Tony Mowbray Discussion

[JHRover]

Mowbray appears to have set the target at 70 points for the season.

Where he's plucked that figure from I'm not sure, but I think if we got that it would be a decent points return, albeit likely to be short of the play-offs and therefore pretty irrelevant as far as our future in this division is concerned (no serious difference in this League between 7th and 17th).

Having set the target short of promotion at 70 points what then is the next stage in the plan? The scheme to sell Dack either in January or the summer to win friends in India and balance the books but then what? A big gaping hole to fill and presumably only a fraction of the Dack cash to reinvest in multiple areas with a manager who has an appalling record in that area.

The next 4-5 months are important. We are reaching the end of Mowbray's schedule which he repeatedly broadcast following promotion of needing several windows to get us to where we need to be. Well we are now into window 4 since promotion and surprise surprise the goalposts are being moved. No money in the kitty and FFP being pushed around into the fanbase collective mindset as an excuse.

Hang on a minute, I thought the whole idea with the gradual slow build policy and sensible wages etc. was to ensure there was no risk of FFP sanctions whilst slowly growing a strong squad, yet here we sit with no keeper, few defenders and problems in attack.

The next question is whether this is acceptable and whether there's any point in persisting with it for another 12-24 months or to try something different. Perhaps a manager who aims for promotion rather than 70 points. Perhaps the owners will ask why he pushed the slow build project rather than accepted their big money offer (if that ever actually happened).

[Pedro]

24 minutes ago, Blackpool_Rover said:

The Mowbray out brigade are really starting to bore me to death. So fickle. It changes weekly.
 

Here's an idea....how about we just get behind the manager and the team. Support them properly and see where we are at the end of the season. Decisions can then be made on the best way to take the club forward.

That is very unfair to suggest genuine life-long supporters on here are fickle.  There are very few fickle folk on here to be honest.

If you've arrived at the party late, you may have missed that the strongest suggestions and criticisms on here have consistently been:

Play players in their proper positions.

Stick with a settled side.

Buy some defenders.

Drop Bennett for Nyambe.

Play to our strengths, not the strengths of the opposition.

Introduce more pace and movement by playing Rothwell.

Stop playing Gallagher as a winger.

BUY SOME DEFENDERS

Move the ball quicker instead of this lethargic approach play.

Press higher up the pitch.

Replace Bell and buy some effing defenders!!!

Now, when Mowbray finally did most of that and he picked the same team for four games, we won four on the bounce - and it wasn't ever rocket science. Yet, myself and the other tiresome members of the brigade didn't get over-excited and knew it wouldn't be long until Bennett was back in situ and way out of his depth, that numerous unnecessary changes would be made in order to give lads a game, that we'd concede ground on the pitch, start inviting crosses into the box again and stop pressing in the other half.  We knew that we would quickly revert to type and a winless run.  We knew this because we recognise what a poor manager he is on the most basic of levels and we listen to Mowbray's contradictory soundbites.

So unfortunately, I can't take your advice to just put up with the dross and shut up because clapping along merrily won't help the long-term future of this club.  Supporting a team doesn't mean sitting back, smiling and accepting failure.  I would much rather get rid of this useless chap now and give the new man the opportunity to chance his arm for the playoffs or at the least, give him a fantastic opportunity to have a kind of  pro-longed pre season 20-21 and see what is worth keeping or shipping out (like we did with Souness).

[tomphil]

Take no notice of these I'll pop in drop a grenade then scoot off again types.

[Amo]

It’s simple, get results. That’s the only way to silence the critics. There's no continuity with Mowbray, we have the odd unbeaten run in-between some awful, barren spells. It's quite worrying how things quickly fall apart. How is that supposed to inspire confidence that he’s the man to take us forward?

I could understand if there was a discernible plan but there’s not. Still massive gaps in the squad, money wasted on goal-shy strikers, no real playing style. Hardly a work in progress. 

[Ewood Ace]

49 minutes ago, Kamy100 said:

I hope that Mowbray is given until the end of the season and then we can review where we are.  The other danger of making any change is that there are still outside influences that have access to Venky’s which always brings the danger that they end up listening to the wrong advice and appoint someone as bad as Coyle/Kean which would throw the club into freefall.

If we give Mowbray until the end of the season we will be more or less exactly where we were at the end of last season only a year further down the line in terms of FFP, our best player injured and Millions more badly spent by Mowbray. Promotion is the only way to get this club's finance back on track and that needs to be achieved sooner rather than later and its clear for all to see that Mowbray is not the man to do it. Everyday that Mowbray is manager only pushes us nearer to the abyss. 

[Crimpshrine]

1 hour ago, Kamy100 said:

 

"TM and his recruitment team are in full control of signing players" 

"The other danger of making any change is that there are still outside influences that have access to Venky’s which always brings the danger that they end up listening to the wrong advice".

 

Kamy, just out of interest, if you believe there are still outside influences that can affect Venky's decisions, how do you know that Mowbray has full control of recruitment ?

I'm not so sure. I believe he is able to sign freebies and loan players himself but maybe he has act on 'advice' when it comes to spending big money ( young, British, 'potential', investment etc ). 

[simongarnerisgod]

if tony does`nt find a new keeper,two full backs and another centre back i`ll be fuming,lets face it we are not getting in the play offs ,just solidify this pitiful defence and work on the other depts next season,if he`s still here that is

Edited January 2, 2020 by simongarnerisgod

[arbitro]

Planning for next season will be starting soon and if Mowbray is given until the end of the season and then sacked any new manager would be starting from scratch in terms of new signings (and given the out of contract and loan players that could be a lot). 

