JANUARY TRANSFER WINDOW

[RovingRover]

I'm really unconvinced by the depth we have at CB.

Derrick Williams has had some injury issues this season and has been bog-standard at best. Jack Rodwell has a injury history as long as his wage-bill at Sunderland. Charlie Mulgrew has a well documented injury history. Darragh Lenihan has had injury issues dating back to a serious injury at the academy. Lewis Travis is largely untested at CB in the Championship. I still think it was a mistake to let Downing go.

I still think we need another CB.

I also think we need width. It's all well and good to play forwards out wide, but it's also good to have out and out wingers who can push players forward. For me, I still think we need to replace Palmer. Conway is decent, but it can't hurt to have options.

I also worry that if we lose Graham, we lose our only proven consistent goalscorer to play up top. When you take Graham out, you are left with 3 goals from Armstrong and 2 from Nuttall.

 

[Wing Wizard Windy Miller]

Just now, deryck guyler's spoon said:

Comparing Mowbray with Kean and Coyle? You should be more circumspect when bandying adjectives like 'shit' around. Also you don't get a say on what people like.

 

I understand your original  point however, managers operate inside a bubble.  How many times over the years have you watched a team (any team at any level) and thought 'this is clearly not working'? Generally, fans will realise something needs to change a long time before the manager. Yet the manager will persist with the same game plan/line up - regardless of their experience within the game.  

Souness at Rovers was a classic example.  Superb for us over a number of years and an incredibly experienced and respected figure in the game.  Yet I bet 80 % of fans thought he was losing the plot before he went to Newcastle.  

You also have to throw in reporting/social media these days, where a manager's comments are stored for posterity.  Usually leading to a shed load of contradictions throughout their tenure.  TM has come out with several to date.

He's doing a good job and I love his integrity and enthusiasm for the game but he isn't above reproach.  Sometimes fairly, sometimes unfairly but that comes down to your personal opinion.  

I scratch my head regularly at games at some of the things that go on.  Yet sometimes the manager has played a  blinder that I wouldn't of seen coming and makes my musings look like those of an idiot.  Other times, they completely  miss the bleeding obvious and it costs us points.

Football will always be a game that divides opinions. 

 

[tomphil]

That's a cracking post ?

[deryck guyler's spoon]

7 minutes ago, Wing Wizard Windy Miller said:

I understand your original  point however, managers operate inside a bubble.  How many times over the years have you watched a team (any team at any level) and thought 'this is clearly not working'? Generally, fans will realise something needs to change a long time before the manager. Yet the manager will persist with the same game plan/line up - regardless of their experience within the game.  

Souness at Rovers was a classic example.  Superb for us over a number of years and an incredibly experienced and respected figure in the game.  Yet I bet 80 % of fans thought he was losing the plot before he went to Newcastle.  

You also have to throw in reporting/social media these days, where a manager's comments are stored for posterity.  Usually leading to a shed load of contradictions throughout their tenure.  TM has come out with several to date.

He's doing a good job and I love his integrity and enthusiasm for the game but he isn't above reproach.  Sometimes fairly, sometimes unfairly but that comes down to your personal opinion.  

I scratch my head regularly at games at some of the things that go on.  Yet sometimes the manager has played a  blinder that I wouldn't of seen coming and makes my musings look like those of an idiot.  Other times, they completely  miss the bleeding obvious and it costs us points.

Football will always be a game that divides opinions. 

 

Hard to disagree with much of that and, as I think you alluded to, I didn't and would never suggest that any manager is beyond reproach or debate.

[Wing Wizard Windy Miller]

8 minutes ago, deryck guyler's spoon said:

Hard to disagree with much of that and, as I think you alluded to, I didn't and would never suggest that any manager is beyond reproach or debate.

*Except King Kenny - he wore a magic hat.

 

 

 

 

**But took it off for European games ?

[roversfan99]

59 minutes ago, deryck guyler's spoon said:

Comparing Mowbray with Kean and Coyle? You should be more circumspect when bandying adjectives like 'shit' around. Also you don't get a say on what people like.

 

No one is, you are taking comments about your terminology out of context.

[dingles staying down 4ever]

7 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

 

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought the first time he got injured he hadn't warmed up properly and the second time was when he played his comeback reserve game on a freezing cold night. Not smart.

You are right, he didn't warm up but I still think that was more Mowbray reacting to the developing situation on the pitch. At the time Evans was stripped ready to come on and Bennett was red carded. Mowbray changed his mind and I dont think Chapman had a choice. To use this as if Chapman has a football brain is a little harsh.

