Mowbray’s Future

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

12 hours ago, Biz said:

I’d take wins anyway but I think that we are actually making it harder for ourselves with those individual errors. Didn’t we say after 5/6 games or so we could’ve been joint top for a goalkeeping error and a poor wall at home to Villa?

Its become a common theme, sadly.

One thing all relegated teams have in common - they keep making the same " Individual Errors ".

[Batman.]

4 minutes ago, K-Hod said:

Have a look through the thread, I haven't seen a single post saying so......

The only posts have been suggesting that things need to improve, or that if things continue this way then Mowbray's position will be under review.

Only like at any other football club on the planet to be fair.

Long way to go before his position should be under discussion. 

And fans moan when managers and players aren't loyal to clubs...

We were always going to have a bad run, we aren't that good.

Hes done exceptionally well for us, and the aim at the start of the season was survival. We've been flirting with the playoffs all season up to now.

People need to stop being so reactionary at the first sign of a dodgy run.

[Mattyblue]

I’m just hoping that the loyalty he had shown to certain players, as admirable as it is, has now come to an end and we can move on.

[Parsonblue]

Mowbray always said that the players who won promotion would be given a chance to prove that they could play at a higher level.  At last week's meeting he indicated that one or two might be left behind as the club moved forward.  I think the last two games have merely underlined that point.  I don't think any of last season's squad can complain that they haven't had opportunities - and in fairness they have stepped up until the last couple of games when they seem to have hit a wall both physically and mentally.

From the very outset, Mowbray has talked about a long term plan that would encompass another two or three transfer windows in order to get a squad together that would be capable of challenging at this level which seems a fair assessment.

We were always going to have a bad run at some point but the points gained thus far have brought us some breathing space with regard to looking over our shoulder at lower end of the table.  A mid-table finish come May would be, for me, a decent season and at the moment I see no reason why that can't be achieved with one or two additions to the squad in January.

 

[DE.]

The manager's position should only come into question if we suddenly find ourselves within touching distance of the drop zone. We're 9 points clear at the moment, so we'd be talking about a fairly drastic downturn in form which, even with the last two games taken into account, seems unlikely. That said, we've got a tough December. Morale could be in pieces by the end of it.

I'm a bit concerned, especially remembering how we couldn't beat the likes of Ipswich or Reading. We've struggled against a lot of the teams below us which isn't a good sign. In fact we were hammered by three teams below us in the table - Wigan, Preston and Bristol City. We weren't able to beat Reading, Ipswich or Rotherham. We'll see if Sheffield Wednesday are added to the list Saturday.

Regardless the warning signs are there. This isn't a sudden bad turn of form as some are making out. We've not been playing well for most of the season so this is in fact more of a swift, hard bump back to reality. There is a lot of work to be done and I think we need a much better January window than we had in the summer to address some major issues across the team. 

[roversfan99]

3 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Seriously people need to calm down and think first before anyone is even thinking of getting rid of Mowbray. A mid table finish this season is a good season for us. How a messageboard can change in 3 games and its like vultures have come out of the woodwork again. Its almost like people have been waiting for Mowbray fail. Shocking poor

I know. I was there. But we were chasing the game

Who has said he should go?

No one wants him to fail. Grow up.

And how is taking off a striker for a left back chasing a game?

3 hours ago, blueboy3333 said:

Rovers made four changes, two of those enforced, and made another half-time alteration as Derrick Williams replaced Danny Graham. “And there might be another four at the weekend until we get it right" - Mowbray after last nights defeat.

ToMo has brought his ToMbola. It's much bigger than Sir Gary's. 

Thats the worry. A total scattergun approach. Wheres the consistency in team selections, wheres our identity, whats our plan bar lumping the ball in the air? Its just make 3 or 4 changes, but there is more than one position whereby I remain unconvinced that there is a solution to in our current imbalanced squad.

1 hour ago, Batman. said:

Are people really calling for Mowbray's head? The fickle nature of the modern football fan never ceases to amaze me.

No, I have not seen on person say it. He is being criticised for 2 horrendous performances and results in which his management played a huge part of. Thats not any more fickle than praising him after the Leeds game or after the Brentford game. Thats commenting on an individual game or games.

43 minutes ago, Parsonblue said:

Mowbray always said that the players who won promotion would be given a chance to prove that they could play at a higher level.  At last week's meeting he indicated that one or two might be left behind as the club moved forward.  I think the last two games have merely underlined that point.  I don't think any of last season's squad can complain that they haven't had opportunities - and in fairness they have stepped up until the last couple of games when they seem to have hit a wall both physically and mentally.

