, unsall said:

Seems to me like a witch-hunt against me, again, from you,what have I actually done wrong, what I wrote seemed to me,to be clear, legible English, and just explained I’m a little more positive than others, seen others come out with far worse but you never seem to mention them,you must have a problem with me.

It’s a problem against the lack of spacing after commas and the lack of paragraphs. 

It only seems like a witch-hunt as you’re the only person that doesn’t space or paragraph properly.

No problem with you being any more positive than anyone else. I do have a problem with you dismissing people’s views as negative though. Explain why you disagree, instead of trying to shut people down because you don’t agree with them.

People are allowed to criticise and question things whilst still being fans of the club and trusting Mowbray. 

We are like every other club on the planet in questioning the manager when he makes mistakes. I’ll bet if you go onto a Man City forum, they’ll criticise Guardiola when he gets it wrong and rightly so! 

Just as they’ll praise him when he gets it right, as fans do here.

If everyone agreed, there would be no need for a messageboard at all.

 

[Hasta]

35 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

but nowhere did I say it Validate my opinion did I, just said listen to Mowbray's comments. 

cos you keep saying staff I haven't even mention FFS

Quote

 

You need to listen to the Mowbray's interview I posted today from BBC Lancashire. He explained the way he has use him so far. and asking for fans to be patience. He explained that he is the Graham, Dack and Armstrong plus 1 more as the front 4 cos of the chemistry and the understand they have. 

We only have 3 strikers fit at the minute and I understand why he wanted another striker available but Samuel and Nuttall are injured. Would be given him more options. 

 

People post opinions and instead of you posting your opinion, you just post what Mowbray has said. It's like people are arguing with Mowbray through you.

See above. Here's another below.

Now maybe you agree with the original poster, and disagree with Mowbray, but rather than put your point of view across you are just telling people to listen to Mowbray. But I doubt it.

 

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

sorry but patience is required. You say he cant play but Mowbray has explained why he has played wide. He has said that he like to play with one wide forward, number 9 and number 10 player with a wide midfielder on the other side. So that's why Mowbray feels short. 

Edited October 26, 2018 by Hasta

[chaddyrovers]

10 minutes ago, Hasta said:

People post opinions and instead of you posting your opinion, you just post what Mowbray has said. It's like people are arguing with Mowbray through you.

See above. Here's another below.

Now maybe you agree with the original poster, and disagree with Mowbray, but rather than put your point of view across you are just telling people to listen to Mowbray. But I doubt it.

 

 

I post my opinion but cant help it being similar to other posters like JHRover and unsall. 

And post links and stories for posters to read or explained reasons for certain questions they asked. 

 

[Hasta]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

 

I post my opinion but cant help it being similar to other posters like JHRover and unsell.  - 

And post links and stories for posters to read or explained reasons for certain questions they asked. 

 

Your first line is irrelevant to the discussion we are having.

The second line is fine if it is in reply to "Was Mulgrew injured last night",   but when Roversfan99 gives an opinion that if we are to use Brereton out wide that we should have signed a winger instead, posting Mowbray in reply is irrelevant. Mowbray is never going to say "Actually I wish we'd singed a winger instead."

Edited October 26, 2018 by Hasta

[Mercer]

2 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

how did it limit our options to strengthen else? Still got money left over from the summer budget. 

You need to listen to Mowbray's comments from yesterday that I have just posted. 

 

 

You need to listen to the Mowbray's interview I posted today from BBC Lancashire. He explained the way he has use him so far. and asking for fans to be patience. He explained that he is the Graham, Dack and Armstrong plus 1 more as the front 4 cos of the chemistry and the understand they have. 

We only have 3 strikers fit at the minute and I understand why he wanted another striker available but Samuel and Nuttall are injured. Would be given him more options. 

How much?

Whether it be £100,000 or £1million, we have £7million LESS to commit in the next transfer window or possibly even one or two windows after that.

£7million would have bought at least 2 or 3 very decent players who would have gone straight into our starting eleven instead of a striker who is not good enough, even Mowbray must acknowledge this by virtue of the fact he wont select him,  to command a regular starting spot.  IMV, a signing that defies logic.

[roversfan99]

2 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

sorry but patience is required. You say he cant play but Mowbray has explained why he has played wide. He has said that he like to play with one wide forward, number 9 and number 10 player with a wide midfielder on the other side. So that's why Mowbray feels short. 

