Ben Brereton Diaz

[Bigdoggsteel]

5 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

I wouldnt be starting him ahead of DG anyway but he needs to be his direct replacement when he invariably tires in games. That said, somebody highlighted how many points we have dropped once DG is off the pitch - though whether this is actually linked or as a team mentally and/or tactically we just do not have the ability to hold on to winning positions is another debate. 

More to do with the fact its always late in the game. When we are defending a lead ,we sit back. I suppose you could argue Graham is a better defender. He clears a lot of corners 

[Bigdoggsteel]

9 minutes ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

Thinking about it I think my main issue with brereton is that he doesn’t ooze cockiness or that slightly nasty streak good strikers have. Looks like a nice lad you would take for tea with your gran. If a big boy asks him to give him the ball he would burst into tears. There is a swagger and a it’s your fault I missed that open goal attitude that I like to see I’m just not seeing. Doesn’t look like he is prepared to put himself about in a hard tussle and that concerns me

Mmm, this is true. Although Graham is nice, but he has a nasty streak when it comes to mixing it physically with defenders. 

Wasn't it yourself who brought up Fletchers displays in the Sunderland show? Now he is a wind bag. I must say though I have seen Brereton giving opposition players lip and that time him and Dack kept the ball in the corner near the end of the game showed balls/cheek. 

Actually ter 3 words I highlighted above could definitely, 100% be used to describe Dack. 

[Bbrovers2288]

Yea it was, he slightly reminds me of fletcher at this point in time, I just want to see more oomph and cockiness in saying to mowbray you will play me and I will score 

[Bigdoggsteel]

If you aren't a top class finisher, you have to be able to mix it with centre halves in the championship physically. 

[tomphil]

3 hours ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

I’m sure you would have been first to welcome him buying ten League One players. 

Spending 7 million on several of the best proven players from there under 25 would have held as much merit as 7 mil on this kid i'd wager.

[tomphil]

1 hour ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

Thinking about it I think my main issue with brereton is that he doesn’t ooze cockiness or that slightly nasty streak good strikers have. Looks like a nice lad you would take for tea with your gran. If a big boy asks him to give him the ball he would burst into tears. There is a swagger and a it’s your fault I missed that open goal attitude that I like to see I’m just not seeing. Doesn’t look like he is prepared to put himself about in a hard tussle and that concerns me

Academies churn out lads like that by the dozen these days the rules of the game have beaten out real characters over recent years. Opposition players would rather hug each other.

[bluebruce]

6 hours ago, blueboy3333 said:

The £7m is guaranteed. Then there are add-ons. This has been confirmed by Sharpe and the Forest journo. Add the salary over 4 years and you are looking at £13-£15m anyway for BB. There are absolutely no guarantees we will get any of that back. He could have bought 10 Dacks instead.  That is your financial comparison.

Wow, when you put it like that, we should just go buy at www.dacksfor750k.com

Dunno if we need ten of him though. Not sure he's much use in defence.

[Stuart]

1 hour ago, bluebruce said:

Wow, when you put it like that, we should just go buy at www.dacksfor750k.com

Dunno if we need ten of him though. Not sure he's much use in defence.

“Park the fridge”

[toogs]

8 hours ago, blueboy3333 said:

The £7m is guaranteed. Then there are add-ons. This has been confirmed by Sharpe and the Forest journo. Add the salary over 4 years and you are looking at £13-£15m anyway for BB. There are absolutely no guarantees we will get any of that back. He could have bought 10 Dacks instead.  That is your financial comparison.

So just to confirm, we have to hand over 7m PLUS potential add ons for Breteton?  This is absolutely confirmed?

Then there’s wages?

It’s often said that football is a business. No businesses are run like that in the real world. 

[Exiled in Toronto]

3 hours ago, tomphil said:

Spending 7 million on several of the best proven players from there under 25 would have held as much merit as 7 mil on this kid i'd wager.

One would hope so but isn’t that what Ipswich did over the summer?

 

[JacknOry]

38 minutes ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

One would hope so but isn’t that what Ipswich did over the summer?

 

Not quite, they picked up one in Edwards and the rest were pretty much his old players for Shrewsbury that had just had a miracle one-off season.

[blueboy3333]

7 hours ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

I’m sure you would have been first to welcome him buying ten League One players. 

I always enjoy it when you can no longer back up your arguments and have to resort to playing the man. 

Edited December 19, 2018 by blueboy3333

[blueboy3333]

1 hour ago, toogs said:

So just to confirm, we have to hand over 7m PLUS potential add ons for Breteton?  This is absolutely confirmed?

Then there’s wages?

It’s often said that football is a business. No businesses are run like that in the real world. 

Confirmed by both the Rovers and Forest journo's. 

I'd suggest he's on £750k - £1m per year over 4 years. There's another £4m. 

£13m total cost won't be far away. 

[blueboy3333]

1 hour ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

One would hope so but isn’t that what Ipswich did over the summer?

 

No.

[blueboy3333]

4 hours ago, bluebruce said:

Wow, when you put it like that, we should just go buy at www.dacksfor750k.com

Dunno if we need ten of him though. Not sure he's much use in defence.

He's better than Bell. 

Team full Of Bradleys, we've got a team full of Bradleys.

