Attendances

[Neal]

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16908899.tony-mowbray-feels-a-warmth-from-fans-to-rovers-players/?ref=mac

 

Felt sorry for Mowbray here and thought was a worthy topic for some open and frank discussion. As many of you are aware, I was a big advocate of the NAPM movement and numerous other protests, particularly when the club was on its arse under Ke*n and Coyle. In these situations, as the saying goes... Desperate times called for desperate measures and if in some way our actions helped to get us in the position we're in now then I don't regret it... If we're being honest though, it was Kean and Coyle's downright ineptitude that cost them their jobs. These days things are much more positive, (on the footballing side at least) yet the aftermath of the damage done by numerous poor managerial appointments, poor management by V*nkys is having a major effect on attendences at home. It's to be expected of course, some people lost faith, lost trust, lost the habit, lost the enjoyment, there are many variables I suppose. I lost most of those things but I always believed this club could find its way back somehow, that's why I still cared and fought for its future. Like many others, under Tony Mowbray I've found something to believe in again, I feel as if he's trustworthy, honest, decent, commited, all the things that I can't say about hardly anyone at Rovers since they took over. Because of this, I feel as I can find some identity with the club again, I look at the way he conducts himself and how the players perform and personally can't help but feel they deserve my support. I can see how other fans of this club and of others would see this as fickle or such like, fair enough, that's their opinion but it's as simple as giving the fans something to believe in, which TM has done both off and on the pitch. Yes Venkys are still the owners and yes they are ignorant but it works both ways and 2 can play that game, I'll ignore their existence as much as they ignore ours but as long as they support TM I couldn't care less. I'm not so short sighted and naive to think that this couldn't all fall apart in the drop of a hat and I doubt many reading this are either, the debt is still there and they still own the club... Whilst V*nkys are in charge anything is possible as we all know. That aside I feel this is a great opportunity to get back to supporting the club whilst there is something/someone worth while to support and make the most of this opportunity... Which bings me on to my main point...

 

The club also needs to do something to seize this opportunity, look at the Oxford game, it doesn't take a scientist to work out why there were so many fans. Empty seats are no good to anyone so why not just do something absolutely radical like season tickets for £150 or a tenner a game? Yet prices increased, I just don't get it. There was an opportunity to really capitalise on that Oxford game that was obviously completely overlooked, perhaps its the decision makers being out of touch with the previous years and general damage that has been done but to use the phrase again... Desperate times call for desperate measures. The club need to try something new,  look at the Bundesliga prices, try something like all tickets from Christmas onwards are £10 and fill the ground as much as we can, it could be pivotal to keeping us up or pushing us up the table. 

 

I hope people at the club are reading this and if you are... Be radical, talk to the fans, give everyone of every income the opportunity to support their local team, be pioneers against pricing poople out of football. Don't look to other clubs as measurement for value for money, set a new standard. We are fighting an ever more losing battle against ifollow and the red button and we have nothing to lose!

 

TMBWA.

 

 

Edited September 28, 2018 by Neal

[Mattyblue]

Good post, though I do think you’d get diminishing returns with £10 tickets every week. Though nearly £30 a game is absolutely crackers.

Mods: maybe merge this with the season ticket thread?

Edited September 28, 2018 by Mattyblue

[Neal]

23 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Good post, though I do think you’d get diminishing returns with £10 tickets every week. Though nearly £30 a game is absolutely crackers.

Mods: maybe merge this with the season ticket thread?

 

Could do but thought it would be better to have a separate on to discuss each game attendances, innovative ideas to increase gates, away attendances and ticket prices etc...

Edited September 28, 2018 by Neal

[Mattyblue]

The season ticket thread has turned into that now anyway.

[Neal]

1 minute ago, Mattyblue said:

The season ticket thread has turned into that now anyway.

 Ok, whatever mods want to do.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

You want bigger attendances at Ewood?....make it more affordable for Joe Public.

Mr Waggot,you had the chance to capitalize with the Promotion feel good factor but chose to raise prices...no good moaning now fella!

[Dreams of 1995]

Waggott obviously has the business idea out of making the most from what little he has. He's obviously decided that by charging the remaining 10 or so thousand that go regularly more he'd make more money than halving the cost of tickets for a possible extra 2 thousand. 

The truth is that people want to watch quality. We haven't had that for years and, with the off field issues also, it has led to a demise in attendance. I'd bet my last quid that if Rovers can still get play offs then the final 3 or 4 home games will see a rise in attendances. Likewise a return to the Premier League will see crowds of 20k returning also.

The boycott has died a death. There are of course a few hundred, maybe even a thousand, still actively "boycotting" but most that began the boycott now simply don't go because they have found other ways to fill their time. I would go as far as to say that even if Venkys went tomorrow we may see a boom in attendances for a few weeks but it would slowly dwindle back down to regular levels. 

We have to understand that as a club we are in a competitive area. The town is small, and a fair portion of the population have no real love for the game let alone the club, and it's become less of a youth pursuit to follow their local club up and down the country. Short of making it to the PL we'll only really have attendances like we used to have (20k+) for derbies, big cup games or games like Oxford where there is a real chance of winning something.