[Tom Stinny]

6 hours ago, deryck guyler's spoon said:

Comparing Mowbray with Kean and Coyle? You should be more circumspect when bandying adjectives like 'shit' around. Also you don't get a say on what people like.

 

He's not saying they are on the same level. I have a little respect for Mowbray but his achievements are increase ten fold because he's liked. Not because what he's done is some miracle. 

 

There's a lot of managers out there who fail left right and centre but have long careers because they know the right people or have the right reputation. Steve McLaren is one of them and I honestly do not rate our manager as highly as some do.

 

Best budget in league 1, with Danny Graham, Bradley Dack and Charlie Mulgrew who was also a Scotland international along with a few others. Finish 2nd and that looked in doubt for a while before the obvious clicked and he started playing effective football. Which many on here at the time stated.

 

This year, he's had over 10 million to spend so expectations go up. It's inevitable and unreasonable to state otherwise especially from a manager who keeps saying we are building slowly yet doesn't seem to want to buy anyone this window. Another thing I don't agree with.

 

When you look at the players you say he's assembled together, who in the team did he bring in? Armstrong, Smallwood, Dack and sometimes Bell along with Reed as a right winger.

 

Now look at how many he's signed. Whittingham, Gladwin, Hart, Caddis, Davenport, Rothwell, Chapman and the list goes on. Many on here could name more.

 

I'm afraid you have your blinders on when it comes to this manager all because he's nice and slightly stable. He will never get us up as he is not good enough. Prove me otherwise I'd say and give reasons why what I've said is a load of rubbish.

[robbojohnno]

16 minutes ago, Tom Stinny said:

He's not saying they are on the same level. I have a little respect for Mowbray but his achievements are increase ten fold because he's liked. Not because what he's done is some miracle. 

 

There's a lot of managers out there who fail left right and centre but have long careers because they know the right people or have the right reputation. Steve McLaren is one of them and I honestly do not rate our manager as highly as some do.

 

Best budget in league 1, with Danny Graham, Bradley Dack and Charlie Mulgrew who was also a Scotland international along with a few others. Finish 2nd and that looked in doubt for a while before the obvious clicked and he started playing effective football. Which many on here at the time stated.

 

This year, he's had over 10 million to spend so expectations go up. It's inevitable and unreasonable to state otherwise especially from a manager who keeps saying we are building slowly yet doesn't seem to want to buy anyone this window. Another thing I don't agree with.

 

When you look at the players you say he's assembled together, who in the team did he bring in? Armstrong, Smallwood, Dack and sometimes Bell along with Reed as a right winger.

 

Now look at how many he's signed. Whittingham, Gladwin, Hart, Caddis, Davenport, Rothwell, Chapman and the list goes on. Many on here could name more.

 

I'm afraid you have your blinders on when it comes to this manager all because he's nice and slightly stable. He will never get us up as he is not good enough. Prove me otherwise I'd say and give reasons why what I've said is a load of rubbish.

When he joined we were in the bottom 3 with many fans fearing we might never recover. He managed to get 22 points from 15 games but failed to keep us up. Just shy of 2 years on we are 10th in the Championship with one of the most valuable assets in the league in Dack (a Mowbray signing). We have a young squad with considerable potential and this season certainly isn't over yet. Mowbray certainly has his flaws, his tactics, Brereton signing and love for the dreadful Williams but overall he's done a great job. That could all change in a few months as things change quickly in football but to say he's not good enough is naive and silly.

Edited January 26, 2019 by robbojohnno

[Waggy76]

15 minutes ago, Tom Stinny said:

He's not saying they are on the same level. I have a little respect for Mowbray but his achievements are increase ten fold because he's liked. Not because what he's done is some miracle. 

 

There's a lot of managers out there who fail left right and centre but have long careers because they know the right people or have the right reputation. Steve McLaren is one of them and I honestly do not rate our manager as highly as some do.

 

Best budget in league 1, with Danny Graham, Bradley Dack and Charlie Mulgrew who was also a Scotland international along with a few others. Finish 2nd and that looked in doubt for a while before the obvious clicked and he started playing effective football. Which many on here at the time stated.

 

This year, he's had over 10 million to spend so expectations go up. It's inevitable and unreasonable to state otherwise especially from a manager who keeps saying we are building slowly yet doesn't seem to want to buy anyone this window. Another thing I don't agree with.

 

When you look at the players you say he's assembled together, who in the team did he bring in? Armstrong, Smallwood, Dack and sometimes Bell along with Reed as a right winger.

 

Now look at how many he's signed. Whittingham, Gladwin, Hart, Caddis, Davenport, Rothwell, Chapman and the list goes on. Many on here could name more.

