Attendances

[chaddyrovers]

22 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

This Big 6 deal could have worked reasonably well, but unfortunately timed just as our play off surge has ended. C'est la vie. However, as we see with half season tickets, they only ever sell in their hundreds, those willing to sign up for every game in a package usually do so in the summer.

Boro is a bad choice for the one off game. Live on Sky with strings attached.

Bolton on Easter Monday or the last game of the season, no strings attached, would have been a much better idea. With thousands of extra fans trapping.

so fans will come back cos we doing well? 

10 pounds for a game as long as you come with Season ticket holder is a bad choice? 

as @only2garners, if we do one off game 10 pounds we have to do for away fans also

2 minutes ago, Stuart said:

I think we need a bit more imagination than that though. Having 18,000 twice a season through a £10 offer would be good but it doesn’t really get numbers back consistently.

It appears to have garnered zero discussion but I quite like the idea of beefing up the 1875 club to offer access to cheaper tickets. If the club was to put up a scheme it would need to have some value in its own right but low cost to Rovers. Free or early access to certain events or away tickets, merchandise discount. Might be controversial but I’d also stop the “club cash” scheme for season ticket holders.

Add in £10 tickets for a limited number number of games, e.g. 10, (subject to availability) and it gives people flexibility, in theory guarantees extra ticket sales. Would it impact ST sales? Possibly, but they just need to get the numbers right to make it match the total revenue of today.

The beauty of such a scheme is that you could continue to charge away fans (and normal walk ons) the normal price.

I’m buying my ST for convenience and certainty of mine and my family’s fixed fortnightly seats.

why stop 'club cash' scheme for season ticket holders? surely loyal season ticket holders should get more benefits/discounts than people who aren't? 

if you are part of the 1875 club don't you already get a 3 pounds discount on tickets? 

[Hasta]

Every home game is £20, providing that  you bought a ticket for the preceeding home game. Therefore there is a benefit to not missing home games for the 'floating fan'.

Season tickets are 5% off every consecutive year up to a max 20% off.

Lets show Rhodri that there is loyalty in football.

Edited February 10, 2019 by Hasta

[JBiz]

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

Your defensive nature of the clubs pricing policies has seemingly caused you to see every word that I have uttered as stinging criticism.

I acknowledged that both offers deserve some credit because the club is trying to get some fans into the club. Something youve ignored. I just think that the uptake may be minimal as the club could be somewhat hamstrung by the teams league position. (And that is not having a go at where we are!) £100 is a lot of money for the vast majority of fans who hasnt budgeted for it, who wasnt otherwise going to attend so clearly isnt desperate to attend, whether you like it or not. Especially for 6 games that dont have the competitive edge of a promotion/play off push or a relegation battle. By that, I am not at all slagging off the pricing by the club for the price per game etc. Im saying to justify spending the sum of £100 promptly and unexpectedly on something you can clearly do without, is a lot.

With the Boro game, or whatever game they selected, I would have recommended a simple tickets for a fiver or for a tenner policy, no strings attached, no terms and conditions, that would for me be much more likely to swell the attendance. Fair play to the club, bring a friend is better than nothing, it was just constructive criticism/advice.

You mention protestors, I suspect some of them have got out of the habit of going now rather than continuing to stay away under protest, its no longer a priority for them to attend. Difference is, I see it as a reason, you see it as an excuse. My attitude is to wonder what the club can do to get them back, yours is to lambast them for not attending in the first place. I hope the club doesnt see the situation like you do with such bitterness and pin the blame onto those who dont go. Whatever the reason. However flimsy it may be perceived, no one is obliged to attend. Hopefully the club is of the opinion, unlike yourself, that those not attending for whatever reason would be welcomed back with open arms and encouraged to do so, not seen with the attitude that if you dont come now, you dont deserve to come at all.

I dont understand your bitterness towards those not attending. Those who care the most that not attending may be to the detriment of the team already attend. Id love to be able to empathise as to why you hold so much resentment to people who quite simply dont see Blackburn Rovers as their number one priority. This is the same for every team, they have the hard core fans, then those that arent as interested, arent as passionate, arent as financially stable, whatever, that require additional coaxing to get through the turnstiles.

Its a simple unwilingness in my opinion to empathise with anyone who isnt as dedicated as you clearly are to attend.

Criticism is criticism. 

I have never understood your irrational need to constantly look for cracks and flaws in club management. The assumption of expertise is tiresome - your input on what the club might or could do holds absolutely no weight since you’ve neither the experience or information at hand.

