Ben Brereton Diaz

[JBiz]

39 minutes ago, tomphil said:

We hope it works out but in no way can this be dressed up as a 'sensible approach' it's an expensive calculated gamble is what it is.

All transfers are gambles. Compared to cost of a prem experienced and established player - it’s certainly a lot less of a gamble in value. Whilst you’ll probably get more initially from those experienced/established players - is the 2/3x a week wage a sensible approach for a team that’s just come back from league 1 after being bled dry by “established” players on big wages?

Id say putting money into potential is far more long term and sensible than putting 150k a week into 3 or 4 players in an attempt to get promoted first go.

[roversfan99]

18 minutes ago, Biz said:

 

If he doesn’t do what you think he’s a dud? Sorry Stuart, I just don’t understand your view point at all. He could be still looking for a start in March and turn out to be a cracking signing. He could also turn out for the game at Newcastle and then be a flop. 

Im also flabbergasted that you and others cannot see the difference in cost between signing someone on standard champ wages, and then the more qualified/expected to bag instantly type. The way you say we are skint too - do you realise why the debt is so high? Paying daft wages mate. Hence why it’s sensible to put any money we can spend into fees, younger players, projects we can likely get something back from.

Rhodes came from league one (6 years ago!) to us on 40k a week mate. Stupid wages but why did we pay it? We wanted to be at the front of the queue. Assombalonga was coveted by a few clubs when at forest - why do you think he’s now paid 50k a week (and still sitting on Boro’s bench)

Waggott himself has said that there was a budget and it flexed between wages/transfers. How you and others can’t see that the gulf between our top earners, and recently relegated from prem and/or city clubs going for immediate promotion, is crazy!

 

Good lord indeed. You’re missing the point again. 7m on a fee for a 19 year old is cheaper compared to spending 3/4m on someone who is 40/50k a week.

There is also a problem with this idea we should be able to find better players than our current 11 for a couple of million and standard championship wages. it’s not realistic to just expect that.

Why is that so hard to grasp? 

Its also not difficult to see why some of the better championship players are turning down prem clubs like Burnley, when they’re being given contracts from Villa, Forest, Boro etc that are 3/4m a year wages. 

7m is not exactly what I’d call daft money either. Yes, you could’ve arguably paid the transfer fees for Hugill, or the lad who went to Derby from Peterborough- but do we believe they fit into our wage setup?

Both went to recently relegated or city teams going for immediate promotion. When this sinks in, you both might be able to start looking at this deal without the “I hate Tony” mindset.

Final say on this, signing young/highly rated/potential players is a reason to be excited about the future for me,  NOT a reason to criticise the manager, the directors, the overall direction of the club, or Ben himself.

I still dont understand how you gave the signing of Brereron an 8 out of 10 judgement the other week. 

May I ask what you have seen to justify that? Theres no way that its been in a Rovers shirt, in the main hes done very little in his cameos. His price tag is a double edged sword, people are very protective of not over burdening him because of it but I think that the price tag is the only evidence we have that he has the ability to really make a name for himself at the moment, and if he had signed for 700k, based on his uneventful cameos and his goal record prior I dont think anyone would bat an eyelid if he was left out of the 18, and people as with Nuttall may have queried whether in fact a loan to the lower leagues is the best bet for him. 

Its perfectly reasonable to suggest, not that its easy to sign players, but that with the budget Mowbray had, no matter how much you seem to downplay it, you would hope we would have been able to improve our team more than we have.

Waggott confirmed that we are mid table in terms of wage budget and for some reason youve assumed that Brereton has come in on a pittance, and also shoot down any suggestions that we could have signed someone to have more of an impact or to provide actual competition for Graham. Your primary argument is to guess that any alternatives will be on wages far too high for us.

The "I hate Tony comment" is laughable. No one hates him, but hes not beyond reproach in terms of judgement over signings.

Only one of his signings has had a positive, consistent impact on the team AS OF YET, and thats Reed. Armstrong has played regularly but in the main looks poor at Championship level, and none of the other 5 have managed to really come close to establishing themselves in the side.

It is a very commonly held wise idea to sign younger players to develop, I dont think many would disagree with the concept in general. At this moment in time though, weve yet to see much to suggest that he could be an asset to profit on. We all hope he makes more of an impact but so far hes not had one.

[tomphil]

28 minutes ago, Biz said:

All transfers are gambles. Compared to cost of a prem experienced and established player - it’s certainly a lot less of a gamble in value. Whilst you’ll probably get more initially from those experienced/established players - is the 2/3x a week wage a sensible approach for a team that’s just come back from league 1 after being bled dry by “established” players on big wages?

