Summer Transfer Window 2019

[Dreams of 1995]

Just now, jim mk2 said:

 So another "target" missed. With the clock ticking to the new season, the need for a new goalkeeper and defender (s) is becoming urgent. Mowbray needs to back up his words with action and move quickly if he is to retain any credibility

We missed out on Maher roughly a month ago. Him and Baeur are the players we have missed out on. If we really went after Baeur that hard anyway.

Signed 3.

Missed out on 2.

I'll live.

[DE.]

Just now, deryck guyler's spoon said:

They are idiots of course. They have however, funded the Academy so who's to say that they won't offer continuing support to a European network? Particularly if it is potentially profitable?

With these owners you never know. History suggests that long-term plans don't necessarily appeal to them though, so the European Global Network Scouting Initiative will need to produce results fairly quickly in order to survive, assuming it is implemented at all. 

[deryck guyler's spoon]

Just now, jim mk2 said:

 So another "target" missed. With the clock ticking to the new season, the need for a new goalkeeper and defender (s) is becoming urgent. Mowbray needs to back up his words with action and move quickly if he is to retain any credibility

Do keep up.

[bluebruce]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

They are in the qualifying rounds though, so it's not that much of  a stretch. Some random clubs qualify for the Europa league, far more obscure than Utrecht! 

Was talking about winning it, not qualifying. That's what I'd consider 'compete for trophies' to mean. Their competing for the Europa is on a level with Walsall 'competing' for the League Cup. Anyway, OP has clarified this wasn't said.

[martonrover]

20 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Mowbray has always unequivocally said that it will take time to get the European scouting working properly. 

Mowbray "unequivocally" says a lot of things, then backtracks or does exactly the opposite.

Wherever he's managed he hasn't got to grips with defending, and shows little sign of sorting ours.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, martonrover said:

Mowbray "unequivocally" says a lot of things, then backtracks or does exactly the opposite.

Wherever he's managed he hasn't got to grips with defending, and shows little sign of sorting ours.

Ok, you have gone a bit off track there.  We were talking about the European scouting network, which he said would take time and when you think about it, in real life, it would. 

[JHRover]

4 minutes ago, DE. said:

Quite a strange thing for a manager to be in charge of though, don't you think? I mean, if it was coming from the top of the club then OK, great, but this seems to be entirely pushed by TM... an employee whose job is by nature relatively short-term. He may legitimately have left the club before the European Scouting Global Network Initiative gets off the ground - then what? New manager comes in to take advantage, or just dismantles the whole thing and goes in a different direction?  

Absolutely the issue. It's only sustainable if Mowbray remains in post long enough to see it bear fruit PLUS it is sustained once he has gone. We're 2 years in now and no indication its ready yet. Mowbray won't be here long in the scheme of things whatever happens. Is there the structure and expertise there to survive or thrive without his input? Probably not.

Mowbray rightly deserves credit for 'rebuilding' the club but the issue really is that it shouldn't have ever have been his job to do so, and it all hinges on him delivering results on matchday.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, JHRover said:

Absolutely the issue. It's only sustainable if Mowbray remains in post long enough to see it bear fruit PLUS it is sustained once he has gone. We're 2 years in now and no indication its ready yet. Mowbray won't be here long in the scheme of things whatever happens. Is there the structure and expertise there to survive or thrive without his input? Probably not.

Mowbray rightly deserves credit for 'rebuilding' the club but the issue really is that it shouldn't have ever have been his job to do so, and it all hinges on him delivering results on matchday.

Not sure where you are getting we are 2 years in? The first time I saw him mention it was in the article below ,which is less than 6 months ago 

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/17437465.mowbray-plans-to-bring-in-european-scouting-network-at-rovers/ 

[bluebruce]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

Ok, you have gone a bit off track there.  We were talking about the European scouting network, which he said would take time and when you think about it, in real life, it would. 

Absolutely. I believe he first started talking about it around a year ago, and I feel I remember it strongly implying that development of it wasn't only just beginning. He also said it would be ready to yield results this summer and we would look to do extensive business in Europe this year. He then backtracked and suggested it might not actually be quite as ready as that after all.

This said, the LT was saying (yesterday or Saturday?) that we may still make a recruitment from Europe this summer. Think I'm remembering that right.

It's astounding our European network was dismantled so extensively that we're taking this long to be up and running again. I understand it being stopped after relegation to League One, but it must have happened sooner as I'm sure it wouldn't be so hard to reinstate after just a year without.

[bluebruce]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

Not sure where you are getting we are 2 years in? The first time I saw him mention it was in the article below ,which is less than 6 months ago 

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/17437465.mowbray-plans-to-bring-in-european-scouting-network-at-rovers/ 

Hmm ok maybe I'm misremembering and it was the scouting network in general he was talking about last summer.

[martonrover]

Just now, bluebruce said:

Absolutely. I believe he first started talking about it around a year ago, and I feel I remember it strongly implying that development of it wasn't only just beginning. He also said it would be ready to yield results this summer and we would look to do extensive business in Europe this year. He then backtracked and suggested it might not actually be quite as ready as that after all.