Edited December 19, 2018 by blueboy3333

[Exiled in Toronto]

31 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

I always enjoy it when you can no longer back up your arguments and have to resort to playing the man. 

Buying ten Bradley Dacks wasn’t an argument

Edited December 19, 2018 by Exiled in Toronto

[bluebruce]

21 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

He's better than Bell. 

Team full Of Bradleys, we've got a team full of Bradleys.

Aye, he is. There's the rub though - Bell cost about 500k. For every Dack you unearth buying that way, you're probably looking at a few Bells and one or two inbetween. You can't just go land ten of him with the Brereton money.

I do think the money could have been spent more wisely, though.

[tomphil]

2 hours ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

One would hope so but isn’t that what Ipswich did over the summer?

 

Not sure but i'd say we've a better squad to bolt the right players onto than them so the starting point is better. It's all in the recruitment obviously but generally players got from down there have served us quite well so far.

 

Edited December 19, 2018 by tomphil

[47er]

7 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

 

 I must say though I have seen Brereton giving opposition players lip and that time him and Dack kept the ball in the corner near the end of the game showed balls/cheek. 

 

That should keep the critics quiet! 

Edited December 19, 2018 by 47er

[toogs]

1 hour ago, blueboy3333 said:

Confirmed by both the Rovers and Forest journo's. 

I'd suggest he's on £750k - £1m per year over 4 years. There's another £4m. 

£13m total cost won't be far away. 

Good god we are as barmy as ever under Venkys. Nothing really ever changes does it. 

[JBiz]

1 hour ago, blueboy3333 said:

Confirmed by both the Rovers and Forest journo's. 

I'd suggest he's on £750k - £1m per year over 4 years. There's another £4m. 

£13m total cost won't be far away. 

1,000,000 a year is 20k a week. I’m not convinced he will be on that. 12.5k a week starting wage would be my estimate, putting him in the Nyambe, Raya, Lenihan category in the club, behind the Mulgrew, Graham, Evans and Dack wages.

Confirmed?

All say slightly different things.

1. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/45334243

”up to 7m”

2. https://www.nottinghampost.com/sport/football/football-news/hopefully-ben-brereton-not-regretting-2142865

”7m

3. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-6108209/Blackburn-Rovers-complete-initial-loan-signing-Nottingham-Forest-striker-Ben-Brereton.html

”with a view to a permenant”

4. https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16984616.rovers-have-big-belief-in-brereton-says-ceo-waggott/

“region of 7m” and “budgeted”

 

The main answer on financing, about why and how is below; (from Waggott)

“I just asked whether we could flex it between transfer money and wages accordingly, but not breach it.

“If someone came along that meant we had to diminish wages to get that player, or vice versa, could we flex it and they said yes.”

So there it is. We could afford a bigger transfer fee, because Ben was a cheaper contract.

Potentially due of age or no prem experience, or because he wasn’t courted by a team who are immediately able to offer the higher champ wages that went to Swansea’s, Stokes, Forests, Derby's and Leeds attacking signings.

 

Edited December 19, 2018 by Biz

[blueboy3333]

14 minutes ago, Biz said:

So there it is. We could afford a bigger transfer fee, because Ben was a cheaper contract.

That's not a good thing when he can't get a game. We've paid £7m for a sub and are paying him good money to be a sub.

I'll stick with £13m total cost over the length of his contract. 

[47er]

20 minutes ago, Biz said:

1,000,000 a year is 20k a week. I’m not convinced he will be on that. 12.5k a week starting wage would be my estimate, putting him in the Nyambe, Raya, Lenihan category in the club, behind the Mulgrew, Graham, Evans and Dack wages.

Confirmed?

All say slightly different things.

1. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/45334243

”up to 7m”

2. https://www.nottinghampost.com/sport/football/football-news/hopefully-ben-brereton-not-regretting-2142865

”7m

3. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-6108209/Blackburn-Rovers-complete-initial-loan-signing-Nottingham-Forest-striker-Ben-Brereton.html

”with a view to a permenant”

4. https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16984616.rovers-have-big-belief-in-brereton-says-ceo-waggott/

“region of 7m” and “budgeted”

 

The main answer on financing, about why and how is below; (from Waggott)

“I just asked whether we could flex it between transfer money and wages accordingly, but not breach it.

“If someone came along that meant we had to diminish wages to get that player, or vice versa, could we flex it and they said yes.”

So there it is. We could afford a bigger transfer fee, because Ben was a cheaper contract.

Potentially due of age or no prem experience, or because he wasn’t courted by a team who are immediately able to offer the higher champ wages that went to Swansea’s, Stokes, Forests, Derby's and Leeds attacking signings.

 

Are you saying there's a chance we don't have to sign him? 

[Leonard Venkhater]

55 minutes ago, 47er said:

That should keep the critics quiet! 

Haha

[Mercer]

2 hours ago, blueboy3333 said:

Confirmed by both the Rovers and Forest journo's. 

I'd suggest he's on £750k - £1m per year over 4 years. There's another £4m. 

£13m total cost won't be far away. 

Many people overlook the fact that employers' NI adds almost 14% to the cost.  In other words, based upon your example, Rovers would pay employers' NI of approx. £100k to £140k pa !  It's a staggering additional cost. 

My estimate, as previously posted, was between £12m and £15m.  Staggering for a lad who only sits on the bench.

Edited December 19, 2018 by Mercer