Tony Mowbray Discussion

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

End of the day this is a forum with about 50 regular posters. Forums generally are less ‘optimistic’ places than ‘real life’ or Facebook etc. Same everywhere.

In real life he’s hardly had a word said against him in 2 and a half years, so no idea why anybody would need to ‘cringe’.

 

I would wager the average age of the poster on here will be older than the ones on " Social Media ". That means most of us have been around the block a few times, bought the Tee shirt etc. We've seen it all before, several times.

[Mattyblue]

I don’t think this place is particularly ‘balanced’, as in a wide cross section of views. Opinion on here more often than not matches mine, certainly more than the Uber positive Facebook groups and LT comments. But I would say this place is more ‘negative’ than the usual consensus at the ground.

So take it all with a pinch of salt.

Edited September 22, 2019 by Mattyblue

[Silas]

1 hour ago, Harry The Bass said:

There is no justification in calling for any managers head after one game.

 

40 minutes ago, Harry The Bass said:

 

90 minutes into a new season. 

 

21 minutes ago, Harry The Bass said:

This thread however was the latest iteration and came right after the Charlton game.

 

13 minutes ago, Harry The Bass said:

Top thread come 7pm after first game of season; “MOWBRAY OUT”

I think you've made your point.  

Repeating it over and over is just going to irritate people. 

Besides that,  it happened 7 weeks ago so you're kind of going over old ground here. 

[JBiz]

Just now, Silas said:

I think you've made your point.  

Repeating it over and over is just going to irritate people. 

Besides that,  it happened 7 weeks ago so you're kind of going over old ground here. 

The irony being, I wouldn’t feel the need to repeat myself if my original points had been left.

 

 

Edited September 22, 2019 by Harry The Bass

[arbitro]

3 hours ago, Harry The Bass said:

There is no justification in calling for any managers head after one game. People will try, tag on last season say things like“I’ve always felt like this”, which is exactly the point about being close minded.

The reality though - whether you see little or lots of value in a manager, there are appropriate windows to sensibly move one on, with certain owners this can be borderline impossible.

Its not about some “I told you so” nonsense, it’s about the opinion that the reaction was embarrassing.

Still is. Thankfully those with the ability to change the thread titles are in agreement.

But it's always exaggerated as to how many wanted him sacked. Can you tell me how many people actually called for his head? Most of the posts I read were genuine concerns and some, as yet are unfounded but the season is a long and arduous process with many turns.

I heard one City supporter calling for Guardiola to be sacked last week. That is how some fans think but sometimes there needs to be context as the vast majority do don't.

[Mattyblue]

Edit

Edited September 26, 2019 by Mattyblue

[CrouchingNunhiddenCucumber]

Big T is aiming for 8th place apparently in his interview in this mornings LT; 70 points, that's going off last year's table at least. 

[JacknOry]

“If we’re in the top half of the table and threatening the top six around Christmas and the new year I can hopefully go to the owners and ask for some more help and that last little push to try and push us ultimately to where we want to be.

Its like groundhog day, we heard exactly the same last season and got to a position to challenge and didnt strengthen despite most of us knowing we would need it. 

[MarkBRFC]

That statement is baffling.

We were 7th come the end of January last season after 4 straight wins and our only business was to sign a player that Mowbray never had any intention of playing!

[LDRover]

Meanwhile the goldfish on the Facebook page are lapping it up.

[JacknOry]

1 hour ago, MarkBRFC said:

That statement is baffling.

We were 7th come the end of January last season after 4 straight wins and our only business was to sign a player that Mowbray never had any intention of playing!

And to send Downing out on loan when we were already short at the back - which backfired quite drastically.

You could easily just copy and paste his comments at around this time last season and they would look identical. I would imagine that the lack of action in January will be quite identical too - though I hope not. Still need defensive additions namely CB and RB. 

[Crimpshrine]

But it is so baffling. I remember at the first fans consultation last season Mowbray stated ' I know the owners will back me if we are around the playoffs in January'.

Look what happened in Jan, yet money was spent in the summer.

Maybe someone has advised our dear owners that you don't get value for money in January. Simple as that.

[philipl]

We know now that Rovers weren't one or two players short of a play-off place last January, we were half a squad short.

Mowbray and Waggott always talked about a four window player acquisition strategy. 

What happened last January picking up Chapman as an injury wreck punt fits into that view and probably the Raos really respect the care which is at long long last being taken with their money.

Suppose we had blown £10m on the Boro forward- was that enough to get to the play-offs? No; we needed at least three at the back as well. So let's say £20m later and we fluked it to 6th. Odds on winning the play-offs??? 

We are building steadily but very clearly advancing.

Let's see if the current defence and game management buy us a bunch of wins now- we might be ahead of schedule 

BUT

Is this squad going to stay in the Premier League if we get there? Clubs have tried buying a Premier League outfit in the summer transfer market and have found themselves back in the Championship having blown a pretty unrecoverable £50-100m in transfer fees and got themselves a £60m pa wage bill to boot.

Perhaps two or maybe four current players are Premier League standard. That needs to be more like eight or nine ahead of Promotion to even have a prayer of finishing 17th first season back. 

 

[Norbert Rassragr]

If I was making decisions after we got promoted this season, I'd take the money and then bank it with a few better players coming in on relatively small money. Do what Burnley have done, not what Fulham did.