[Neal]

1 hour ago, Mattyblue said:

Good post, though I do think you’d get diminishing returns with £10 tickets every week. Though nearly £30 a game is absolutely crackers.

 

Was thinking about this, what about some sort of loyalty scheme that say your first ticket is 20 quid you get 2 pounds knocked off your next ticket and max lowest price is £10. If you miss a game then it goes back up to £20.

[justjonny]

I remember when they had those loyalty cards, was it go to 5 games and get 1 free? Or something along the lines of that.

[JBiz]

For me, the easiest long term solution has always been kids should go for free.

The actual age limit is subjective, but many (like me) who watched football regularly between the ages of 6-16 will be hooked for life.

Obviously - being 6 in 1991, 10 in 95 and 16/17 during Souness/Hughes era is a bit different to turning 6 in 2008 (when venkys took over) but I still think that our club lacks many offers like this.

For instance, I don’t recall my workplace (school in east Lancashire) ever being offered free or subsidised tickets. I’m quite sure the primary schools still have this system, and it might be a lazy PE teacher not answering letters but from discussions I’ve had with many other secondary teachers in Blackburn, Accrington and similar - the offers have somewhat dried up in recent years.

This is probably due to funding cuts in local area and maybe even more stringent safeguarding (CRB cost for volunteers etc), but every time I see an empty seat at Ewood, I always think the long term profits would outweigh the short term cost of giving ALL unsold tickets away, some snacks, and paying for youth workers to drive them to and from, whilst looking after them during the match.

Maybe the club is doing their utmost in this area and the clamour from schools isn’t there, but I seriously doubt this is the case.

[blueboy3333]

…. and many also stop going to games when they get to their late teens/early 20's and other things start to take up their limited resources, at a time when Bank of Mum and Dad are no longer buying their ST's. This is why clubs (including tomorrows opponents Forest) are selling a ST for under 23's for £100.

“Following consultation with various fan representatives, it also became apparent that making football more accessible for young supporters was crucial.As a result, the club is delighted to offer significant price decreases for 2018/19 Season Cards for fans from the age of four right through to the age of 23" - David Cook, Chief Commercial Officer at Forest.

https://www.nottinghampost.com/sport/football/nottingham-forest-reveal-new-season-1262904

So what exactly are our fans representatives doing? Are they not listened to by the club or are they just as out of touch as Waggott and Co and see no reason to push cheaper tickets for younger fans?

For comparison if you're under 24 at Forest you get a ST for £100. At Rovers you pay between £195 and £299 aged 18-21. Over 21 and your paying full price.

In the best stand at Ewood at the age of 22-23 you're paying £499. At Forest it's £100!!!!!!!!!

At Rovers aged 12-17 you pay between £90 and £110. At Forest it's £50.

At Rovers aged 0-11 you pay between £60 and £75. At Forest it's £10. Under 4's are free at Forest I think. 

Above the age of 75 they are also reduced from the usual OAP price. At Rovers that doesn't happen. 

When NFFC can reduce prices by so much (because they have done their research) and they averaged 25K last season with a much bigger fanbase then WTF are Rovers playing at???

 Answers on a postcard to Waggott and Mowbray c/o Ewood Park.

 

Edited September 28, 2018 by blueboy3333

[AAK]

1 hour ago, blueboy3333 said:

…. and many also stop going to games when they get to their late teens/early 20's and other things start to take up their limited resources, at a time when Bank of Mum and Dad are no longer buying their ST's. This is why clubs (including tomorrows opponents Forest) are selling a ST for under 23's for £100.

“Following consultation with various fan representatives, it also became apparent that making football more accessible for young supporters was crucial.As a result, the club is delighted to offer significant price decreases for 2018/19 Season Cards for fans from the age of four right through to the age of 23" - David Cook, Chief Commercial Officer at Forest.

https://www.nottinghampost.com/sport/football/nottingham-forest-reveal-new-season-1262904

So what exactly are our fans representatives doing? Are they not listened to by the club or are they just as out of touch as Waggott and Co and see no reason to push cheaper tickets for younger fans?

For comparison if you're under 24 at Forest you get a ST for £100. At Rovers you pay between £195 and £299 aged 18-21. Over 21 and your paying full price.

In the best stand at Ewood at the age of 22-23 you're paying £499. At Forest it's £100!!!!!!!!!

At Rovers aged 12-17 you pay between £90 and £110. At Forest it's £50.

At Rovers aged 0-11 you pay between £60 and £75. At Forest it's £10. Under 4's are free at Forest I think. 

Above the age of 75 they are also reduced from the usual OAP price. At Rovers that doesn't happen. 

When NFFC can reduce prices by so much (because they have done their research) and they averaged 25K last season with a much bigger fanbase then WTF are Rovers playing at???

 Answers on a postcard to Waggott and Mowbray c/o Ewood Park.

 

Very good post, Mattyblue will like this. 