From the very outset, Mowbray has talked about a long term plan that would encompass another two or three transfer windows in order to get a squad together that would be capable of challenging at this level which seems a fair assessment.

We were always going to have a bad run at some point but the points gained thus far have brought us some breathing space with regard to looking over our shoulder at lower end of the table.  A mid-table finish come May would be, for me, a decent season and at the moment I see no reason why that can't be achieved with one or two additions to the squad in January.

 

I dont see that plan at all in terms of our style of play, in terms of our summer signings and how they have/havent been fit into the side, or in terms of his scattergun approach to selecting a side.

[K-Hod]

1 hour ago, Batman. said:

Long way to go before his position should be under discussion. 

And fans moan when managers and players aren't loyal to clubs...

We were always going to have a bad run, we aren't that good.

Hes done exceptionally well for us, and the aim at the start of the season was survival. We've been flirting with the playoffs all season up to now.

People need to stop being so reactionary at the first sign of a dodgy run.

The first bit is all anyone is saying, to be fair.

Nobody's arguing that he's got credit in the bank due to last season or saying he hasn't done well in the main. 

Re the last line, people are always going to be angry after we lose two games in a row, never mind  to local rivals to boot.....

Edited November 29, 2018 by K-Hod

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

17 minutes ago, K-Hod said:

The first bit is all anyone is saying, to be fair.

Nobody's arguing that he's got credit in the bank due to last season or saying he hasn't done well in the main. 

Re the last line, people are always going to be angry after we lose two games in a row, never mind  to local rivals to boot.....

It's not the losing that should be bothering us. It's the manner of the losing. I never bought into the " pushing for promotion " story and I predicted a finish of around 6th from the bottom. I'd be delighted with a mid table finish this season.

Edited November 29, 2018 by K-Hod

[chaddyrovers]

34 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Who has said he should go?

No one wants him to fail. Grow up.

And how is taking off a striker for a left back chasing a game?

 

look at the thread and people comments saying his position should be look at. Like Mercerman and some others. I haven't got the time to go through. 

Grow up? cracking comment. 

Look at the game and why we change formation and why Graham went off?

[arbitro]

1 hour ago, Parsonblue said:

Mowbray always said that the players who won promotion would be given a chance to prove that they could play at a higher level.  At last week's meeting he indicated that one or two might be left behind as the club moved forward.  I think the last two games have merely underlined that point.  I don't think any of last season's squad can complain that they haven't had opportunities - and in fairness they have stepped up until the last couple of games when they seem to have hit a wall both physically and mentally.

From the very outset, Mowbray has talked about a long term plan that would encompass another two or three transfer windows in order to get a squad together that would be capable of challenging at this level which seems a fair assessment.

We were always going to have a bad run at some point but the points gained thus far have brought us some breathing space with regard to looking over our shoulder at lower end of the table.  A mid-table finish come May would be, for me, a decent season and at the moment I see no reason why that can't be achieved with one or two additions to the squad in January.

 

I believe he was right to give the players from last season a chance and clearly some of them aren't up to it but almost as big a problem to me is that pretty much every summer signing has done little to prove themselves good enough. Armstrong, Brereton, Palmer and Rothwell haven't been good enough although one or two aren't really getting a chance. I didn't agree with the contract extensions handed out to some of the players who were still under contract as a reward for promotion. They will have received handsome bonuses for promotion. If the likes of Smallwood and Williams proved themselves good enough over a longer period then reward them. It's not like we are protecting ourselves for a potential sales value.

[roversfan99]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

look at the thread and people comments saying his position should be look at. Like Mercerman and some others. I haven't got the time to go through. 

Grow up? cracking comment. 

Look at the game and why we change formation and why Graham went off?

Not seen one person say Mowbray needs to go. This always happens when people criticise him, others chirp up and claim that they are being unreasonable and calling for his head. If anyone is saying that, then IMO they are wrong to do so, but I havent seen anyone say it, and the fact that you "havent got the time" to show me suggests that you havent.

No one wants him to fail. Everyone is frustrated at the crap that has been served up in the last few days, that over 7,000 tickets have been sold to see, that I have spent £50 on tickets and travel etc to watch embarrassing performances.