Id say putting money into potential is far more long term and sensible than putting 150k a week into 3 or 4 players in an attempt to get promoted first go.

It's a fair argument but the balance is somewhere in between is it not ?  No one wants to go down the Murphy or Best route again I think they've actually realised that's not the way to go now.

Two of our best and most experienced reliable players came via big wages and long contracts on frees whilst the best quality player we have came in for less than a million before add on's and was under 25.   Surely that's the way to go for a club like us and if you are going to commit huge money go for some quality however the expense is packaged up - in terms of fee/wages/length of contract- to add straight on to what we have now. 

No need for boom and bust a plan over say three seasons is fine but i'd say there are good young players out there very gettable and affordable on fees and wages who are more akin to the Dack model than the Breretons who'll give a good potential return a bit quicker on and off the pitch. There is every possibility in 3 years time we'll still be waiting for Brereton to blossom he'll still be young but c10 million quid is still tied u in him that might have made a big difference to the team in that period invested a bit more cunningly.

Edited December 20, 2018 by tomphil

[Mattyblue]

I’m all for this young English player route, eminently sensible.

However, many of our top/established players are the likes of Mulgrew, Graham, Dack (25 next week),  Bennett, Evans. Experienced pros. We can’t approach every window with this ‘jam tomorrow’ method.

Biz - you said yesterday that you’d be happy to ‘buy players like Armstrong, Davenport and Brereton every window and we’ll develop a team to good enough to fight for promotion in a few years’.

We buy players like those 3 every summer and I’ll say we won’t be. Instead we’ll be constantly chasing our tail, as some of those young lads develop, some just don’t and the actual top players we have simply move on.

Edited December 20, 2018 by Mattyblue

[Bigdoggsteel]

47 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

I’m all for this young English player route, eminently sensible.

However, many of our top/established players are the likes of Mulgrew, Graham, Dack (25 next week),  Bennett, Evans. Experienced pros. We can’t approach every window with this ‘jam tomorrow’ method.

Biz - you said yesterday that you’d be happy to ‘buy players like Armstrong, Davenport and Brereton every window and we’ll develop a team to good enough to fight for promotion in a few years’.

We buy players like those 3 every summer and I’ll say we won’t be. Instead we’ll be constantly chasing our tail, as some of those young lads develop, some just don’t and the actual top players we have simply move on.

Yep, you need to sign some new Mulgrews, Bennetts and Evans. Solid or above proven Championship players

[G Somerset Rover]

76 pages already. How many will we be on when he starts his first league game? Or dare I say it, bags his first goal? 

[JBiz]

54 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I still dont understand how you gave the signing of Brereron an 8 out of 10 judgement the other week. 

May I ask what you have seen to justify that? Theres no way that its been in a Rovers shirt, in the main hes done very little in his cameos. His price tag is a double edged sword, people are very protective of not over burdening him because of it but I think that the price tag is the only evidence we have that he has the ability to really make a name for himself at the moment, and if he had signed for 700k, based on his uneventful cameos and his goal record prior I dont think anyone would bat an eyelid if he was left out of the 18, and people as with Nuttall may have queried whether in fact a loan to the lower leagues is the best bet for him. 

Its perfectly reasonable to suggest, not that its easy to sign players, but that with the budget Mowbray had, no matter how much you seem to downplay it, you would hope we would have been able to improve our team more than we have.

Waggott confirmed that we are mid table in terms of wage budget and for some reason youve assumed that Brereton has come in on a pittance, and also shoot down any suggestions that we could have signed someone to have more of an impact or to provide actual competition for Graham. Your primary argument is to guess that any alternatives will be on wages far too high for us.

The "I hate Tony comment" is laughable. No one hates him, but hes not beyond reproach in terms of judgement over signings.

Only one of his signings has had a positive, consistent impact on the team AS OF YET, and thats Reed. Armstrong has played regularly but in the main looks poor at Championship level, and none of the other 5 have managed to really come close to establishing themselves in the side.

It is a very commonly held wise idea to sign younger players to develop, I dont think many would disagree with the concept in general. At this moment in time though, weve yet to see much to suggest that he could be an asset to profit on. We all hope he makes more of an impact but so far hes not had one.

I gave the judgement for that signing for that particular thread in august, like most people. The reason why that thread was dredged up in reaction to a defeat is anyone's guess - and I still think our business last summer was exceptional - even with hindsight.