[Mattyblue]

Ha! I assume we’ve had a similar conversation! Or should I say rant? 

[AAK]

43 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Ha! I assume we’ve had a similar conversation! Or should I say rant? 

Yes mate ?. You are very good with stuff like this to be fair. 

[gumboots]

The problem is, there is no comparison between us and Forest. Nottingham is a big city and there's a huge student population with 2 universities so there are plenty of potential ticket purchasers. Having said that, I might be free tomorrow and decide I fancy going to Rovers. There's nothing to encourage me to go. If I don't decide and sort a ticket early in the day then I pay extra. I have to find somewhere to park when I get there. Compare that to last week when we decided to go to the AJ Bell to watch the Sharks. Park free at the Trafford Centre, free shuttle bus to and from the ground with priority given to getting the buses away post match, and tickets on sale up to kick off at the same price as if bought weeks in advance. I'm not suggesting Rovers could or should do all of that but the same price tickets would be a good start 

[blueboy3333]

Just now, gumboots said:

The problem is, there is no comparison between us and Forest. Nottingham is a big city and there's a huge student population with 2 universities so there are plenty of potential ticket purchasers.

Which is exactly the point. They have a far bigger fanbase, far bigger crowds yet are offering much cheaper tickets to their young fans. They aren't the only club doing it either. Shrewsbury and MK Dons have too. 

[Mattyblue]

Every club has a load of kids in the stands. The problem is that jump from parents paying to suddenly having to find hundreds of quid themselves for their now non child priced season ticket.

So plenty just stop going. Plus, many of that age group help whip up an atmosphere, so it’s a double loss. A Forest-esque initiative would help keep them in the tent.

Edited September 28, 2018 by Mattyblue

[gumboots]

Young people don't stay here though. Of my 4 who all had season tickets into their teens, the nearest one now lives south of Manchester. The others live on Tyneside, in Germany and in South Korea. Nowadays more kids go away to Uni and never come back. It's a problem many towns and rural areas have. 

[Mattyblue]

*Some* young people don’t stay here, plenty do and they need to be catered to.

There’s nearly 20,000 empty seats most weeks. What’s to lose? 

[blueboy3333]

6 minutes ago, gumboots said:

Young people don't stay here though. Of my 4 who all had season tickets into their teens, the nearest one now lives south of Manchester. The others live on Tyneside, in Germany and in South Korea. Nowadays more kids go away to Uni and never come back. It's a problem many towns and rural areas have. 

Not every 18-24 year old is at Uni. Not every 18-24 that turned up against Oxford and hasn't been back since (and there were thousands of them) is at Uni. 

[blueboy3333]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

*Some* young people don’t stay here, plenty do and they need to be catered to.

There’s nearly 20,000 empty seats most weeks. What’s to lose? 

All the research is out there. Young people don't attend football in the numbers they used to (it's one of the reasons for the lack of atmosphere in many grounds). The BBE is full of 40 year olds. If those young people were offered a £100 ticket (and the other deals Forest offer) it might put 2,000 on the gate. It certainly wouldn't lose any fans. £400 tickets for 22 year olds will though. I think Waggott and Mowbray think Blackburn is a tax haven for the rich. 

[gumboots]

I'm not suggesting all kids go away but town teams with a rural catchment area are affected more by young people moving away than a city team would. That's not to say the club couldn't do more for its young fans. Of course it could. As it could do more for families, older fans, etc. The fans have to be central to the clubs thinking and for a long time at Ewood they haven't been. They've been an inconvenience. That needs to change before fans will return in any significant numbers

[tomphil]

32 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

*Some* young people don’t stay here, plenty do and they need to be catered to.

There’s nearly 20,000 empty seats most weeks. What’s to lose? 

That's a good point and is part of what sets us apart from a lot of clubs the stadium has always been too big for the town so that's why for me its always called for something like a Bradford or Huddersfield effort on ST's.  Also to re-engage the fans regularly and on the back of promotion especially, we have it but don't use it properly the easy option is to just keep closing bits down.

They'll never create a demand outstripping supply situation at Ewood unless it was the size of Turd Moor so price increases although probably needed from a business sense  is counter productive.

Try and fill it not close it.

 

[chaddyrovers]

1 hour ago, gumboots said:

Young people don't stay here though. Of my 4 who all had season tickets into their teens, the nearest one now lives south of Manchester. The others live on Tyneside, in Germany and in South Korea. Nowadays more kids go away to Uni and never come back. It's a problem many towns and rural areas have. 

Its a decent point. I was set to go Newcastle university at 19 years old and if I gone up there Im not sure I would have come back down here to be honest. 

[47er]

1 hour ago, blueboy3333 said:

Not every 18-24 year old is at Uni. Not every 18-24 that turned up against Oxford and hasn't been back since (and there were thousands of them) is at Uni. 

You can't keep bringing up the Oxford game, it was a special occasion----a one-off. Unfortunately that applies to the ticket prices as well.

Lesson is, if you want bigger crowds, lower the prices. It worked before.