Not in terms of the discussion we are having! I know that he likes his wide forwards, but I dont think that Brereton is a wide forward.

Einstein once defined insanity as "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." I feel that repeatedly playing Brereton wide falls under that definition, therefore patience is irrelevant.

If he was playing in his natural role down the middle, and showing some promising signs and also some inconsistency, then telling me to "show some patience" would be relevant. As it is, he is playing in the wrong position, therefore it is not. In this situation, I am frustrated at Mowbray and hope he changes to only using him in his natural position.

Brereton is a striker. Mowbray has moaned that he feels he doesnt have enough forwards. That being said, he at the moment seemingly refuses to consider a 6m striker he bought himself for that position, even though that is the position in which he garnered the positive reputation at his previous club to impress Mowbray enough to buy him in the first place. If that situation was to continue, then something has obviously gone wrong somewhere.

As @Hasta explains perfectly, just because Mowbray says something, it doesnt mean that it is right, or that you have to justify it. 

The other day, you stated after watching the Swansea game that Brereton playing wide is not something that works and something that you disagree with. Even though you came to the conclusion that it is a bad idea with your own eyes, I find it quite baffling that just because Mowbray has come out and said soemthing in the press, youve had a total u-turn. 

The only reason that you are asking for patience is because that Mowbray has said that. After listening to his interview asking for patience, he (and the interviewer) have not acknowledged that much of the frustration is aimed at Mowbray himself.

Mowbray also said "the money is not irrelevant" by the way.

[Bigdoggsteel]

27 minutes ago, Mercer said:

How much?

Whether it be £100,000 or £1million, we have £7million LESS to commit in the next transfer window or possibly even one or two windows after that.

£7million would have bought at least 2 or 3 very decent players who would have gone straight into our starting eleven instead of a striker who is not good enough, even Mowbray must acknowledge this by virtue of the fact he wont select him,  to command a regular starting spot.  IMV, a signing that defies logic.

Should a player not be given time though, particularly a younger guy? If he starts for us next season and does a job, that's 7 million (or whatever) we'll spent 

[Bigdoggsteel]

5 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Not in terms of the discussion we are having! I know that he likes his wide forwards, but I dont think that Brereton is a wide forward.

Einstein once defined insanity as "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." I feel that repeatedly playing Brereton wide falls under that definition, therefore patience is irrelevant.

If he was playing in his natural role down the middle, and showing some promising signs and also some inconsistency, then telling me to "show some patience" would be relevant. As it is, he is playing in the wrong position, therefore it is not. In this situation, I am frustrated at Mowbray and hope he changes to only using him in his natural position.

Brereton is a striker. Mowbray has moaned that he feels he doesnt have enough forwards. That being said, he at the moment seemingly refuses to consider a 6m striker he bought himself for that position, even though that is the position in which he garnered the positive reputation at his previous club to impress Mowbray enough to buy him in the first place. If that situation was to continue, then something has obviously gone wrong somewhere.

As @Hasta explains perfectly, just because Mowbray says something, it doesnt mean that it is right, or that you have to justify it. 

The other day, you stated after watching the Swansea game that Brereton playing wide is not something that works and something that you disagree with. Even though you came to the conclusion that it is a bad idea with your own eyes, I find it quite baffling that just because Mowbray has come out and said soemthing in the press, youve had a total u-turn. 

The only reason that you are asking for patience is because that Mowbray has said that. After listening to his interview asking for patience, he (and the interviewer) have not acknowledged that much of the frustration is aimed at Mowbray himself.

Mowbray also said "the money is not irrelevant" by the way.

I don't think he is suited to the wing/inside forward position because he is too lanky. You need a lad with a bit of nippyness(made up word) I feel. Armstrong isnt perfect, he has one trick-kick and chase. That works if he has better acceleration than the full back. So I can tell very early watching  a game if Armstrong had the beating of his man, I think we all can. I think you mentioned it earlier and I agree wholeheartedly, Brereton needs to be number 2 to Graham. Ahead of anyone else. He's not a winger 

Edited October 26, 2018 by Bigdoggsteel

[Hasta]

18 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I don't think he is suited to the wing/inside forward position because he is too lanky. You need a lad with a bit of nippyness(made up word) I feel. Armstrong isnt perfect, he has one trick-kick and chase. That works if he has better acceleration than the full back. So I can tell very early watching  a game if Armstrong had the beating of his man, I think we all can. I think you mentioned it earlier and I agree wholeheartedly, Brereton needs to be number 2 to Graham. Ahead of anyone else. He's not a winger 

Agree with both your posts. Next season Brereton could be a star but I very much doubt it will be wide right. It's the decision to play him where he looks poor, and where we have other options,  that is baffling.

