Ben Brereton Diaz

[Guest]

It’s no wonder BB struggled to touch the ball yesterday, we conceded a goal and then resorted to the Bowyer days of lumping the ball 80 yards down field! Dack, Armstrong and Reed all probably touched the ball less than BB did in the same time period.

[blueboy3333]

Just now, Mellor Rover said:

t’s no wonder BB struggled to touch the ball yesterday, we conceded a goal and then resorted to the Bowyer days of lumping the ball 80 yards down field

You do realise that's actually how Mowbray plays don't you? The most long balls in the league etc...

[Amo]

A wasteful signing so far. That rumoured £7m could've been spent on our problem areas (i.e. full backs, midfield).

[G Somerset Rover]

Getting fed up with those on here moaning about ‘Ben bashing’ or whatever they’re calling it. It’s been said a million times over already, so it really shouldn’t need saying again, but it’s not what this is about. It’s because we have so many glaring weaknesses in our team that we shouldn’t have shelled out £7 million on potential. That’s the crux of it. If we had a bottomless pit I’m sure we’d all be thrilled with bringing in a young lad who could one day make a name for himself. As it stands, and at no fault of Ben’s, this is looking to be a very baffling and costly signing.

Edited December 16, 2018 by Gavlar Somerset Rover!

[OldEwoodBlue]

I heard yesterday that Ben was from the C list after no A or B targets could be secured. I also heard we are after Sam Vokes.

[blueboy3333]

Just now, Franky said:

I heard yesterday that Ben was from the C list after no A or B targets could be secured. I also heard we are after Sam Vokes.

Reading between the lines I'd definitely say it was a desperation signing. Mogga had money to spend, was expected to spend it, but couldn't secure his top targets. Hence we spent £7m at the last minute on someone who can't get a game. 

[SBlue]

1 hour ago, Amo said:

A wasteful signing so far. That rumoured £7m could've been spent on our problem areas (i.e. full backs, midfield).

I’d say up top is a problem area though?

[JBiz]

1 hour ago, Gavlar Somerset Rover! said:

Getting fed up with those on here moaning about ‘Ben bashing’ or whatever they’re calling it. It’s been said a million times over already, so it really shouldn’t need saying again, but it’s not what this is about. It’s because we have so many glaring weaknesses in our team that we shouldn’t have shelled out £7 million on potential. That’s the crux of it. If we had a bottomless pit I’m sure we’d all be thrilled with bringing in a young lad who could one day make a name for himself. As it stands, and at no fault of Ben’s, this is looking to be a very baffling and costly signing.

You know what’s equally as frustrating and leads to me getting fed up? The idea that buying players is akin to a supermarket... 

How much would you sell Lenihan or Nyambe for? Take that figure and double it for any similar aged but prem experienced players.

Then look at someone like Graham, and find an effective similar replacement on reasonable wages under 25.

What would be the cost of a lightning quick and quality final ball winger to be established in this division?

All those “glaring” weaknesses aren’t going to be covered by 7m.

Hopegully, if we do sign more players, particularly younger- they’ll be given more time than Brererton has been, before they’re labelled a “baffling clanger”

[blueboy3333]

Just now, S8 & Blue said:

I’d say up top is a problem area though?

Definitely. So why spend £7m on someone he doesn't trust to play up front, and when he doe get some minutes up there he looks poor?

[SBlue]

Just now, blueboy3333 said:

Definitely. So why spend £7m on someone he doesn't trust to play up front, and when he doe get some minutes up there he looks poor?

Like it or not he wasn’t signed for this week, this month or even this season.

Opinions vary if he looks a good investment, but people saying we shouldn’t sign highly rated young strikers because we need a left back too is bordering on ridiculous.

[blueboy3333]

Just now, Biz said:

All those “glaring” weaknesses aren’t going to be covered by 7m.

Straw man. BB was bought to play up front/out wide. He can't get in the team in either position. Meanwhile we have one effective target man who struggles to complete 90 mins every week and our whole way of playing is totally reliant on an effective target man. That £7m would have bought you at least 1 effective target man in this league. 