 

I'm afraid you have your blinders on when it comes to this manager all because he's nice and slightly stable. He will never get us up as he is not good enough. Prove me otherwise I'd say and give reasons why what I've said is a load of rubbish.

I agree with some of your points , when we got relegated (we got relegated with a lot of points). Who would have done better than automatic promotion and 10th by January 26th in championship ????

Paul Cook is and was God with some on here , have a look at the table!!!

 

[philipl]

There are too many people in Blackburn who are only happy when they are moaning or angry.

Mowbray is doing a very decent job at Rovers.

He has turned the club around in all the ways traditional fans value

- players bonding and enjoying their game

- team spirit

- ridiculously unlucky relegation after picking up a wreckage, promotion and a better first season back than everyone expected if we are being honest  

Yes he had financial backing in League One but it was nothing remotely like the difference Guardiola or Mourinho worked wih compared with Dyche either relatively or absolutely. 

Stoke, West Brom and Swansea have come down with parachute payments out of all proportion to the budgets of most of the Championship but only one of them is in the play-offs.

And in the lucky dip that is the transfer market, his record is certainly no worse than average and I would say looking promising.  

 

[arbitro]

1 hour ago, philipl said:

There are too many people in Blackburn who are only happy when they are moaning or angry.

Mowbray is doing a very decent job at Rovers.

He has turned the club around in all the ways traditional fans value

- players bonding and enjoying their game

- team spirit

- ridiculously unlucky relegation after picking up a wreckage, promotion and a better first season back than everyone expected if we are being honest  

Yes he had financial backing in League One but it was nothing remotely like the difference Guardiola or Mourinho worked wih compared with Dyche either relatively or absolutely. 

Stoke, West Brom and Swansea have come down with parachute payments out of all proportion to the budgets of most of the Championship but only one of them is in the play-offs.

And in the lucky dip that is the transfer market, his record is certainly no worse than average and I would say looking promising.  

 

Constructive criticism (that's mostly what I read about Mowbray) is completely different to moaning. I genuinely believe that the vast majority of fans appreciate that Mowbray has been 'very decent' but there have been failings too. His tactics, substitutions, team selection will always be open to criticism as we all pretty much see things differently and by his own admission he over thinks too much. Your description of average in the transfer market is about right with some really good incoming signings and some poor ones.

He is worth his position at the moment but there will nearly always be perceived issues from fans. That goes with the territory of anybody in the public eye. And I'd be amazed if Mowbray wasn't critical of himself at times.

[Roverthechimp]

So an transfers then...

Mowbray - take away the fee for BB and i think most would say he is doing better than expected this season. Include the fee and many will suggest we could/should be doing better.

Fine line to draw.

[Stuart]

8 hours ago, deryck guyler's spoon said:

Hard to disagree with much of that and, as I think you alluded to, I didn't and would never suggest that any manager is beyond reproach or debate.

Just goes to show that you continue to play the man and not the ball.

Hey ho.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

10 hours ago, S8 & Blue said:

Aye I see what you mean, but if we took that Oldham game as any judgement on ability I’d practically want a new first eleven.

Yes, very true. Nobody shone that day.

[JBiz]

57 minutes ago, Stuart said:

Just goes to show that you continue to play the man and not the ball.

Hey ho.

Not true at all. When you’re ignoring 9/10 decisions to criticise the 1/10, it’s you that’s unfairly playing the man(ager) instead of being fair about his decisions and success overall. Balance. We remember you didn’t want Mowbray, you don’t have to constantly justify the initial underwhelming.

Charlton away a great example. How anyone could refer to that game as a major criticism in the scheme of last season... beyond my understanding. It’s almost as if you saw finishing second as an insult! Charlton was 4/5 days after the best day as a Rovers fan since... 2009? I dunno..

And this week. To be so frustrated that we now only have 4 options at CB instead of 5, it’s disengenous.

Not only you that - I couldn’t help but laugh that earlier in the week, our three centrebacks (Mulgrew, Lenihan and Rodwell) are all kind of “un droppable” at current... the minute we sell/loan Downing, we only have “converted midfielders”....

Thats typical BRFCS for you. If I remember correctly Stuart, you snarled at not using u23s in the newcastle game - it 3/4 of Del, Jack, Darragh and Charlie gets injured - don’t we still have a few other than those on loan to get involved?

 

[tomphil]

TM needs to keep his foot on the peddle and carry on the good work and keep a drive to push the club forwards on and off the pitch that's the key for most people I think.  The min you stand still fold your arms and think job done at a club like Rovers that very min it begins to stagnate again after all the crap over the last ten years and I think that's the fear brought about by genuine reasons not a wish just to slag the manager off.