Im still scratching my head as to why he made the sub. It was a stupid sub and I'd love you to explain it if you know as I havent a clue.

[Ewood Ace]

Nearly half way through the season and he still doesn't know his best team, best formation or players' best position. The new signings haven't had much of an impact but that may well have something to do with the fact that he can't seem to decide what position to play them in. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

Not seen one person say Mowbray needs to go. This always happens when people criticise him, others chirp up and claim that they are being unreasonable and calling for his head. If anyone is saying that, then IMO they are wrong to do so, but I havent seen anyone say it, and the fact that you "havent got the time" to show me suggests that you havent.

No one wants him to fail. Everyone is frustrated at the crap that has been served up in the last few days, that over 7,000 tickets have been sold to see, that I have spent £50 on tickets and travel etc to watch embarrassing performances.

Im still scratching my head as to why he made the sub. It was a stupid sub and I'd love you to explain it if you know as I havent a clue.

He wanted to go 3 at the back and push Armstrong upfront. Not the craziest idea in fairness. Didn't work though 

I read somewhere Graham had a knock as well 

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Ewood Ace said:

Nearly half way through the season and he still doesn't know his best team, best formation or players' best position. The new signings haven't had much of an impact but that may well have something to do with the fact that he can't seem to decide what position to play them in. 

Rothwell has looked very good. Mowbray said he is top 3 in his physical stats. Reed needs to replace Smallwood and Rothwell needs to start on the wing 

[roversfan99]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

He wanted to go 3 at the back and push Armstrong upfront. Not the craziest idea in fairness. Didn't work though 

I read somewhere Graham had a knock as well 

I disagree. We were one down and had 3 attacking players on the pitch. To remove one for a left back to play in a back 3 baffled me and others around me and it didnt work. 

If Graham was injured, we had 3 attacking players on the bench that Mowbray signed himself in the summer. One of whom cost 7. I personally think the fact that none were brought on at that time is pretty galling in terms of how our summer recruitment went.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

I disagree. We were one down and had 3 attacking players on the pitch. To remove one for a left back to play in a back 3 baffled me and others around me and it didnt work. 

If Graham was injured, we had 3 attacking players on the bench that Mowbray signed himself in the summer. One of whom cost 7. I personally think the fact that none were brought on at that time is pretty galling in terms of how our summer recruitment went.

You can use a change of formation to be more attacking. 3 at the back means you have one less defender. It's not simply a striker for a full back. 

Your second paragraph contradicts what happened. He put one of the summer signings in Armstrong upfront 

We were getting routed. They hit the post a few times. He had to try something. It just didn't work 

[chaddyrovers]

18 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

 

No one wants him to fail. Everyone is frustrated at the crap that has been served up in the last few days, that over 7,000 tickets have been sold to see, that I have spent £50 on tickets and travel etc to watch embarrassing performances.

Im still scratching my head as to why he made the sub. It was a stupid sub and I'd love you to explain it if you know as I havent a clue.

I went to both games. 

Graham was probably injured. I have explained why he change to 3 at the back in the match thread and @arbitro suggest something aswell

[Ewood Ace]

2 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

You can use a change of formation to be more attacking. 3 at the back means you have one less defender. It's not simply a striker for a full back. 

Your second paragraph contradicts what happened. He put one of the summer signings in Armstrong upfront 

We were getting routed. They hit the post a few times. He had to try something. It just didn't work 

But in reality it was 5 at the back as Nyambe and Bell aren't exactly marauding  wing backs are they. And Armstrong is never a lone striker particularly with the hoof ball that we play. 

[Guest]

My biggest gripe is how easy it is to expose us down the flanks, coupled with how non-dangerous we are in regards to the same thing.

All 4 goals at Preston conceded down a flank (except maybe the second one, although it was scored by their winger...) i’d say all 3 last night too as well as the goal vs rotherham the game before preston. Derrick Williams is appalling at both ends, Bell not much better. Nyambe young and learning.

We need to get in some natural width, actual out and out wingers. Brereton/Armstrong as wingers lacks all logic when from my point of view it seems like a potential deadly strike force? We got away with it in league one but Armstrong is not and never has been a winger, we’re neutralising the thing that stands out from him over all our other players... PACE!!! Out wide you’re limited as to the runs you can make and he doesn’t have the natural ability to beat a man from skill like chapman, marshall, conway used to have. 