This said, the LT was saying (yesterday or Saturday?) that we may still make a recruitment from Europe this summer. Think I'm remembering that right.

It's astounding our European network was dismantled so extensively that we're taking this long to be up and running again. I understand it being stopped after relegation to League One, but it must have happened sooner as I'm sure it wouldn't be so hard to reinstate after just a year without.

It's all smoke and mirrors in my opinion. All talk, and constantly moving the goalposts to buy time.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, bluebruce said:

Absolutely. I believe he first started talking about it around a year ago, and I feel I remember it strongly implying that development of it wasn't only just beginning. He also said it would be ready to yield results this summer and we would look to do extensive business in Europe this year. He then backtracked and suggested it might not actually be quite as ready as that after all.

This said, the LT was saying (yesterday or Saturday?) that we may still make a recruitment from Europe this summer. Think I'm remembering that right.

It's astounding our European network was dismantled so extensively that we're taking this long to be up and running again. I understand it being stopped after relegation to League One, but it must have happened sooner as I'm sure it wouldn't be so hard to reinstate after just a year without.

The article I shared above from less than 6 months ago is the first mention I recall of it. 

Ah come on now, this Mowbray lies, backtracks stuff etc is getting out of hand. People are just looking to twist everything now.  IF he said it may bare some fruit for summer, us not signing someone from Europe isn't necessarily backtracking. He did say a few days ago that we are looking at keepers in Europe "as long as the have played at the top level".

I know it's shocking how badly it was dismantled. Hard to pinpoint when exactly, but we had one of the best before Venkys took over. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, martonrover said:

It's all smoke and mirrors in my opinion. All talk, and constantly moving the goalposts to buy time.

Buy time for what exactly? 

[AllRoverAsia]

Just now, bluebruce said:

Hmm ok maybe I'm misremembering and it was the scouting network in general he was talking about last summer.

At least a year ago Mowbray was on about setting up a scouting system using online videos etc. A sifting that brought the gems to his attention.

[JacknOry]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

Not sure where you are getting we are 2 years in? The first time I saw him mention it was in the article below ,which is less than 6 months ago 

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/17437465.mowbray-plans-to-bring-in-european-scouting-network-at-rovers/ 

Goes back much further than that.

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/15680956.tony-mowbray-looking-to-overhaul-rovers-scouting-and-recruitment-departments-and-awaits-the-green-light-from-venkys/

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, AllRoverAsia said:

At least a year ago Mowbray was on about setting up a scouting system using online videos etc. A sifting that brought the gems to his attention.

Yes he did, but we are discussing when he first mentioned setting up the European one.  

[TBTF]

28 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Mowbray has always unequivocally said that it will take time to get the European scouting working properly. 

Yep I get that up to a point. But the scouting network hasn't got much more to do than watch and assess players on a full time basis. This is not some low cost , part time hobby we are talking about . They are well paid and you'd like to think they have done this before and have some level of experience in the role. This shouldn't be new to anyone nor should this be a complete standing start as some are trying to make out. 

The task in front of the Management team  has been known to them for at least 6 months even ignoring the fact he talked about 4 or 5 windows , 4 or 5 windows ago …...bloody hell we all knew in January what was needed as the goals kept flying into our net through ridiculous defending /keeping. TM was critical of our defending back then and specifically so of Raya after Rotherham to the point of eventually leaving him out. So to have got to this point in the window is crazy with so little having been identified beyond the Hanleys, Danns of this world. The keeper is even more acute -he knew he needed a keeper well before the season ended.

So for me , the scouting network doesn't look like its delivered anything beyond names that we all know, have regularly watched and have our own opinions on. I know deals need doing and can be very difficult at the negotiation stage when working to a budget but on the face of things we don't appear to have identified anything from our specialists in the recruitment dept.

The next line from TM will be about taking time to gel, get to know each other (on the effing grass as he likes to say time and again) and learning our system etc etc. Put it this way , we cant be on Target A any more and more likely we'll be at G or H though it will be put out as 'persistence' in order to get our man, no doubt.

I just think its poor tbh though desperately hoping it all comes right by 8th Aug.  

As fans , the Summer window is a time of anticipation, getting yourself in better shape for the new season and hoping you can push on from the last one. Ours just looks a mess at the minute and then they wonder why ST sales aren't flying out the door.

I'm trying not to be 'half empty' but somebody down at Ewood has to be accountable for sorting this crucial aspect out. Lots of drivel in the press about what we aim to do and aim to be and who's model we are following blah blah but not an awful lot in the way of substance from where I sit. 

Go on TM , prove me wrong and I will be delighted.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, JacknOry said:

Goes back much further than that.

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/15680956.tony-mowbray-looking-to-overhaul-rovers-scouting-and-recruitment-departments-and-awaits-the-green-light-from-venkys/

I would take that as more general improvements and setting up of a better scouting system, even though he does mention other countries. It was to do with watching videos wasn't it? I think he only started talking about getting scouts over to games in Europe this year. 