The price tag is only a double edge sword for those prepared to wield it as a criticism, and to up the expectation levels. It makes you look stupid, and it puts more expectation on the player when articles like HITC pick them up for click bait.

I am not sure where Nuttall comes into this either. If you are asking me why I wouldn't be over critical from what I have seen so far; We've barely seen what he can do. Not because he has flattered to deceive, but because his time on the pitch has been limited. The reasons for that (in my book) are Graham, our system and his readiness/age. Not some ridiculous contract agreement, Tony not wanting to play players he didn't choose or his limited ability.

It isn't a guess to look at Bamford and Celina (two others we tried to get according to reports) and see that their transfer fee + wage is likely a lot more expensive than a structured 7M + add ons, for a 19 year old with no premier league experience. It isn't a guess, it is simple maths. Even Mercer made the point about what 25k actually is including taxes. I'm not suggesting Brereton is on tiny wages either, but I expect (having read Waggotts comments) that his wage was more reasonable to allow that fee. 

The "I hate tony comment" is just tongue in cheek, but its no coincidence you've returned to this thread to pour more more cold water on any attempt to explain and see reasoning, sensible motives and a long term plan in signing Ben, and others new players.

Armstrong is also 21 - mainly looks poor at this level? I do not understand your readiness to simply say someone isn't good enough - remember, he scored last weekend, and is currently in a similar position (behind Conway if it wasn't for injury) as a member of the 18 but not starting 11. He is also like Ben, only 3 and bit months into his championship foray with us. At least give him time to develop?

1 hour ago, tomphil said:

It's a fair argument but the balance is somewhere in between is it not ?  No one wants to go down the Murphy or Best route again I think they've actually realised that's not the way to go now.

Two of our best and most experienced reliable players came via big wages and long contracts on frees whilst the best quality player we have came in for less than a million before add on's and was under 25.   Surely that's the way to go for a club like us and if you are going to commit huge money go for some quality however the expense is packaged up - in terms of fee/wages/length of contract- to add straight on to what we have now. 

No need for boom and bust a plan over say three seasons is fine but i'd say there are good young players out there very gettable and affordable on fees and wages who are more akin to the Dack model than the Breretons who'll give a good potential return a bit quicker on and off the pitch. There is every possibility in 3 years time we'll still be waiting for Brereton to blossom he'll still be young but c10 million quid is still tied u in him that might have made a big difference to the team in that period invested a bit more cunningly.

Of course - but I don't think there are as many of them options in the middle that we would want - I also think that when top level championship clubs are paying bigger wages than some lower premier league clubs, the competition to get those established players in this division becomes more difficult. Does anyone remember Mowbrays comments about when Bamford went to leeds?

I also think the Dack type of signing is rarer than something to be expected - How many players do you think we could sign from league one for less than a million, and within 12 months have the option to sell of nearly 20m? I reckon there will be some in there but its a difficult method. Ipswich brought a few players we would've loved, but they've ended up poor for changing some of their staff for less established second tier players and a manager.

1 hour ago, Mattyblue said:

I’m all for this young English player route, eminently sensible.

However, many of our top/established players are the likes of Mulgrew, Graham, Dack (25 next week),  Bennett, Evans. Experienced pros. We can’t approach every window with this ‘jam tomorrow’ method.

Biz - you said yesterday that you’d be happy to ‘buy players like Armstrong, Davenport and Brereton every window and we’ll develop a team to good enough to fight for promotion in a few years’.

We buy players like those 3 every summer and I’ll say we won’t be. Instead we’ll be constantly chasing our tail, as some of those young lads develop, some just don’t and the actual top players we have simply move on.

The idea is to have players in position to pick up the mantle with that process. For example, If Dack left in January - we'd potentially have Palmer or Rothwell to get involved in his role, or have the option of changing the system to two strikers (Graham/Ben/Armstrong) . Also, if he did get sold, a large amount of money to add young hungry footballers with room to improve.

It's not exactly what I'd call the most "ambitious" or instant route to promotion, but it is a method that a few other premier league clubs have taken to moving from second tier to first, and staying in there. Southampton and Bournemouth are good examples.

 

[Mattyblue]

‘Exceptional’ business in the summer?

Not one signing is first choice and they can’t displace players freshly out of League 1...

Edited December 20, 2018 by Mattyblue

[JBiz]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

‘Exceptional’ business in the summer?

Not one signing is first choice and can’t displace players freshly out of League 1...