[JacknOry]

I think id take going up even if the players are not good enough to stay there, the 100 odd million the club would earn would be more than worth it. Dont do a Fulham and buy a whole new team, just invest wisely ala Burnley (hate saying it) so that your squad is good enough to come straight back up if relegated again.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, philipl said:

Is this squad going to stay in the Premier League if we get there?

Probably not no, that would be a pretty unanimous shared opinion, but the summer leading into that Premier League season (hopefully) would allow us to strengthen significantly. We can only hope!

[Crimpshrine]

19 minutes ago, philipl said:

 

What happened last January picking up Chapman as an injury wreck punt fits into that view and probably the Raos really respect the care which is at long long last being taken with their money.

But doesn't fit with Mowbray's talk about spending money in January if the playoffs were achievable.

Last January we were in a great position and we didn't attempt to capitalise.

[Adam C]

22 minutes ago, philipl said:

 

Perhaps two or maybe four current players are Premier League standard. That needs to be more like eight or nine ahead of Promotion to even have a prayer of finishing 17th first season back. 

 

Which players are you referring to? I’d say Dack is maybe prem standard, although the championship may just be his level. Other than that I can’t think of one premiership quality player in our ranks. We would need massive investment if we were promoted, and I wouldn’t fancy being premiership whipping boys next season so the slow build works for me. 

[Sparks Rover]

Our trouble is that a lot of the older squad players know if they get promoted then they lose their jobs. Why rock the boat?

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

44 minutes ago, philipl said:

We know now that Rovers weren't one or two players short of a play-off place last January, we were half a squad short.

Mowbray and Waggott always talked about a four window player acquisition strategy. 

What happened last January picking up Chapman as an injury wreck punt fits into that view and probably the Raos really respect the care which is at long long last being taken with their money.

Suppose we had blown £10m on the Boro forward- was that enough to get to the play-offs? No; we needed at least three at the back as well. So let's say £20m later and we fluked it to 6th. Odds on winning the play-offs??? 

We are building steadily but very clearly advancing.

Let's see if the current defence and game management buy us a bunch of wins now- we might be ahead of schedule 

BUT

Is this squad going to stay in the Premier League if we get there? Clubs have tried buying a Premier League outfit in the summer transfer market and have found themselves back in the Championship having blown a pretty unrecoverable £50-100m in transfer fees and got themselves a £60m pa wage bill to boot.

Perhaps two or maybe four current players are Premier League standard. That needs to be more like eight or nine ahead of Promotion to even have a prayer of finishing 17th first season back. 

 

I wasn't getting over excited about the striker ( Assambolonga ? )  we were supposed to be interested in from Boro earlier this year either. I'm not sure he was the sort of striker we needed and I'm not sure he would have made that much of a difference given the way we were playing.

Edited September 27, 2019 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[Exiled in Toronto]

32 minutes ago, Crimpshrine said:

But doesn't fit with Mowbray's talk about spending money in January if the playoffs were achievable.

Last January we were in a great position and we didn't attempt to capitalise.

Jan was the high water mark for a mid-table team. We didn’t win one out of the next 11 because we were missing Boro’s striker. We are in far better shape this year to be realistic top 6 challengers 

[JacknOry]

Just now, Exiled in Toronto said:

Jan was the high water mark for a mid-table team. We didn’t win one out of the next 11 because we were missing Boro’s striker. We are in far better shape this year to be realistic top 6 challengers 

I think we wanted the other end of the pitch sorted tbh, people did get a little excited at the prospect of Assombalonga but most were more concerned with our strength and depth at the back (still are). We actually weakened by sending a CB out on loan and it kicked us in the butt. 

[JHRover]

Heard all this stuff before. Sometimes I wonder whether it is Mowbray sending messages to Venkys and putting the ball in their court e.g. if I do my bit over the next couple of months we expect you to come back and do your bit by spending. 

As others have pointed out we were in a very good position in January 2019 to launch a play off push yet signed nobody and let our defenders go out on loan. We ended up plummeting whilst PNE went much nearer the top 6.

I always find this talk of 'pushing' or 'chasing' the top 6 funny. The whole point of the play off system is to ensure most teams in the league have something to fight for in the latter stages of the season. If you aren't fighting relegation and aren't in the automatic promotion slots then most other clubs will be in the play-offs or in with a chance of getting there in January and February

Traditionally 50 points is the survival requirement and 70+ is the play offs. So as long as we are comfortably past 50 needed for survival then we are going to be within a few wins of the play offs. That's the way it always is. 

Of course the play-offs themselves don't mean much unless you go on and win them. If not they can be very damaging going into the following season as sides like Reading have found out. Much better targeting the top 2 with the play-offs as a consolation.

What does all this mean for Venkys and funding? Conceivably we could be 7th and 10 points off the top 6 in January or we could be 13th and 3 points off them. Which is better for Venkys when deciding whether to chuck more cash in?

[tomphil]

If we are doing ok it'll end up as 'go with what we have and keep faith with those who've got us this far' rather than any extra push investment.

It's all standard speak in my book just preparing for nothing out of the ordinary come what may, doing well = no need to spend for sake of it, doing average = why waste big money now might as well take stock in summer when prices are lower.

TM has got this game down to a T here.

 

[LDRover]

You don't push for the playoffs, you get in the top 6 and either stay there or push for top 2.