The mysterious case of Joe Rothwell.

[blueboy3333]

12 minutes ago, Swanson said:

Is Rothwell quicker than Arma? Seems really fast on the pitch yesterday.

Quickest player a the club according to one of the players in those '5 minutes with' things they do on the official site.

[Mattyblue]

Watching the first goal celebrations, Graham looked towards the Blackburn End whilst pointing at him, ‘this lad can play’ was the jist. He did it again as they started to walk back to the halfway line.

He should have been looking toward the dugout...

Edited April 10, 2019 by Mattyblue

[Neal]

8 hours ago, iSeeRed said:

Rothwell were wonderful tonight and he's finally off the mark with that goal. Surely Mowbray has to give him a run in the starting 11 now.

I don't think thats good enough, he's the type of midfielder you build a team around, he will have games where he will try things and it might not come off but you just have to take the rough with the smooth. Dack gets this allowance and it shouldn't be any different for Joe. 

[philipl]

Well done Joe!

[blueboy3333]

1 minute ago, Neal said:

I don't think thats good enough, he's the type of midfielder you build a team around, he will have games where he will try things and it might not come off but you just have to take the rough with the smooth. Dack gets this allowance and it shouldn't be any different for Joe. 

Dack has consistently scored goals throughout his career. He's proved himself. Rothwell now needs to prove himself in a consistent basis. To do that he needs a manager who believes in him. 

[Amo]

22 minutes ago, Neal said:

I don't think thats good enough, he's the type of midfielder you build a team around, he will have games where he will try things and it might not come off but you just have to take the rough with the smooth. Dack gets this allowance and it shouldn't be any different for Joe. 

That's the thing, players like Rothwell are judged more harshly by the manager than Bennett, Williams, Smallwood, Evans, et al. because he's a flair player. Same reason Rochina hardly got a crack here but lots of dross like Lowe, Williamson, Feeney played week in, week out. 

[Neal]

13 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

Dack has consistently scored goals throughout his career. He's proved himself. Rothwell now needs to prove himself in a consistent basis. To do that he needs a manager who believes in him. 

 

100%. Not sure Joe will ever be the goal scorer that Dack is but will be a better creator of goals than him I think. 

[Pedro]

55 minutes ago, blueboy3333 said:

Dack has consistently scored goals throughout his career. He's proved himself. Rothwell now needs to prove himself in a consistent basis. To do that he needs a manager who believes in him. 

I hope he learns a lot from his goal. Composure got him that, rather than lashing at the ball.  I'm a big fan of the lad. The first time I saw him I said he was like Rochina without the faffing about, I haven't changed my mind. He's going to be one he'll of a weapon for us if TM has the balls to stick with him.

[BankEnd Rover]

Big question for us is if he's lost faith with Tony. For all we know he might of already sorted his future out elsewhere. In that case the fingers needs to pointed, once again, at the manager!

[Neal]

24 minutes ago, BankEnd Rover said:

Big question for us is if he's lost faith with Tony. For all we know he might of already sorted his future out elsewhere. In that case the fingers needs to pointed, once again, at the manager!

I was enjoying my day until you p*ssed on my chips here. 

 

In all seriousness though its a valid point, if he's on substantially less than players like Dack and Graham and TM is serious about playing him from now on then he probably needs to be offered another contract. He's not going to turn it down at this point I don't think. 

[BankEnd Rover]

9 minutes ago, Neal said:

I was enjoying my day until you p*ssed on my chips here. 

 

In all seriousness though its a valid point, if he's on substantially less than players like Dack and Graham and TM is serious about playing him from now on then he probably needs to be offered another contract. He's not going to turn it down at this point I don't think. 

Got it in my mind as it's to be expected. It would do more than p*ss on my own chips if it did happen. These last few games i feel may help sway his decision.

[rovers11]

We have a good player on our hands here. It’s a mystery why he hasn’t been played more. He’s better than Armstrong. 

[roversfan99]

4 hours ago, Amo said:

That's the thing, players like Rothwell are judged more harshly by the manager than Bennett, Williams, Smallwood, Evans, et al. because he's a flair player. Same reason Rochina hardly got a crack here but lots of dross like Lowe, Williamson, Feeney played week in, week out. 

Think you are re writting history somewhat on Rochina. Rothwell definitely has somewhat of a valid reason to feel aggrieved, considering that all season effectively weve struggled to be effective from wide positions.

Whilst the likes of Lowe and Williamson (Feeney was never a regular for a prolonged spell) playing was really problematic in terms of us pushing on, that was a seperate caused through poor/lack of recruitment in a different position and over loyalty.

When Gestede and Rhodes were here, even Josh King who has gone on to have the best career of the lot couldnt be aggrieved not to play such was the numbers that pair were contributing. Beforehand, Rochina often flattered to deceive when he did play and Dunn and even at times Kazim Richards proved more effective partners to Rhodes.

[bluebruce]

People aren't rewriting history by rating Rochina, they just rated Rochina. Like I did, at the time. Wasn't perfect but should have got a lot more game time.

Rothwell is more direct, quicker, with very good technique (though not as good as Rochina's). He needs to hone that end product to be a serious star, but he needs to keep getting games.

Edited April 10, 2019 by bluebruce

[Amo]

3 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Think you are re writting history somewhat on Rochina. Rothwell definitely has somewhat of a valid reason to feel aggrieved, considering that all season effectively weve struggled to be effective from wide positions.

Whilst the likes of Lowe and Williamson (Feeney was never a regular for a prolonged spell) playing was really problematic in terms of us pushing on, that was a seperate caused through poor/lack of recruitment in a different position and over loyalty.