That constant need to suggest improvement or isolate potential flaws shows unwillingness to see a situation (none of us are experts in) with any balance.

I personally think, or rather should say “know” since it’s impossible to argue against - if we had bigger attendances, we’d be in a better starting position for moving the club forward. 

I can’t empathise with fans who will only support their team when it’s a big game or after success - and why should I? That attitude is far more detrimental to the club than using the word “Commitment” in a marketing gimmick.

It listening to countless excuses for not supporting the club (under generally false guises) has made me view some “supporters” with a certain bitterness, then so be it.

58 minutes ago, Hasta said:

But it wasn't 3 in 3, and most people didn't see the away performance. 

You talk about form being a factor, but are then arguing that people attended because it was 3 wins in 12 but wouldn't have if it was 0 wins in 12.   3 wins in 12 is hardly stirring form!

Therefore that just leaves the opposition and I've covered that above.

As for encouraging people to attend the last 6, we will struggle now as interest will wane even more oncd we have nothing to push for.  However a well publicised £10 a ticket, £1 for kids will get a big crowd on for Bolton on Easter Monday.

 

There’s scope for improvement but the key thing is how we play, not the pricing structure for me. If we are in a good place come April, it’ll impact ST sales too.

 

56 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

Clearly not at Rovers as the owners are pumping in £m's a year just to keep the club running. Our gate receipts for the season wouldnt buy BB's left bollock.

What about FFP?

[Mattyblue]

34 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

is floating fan a thing now?

Now? Has been since day dot.

[Mattyblue]

35 minutes ago, Stuart said:

I think we need a bit more imagination than that though. Having 18,000 twice a season through a £10 offer would be good but it doesn’t really get numbers back consistently.

It appears to have garnered zero discussion but I quite like the idea of beefing up the 1875 club to offer access to cheaper tickets. If the club was to put up a scheme it would need to have some value in its own right but low cost to Rovers. Free or early access to certain events or away tickets, merchandise discount. Might be controversial but I’d also stop the “club cash” scheme for season ticket holders.

Add in £10 tickets for a limited number number of games, e.g. 10, (subject to availability) and it gives people flexibility, in theory guarantees extra ticket sales. Would it impact ST sales? Possibly, but they just need to get the numbers right to make it match the total revenue of today.

The beauty of such a scheme is that you could continue to charge away fans (and normal walk ons) the normal price.

I’m buying my ST for convenience and certainty of mine and my family’s fixed fortnightly seats.

Preaching to the converted with me.

We should be trying anything and everything.

My point was more about my surprise that merely suggesting that there other things to try for your floating fan than a quarter season ticket was met with uproar from a certain poster.

[blueboy3333]

3 minutes ago, Biz said:

 

What about FFP?

What about it? IIRC a club can lose £39m over a 3 year period. 

[JBiz]

18 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

What about it? IIRC a club can lose £39m over a 3 year period. 

Well since we’ve lost on average about 15m a season since the owners rocked up, it’s not hard to imagine that we may fall foul of those rules, especially if the turnover is written off by slashing season ticket prices.

 

[blueboy3333]

2 minutes ago, Biz said:

Well since we’ve lost on average about 15m a season since the owners rocked up, it’s not hard to imagine that we may fall foul of those rules, especially if the turnover is written off by slashing season ticket prices.

 

We aren't losing £15m a season now so its very hard to see how cutting ST prices would make much difference. We bring in about £3.5m a season in gate receipts. 

[roversfan99]

30 minutes ago, Biz said:

Criticism is criticism. 

I have never understood your irrational need to constantly look for cracks and flaws in club management. The assumption of expertise is tiresome - your input on what the club might or could do holds absolutely no weight since you’ve neither the experience or information at hand.

That constant need to suggest improvement or isolate potential flaws shows unwillingness to see a situation (none of us are experts in) with any balance.

I personally think, or rather should say “know” since it’s impossible to argue against - if we had bigger attendances, we’d be in a better starting position for moving the club forward. 

I can’t empathise with fans who will only support their team when it’s a big game or after success - and why should I? That attitude is far more detrimental to the club than using the word “Commitment” in a marketing gimmick.

It listening to countless excuses for not supporting the club (under generally false guises) has made me view some “supporters” with a certain bitterness, then so be it.

There’s scope for improvement but the key thing is how we play, not the pricing structure for me. If we are in a good place come April, it’ll impact ST sales too.