Take your pick for every other position in the team. Very few players go for over £7m in this league and there are some very good players … ergo you could a very good Championship player for any position on the pitch for £7m. 

[blueboy3333]

2 minutes ago, S8 & Blue said:

Like it or not he wasn’t signed for this week, this month or even this season.

Opinions vary if he looks a good investment, but people saying we shouldn’t sign highly rated young strikers because we need a left back too is bordering on ridiculous.

You said 'up top' was a problem area. So like it or not Mowbray has spent £7m on a striker WITHOUT addressing the problem area he is supposed to play in. That's a very careless waste of £7m. 

 

[Ewood Ace]

He's a rich man's Chris Brown. Forest must be laughing like mad to get £7 million from us for him. A complete waste of money which if spent well would have had us in and around the play offs. He might be young but I don't see any attribute that makes me think he is going to be a top striker or winger at this level.

[JBiz]

16 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

Straw man. BB was bought to play up front/out wide. He can't get in the team in either position. Meanwhile we have one effective target man who struggles to complete 90 mins every week and our whole way of playing is totally reliant on an effective target man. That £7m would have bought you at least 1 effective target man in this league. 

Take your pick for every other position in the team. Very few players go for over £7m in this league and there are some very good players … ergo you could a very good Championship player for any position on the pitch for £7m. 

I don’t think it’s that easy B.B. For example, did Britt Assombalonga sign for a championship team because they offered more wages than Burnley offered him?

I don’t think we are in a position to offer huge wages AND 7m for someone, and the Bamford’s/Assombolonga’s who are proven at this level cost that and the weekly wage.

Gestede would be a shout for me as that target man— but realistically he’s probably too highly paid after stints in the prem with villa and Boro.

[SBlue]

22 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

You said 'up top' was a problem area. So like it or not Mowbray has spent £7m on a striker WITHOUT addressing the problem area he is supposed to play in. That's a very careless waste of £7m. 

 

Good business doesn’t always mean instant gratification.

Anyone finding it criminal or careless that we haven’t got a playoff squad yet in every position are proving how far we’ve come in a short space of time.

I expect by the end of the year BB will be ample back up and pushing DG for a starting place.

Graham is one of the best in the league. Brereton is 19.

I just don’t get why people are so keen to write him off yet.

 

[blueboy3333]

Just now, Biz said:

I don’t think it’s that easy B.B. For example, did Britt Assombalonga sign for a championship team because they offered more wages than Burnley offered him?

I don’t think we are in a position to offer huge wages AND 7m for someone, and the Bamford’s/Assombolonga’s who are proven at this level cost that and the weekly wage.

Gestede would be a shout for me as that target man— but realistically he’s probably too highly paid after stints in the prem with villa and Boro.

I'm sure it's not as easy as that but the issue specifically relates to BB. We've spent £7m on someone who looks no better than Nuttall and is probably less suited to playing up front than Nuttall. There will be players out there who would be a fraction of the cost of BB and be on similar wages. That is obviously not Assombolonga so not sure of the relevance? Hugill, Grigg etc were all picked up from the lower leagues in their early 20's. 

Gestede would be a poor replacement for DG IMO. He doesn't hold the ball up well and is better suited to a front two. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

The argument that Mowbray should have spent the money elsewhere certainly has merit. At the same time, I think people are ridiculously critical of Brereton. I thought he looked OK yesterday. Made a few runs, didn't see him give the ball away, got in position for two efforts. Fans are dramatically making him out to be worse and play worse than he is. It must purely be based on the price tag, because Armstrong is far more frustrating to watch. As I said though, the price tag and how the money should have been spent is something to be critical of Mowbray about, not Brereton. 

[blueboy3333]

Just now, S8 & Blue said:

Good business doesn’t always mean instant gratification.

Anyone finding it criminal or careless that we haven’t got a playoff squad yet in every position are proving how far we’ve come in a short space of time.

