Tony Mowbray Discussion

[tomphil]

Just now, Amo said:

Correct me if I'm wrong but Steele and Leutwiler are the only goalies we've paid for.

Yeah i'd say that was right unless they paid a minimal fee for Clint ? 

Such a vital area of any football team the no 1 position especially at Rovers where the crowd likes to bond with their keeper. If you start with Leon Best just how much has been spent at the opposite end up top compared to the equally important keeper position ?

Absolutely bonkers.

[RevidgeBlue]

6 hours ago, unsall said:

Good post as usual, and with a few winnable games coming up let’s see what happens.

Some of the dross directed at Mowbray is crazy, he’s been very good to the club and I hope he can turn it round. If he can’t come January,  well lets have a change, I still think we have some very decent players but the main problem is finding a settled side and focus on our strengths instead of keep changing the side to counter different  teams. 

Love the manager at Shef Unt who plays the same home and away, 3 at the back and play with no fear, and with no real stars, just high tempo stuff, So for me, give TM till after the Xmas games and see where we are.

A new man needs to come asap and assess the squad ahead of the January window. Why wait until January to make a decision? By then we'd be struggling to get another manager in before the end of the transfer window which would be another one gone and wasted and we'd be in real difficulty avoiding the drop.

We made this mistake in February. TM should have been axed then and a new man been brought in for the last ten games or so to assess the squad and have a clear out and stamp his authority on the squad in summer. By not doing so what could have been a very good campaign in the most mediocre Championship I've seen will instead be at best another wasted season where we've gone backwards and at worst another relegation to League one.

I'd take Warnock if he was interested. Not sure what he would make of the attitude of this squad of players though and the relaxed holiday camp "we're aiming to make a challenge for promotion sometime within the next ten years' type mentality which seems to be prevalent. I think he'd be disgusted by both.

[RevidgeBlue]

22 hours ago, arbitro said:

This interview should be the tipping point for anybody who still backs him. He is talking about results with this quote.

“Is it a concern? I judge the team on their performance levels,” Mowbray told the Lancashire Telegraph.

Hopefully he understands if you lose too many games you get relegated.

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/quicktest/18027479.is-concern--rovers-boss-mowbray-recent-results/

So if we continue to lose matches by the odd goal and get relegated but don't get drubbed by anyone score wise that's ok then?

What a load of cobblers. Bit like his post match comment about Leeds' 15 shots on goal not being 'hundreds". He's really struggling to say anything constructive whatsoever now.

Once again singling out Nyambe by giving him a back handed compliment but at the same time inferring it's his fault we're struggling is an absolute disgrace. He should have added to that comment 'RN's doing his best but isn't helped by players like Elliott Bennett who are absolutely dog***** every week."

Assuming all the players all like each other you do wonder how the treatment of Raya,  Nyambe, Brereton,  Chapman, Rothwell, and Mulgrew sits with the rest of the squad. It's hard to imagine squad morale is that great when certain players are obviously treated so much more favourably than the rest and at the other end of the scale certain other players are singled out for criticism or frozen out altogether.

The more I hear from Mowbray the more I'm becoming  convinced we'll go down unless we make a change.

Edited November 12, 2019 by RevidgeBlue

[Stuart]

7 hours ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

I’m not one for conspiracy theories but the disparity between spending on the back 5 versus forwards during Venky’s reign simply cannot be the collective brain farts of seven different managers. Come to think of it, when was the last time we lashed out on a good midfielder?

Which leads to the second point as to why then does Mowbray not walk? Personally, I think all the “man of integrity” stuff is groupthink on here. I’m sure he is honest, but I’m also sure he loves football so much he’d stay in a job that gives him 90% of what he loves versus being on the dole and getting 0%.

If you take away the two very odd multi-million pound strikers during the last two seasons and we have spent very little on anyone.

[Blue blood]

1 hour ago, RevidgeBlue said:

So if we continue to lose matches by the odd goal and get relegated but don't get drubbed by anyone score wise that's ok then?