I anticipated young cheap premier league or higher championship u23 loans, older cheap free's and more youth progressed into the first 18.

We got some exciting loans (even if one hasn't had the impact I would of thought; KP), three cash transfers; particularly highly rated potential players in Davenport, Armstrong and Ben and signed Rodwell and Rothwell - one (at the time of signing) could've been seen as a coup, a future captain if he regains any sort of ability/form of his earlier years. The other   (Rothwell) more of what I expected all our signings to be - but particularly impressive early days, and another at 23 that will get better.

How can I see that as anything but impressive? I know its a classic football cliche, but if you'd speculated that level of business over a pint after the Oxford game in May, I would've told you - "No chance"

[Mattyblue]

The fact you had low expectations in May doesn’t make those players ‘exceptional’ signings.

[JBiz]

11 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

The fact you had low expectations in May doesn’t make those players ‘exceptional’ signings.

You’re talking about 1 sentence of my views,  based on reaction to a thread titled “Transfer window; Success or Failure”. 

Even still, to add such potential and highly rated/sought after players into the club is quality transfer business - even if they are yet to displace those who (as we’ve been told) earned a crack/shift at this division last year.

 

[Rogerb]

1 hour ago, Gavlar Somerset Rover! said:

76 pages already. How many will we be on when he starts his first league game? Or dare I say it, bags his first goal? 

Depends how quickly he can develop that upper body strength.

[Mattyblue]

8 minutes ago, Biz said:

You’re talking about 1 sentence of my views,  based on reaction to a thread titled “Transfer window; Success or Failure”. 

Even still, to add such potential and highly rated/sought after players into the club is quality transfer business - even if they are yet to displace those who (as we’ve been told) earned a crack/shift at this division last year.

 

So ‘potentially’ exceptional then?

[JBiz]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

So ‘potentially’ exceptional then?

You’re talking about their overall impact of their deals, the 8/10 comment is taken out of context, a summary of one transfer window being excellent, exceptional or any adjective meaning “good” or better than anticipated.

Do I think they’ll all turn out exceptional signings? No. For instance Davenport has had poor luck with injuries and those are the kind of barriers for ANY signing, young or old.

Thats not to say I’m writing him off either! Hopefully the new year will see him get involved, Armstrong to score a few more and Ben to be more involved!

[Mattyblue]

I’m taking about this thread where you said it was an exceptional summer.

If in your opinion, it was, because you expected to sign journeymen free transfers etc, fair enough, but it wouldn’t be my description.

Edited December 20, 2018 by Mattyblue

[Dreams of 1995]

I thought we had a good transfer window in terms of players bought. I don't think we have used them half as much as I'd have liked though.

There has to be a point in the season where Rothwell and Rodwell get a run of games. Smallwood and Evans are hard working characters but, like it or not, are a huge part of the reason why we aren't putting games to bed. There's such a lack of game management in this team it's unbelievable and you can't help but think a person of Rodwell's experience would go a huge way in seeing games out as opposed to a tired, lethargic duo of Smallwood/Evans.

As a conclusion though if we are to judge the summer window, up until January transfer window, it's hardly been 'exceptional' or even good. There's a chance that there could well be some good additions but, saving Reed who is on loan, no player has really stood up and made to be counted in a team you could argue is more than replaceable.

[Bigdoggsteel]

11 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

I thought we had a good transfer window in terms of players bought. I don't think we have used them half as much as I'd have liked though.

There has to be a point in the season where Rothwell and Rodwell get a run of games. Smallwood and Evans are hard working characters but, like it or not, are a huge part of the reason why we aren't putting games to bed. There's such a lack of game management in this team it's unbelievable and you can't help but think a person of Rodwell's experience would go a huge way in seeing games out as opposed to a tired, lethargic duo of Smallwood/Evans.

As a conclusion though if we are to judge the summer window, up until January transfer window, it's hardly been 'exceptional' or even good. There's a chance that there could well be some good additions but, saving Reed who is on loan, no player has really stood up and made to be counted in a team you could argue is more than replaceable.