These ‘false wingers’ as i describe them just never ever seem to work as i think they’re intended to do. Armstrong played left back at Preston?! If Mowbray intends on playing Brereton as a winger then i think it’ll trump anything K**n did in regards to pointless signings (Portugal’s U19 team aside). 7 million could’ve got you 2 proper wingers with some left over.

Shopping list for January: 2 wingers, a left back, a right back, a centre back. We’re good for strikers, if they’re played up front... 

 

[Bigdoggsteel]

8 minutes ago, Ewood Ace said:

But in reality it was 5 at the back as Nyambe and Bell aren't exactly marauding  wing backs are they. And Armstrong is never a lone striker particularly with the hoof ball that we play. 

Nyambe can be pretty decent going forward. 

No, the players weren't up to it, but the formation can work with the correct personnel 

[Ewood Ace]

5 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Nyambe can be pretty decent going forward. 

No, the players weren't up to it, but the formation can work with the correct personnel 

Really he's a good defender but going forward he never gets a good cross in fact I'm struggling to remember when he last made an assist because he certainly hasn't made many.

Of course the formation can work with the right players but he's been trying this 3/5 at the back on and off for a year and we've never looked good playing it which suggests we don't have the right personnel.

[Bigdoggsteel]

2 minutes ago, Ewood Ace said:

Really he's a good defender but going forward he never gets a good cross in fact I'm struggling to remember when he last made an assist because he certainly hasn't made many.

Of course the formation can work with the right players but he's been trying this 3/5 at the back on and off for a year and we've never looked good playing it which suggests we don't have the right personnel.

I think the amount of talk on here about it isn't proportional to the amount of times that he has actually done it. 

I think this could work 

                           Raya

      Nyambe Lenihan Mulgrew

Bennet     Reed Evans    Rothwell

   Brereton Graham Armstrong

or

                         Raya

      Nyambe Lenihan Mulgrew

Bennett     Reed Evans    Rothwell

                      Dack

            Brereton Graham

 

Whatever about the right hand side, we badly need someone who can play left wing 

[Ewood Ace]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

I think the amount of talk on here about it isn't proportional to the amount of times that he has actually done it. 

I think this could work 

                           Raya

      Nyambe Lenihan Mulgrew



Bennet     Reed Evans    Rothwell



   Brereton Graham Armstrong

or

                         Raya

      Nyambe Lenihan Mulgrew

Bennett     Reed Evans    Rothwell

                      Dack

            Brereton Graham

 

Whatever about the right hand side, we badly need someone who can play left wing 

We are a centre back and a two wing backs of being able to set up like that.

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

You can use a change of formation to be more attacking. 3 at the back means you have one less defender. It's not simply a striker for a full back. 

Your second paragraph contradicts what happened. He put one of the summer signings in Armstrong upfront 

We were getting routed. They hit the post a few times. He had to try something. It just didn't work 

It wasnt because it was essentially a back 5. Either way it was never going to improve us as an attacking team.

I think its pretty meaningful that he has a forward that cost 7 million on the bench, as well as 2 attacking midfielders he signed, and when lets assume Graham got injured (not seen anything to suggest that) he resorted to a defender in a bizarre changed that panned out exactly as to be expected.

Yes he had to try something but to be honest its worrying that hes having to be so desperately reactive in the absence of a way of cresting attacks from the start. But the sub he did make made absolutely no sense and it proved a complete failure.

The most problematic aspect was that we didnt appear to have any sort of plan regardless of what formation and set of personnel were on the pitch.

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

I went to both games. 

Graham was probably injured. I have explained why he change to 3 at the back in the match thread and @arbitro suggest something aswell

And? So did I.

Ive yet to see a logical explanation fot a sub that clearly didnt work. Im not even sure Graham was injured but he had 3 of his own attacking players on the bench. The sub was a total failure, lets not dress it up. 

1 hour ago, Ewood Ace said:

But in reality it was 5 at the back as Nyambe and Bell aren't exactly marauding  wing backs are they. And Armstrong is never a lone striker particularly with the hoof ball that we play. 

Absolutely right. It was both a baffling and conservative change in equal measures. It seemed strange at the time and it didnt work.

[Mercer]

5 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Its different when some people did it to me didnt hear you say owt then? Quite remarkable  

I remove it if you want but Mercerman post is embarrassing

Hits a number of nails on the head.

Trouble is Chaddy, you bury your head in the sand too much, hiding from stark reality just hoping it's all a bad dream.