What a load of cobblers. Bit like his post match comment about Leeds' 15 shots on goal not being 'hundreds". He's really struggling to say anything constructive whatsoever now.

Once again singling out Nyambe by giving him a back handed compliment but at the same time inferring it's his fault we're struggling is an absolute disgrace. He should have added to that comment 'RN's doing his best but isn't helped by players like Elliott Bennett who are absolutely dog***** every week."

Assuming all the players all like each other you do wonder how the treatment of Raya,  Nyambe, Brereton,  Chapman, Rothwell, and Mulgrew sits with the rest of the squad. It's hard to imagine squad morale is that great when certain players are obviously treated so much more favourably than the rest and at the other end of the scale certain other players are singled out for criticism or frozen out altogether.

The more I hear from Mowbray the more I'm becoming  convinced we'll go down unless we make a change.

Great post and sums up why TM is not a man of integrity. Blaming Nayambe (far from the most culpable of our team) for all our failings, lying about how the Leeds game went, being happy with the non-target of competing - where is the integrity of any of that. 

 

On a separate note I think the theories that we can't spend money on defenders must be true given a) the amount we have spent on this under Vs and b) the contrast between TMs comments and actions. 

[Mattyblue]

Forget that article yesterday about it being about performances. Today piece, it’s a ‘results business and we haven’t won enough’

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/quicktest/18029658.football-winning-games-havent-won-enough/

Edited November 12, 2019 by Mattyblue

[OldEwoodBlue]

“It doesn’t matter about possession. You have to score."

 

Tony makes a U Turn. 

[arbitro]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

Forget that article yesterday about it being about performances. Today piece, it’s a ‘results business and we haven’t won enough’

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/quicktest/18029658.football-winning-games-havent-won-enough/

The two articles kind of sum up where we are as a football team. His contradictory nature on tactics, style of play etc are one of the reasons we struggle in my opinion. Now his contradiction in two back to back interviews are apparent. 

No wonder the players look confused at times. Was it the American TV programme called Soap that used the strapline "Confused - you will be........."

[DE.]

8 hours ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

Personally, I think all the “man of integrity” stuff is groupthink on here. 

I would argue it's more the outside social media sphere that perpetuates that myth than this site. Most of us sussed out Mowbray some time ago. He's the same as virtually every other football manager across the land - self-preservation first, everything else a distant second. 

[chaddyrovers]

15 hours ago, Parsonblue said:

Whilst I agree that the manager is struggling at the moment I can't agree with any of the above.

He certainly isn't a bumbling fool and I think to accuse him of been some sort of con merchant is totally out of order.

I would never question his honesty or integrity because I think they are beyond question.  I personally believe him to be a genuine guy doing his best but who is struggling at the moment to find the right solutions to problems, which in fairness, have been of his own making in terms of defenders.  I think it's those attributes that many supporters - perhaps not on here - have latched onto and is the reason why he is being given more time by the majority of the fanbase.

Ultimately, as with all managers, results will determine when the fanbase turns but, as yet, there is no real sign of it - either at Ewood or at away matches.

In recent weeks I have questioned many of the decisions that have been made and certainly have doubts about some of the signings we've made - Gallagher, Brereton and Chapman to name but three - but I would never question the guy's honesty or integrity.  

Managers have to have total self belief in what they are doing - after all there any number of folk telling them they are doing it wrong every week!

I believe Mowbray genuinely believes that he will take this club in the right direction over a period of time and I suspect that at the moment the owners will give him time.  The decision to pay up the remainder of his contract - together with others on the coaching staff - and then employ yet another manager and staff will not be one that the owners will be keen to take from a purely financial point of view. 

After the international break we have games where we would expect to turn our recent defeats into wins and draws.  The period between now and Christmas will be the one that may well determine his future.

Its wrong to called him a fool or con merchant after all he has done at the club and rebuild the club. I feel that Mowbray still has the majority of Game attending fans before him. 

Whilst I would a change manager this week, I dont think it will happen at all and he still has support and credit in the bank from the owners. They happy to support and back him. 