 

What about FFP?

I have never professed to be better suited to do Waggotts role, likewise with Mowbray, both are obviously better placed but I feel like im entitled to an opinion.

The current set up seems to be based on short term income, almost accepting that the attendances wont vary too dramatically and getting a bit more money from those who do attend. Failure to hit the season ticket sales target shows they havent necessarily got their decisions spot on and thus they are open to judgement and discussion, and my suggestion is to think slightly longer term, lower prices initially at a point of high supporter engagement following promotion then look to make any price increases with the stronger and bigger regular supporter behind it. Then youve got both potentially an increase in turnover and higher attendances which the club claims to be desperate for. Thats my opinion, neither of us have the numbers or the stats to prove our opinions but thats all they are.

Its not about justifying them. If you want to feel bitter about people who by the very definition would admit that they are not hardcore fans then thats your call. I am looking at it from the clubs viewpoint just like you are. But from the perspective of trying to entice them back wherever possible, not to call them out for their current non attendance as that will ultimately not bring them back.

Youve not suggested how you feel like we can increase attendances further on what they already are, from what ive seen. Bitterly calling out non-attendees will not do that.

[JBiz]

4 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

We aren't losing £15m a season now so its very hard to see how cutting ST prices would make much difference. We bring in about £3.5m a season in gate receipts. 

Sorry BB, 3.5m is a huge slice of the clubs overall turnover at this level.

I understand it’s negligible in the prem, but even with the Rao’s investment and 5m tv money for the championship - that money will be key for helping us compete.

 

[blueboy3333]

4 minutes ago, Biz said:

Sorry BB, 3.5m is a huge slice of the clubs overall turnover at this level.

I understand it’s negligible in the prem, but even with the Rao’s investment and 5m tv money for the championship - that money will be key for helping us compete.

 

Who said it wasn't? 

[JBiz]

16 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I

Youve not suggested how you feel like we can increase attendances further on what they already are, from what ive seen. Bitterly calling out non-attendees will not do that.

I have made plenty of posts about the key being re-engaging with the schools and getting kids in for free.

[JBiz]

Just now, blueboy3333 said:

Who said it wasn't? 

Keep up - youve suggested we slash the turnover and it wont make a difference.

[roversfan99]

Just now, Biz said:

I have made plenty of posts about the key being re-engaging with the schools and getting kids in for free.

Fair enough, I genuinely have missed them and do agree that its an avenue the club should pursue. Start them young.

[only2garners]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

is floating fan a thing now?

Well it was in the 30s when my grandad was going to Ewood and Deepdale on alternate weeks, walking to both from Bamber Bridge.

And it was in the 70s when I was watching Southport on Friday nights and alternating Saturdays with Ewood and somewhere else when they Rovers away somewhere a distance away.

And I’m pretty sure it was in the 90s when there were plenty of fans coming to watch Premier League games at Ewood because they could.

[blueboy3333]

5 minutes ago, Biz said:

Keep up - youve suggested we slash the turnover and it wont make a difference.

Straw manning again I see. I didn't say the budget would be slashed by £3.5m, I said that's the amount we take in each season in ST money. The context (which you always miss) is that this will have very little impact on FFP. That's what we were discussing. You brought it up, remember.

Keep up. 

[JBiz]

Just now, blueboy3333 said:

Straw manning again I see. I didn't say the budget would be slashed by £3.5m, I said that's the amount we take in each season in ST money. The context (which you always miss) is that this will have very little impact on FFP. That's what we were discussing. You brought it up, remember.

Keep up. 

You need to look up the meaning of Straw man!

You said you don’t think cutting prices, ergo cutting revenue will make much difference.

I disagree entirely. We need to maximise our income to compete. Just because the turnover for season tickets is small fry compared to the yearly wage bill, it doesn’t mean it’s completely negligible - and FFP limits investment.

 

[roversfan99]

Just now, Biz said:

You need to look up the meaning of Straw man!

You said you don’t think cutting prices, ergo cutting revenue will make much difference.

I disagree entirely. We need to maximise our income to compete. Just because the turnover for season tickets is small fry compared to the yearly wage bill, it doesn’t mean it’s completely negligible - and FFP limits investment.

 

I think that is oversimplified. There is obviously a correlation between how low prices are and how high attendances are. We have to get the balance right and failure to meet season ticket sales targets suggests either that the budgeting/targets are miscalculated or that the pricing needs tweaking.