Small positive baby steps needed EVERY window for that so maybe Chapman at least coming in will help but if not he needs something similar. The blooding of Travis and the signs Nuttall is shaping up have to be taken as positives though as if not those two would've been loaned and some squad bluffer outers brought in instead who may not have contributed much.  So they are like a couple of fresh faces really and that needs considering.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

3 hours ago, dingles staying down 4ever said:

You are right, he didn't warm up but I still think that was more Mowbray reacting to the developing situation on the pitch. At the time Evans was stripped ready to come on and Bennett was red carded. Mowbray changed his mind and I dont think Chapman had a choice. To use this as if Chapman has a football brain is a little harsh.

Everybody has a choice about warming up. There's no point dashing on if you're going to come off limping later on.

[ChrisPriceBaldSpot]

Are we reckoning on a half time announcement of Harry Chapman? Did anyone see the way Celtic announced their new player on Wednesday? Can't see us going down that route. Maybe Harry coming out dressed as David Bowie carrying a cup of Bovril. 

[gumboots]

It seems to me that some have forgotten that for a large part of his tenure Mowbray has been rebuilding not just the team but the club, the fans, the morale around the whole place. He is almost single handedly responsible for our club no longer being one of the laughing stocks of the league and instead being a team other teams are wary of playing. That doesn't make him immune from criticism, but it does buy him a lot 9f goodwill that other recent managers may not have enjoyed. 

[blueboy3333]

35 minutes ago, Biz said:

Not only you that - I couldn’t help but laugh that earlier in the week, our three centrebacks (Mulgrew, Lenihan and Rodwell) are all kind of “un droppable” at current... the minute we sell/loan Downing, we only have “converted midfielders”....

 

Edited January 26, 2019 by blueboy3333

[CD_93]

That Nixon fella claims fee agreed for Chappers.

Edited January 26, 2019 by CD_93

[J*B]

Just now, CD_93 said:

That Nixon fella claims fee agreed for Chappers.

He's only saying that because we started mischief making on here.

[Stuart]

46 minutes ago, Biz said:

Not true at all. When you’re ignoring 9/10 decisions to criticise the 1/10, it’s you that’s unfairly playing the man(ager) instead of being fair about his decisions and success overall. Balance. We remember you didn’t want Mowbray, you don’t have to constantly justify the initial underwhelming.

Charlton away a great example. How anyone could refer to that game as a major criticism in the scheme of last season... beyond my understanding. It’s almost as if you saw finishing second as an insult! Charlton was 4/5 days after the best day as a Rovers fan since... 2009? I dunno..

And this week. To be so frustrated that we now only have 4 options at CB instead of 5, it’s disengenous.

Not only you that - I couldn’t help but laugh that earlier in the week, our three centrebacks (Mulgrew, Lenihan and Rodwell) are all kind of “un droppable” at current... the minute we sell/loan Downing, we only have “converted midfielders”....

Thats typical BRFCS for you. If I remember correctly Stuart, you snarled at not using u23s in the newcastle game - it 3/4 of Del, Jack, Darragh and Charlie gets injured - don’t we still have a few other than those on loan to get involved?

 

You’re switching the argument again though.

1) Newcastle was a cup game - I also said we should have played Brereton in the first match.

2) I wasn’t championing the U23 centre backs - although it would have been low risk in a cup game - we don’t have the depth there.

3) We’ve loaned out Grayson and Wharton (again) and Platt will probably go out on loan again.  Our best three U23 cbs. In the last U23 game, we played our fourth best and... Downing!

4) How often do people talk about playing Mulgrew, Lenihan or Rodwell I’m midfield? Whether you like to admit it or not, despite two of them being very accomplished there, and one being a class above despite being... let’s say... a bit detached, they are midfielders.

5) But allowing for their conversion, the bit you (and others) are ignoring is the fragility of Mulgrew and even Lenihan. We had the same problem two years ago. We had no first team cb depth and it relegated us. Downing should not have been allowed to go until we had an adequate replacement.

I think Mowbray is a good bloke but is a little too revered. He has done the realistic minimum so far given our budget. Relegation (when survival was possible), second in L1 (when first was possible) and midtable Championship (when 6th place is in reach). Yes, he has stopped the rot, on the face of it, but he has a lot to do. Right now it smacks of “job done”. Survival appears to be the only aim this season despite the opportunity we have because of how tight the league is.

Do I want him out? Of course not.

Do I want him to start showing a little more ambition? Yes.

He also needs to improve significantly in his recruitment because so far he has been poor in that regard.

Good to have you back pal.

[blueboy3333]

16 minutes ago, J*B said:

He's only saying that because we started mischief making on here.

So none of you actually know?