No doubt our summer recruitment wasnt good enough or what we need. Questions need to be asked about this. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

Ya, absolutely no way Mowbray should be called anything insulting to his character, he isn't Kean or anywhere near that. He's a decent man, who is stubborn and stuck in his ways and its going to cost him his career at this level eventually. He might get one more job after here, but he ain't gonna change.

Ps https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/quicktest/18028561.three-rovers-defenders-now-walking-suspension-tightrope/ 

"Defenders are coming" 

[Amo]

58 minutes ago, DE. said:

I would argue it's more the outside social media sphere that perpetuates that myth than this site. Most of us sussed out Mowbray some time ago. He's the same as virtually every other football manager across the land - self-preservation first, everything else a distant second. 

Pretty much. Why fans choose to put football managers on a pedestal is beyond me. Now and again you might find one who puts the club's needs before his own.

[tomphil]

1 hour ago, arbitro said:

The two articles kind of sum up where we are as a football team. His contradictory nature on tactics, style of play etc are one of the reasons we struggle in my opinion. Now his contradiction in two back to back interviews are apparent. 

No wonder the players look confused at times. Was it the American TV programme called Soap that used the strapline "Confused - you will be........."

This is it, Tony two minds he's continually caught between a rock and a hard place on how he wants the team to play.

Said it all along right from when he first arrived and i expected the team to be fighting tooth and nail to fight the drop but it didn't really we sort of plodded to relegation. We were nearly there though and only went down by the odd point so it seemed accepted.  He's an old school manager who tries to apply International chess style thinking.

Fur coat and no knickers i'm afraid.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

3 hours ago, Stuart said:

If you take away the two very odd multi-million pound strikers during the last two seasons and we have spent very little on anyone.

I agree with you Stuart but we have a massively bloated first team squad. What must that be costing in wages ? Lets say 30 players are on a average of  £10k a week  ( maybe that could be on the low side. ) -  £300k  a week - £1.2 million per month  - £14.5 million a year. Plus that is just first team standard players although in my book they're very much all of a muchness with not many outstanding players. We need to slim down that squad dramatically. There's a good half dozen that we could release now and never miss.

[Amo]

If I remember rightly, Mowbray's WBA side were known for playing good football but were also a soft-touch that failed to mix things up and win ugly. Sounds exactly like us, except for the "playing good football" part. 

[Wegerleswiggle]

Just now, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I agree with you Stuart but we have a massively bloated first team squad. What must that be costing in wages ? Lets say 30 players are on a average of  £10k a week  ( maybe that could be on the low side. ) -  £300k  a week - £1.2 million per month  - £14.5 million a year. Plus that is just first team standard players although in my book they're very much all of a muchness with not many outstanding players. We need to slim down that squad dramatically. There's a good half dozen that we could release now and never miss.

You could quite easily replace Leutweiller, Bennett, Bell, Evans, Smallwood, Mulgrew, Samuel and Gladwin straight away with U23s and not miss them. That is a massive chunk of wages freed up. With that saving you could easily bring in a keeper, a couple of defenders and a striker(that can score) and still have room in the wage budget. 

[Amo]

Just now, Wegerleswiggle said:

You could quite easily replace Leutweiller, Bennett, Bell, Evans, Smallwood, Mulgrew, Samuel and Gladwin straight away with U23s and not miss them. That is a massive chunk of wages freed up.  

That's a good point. Although most of our youth players will end up in the football wilderness, there are some who could do a job for less money than the "squaddies" we have now.

[tomphil]

57 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I agree with you Stuart but we have a massively bloated first team squad. What must that be costing in wages ? Lets say 30 players are on a average of  £10k a week  ( maybe that could be on the low side. ) -  £300k  a week - £1.2 million per month  - £14.5 million a year. Plus that is just first team standard players although in my book they're very much all of a muchness with not many outstanding players. We need to slim down that squad dramatically. There's a good half dozen that we could release now and never miss.