I expect by the end of the year BB will be ample back up and pushing DG for a starting place.

Graham is one of the best in the league. Brereton is 19.

I just don’t get why people are so keen to write him off yet.

 

And still the problem position 'up top' remains unsolved. BB might be the answer in the future. At £7m he should be the answer now yet he can't even get a game. 

Unless of course we are now able to spend like a Prem side and spend £7m on lads for the bench? Because that's what we've done. 

[Ewood Ace]

I honestly think that it might be best for Rovers and Brereton long term if he went out on loan into League 1 for the second half of the season to start some and try to get some goals and confidence. Of course it would be hugely embarrassing for Mowbray to have to loan out his £7 million man but if the second half of the season is going to be the same as the first half then he is only going to lose confidence by sitting on the bench and being reduced to cameo appearances here and there. 

[blueboy3333]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

As I said though, the price tag and how the money should have been spent is something to be critical of Mowbray about, not Brereton. 

Exactly. Players don't sign themselves and decide the fee. That doesn't make the criticism of the signing any less valid though when there are glaring weaknesses in other areas of the pitch.

Lets be honest, spending £7m on a lad to sit on the bench in the Championship is insane. He'll be one of the top earners too as our current record signing. His agent will have seen to that. 

[SBlue]

4 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

And still the problem position 'up top' remains unsolved. BB might be the answer in the future. At £7m he should be the answer now yet he can't even get a game. 

Unless of course we are now able to spend like a Prem side and spend £7m on lads for the bench? Because that's what we've done. 

I struggle to think of a striker we could get that is better than DG, at a good age, for £7m or less?

[blueboy3333]

Just now, S8 & Blue said:

I struggle to think of a striker we could get that is better than DG, at a good age, for £7m or less?

Straw man. BB is not worth £7m. He can't even get in the team and when he's on the pitch he looks no better than Nuttall who was free or Samuel who cost £500k.  That is all.  If you think he looks like a £7m player then fair enough. 

Anyway, it's not really relevant if you know any strikers better than DG and what they'll cost. You aren't paid to know. Mowbray and his scouting team are. I doubt you knew much about Dack. 

[JBiz]

8 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

Exactly. Players don't sign themselves and decide the fee. That doesn't make the criticism of the signing any less valid though when there are glaring weaknesses in other areas of the pitch.

Lets be honest, spending £7m on a lad to sit on the bench in the Championship is insane. He'll be one of the top earners too as our current record signing. His agent will have seen to that. 

Comparing 7m spent now and 15 years, or even 5 years ago is silly. There’s also little chance the club would destroy a wage budget on a 19 year old. Since we are both assuming, isn’t it common sense to think we might’ve paid a bit more on the fee because the wages are reasonable? 

8 minutes ago, S8 & Blue said:

I struggle to think of a striker we could get that is better than DG, at a good age, for £7m or less?

Shhh, don’t you know we should be top because that 7m could’ve bought a whole new team?

[Ewood Ace]

13 minutes ago, S8 & Blue said:

I struggle to think of a striker we could get that is better than DG, at a good age, for £7m or less?

Since last June the following have all moved for £7 Million or less. Norwich got Pukki on a free. Brentford got Maupay for £1.5 Million. Leeds got Bamford for £7 Million. Forest got Grabban for £6 Million. Brentford also signed Watkins for around £2 Million. I'd also be surprised if you couldn't get someone like Lucas Joao for £7 million or less. I'd also suggest that £7 Million would very much tempt Preston for Robinson or Birmingham for Adams. And even you couldn't get someone for £7 Million that still doesn't make Brereton worth it.

Edited December 16, 2018 by Ewood Ace

[blueboy3333]

Just now, Biz said:

Comparing 7m spent now and 15 years, or even 5 years ago is silly.

Straw man. I didn't do that. I just said we'd paid £7m for a lad to sit on the bench. If you think that's normal in the Championship in 2018 then it probably explains your standpoint. You're wrong, but you're entitled to your opinion?