In the last couple of games Armstrong has done really well to get into a good crossing position only to turn back on his right foot.   He'd be more effective on the right IMO but then somebody else is going to have the same problem on the left, unless they are 2-footed

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Hasta said:

Agree with both your posts. Next season Brereton could be a star but I very much doubt it will be wide right. It's the decision to play him where he looks poor, and where we have other options,  that is baffling.

In the last couple of games Armstrong has done really well to get into a good crossing position only to turn back on his right foot.   He'd be more effective on the right IMO but then somebody else is going to have the same problem on the left, unless they are 2-footed

The only two footed player we have is Rodwell. It's a great skill, but if you have a winger who is two footed and good at crossing, he won't be paying with us

I reckon Armstrong would be better on the right. I presume he is left so that he can cut in, but he ain't great at that on a regular basis. 

Our crossing in general needs major work 

[Mercer]

38 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Should a player not be given time though, particularly a younger guy? If he starts for us next season and does a job, that's 7 million (or whatever) we'll spent 

Varies from player to player - some make an immediate impact (eg Shearer), some need a bit of time (Sherwood) and some will never cut it because they are simply a dud!

Seen Brereton several times now and I haven't seen anything at all which made me sit up and take notice or even think he has half decent potential - irrespective of where he has played.  I would have been disappointed even if we'd have signed him on a free!  I would love to know the full story behind this signing - sadly, it's all reminiscent of the many clangers dropped by Rovers that it's been my misfortune to see in almost six decades of supporting the club.

[Stuart]

58 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Not in terms of the discussion we are having! I know that he likes his wide forwards, but I dont think that Brereton is a wide forward.

Einstein once defined insanity as "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." I feel that repeatedly playing Brereton wide falls under that definition, therefore patience is irrelevant.

If he was playing in his natural role down the middle, and showing some promising signs and also some inconsistency, then telling me to "show some patience" would be relevant. As it is, he is playing in the wrong position, therefore it is not. In this situation, I am frustrated at Mowbray and hope he changes to only using him in his natural position.

Brereton is a striker. Mowbray has moaned that he feels he doesnt have enough forwards. That being said, he at the moment seemingly refuses to consider a 6m striker he bought himself for that position, even though that is the position in which he garnered the positive reputation at his previous club to impress Mowbray enough to buy him in the first place. If that situation was to continue, then something has obviously gone wrong somewhere.

As @Hasta explains perfectly, just because Mowbray says something, it doesnt mean that it is right, or that you have to justify it. 

The other day, you stated after watching the Swansea game that Brereton playing wide is not something that works and something that you disagree with. Even though you came to the conclusion that it is a bad idea with your own eyes, I find it quite baffling that just because Mowbray has come out and said soemthing in the press, youve had a total u-turn. 

The only reason that you are asking for patience is because that Mowbray has said that. After listening to his interview asking for patience, he (and the interviewer) have not acknowledged that much of the frustration is aimed at Mowbray himself.

Mowbray also said "the money is not irrelevant" by the way.

I don’t think you can really put it any more clearly than that.

[unsall]

1 hour ago, Mercer said:

How much?

Whether it be £100,000 or £1million, we have £7million LESS to commit in the next transfer window or possibly even one or two windows after that.

£7million would have bought at least 2 or 3 very decent players who would have gone straight into our starting eleven instead of a striker who is not good enough, even Mowbray must acknowledge this by virtue of the fact he wont select him,  to command a regular starting spot.  IMV, a signing that defies logic.

Wonder why Mowbray gave the ok to sign him then, he wasn’t getting much game time at Forest, but it’s potential he has, why do England u20s pick him, he must have something.

[roversfan99]

Just now, unsall said:

Wonder why Mowbray gave the ok to sign him then, he wasn’t getting much game time at Forest, but it’s potential he has, why do England u20s pick him, he must have something.

If played in his position, yes.