I think it just touches on the shambles he walked into. An absolutely dismantled and toothless scouting system. Shocking when you consider we had arguably the best in the league under Hughes.  I don't have to list the gems discovered around that time. 

Edited July 15, 2019 by Bigdoggsteel

[JacknOry]

Either way, we're a year and a half down the line from that article and we're still signing Boro players, ex players or players that have previously played for TM. Doesn't suggest much has been done with our scouting no matter whether domestically, across Europe or over the globe (as he put it in that article).

All i saw was TM go to Holland to watch a couple of matches. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, TBTF said:

Yep I get that up to a point. But the scouting network hasn't got much more to do than watch and assess players on a full time basis. This is not some low cost , part time hobby we are talking about . They are well paid and you'd like to think they have done this before and have some level of experience in the role. This shouldn't be new to anyone nor should this be a complete standing start as some are trying to make out. 

The task in front of the Management team  has been known to them for at least 6 months even ignoring the fact he talked about 4 or 5 windows , 4 or 5 windows ago …...bloody hell we all knew in January what was needed as the goals kept flying into our net through ridiculous defending /keeping. TM was critical of our defending back then and specifically so of Raya after Rotherham to the point of eventually leaving him out. So to have got to this point in the window is crazy with so little having been identified beyond the Hanleys, Danns of this world. The keeper is even more acute -he knew he needed a keeper well before the season ended.

So for me , the scouting network doesn't look like its delivered anything beyond names that we all know, have regularly watched and have our own opinions on. I know deals need doing and can be very difficult at the negotiation stage when working to a budget but on the face of things we don't appear to have identified anything from our specialists in the recruitment dept.

The next line from TM will be about taking time to gel, get to know each other (on the effing grass as he likes to say time and again) and learning our system etc etc. Put it this way , we cant be on Target A any more and more likely we'll be at G or H though it will be put out as 'persistence' in order to get our man, no doubt.

I just think its poor tbh though desperately hoping it all comes right by 8th Aug.  

As fans , the Summer window is a time of anticipation, getting yourself in better shape for the new season and hoping you can push on from the last one. Ours just looks a mess at the minute and then they wonder why ST sales aren't flying out the door.

I'm trying not to be 'half empty' but somebody down at Ewood has to be accountable for sorting this crucial aspect out. Lots of drivel in the press about what we aim to do and aim to be and who's model we are following blah blah but not an awful lot in the way of substance from where I sit. 

Go on TM , prove me wrong and I will be delighted.

In my opinion it's a complete overreaction to say our window "looks a mess". We have signed 3 players who could all potentially make the first 11. We are certainly going to sign at least 1 keeper as well as a center half. 

As for our recruitment department. I would be interested to know what it actually looks like, ie how many have we and what areas are they covering. I would say it was bare bones when Mowbray started. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, JacknOry said:

Either way, we're a year and a half down the line from that article and we're still signing Boro players, ex players or players that have previously played for TM. Doesn't suggest much has been done with our scouting no matter whether domestically, across Europe or over the globe (as he put it in that article).

All i saw was TM go to Holland to watch a couple of matches. 

We signed 1 player from Boro this summer, a good signing imo. Johnson never played for Mowbray. Gallgher did a few games here, again though a good signing. 

It's a big change for the better from the summers before Mowbray arrived.  If we signed Downing, Johnson and a striker for £5 million the summer Coyle was here, fans wouldn't be able to believe what they are seeing. 

I think we need to look in Europe and hopefully we spot some gems there, but I don't get the criticism of the signings we have made this summer. So what if a player played for Mowbray before or for Boro? If they are good enough and improve results, I couldn't care less where they come from. 

Edited July 15, 2019 by Bigdoggsteel

[JacknOry]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

We signed 1 player from Boro this summer, a good signing imo. Johnson never played for Mowbray. Gallgher did a few games here, again though a good signing. 

It's a big change for the better from the summers before Mowbray arrived.  If we signed Downing, Johnson and a striker for £5 million the summer Coyle was here, fans wouldn't be able to believe what they are seeing. 

I am not disputing the signings are bad as such...actually pretty happy with them (so far), just clarifying that this talk of improving the scouting setup has been going on for some time now. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

I notice Chapman has disappeared off social media in the last few weeks. I have a funny feeling he is injured again and it is being kept quite. If he is, it would be very, very worrying. 

[roversfan99]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

I notice Chapman has disappeared off social media in the last few weeks. I have a funny feeling he is injured again and it is being kept quite. If he is, it would be very, very worrying. 

He didnt play in the friendly last week, Mowbray said he, Bell and Williams were injured. Shouldnt have been resigned.

[Dreams of 1995]

We all knew this about Harry Chapman and it's the reason he has come on such a cheap. The boys legs are so full of scar tissue that little niggles and tears will continue to happen.

He's electric on his day and genuinely gets you out of your seat. For the nominal fee it cost us, and no doubt the small wages he takes, it was worth a shot. If he's injured again then it is a crying shame as real talent is being wasted.

 

Edited July 15, 2019 by Dreams of 1995