After all the trimming back and getting it under control it seems to be getting bloated again. Those at the club often flag up the wage bill but the owners never seem that bothered about it they keep adding the shortfall.  Which is all well and good but the trouble is the unbalanced squad and most of the wages and fees going on forwards and a few mids.

Time and again we are undone at the other end through poor play from players not really up to it yet they never get upgraded. Then we get told we couldn't afford this that or the other defender / keeper !

Not really much of a plan i don't think just the perennial scattergun.   Invest in some bloody quality in that back line and between the sticks and free up the space by getting rid of the constant wage drain under achievers who we really don't need to carry anymore.

Evans and Samuel for a start, easy 20 grand plus per week there.

[Stuart]

1 hour ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I agree with you Stuart but we have a massively bloated first team squad. What must that be costing in wages ? Lets say 30 players are on a average of  £10k a week  ( maybe that could be on the low side. ) -  £300k  a week - £1.2 million per month  - £14.5 million a year. Plus that is just first team standard players although in my book they're very much all of a muchness with not many outstanding players. We need to slim down that squad dramatically. There's a good half dozen that we could release now and never miss.

True enough. Trouble is that slimming down would likely see us lose Rothwell and keep Evans.

[K-Hod]

I don’t think Mowbray is a bad guy at all, but I don’t think he’s the angel some suggest he is.

I’d say he’s something in the middle, which is probably about where his ability sits tbh.

[BlackburnEnd75]

Good comment made earlier by one poster. After all the effort we made to get rid of a bloated uneven squad we seem to have ended up with the same issue but this time it’s arguable worse.

we can’t use the under 23’s to replace some of those players suggested earlier because simply the under 23’s that are ready to step up don’t play in those positions. Tony has blocked the path of the players most likely to break through. 
 

He’s now settled on a defence which has at right back a jobbing midfielder, at centre half we have a right back and a potentially good cb who isn’t ours, and at left back we have a backup centre half. 
 

He seemed to realise what the problem is at the end of last season with the 'defenders are coming' but they didn’t really. He moans about Lenihan being injured but anyone building a defence around Lenihan knows he is going to miss between 10-20 games a season through injury as he has the last 2 seasons Tony has been in charge!!!

Forget the transfer fees for a minute (lucky for Mr £5million & 1 goal in16 games) but the money he’s spending on wages means that we can’t just finish 17th again, he has to justify that with at least a top 10 finish. If your splurging money on Downing, Johnson, Tosin, Holtby and Cunningham then you also  can’t argue that we are a work in progress or a side for the future as those are players for now. 
 

Throw in the frequent tactical head scratchers and selection issues and my point is he doesn’t know how he’s going to get us up the league and for my money there isn’t much point hanging onto someone who is only going to waste more resources and not improve us.

Edited November 14, 2019 by BlackburnEnd75
word mispelt

[Pedro]

17 hours ago, tomphil said:

When did we last sign a good keeper ?  Something thats been majorly missing for ten years, no coincidence there either i don't think !

Honestly, I never rated Robinson at all, so for me the last decent keeper we signed was Friedel (unless there's someone obvious I've forgotten).

[tomphil]

Just now, Pedro said:

Honestly, I never rated Robinson at all, so for me the last decent keeper we signed was Friedel (unless there's someone obvious I've forgotten).

Massive boots to fill in the form of Friedel though so anything was a step down.  Robinson was a competent Prem keeper a good one if not a great one. Went on the slide badly once Allardyce left but replacing him with Boro's 3rd choice Steel was ridiculous but par for the course.

Raya offered some respite with his potential but we were at lhe 1 level by then. Really though they've shopped in poundland for keepers and defenders just like managers all along.

[G Somerset Rover]

Mowbray’s delusion rubbing off on the players now:

@TosinAdarabioyo: Not the result we wanted or deserved on the weekend but we've got two weeks now to right our wrongs! 

[DE.]

I suppose he's right in the sense we probably deserved to lose by more.

Edited November 12, 2019 by DE.