I think your first sentence explains the issue in your last sentence. The players signed, like Rothwell and Rodwell have not been given enough time. I like Smallwood, but he isn't going to be joining Man city for almost £20 million any time so, as Rodwell did. If Rodwell is fit, he could be head and shoulders above other midfielders in the league. He isn't in his mid 30s, he is in his prime. It's odd Mowbray only seems keen on playing him centre half, well I suppose he isn't on the wing at least

Edited December 20, 2018 by Bigdoggsteel

[Dreams of 1995]

10 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I think your first sentence explains the issue in your last sentence. The players signed, like Rothwell and Rodwell have not been given enough time. I like Smallwood, but he isn't going to be joining Man city for almost £20 million any time so, as Rodwell did. If Rodwell is fit, he could be head and shoulders above other midfielders in the league. He isn't in his mid 30s, he is in his prime. It's odd Mowbray only seems keen on playing him centre half, well I suppose he isn't on the wing at least

Yeah. There must be something above our level of understanding of the tactical side of the game to as why Rodwell/Rothwell aren't playing more regularly. With BB you get the impression that he simply isn't ready to be shunted regularly in our first team - whether you agree with his transfer fee or not - whereas Rothwell and Rodwell have been more than good enough to command first team games when they have come on.

Either there is reasoning to his methods or Mowbray is sticking to what he knows (overly cautious?). I don't for an instance think this current starting 11 will ever get us relegated but I don't think we will get any further either. It's all well and good "signing potential" but eventually they have to realise that potential; they won't do that sat on the bench watching Smallwood and Evans run around the pitch like men possessed.

[Bigdoggsteel]

7 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

Yeah. There must be something above our level of understanding of the tactical side of the game to as why Rodwell/Rothwell aren't playing more regularly. With BB you get the impression that he simply isn't ready to be shunted regularly in our first team - whether you agree with his transfer fee or not - whereas Rothwell and Rodwell have been more than good enough to command first team games when they have come on.

Either there is reasoning to his methods or Mowbray is sticking to what he knows (overly cautious?). I don't for an instance think this current starting 11 will ever get us relegated but I don't think we will get any further either. It's all well and good "signing potential" but eventually they have to realise that potential; they won't do that sat on the bench watching Smallwood and Evans run around the pitch like men possessed.

It is being over cautious/loyal. Simple as that. Rodwell and Rothwell should have played more. 

[frosty]

I can't imagine Rothwell is happy having only started once (I think - Bolton away) in the league. Mowbray said he was like a pitbull ready to be let off the leash, that was a couple of months ago I think so I can't even imagine how he is now.

I'd say to Rothwell "I'm going to give you a run of half a dozen starts, go out there and make it impossible for me to leave you out again". 

He's got technical ability, a spark and a drive that we don't otherwise have and I'd like to see him get a chance. 

[roversfan99]

2 hours ago, Biz said:

I gave the judgement for that signing for that particular thread in august, like most people. The reason why that thread was dredged up in reaction to a defeat is anyone's guess - and I still think our business last summer was exceptional - even with hindsight.

The price tag is only a double edge sword for those prepared to wield it as a criticism, and to up the expectation levels. It makes you look stupid, and it puts more expectation on the player when articles like HITC pick them up for click bait.

I am not sure where Nuttall comes into this either. If you are asking me why I wouldn't be over critical from what I have seen so far; We've barely seen what he can do. Not because he has flattered to deceive, but because his time on the pitch has been limited. The reasons for that (in my book) are Graham, our system and his readiness/age. Not some ridiculous contract agreement, Tony not wanting to play players he didn't choose or his limited ability.

It isn't a guess to look at Bamford and Celina (two others we tried to get according to reports) and see that their transfer fee + wage is likely a lot more expensive than a structured 7M + add ons, for a 19 year old with no premier league experience. It isn't a guess, it is simple maths. Even Mercer made the point about what 25k actually is including taxes. I'm not suggesting Brereton is on tiny wages either, but I expect (having read Waggotts comments) that his wage was more reasonable to allow that fee. 

The "I hate tony comment" is just tongue in cheek, but its no coincidence you've returned to this thread to pour more more cold water on any attempt to explain and see reasoning, sensible motives and a long term plan in signing Ben, and others new players.

Armstrong is also 21 - mainly looks poor at this level? I do not understand your readiness to simply say someone isn't good enough - remember, he scored last weekend, and is currently in a similar position (behind Conway if it wasn't for injury) as a member of the 18 but not starting 11. He is also like Ben, only 3 and bit months into his championship foray with us. At least give him time to develop?

Of course - but I don't think there are as many of them options in the middle that we would want - I also think that when top level championship clubs are paying bigger wages than some lower premier league clubs, the competition to get those established players in this division becomes more difficult. Does anyone remember Mowbrays comments about when Bamford went to leeds?

I also think the Dack type of signing is rarer than something to be expected - How many players do you think we could sign from league one for less than a million, and within 12 months have the option to sell of nearly 20m? I reckon there will be some in there but its a difficult method. Ipswich brought a few players we would've loved, but they've ended up poor for changing some of their staff for less established second tier players and a manager.

