Mowbray’s Future

[RevidgeBlue]

1 hour ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

I’m confused. Were they top players that could guarantee promotion or three useless has-beens no-one would touch with a barge-pole?

Neither. They weren't good enough to stop us going down and we wouldn't have been promoted without Dack. At the time we were relegated I'd say only Mulgrew would have been considered a major loss although Graham has done better since.

I'm sure that ideally they would rather not have played in League 1 but obviously they must have been well enough remunerated not to receive an equivalent or better offer from a Club higher up the pyramid. Bit of a stretch to call it a masterstroke on behalf of the manager.

[Exiled in Toronto]

54 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

Wednesday tried to get Mulgrew for like 100k or something embarrassing and Lenihan obviously attracted interest from the other Sheffield club. Truth is we do not know the phonecalls and bids that might have come in behind the scenes. I would expect there would have been interest for some of our players as plucking players from relegated clubs is quite normal.

Wasnt there a story that 5 or 6 senior players had to be persuaded to stay?

Yes there was, but it’s another BRFCS reverse ferret as it doesn’t fit with the new narrative that Mowbray had promotion handed to him on a plate. Don’t you recall the numerous “Thank God Cory Evans Is Staying!” threads? And all those “If we go down we’ll be playing at Plessy in three years” threads were just malicious Dingles toying with us.

[Bigdoggsteel]

4 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

We could always do them a swap for that lad we let go for peanuts a few years back.

Ya, I don't think many saw him turning into a good championship defender. Unfortunately 

[Bigdoggsteel]

4 hours ago, philipl said:

Crazy stuff on this thread.

Boy you guys were slow to get going when there was real shit at this club but once goaded you never stop.

Yes PNE and Wigan were awful and cost Mowbray a huge amount of goodwill he needed for the rest of this run.

But to be debating whether he should get sacked after what he has achieved at Rovers is just bonkers.

Especially when you look at the recent list of managers:

Kean

Berg

Appleton

Bowyer

Lambert

Coyle (displacing a good as appointed Warnock let's not forget)

Questions for you guys:

- be serious, is anybody going to chose any of the above as better than Mowbray?

- you are treating promotion from League 1 as an easy peasy splash in a toddler's paddle pool. Swap places with any of Barnsley, Burton or Sunderland just now?

- Between 0 and 100%, your level of confidence, Venky's to select a significantly better manager than Mowbray? 

 

The best bit is that those who are saying he should be sacked are the very ones who said they would be happy with us just staying up. 

[K-Hod]

13 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

The best bit is that those who are saying he should be sacked are the very ones who said they would be happy with us just staying up. 

Are they though? This seems to be conjecture at best and the kind of thing that would need proof to give it any credibility. If what you say is true, I’m sure such proof wouldn’t be too difficult to track down....

[davulsukur]

5 hours ago, philipl said:

Crazy stuff on this thread.

Boy you guys were slow to get going when there was real shit at this club but once goaded you never stop.

Yes PNE and Wigan were awful and cost Mowbray a huge amount of goodwill he needed for the rest of this run.

But to be debating whether he should get sacked after what he has achieved at Rovers is just bonkers.

Especially when you look at the recent list of managers:

Kean

Berg

Appleton

Bowyer

Lambert

Coyle (displacing a good as appointed Warnock let's not forget)

Questions for you guys:

- be serious, is anybody going to chose any of the above as better than Mowbray?

- you are treating promotion from League 1 as an easy peasy splash in a toddler's paddle pool. Swap places with any of Barnsley, Burton or Sunderland just now?

- Between 0 and 100%, your level of confidence, Venky's to select a significantly better manager than Mowbray? 

 

 

 

We are now back to "we can't sack the manager because we won't get anyone better"

It's like Bowyer all over again 

Edited December 27, 2018 by davulsukur

[davulsukur]

3 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

 The poor defending isn't new - the team was susceptible to giving away goals last season.  Why can't Mowbray fix it  ? Fans could also see the need for a big centre half in the summer - why didn't Mowbray ?  He's had plenty of time to act but shows no sign of being able to solve the problem

Pretty sure the majority of Moggas managerial career has been one giant sieve.

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 hour ago, K-Hod said:

Are they though? This seems to be conjecture at best and the kind of thing that would need proof to give it any credibility. If what you say is true, I’m sure such proof wouldn’t be too difficult to track down....

Oh come on man. You are a moderator aren't you? I have been on here rarely since the Leeds game and I have seen a number of posters say it.  Particularly in the match thread. I have seen posters say it today. Does it not count if people say it there after a game or something? 