When Gestede and Rhodes were here, even Josh King who has gone on to have the best career of the lot couldnt be aggrieved not to play such was the numbers that pair were contributing. Beforehand, Rochina often flattered to deceive when he did play and Dunn and even at times Kazim Richards proved more effective partners to Rhodes.

In 12/13, Rochina made 19 appearances, he scored 5 goals and 4 assists. A better return than Rothwell this season. 

Rochina was a showpony but he was undoubtedly talented. For a lot of managers though that's a luxury they won't afford.

Edited April 10, 2019 by Amo

[roversfan99]

Just now, Amo said:

In 12/13, Rochina made 19 appearances, he scored 5 goals and 4 assists. A better return than Rothwell this season. 

Rochina was a showpony but he was undoubtedly talented. For a lot of managers though that's a luxury they won't afford.

The primary difference is that Rothwell is a player competing for a wide birth where our wide men have been collectively ineffective in the main.

Rochina was competing with players in central areas who in particular following the signing of Gestede were consistently contributing goals. Theres no way you could justify playing Rochina over a 20 goal striker, in Rhodes and then both Rhodes and Gestede, something that also did for Josh King, now the best out of the 4 but ultimately that was the (perhaps only) part of our team that functioned well.

[tomphil]

Maybe Mowbrays approach to handling Rothwell is now paying dividends perhaps he was after this kind of contribution all along.

Sadly he's left it too late in the day if so it should have been something he was working on right from when he was fit enough to be considered.

[Stuart]

31 minutes ago, tomphil said:

Maybe Mowbrays approach to handling Rothwell is now paying dividends perhaps he was after this kind of contribution all along.

Sadly he's left it too late in the day if so it should have been something he was working on right from when he was fit enough to be considered.

Normally it takes more than 5 minutes to rewrite history!

[blueboy3333]

1 hour ago, bluebruce said:

People aren't rewriting history by rating Rochina, they just rated Rochina. Like I did, at the time. Wasn't perfect but should have got a lot more game time.

Rothwell is more direct, quicker, with very good technique (though not as good as Rochina's). He needs to hone that end product to be a serious star, but he needs to keep getting games.

Is Mowbray the man to develop Rothwell? 

[DE.]

1 hour ago, tomphil said:

Maybe Mowbrays approach to handling Rothwell is now paying dividends perhaps he was after this kind of contribution all along.

Sadly he's left it too late in the day if so it should have been something he was working on right from when he was fit enough to be considered.

I think it's being very generous to assume that this is some kind of elaborate plan by Mowbray to mould Rothwell into some kind of star player. Based on what we've seen of Mowbray the most simple answer is likely the right one - he's terrified of other teams and thus prefers to play defensive-minded players rather than take any risks. Yesterday's line up seemed to be TM throwing his hands up and saying screw it, might as well try this because nothing else is working. My guess would be that TM feels deeply uncomfortable about how much better we were last night compared to how we usually play,

[Tom Stinny]

I think it's more along the lines of being weak willed against the senior players. You've got Evans, Smallwood, Bennet, Mulgrew and Conway who shouldn't start regular games yet can be guaranteed to be playing.

 

It's already been demonstrated that he'll dig Raya and Rothwell out. He doesn't dig Brereton because of his price but if he cost a low amount he'd be on the hit list as well.

 

It's cowardly, piss poor management. It isn't being to afraid of other teams it's simply keeping the right players happy. Everyone else can do one mentality. 

Edited April 10, 2019 by Tom Stinny

[joey_big_nose]

12 hours ago, Neal said:

I don't think thats good enough, he's the type of midfielder you build a team around, he will have games where he will try things and it might not come off but you just have to take the rough with the smooth. Dack gets this allowance and it shouldn't be any different for Joe. 

What was exciting about last night was previously I would have said Dack and Rothwell would struggle to play together as they inhabit similar space on the pitch. I was totally wrong. Their linkup was superb.

Can't wait to see them on there with Chapman too on the right. Something to look forward to after two months of terrible performances.

 

Edited April 10, 2019 by joey_big_nose

[Admiral Nelsen]

21 minutes ago, Tom Stinny said:

I think it's more along the lines of being weak willed against the senior players. You've got Evans, Smallwood, Bennet, Mulgrew and Conway who shouldn't start regular games yet can be guaranteed to be playing.

 

It's already been demonstrated that he'll dig Raya and Rothwell out. He doesn't dig Brereton because of his price but if he cost a low amount he'd be on the hit list as well.

 

It's cowardly, piss poor management. It isn't being to afraid of other teams it's simply keeping the right players happy. Everyone else can do one mentality. 

Not sure that's the full story. I don't agree with Tony when he has dug out Raya and Rothwell, but to be fair it's usually just been with the one aspect of their game when saying that they can do other stuff well. He's done the same with Mulgrew and how well he can be dodgy in the air, and he's called Smallwood a limited player basically since he came through the door. Said that he wasn't picking Evans for a lot of last season beacuse he wasn't playing well enough.

On Rothwell in particular, I would've played him more and I think Mowbray has been a bit too harsh on him, but I aso think this is probably a case where the manager can't do right for doing wrong. We've been letting in far too many goals this season, but in my view we can't complain about that whilst at the same time dig the manager out for expecting his midfielders to be able to defend.

[Husky]

1 hour ago, blueboy3333 said:

Is Mowbray the man to develop Rothwell? 

 

[bluebruce]

3 hours ago, tomphil said:

Maybe Mowbrays approach to handling Rothwell is now paying dividends perhaps he was after this kind of contribution all along.

Or maybe he could have had this kind of contribution all along.

2 hours ago, blueboy3333 said:

Is Mowbray the man to develop Rothwell? 

Ehh...no. His version of developing players seems to be to bench them for as long as possible.