[blueboy3333]

22 minutes ago, Biz said:

You need to look up the meaning of Straw man!

You said you don’t think cutting prices, ergo cutting revenue will make much difference.

I disagree entirely. We need to maximise our income to compete. Just because the turnover for season tickets is small fry compared to the yearly wage bill, it doesn’t mean it’s completely negligible - and FFP limits investment.

 

Sigh. We were on about FFP. You asked about it. I told you it's £39m loss permissible every 3 years. A few hundred grand will make no difference through loss of ST income. Keep up. 

[Tom Stinny]

Rovers won't hit higher attendance figures unless they get into the premier league or there's a game with something genuinely riding on it like last year's last game.

 

With trying to attract kids lets be honest I couldn't see many kids turning round and saying I'd rather watch Bradley Dack over a De bryne or a Pogba it isn't how kids work unless they are generation supporters who follow on from family.

 

If Rovers want higher attendances. Invest majorly and get back into the premier league. There's very little other choices to that. 

[Stuart]

3 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

I have never professed to be better suited to do Waggotts role, likewise with Mowbray, both are obviously better placed but I feel like im entitled to an opinion.

The current set up seems to be based on short term income, almost accepting that the attendances wont vary too dramatically and getting a bit more money from those who do attend. Failure to hit the season ticket sales target shows they havent necessarily got their decisions spot on and thus they are open to judgement and discussion, and my suggestion is to think slightly longer term, lower prices initially at a point of high supporter engagement following promotion then look to make any price increases with the stronger and bigger regular supporter behind it. Then youve got both potentially an increase in turnover and higher attendances which the club claims to be desperate for. Thats my opinion, neither of us have the numbers or the stats to prove our opinions but thats all they are.

Its not about justifying them. If you want to feel bitter about people who by the very definition would admit that they are not hardcore fans then thats your call. I am looking at it from the clubs viewpoint just like you are. But from the perspective of trying to entice them back wherever possible, not to call them out for their current non attendance as that will ultimately not bring them back.

Youve not suggested how you feel like we can increase attendances further on what they already are, from what ive seen. Bitterly calling out non-attendees will not do that.

Excellent post

[chaddyrovers]

any response yet @Stuart

why stop 'club cash' scheme for season ticket holders? surely loyal season ticket holders should get more benefits/discounts than people who aren't? 

if you are part of the 1875 club don't you already get a 3 pounds discount on tickets? 

[Rover_Shaun]

Season ticket holders have always been footballs equivalent to an 80 year old British Gas and BT customer, in that they are a regular cashcow, so why offer them discounts when they are already in the bag? It's new customers that count. Hence why the club has always done deals for the casual fan.

We all know (I was one) that many ST holders grumble about it but then flash the cash on day 1 of renewal

There will be even less cash floating around Blackburn once the grim reality of the March 29th regression hits home

Edited February 10, 2019 by Rover_Shaun

[Stuart]

4 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

any response yet @Stuart

why stop 'club cash' scheme for season ticket holders? surely loyal season ticket holders should get more benefits/discounts than people who aren't? 

if you are part of the 1875 club don't you already get a 3 pounds discount on tickets? 

Bit rich that first line, Chris.

So you are saying a financial incentive is a factor for some fans but only for “loyal ST holders”? That’s kind of contradicting your argument that financial considerations shouldn’t be a factor for anyone buying tickets.

I said the 1875 club could be improved to make it more attractive. The current “discount” has resulted in 18,000 empty seats with only 40% of the ground in use . What we “already have” doesn’t address that so new ideas are needed.

What suggestions do you have? Because “you can’t have it your own way” really isn’t the kind of thing to include in your C.V. for a role in the club’s marketing department. Even if it might impress Waggott and a few of the FF members.

[chaddyrovers]

1 minute ago, Stuart said:

Bit rich that first line, Chris.

So you are saying a financial incentive is a factor for some fans but only for “loyal ST holders”? That’s kind of contradicting your argument that financial considerations shouldn’t be a factor for anyone buying tickets.

I said the 1875 club could be improved to make it more attractive. The current “discount” has resulted in 18,000 empty seats with only 40% of the ground in use . What we “already have” doesn’t address that so new ideas are needed.

What suggestions do you have? Because “you can’t have it your own way” really isn’t the kind of thing to include in your C.V. for a role in the club’s marketing department. Even if it might impress Waggott and a few of the FF members.

Season ticketsl holders should get the best benefits..

Ive suggested a few ideas. Have you not seen them?