I couldn't be bothered going back and finding posts. I have better things to be doing! 

Edited December 27, 2018 by Bigdoggsteel

[Bigdoggsteel]

4 hours ago, Mercer said:

If the club wants to move forward then yes.

He inherited a mess from  C o y l e but at the end of the day, I think he should still have kept us up.  To be relegated on goal difference was a tough, tough one to take when, IMO, his overly cautious approach and muddled tactical thinking turned some winning positions into draws and drawing positions into losses.

Mowbray had to get us back at the first attempt which in fairness he did.  However, Div 1 is pi$$ poor and nowhere near the challenge that Gordon Lee and Howard Kendall successfully came through.  Rovers were the best resourced club in Div 1 by a long way.  In my opinion, we 'ragged' it on a number of occasions last season and I was never convinced we were a team on the march that was going to make an impact this season.

As I posted earlier today, I really scratch my head as to what Mowbray brings to the party.  I think we are unattractive to watch, tactically muddled and our player trading is very poor apart from the rare exception (Dack) - two of our better players (Mulgrew and Graham) were both secured by C o y l e !

If you want 'stability' and are happy to tread water in the bottom half of the Championship then Mowbray is your man.

Interesting and well thought out in fairness to you. Although I disagree with a fair bit, some parts do ring true. 

Who would you like to get in? 

Personally the ex Fulham manager would be good I reckon. The thing is you need a specific type of manager to work effectively under Venkys, or at least attempt to. 

I think Mowbray is a good, honest and hardworking man. I have some doubts if he is the one to take us up, but I think he deserves this window and the summer one. At that point, if the backing continues, there really can be no excuses. 

 

[Bigdoggsteel]

3 hours ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

A poster yesterday - Mellorsomething - hit the nail on the head for me: since Venkys took over, a grand total of $250k has been made available for defenders, whereas money seems to fall from the sky for forwards.  I think there’s something in that.

Well that's not true,off the top of my head we signed Scott Dann for at least £4 million. 

[DE.]

24 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Well that's not true,off the top of my head we signed Scott Dann for at least £4 million. 

Dann and Duffy have probably been our major purchases in defence (I think Duffy was about £2m), but arguably we've been hit harder by failing to buy a decent defensive centre-midfielder. Other than Evans - who cost about £500k-ish? - we've largely been stuck with average/poor players like Lowe, Williamson, Smallwood, etc in the DM position. Even Cairney who was signed as an AMC ended up on the wing for most of his time here. Full backs have also been neglected somewhat. Fact is under Venky's we haven't spent much at all across any areas of the pitch since 2012/13 - striker is an outlier only because of Rhodes and Brereton costing a combined £15m between them. Take those two out of the equation and we've been frugal for a long time now and it shows in the overall lack of quality we have across the team. Mowbray has done well in keeping and adding hard workers, but Dack aside (who was also pretty cheap) we haven't added much quality since the days of Rhodes, Cairney, Duffy, etc. 

[Mercer]

17 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Interesting and well thought out in fairness to you. Although I disagree with a fair bit, some parts do ring true. 

Who would you like to get in? 

Personally the ex Fulham manager would be good I reckon. The thing is you need a specific type of manager to work effectively under Venkys, or at least attempt to. 

I think Mowbray is a good, honest and hardworking man. I have some doubts if he is the one to take us up, but I think he deserves this window and the summer one. At that point, if the backing continues, there really can be no excuses. 

 

I am not as close to football as I once was.  However, other clubs find innovative managers.  Who on this MB knew much about Wagner, Farke, Santo, Jokanovic etc before they were appointed.

I want a manager with real passion and a spark that transmits to all connected with the club - it goes a long way.  A manager who gets us playing in a style that excites and wins football matches.  A manager who can get us to the PL, keep us there and turn us into a top 10 team.  Sadly, in my eyes, Mowbray doesn't fit the profile.

You should never ever settle for mediocrity and stagnation.  A poster earlier made a valid point, don't let fear rule - we wont be able to do any better.  When Bowyer was our manager there were better options out there and I am convinced there are far better options out there than Mowbray.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Personally I wouldn't over react right now and I think most others wouldn't either. It's not about the Norwich or Leeds games. They were so frustrating, but they are top of the table team and that's football. For me, the real frustration stems from the Preston, Wigan, Rotherham and Birmingham games. The Norwich and Leeds games have just compounded that. 