The idea is to have players in position to pick up the mantle with that process. For example, If Dack left in January - we'd potentially have Palmer or Rothwell to get involved in his role, or have the option of changing the system to two strikers (Graham/Ben/Armstrong) . Also, if he did get sold, a large amount of money to add young hungry footballers with room to improve.

It's not exactly what I'd call the most "ambitious" or instant route to promotion, but it is a method that a few other premier league clubs have taken to moving from second tier to first, and staying in there. Southampton and Bournemouth are good examples.

 

How can you say its exceptional business? 3 goals between 4 attacking players with a combined cost of close to 10m suggests theyve yet to have a significant impact. Not denying their talent but theres no way you can say theyve been exceptional pieces of business at this point in time. If you said "theyve yet to really have an impact but I believe they will in time" then that would be much fairer.

Your figures for Bamford and in particular Celina are total guesses. Swansea spent a small fraction of their incomings and have relied a lot on youth so I am skeptical of your assumption that they are spending loads more than we could afford.

Armstrong has been nowhere near as effective as he was last year in League 1, theres no way you can suggest otherwise.

I have never suggested that we arent playing Brereton due to the managers disgruntlement over signings above his head, contractual reasons, any of that. I am basing him solely on footballing matters. 

I also do agree in theory with mainly signing younger players to develop. But we are judging them as individuals. 

I feel like you are overestimating their youth and portraying them as being less ready than they are. Rodwell and Palmer are only here for a year so any impact needs to be this season. Rothwell and Brereton have played enough at previous clubs to make Mowbray interested in the first place.

Much of your argument is based around totally hypothetical figures, the difficulty of signing players in general and an underestimation of the fact that we do offer competitive wages at this level. Not with Villa, Stoke etc but 10th-16th as Waggott said.

You are seemingly reluctant to admit that the signings bar Reed have had a significant impact thus far, calling them exceptional is presumably not at all based on what they have shown in a Rovers shirt.

We made numerous signings for a lot of money combined to improve our squad, in particular going forward, with Mowbray often talking about making us play more attractive, passing football. At the moment, our team is the most direct in the league statistically, and for goals we are almost totally reliant on the Graham and Dack partnership we had last season, or Mulgrew set pieces. Beyond that our few goalscorers are on 1s and 2s. As it stands the new signings have not developed our team in the way we may have hoped, not that they may not in the future, fans are perhaps slightly frustrated not to see more of them, and as a result to describe the business as exceptional.

[OJRovers]

42 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

It is being over cautious/loyal. Simple as that. Rodwell and Rothwell should have played more. 

To be fair to Mowbray, we've already got a lot of young regular players in the 1st team (Raya, Nyambe, Bell, Armstrong, Reed, Lennihan). 

I said it before when someone mentioned Brereton's age/experience. That can't be the factors holding him back from starting, because he's got more Championship playing experience than most of the starting XI.

Agreed that Rodwell and Rothwell should have more game time. They have both played well when brought in.

 

[Rogerb]

3 hours ago, Gavlar Somerset Rover! said:

76 pages already. How many will we be on when he starts his first league game? Or dare I say it, bags his first goal? 

Depends how quickly he can develop that upper body strength. If you look at how Nyambe has bulked up in the last two years Ben is still growing at 19 could be a monster in two years time.

[blueboy3333]

8 hours ago, Biz said:

£7m on a fee for a 19 year old is cheaper compared to spending 3/4m on someone who is 40/50k a week.

Who mentioned 40/50kpw?

 

8 hours ago, Biz said:

7m is not exactly what I’d call daft money either. Yes, you could’ve arguably paid the transfer fees for Hugill, or the lad who went to Derby from Peterborough- but do we believe they fit into our wage setup?

Not daft? £7m for a lad who's not ready to play according to the man who signed him. As a mid-table payer of wages there will be quite a few players who can contribute now who will fit into our wage budget. Those players are playing for other clubs and didn't cost £7m. 

[JBiz]

8 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

Who mentioned 40/50kpw?

 

Not daft? £7m for a lad who's not ready to play according to the man who signed him. As a mid-table payer of wages there will be quite a few players who can contribute now who will fit into our wage budget. Those players are playing for other clubs and didn't cost £7m. 

That’s the going wage for a top championship player, keep up. Without even mentioning Tax/Ni.

Who are these strikers that fit into that profile then Blueboy?