[Mercer]

2 minutes ago, DE. said:

Dann and Duffy have probably been our major purchases in defence (I think Duffy was about £2m), but arguably we've been hit harder by failing to buy a decent defensive centre-midfielder. Other than Evans - who cost about £500k-ish? - we've largely been stuck with average/poor players like Lowe, Williamson, Smallwood, etc in the DM position. Even Cairney who was signed as an AMC ended up on the wing for most of his time here. Full backs have also been neglected somewhat. Fact is under Venky's we haven't spent much at all across any areas of the pitch since 2012/13 - striker is an outlier only because of Rhodes and Brereton costing a combined £15m between them. Take those two out of the equation and we've been frugal for a long time now and it shows in the overall lack of quality we have across the team. Mowbray has done well in keeping and adding hard workers, but Dack aside (who was also pretty cheap) we haven't added much quality since the days of Rhodes, Cairney, Duffy, etc. 

We need two quality centre halves and I would then let Charlie anchor our midfield playing just in front of the defence.  He reads the game well, can tackle and can pass the bloody ball.

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 minute ago, Mercer said:

I am not as close to football as I once was.  However, other clubs find innovative managers.  Who on this MB knew much about Wagner, Farke, Santo, Jokanovic etc before they were appointed.

I want a manager with real passion and a spark that transmits to all connected with the club - it goes a long way.  A manager who gets us playing in a style that excites and wins football matches.  A manager who can get us to the PL, keep us there and turn us into a top 10 team.  Sadly, in my eyes, Mowbray doesn't fit the profile.

You should never ever settle for mediocrity and stagnation.  A poster earlier made a valid point, don't let fear rule - we wont be able to do any better.  When Bowyer was our manager there were better options out there and I am convinced there are far better options out there than Mowbray.

Ya, those managers have been successes, however many Norwich fans wanted Farke gone last year and for everyone of those you mention, there is one like the guy at Sheffield Wednesday. 

Here's hoping Mowbray can turn it around 

 

[DE.]

3 minutes ago, Mercer said:

We need two quality centre halves and I would then let Charlie anchor our midfield playing just in front of the defence.  He reads the game well, can tackle and can pass the bloody ball.

Agreed, Mulgrew and Lenihan isn't a great CB partnership but funnily enough I think they'd make a more effective CM partnership than Evans/Smallwood. We need at least one good CB to come in and add some steel to the backline, I'd be shocked if we managed to get two.

[Mercer]

9 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Ya, those managers have been successes, however many Norwich fans wanted Farke gone last year and for everyone of those you mention, there is one like the guy at Sheffield Wednesday. 

Here's hoping Mowbray can turn it around 

 

Look, every managerial appointment comes with risk.  Every Johnny Foreigner will not be a success, every UK manager will not be a success.

There has to come a point where you ask yourself if our current manager is the man to take the club on to the next level.  In my opinion, Mowbray is not and I don't want to wait until 2022 for this to be proven beyond all doubt.

I got hammered in some quarters on this MB for my early views on Brereton but I think more and more on here now feel the same way.  Similarly, and I have spelt out why, on several occasions on this MB,  I feel Mowbray has taken us as far as he can and we need to change.

Edited December 27, 2018 by Mercer

[Mercer]

19 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Personally I wouldn't over react right now and I think most others wouldn't either. It's not about the Norwich or Leeds games. They were so frustrating, but they are top of the table team and that's football. For me, the real frustration stems from the Preston, Wigan, Rotherham and Birmingham games. The Norwich and Leeds games have just compounded that. 

So, thoughts are, we've been poor to shyte in six recent games, two games against good opponents and four games against poor to average opponents (and in two of those games <Preston and Wigan> we were woefully thrashed).

This pattern of both performances and results doesn't augur well.  Didn't see the Preston game but understand we were woeful - did see the Wigan game and we were dire (reminiscent of the worse days of Kean and C o y l e).  

Edited December 27, 2018 by Mercer

[47er]

7 hours ago, DE. said:

Most clubs that go down aren't allowed to keep players like Graham, Mulgrew or Evans - in fact most clubs would have lost players like Raya, Nyambe, Lenihan and Williams too. Mowbray was fortunate to be able to keep every decent player we had and bring in even more. Promotion is promotion but we should never have been in League 1 and it was actually a little unfair for us and Wigan to be down there with such strong squads. Nobody else really stood a chance as far as automatic promotion was concerned. 

I don't see many people on here demanding that Mowbray is sacked. Most people are saying the opposite - frustrated by his inability to fix our problems, but aware that sacking him is unlikely to be the answer. Doesn't mean he shouldn't be critcised when the same mistakes happen over and over again though. 

 

"frustrated by his inability to fix our problems" is one way of putting it, failure to see or acknowledge them is another.

 

5 hours ago, philipl said:

Evening Standard 8 August 2018

Answers two questions above:

Blackburn have ended their pursuit of Charlton defender Patrick Bauer.

Bauer has been pushing for a move away from Charlton but Blackburn manager Tony Mowbray says Rovers have “moved on” after being told the German was not for sale.

Charlton have rejected several bids for Bauer from Blackburn, with the latest thought to be £500,000.

Bauer issued a statement on Twitter on Sunday to say he will not sign an extension to his contract which expires at the end of the season.

But Charlton manager Lee Bowyer has blocked his exit from The Valley and Blackburn boss Mowbray said: “I have spoken to Lee and if he [Bauer] is not for sale then he is not for sale. 

“That is fine, we did a similar thing when other clubs tried to sign some of our players last season. That is football. You are allowed to bid for players and they are allowed to say no. We have to move on and that is what we have done.”

Tragedy for Chaddy!

[47er]

2 hours ago, K-Hod said:

Are they though? This seems to be conjecture at best and the kind of thing that would need proof to give it any credibility. If what you say is true, I’m sure such proof wouldn’t be too difficult to track down....

BDS isn't pathetic and has a life so I doubt whether he'll bother! He'd like it to be true though.   

[Scratch Andy]

There is a lot of bullshit on here, lots of dreamers !!!

Realism is in short supply, people have short memories.

I understand that it's about opinions but we are work in progress and yes we have got weaknesses  ( late goals etc) 

If we win the other side are crap and we lose we should have won,  no credit where due ?

The hospitals are busy enough without going on suicide watch

COYB

[Bbrovers2288]

Here is a left field name for you, will probably go down like a lead balloon but.......... Aidy Boothroyd.

was once highly regarded after doing miracles with Watford, lost his way granted through some strange managerial choices after that but is redeeming himself with youngsters of England. Won the u21 tournament. My thinking is he will be more than willing to work a team of youngsters and create something a bit special- quite possibly lift us where mowbray can’t.

just thinking out loud really 

[DeeCee]

Sol Campbell?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just kidding ?

[SBlue]

56 minutes ago, Scratch Andy said:

There is a lot of bullshit on here, lots of dreamers !!!

Realism is in short supply, people have short memories.

I understand that it's about opinions but we are work in progress and yes we have got weaknesses  ( late goals etc) 

If we win the other side are crap and we lose we should have won,  no credit where due ?

The hospitals are busy enough without going on suicide watch

COYB

 

36 minutes ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

Here is a left field name for you, will probably go down like a lead balloon but.......... Aidy Boothroyd.

was once highly regarded after doing miracles with Watford, lost his way granted through some strange managerial choices after that but is redeeming himself with youngsters of England. Won the u21 tournament. My thinking is he will be more than willing to work a team of youngsters and create something a bit special- quite possibly lift us where mowbray can’t.

just thinking out loud really 

 

Two more contrasting posts you couldn’t wish to see.

 

@Bbrovers2288 - look mate, we’ve all had a drink...

[Butty]

3 hours ago, Mercer said:

Look, every managerial appointment comes with risk.  Every Johnny Foreigner will not be a success, every UK manager will not be a success.

There has to come a point where you ask yourself if our current manager is the man to take the club on to the next level.  In my opinion, Mowbray is not and I don't want to wait until 2022 for this to be proven beyond all doubt.

I got hammered in some quarters on this MB for my early views on Brereton but I think more and more on here now feel the same way.  Similarly, and I have spelt out why, on several occasions on this MB,  I feel Mowbray has taken us as far as he can and we need to change.

I won’t say Mowbray has taken us as far as he can until there comes a point where we are actually underachieving as a squad and as a team, we are where we should be on paper and if we could hold on to a lead we’d be in the top six, you could obviously lay the blame at Mowbray for the way in which we’ve been seeing out games but for us to be mid table at this point in the season is not bad at all. Until we have a squad which on paper should be challenging towards the top end of the league but isn’t, you can’t say Mowbray has taken us as far as he can. Bowyer’s 2013-2015 Rovers should definitely have finished in the top six in one of those two seasons, we had two strikers with 20 goals each in the 14/15 season.. I can’t help but feel our good start to the season has raised expectations too much, survival was the main aim for this season and we will do that. All of us can see we need two wingers, a new left back another striker and a centre half partner for Mulgrew. Spending what we have on Brereton is indefensible and if Mowbray doesn’t address these issues in the summer I will soon change my tune, but if we can add those positions before the start of next season we should be right to expect more but until that time comes we should accept the fact we won’t be pulling many trees up this year, just throwing leads instead