[oldjamfan1]

Just now, arbitro said:

Planning for next season will be starting soon and if Mowbray is given until the end of the season and then sacked any new manager would be starting from scratch in terms of new signings (and given the out of contract and loan players that could be a lot). 

Which is exactly why we should be potting him Tony. Venkys may provide money but they provide absolutely zero leadership.

 

[glen9mullan]

My view of Mowbray is he was like a breathe of fresh air when he came in and during our promotion season. He said the right things, assembled a pretty decent side in league 1 and brought a bit of pride back into the shirt.

That being said, his signings since promotion with the biggest spend of any manager during Venkys reign have in the main been disappointing.

Dack is the one who has been a massive success and is one of the best bargains we've ever found, but lets not kid ourselves most clubs find a bargain each season sell him make money, then find another.

Some frustrations

£12 million on strikers that neither score or play consistently in the position they were bought for.

His failure to buy a goalkeeper, in what world as a championship professional club do we fail to have a first choice keeper contracted to the club? Walton has cost us 3 or 4 games already this season.

He highlighted and publically stated our defence was not good enough last season, but has failed to improve upon it. 2 of the 4 that started the season are loanees , one is out for the season, whilst the other has been steady without being spectacular. Our early season poor run was due to us having no defenders.

Formation? What actually is it? The product is dross, with the odd decent game every 10 or so. In the main i've been bored at most matches this season and only get my Butt out of my seat when someone wants to walk past.

Players out of position? Its quicker to list who is playing in position as that list you can count on one hand.

Leaders - the team lacks any, are we any better for the loss of Conway and Mulgrew? Id say no, as we dont seem to have the same grit and determination.

Are we playing better or worse this season than last? I think worse, despite more points, we drew a lot last season and the defeat column was much less at this stage last season.

The team has gone stale in my opinion, all this "dont trust them to appoint anyone better"? Is hogwash, its certainly not a reason to keep a manager. Personally i think his time is up, if he left now he would leave with , "he did a good job". If he sees out the season, that good job could soon be forgotten as something needs to give.

This unbeaten 8 game run, was on the back of an awful start, and has been followed by a crap xmas. 

[unleaded]

Regarding Gladwin ... why is he giving contracts to Crocks .. Thank goodness he’s left ..

TM thinks BRFC is a charity but who cares as long he is getting paid and that the club is losing money each day .. 

12 Million on 2 duds !! 

please Venkys Sack him .. Should be held accountable for his player recruitment and the fact that he plays boring football ... 

[Husky]

40 minutes ago, arbitro said:

Planning for next season will be starting soon and if Mowbray is given until the end of the season and then sacked any new manager would be starting from scratch in terms of new signings (and given the out of contract and loan players that could be a lot). 

Giving someone 'until the end of the season' basically screws up the start of the next season too.

Ideally a new manager needs to come in and see what he's got during 'competitive games' which shouldn't be any later than the back end of the season. Anyone that's 'on the beach' will be exposed etc. and the manager will have a better idea of who to get rid of and what he needs to bring in.

 

[Mashed Potatoes]

16 minutes ago, glen9mullan said:

My view of Mowbray is he was like a breathe of fresh air when he came in and during our promotion season. He said the right things, assembled a pretty decent side in league 1 and brought a bit of pride back into the shirt.

That being said, his signings since promotion with the biggest spend of any manager during Venkys reign have in the main been disappointing.

Dack is the one who has been a massive success and is one of the best bargains we've ever found, but lets not kid ourselves most clubs find a bargain each season sell him make money, then find another.

Some frustrations

£12 million on strikers that neither score or play consistently in the position they were bought for.

His failure to buy a goalkeeper, in what world as a championship professional club do we fail to have a first choice keeper contracted to the club? Walton has cost us 3 or 4 games already this season.

He highlighted and publically stated our defence was not good enough last season, but has failed to improve upon it. 2 of the 4 that started the season are loanees , one is out for the season, whilst the other has been steady without being spectacular. Our early season poor run was due to us having no defenders.

Formation? What actually is it? The product is dross, with the odd decent game every 10 or so. In the main i've been bored at most matches this season and only get my Butt out of my seat when someone wants to walk past.

Players out of position? Its quicker to list who is playing in position as that list you can count on one hand.

Leaders - the team lacks any, are we any better for the loss of Conway and Mulgrew? Id say no, as we dont seem to have the same grit and determination.

Are we playing better or worse this season than last? I think worse, despite more points, we drew a lot last season and the defeat column was much less at this stage last season.

The team has gone stale in my opinion, all this "dont trust them to appoint anyone better"? Is hogwash, its certainly not a reason to keep a manager. Personally i think his time is up, if he left now he would leave with , "he did a good job". If he sees out the season, that good job could soon be forgotten as something needs to give.

This unbeaten 8 game run, was on the back of an awful start, and has been followed by a crap xmas. 

You are entitled to your opinion like everyone else but I do find the conclusion that we are playing worse this season despite accruing points at a better rate somewhat bizarre.

The reason is that we have better game management now and despite your remarks about defence is because we are able to keep a reasonable number of clean sheets.

I don't understand your down on the loan system for which nowadays effective utilisation is an essential part of the manager's skillset. Regarding your comment on the goalkeeper Sheffield United were promoted last season with an on loan goalkeeper in Dean Henderson and are doing the same again this season - pretty well by the look of the league table.

[Vinjay]

5 hours ago, Pedro said:

Personally, I can't imagine Jack Walker putting up with Mowbray, his excuses, poor performances etc. Nor any other owner of a similarly failing club.  Yet through apathy, certain areas of the fanbase accept failure.  They champion it and have embraced something of a small club mentality - yet we have big club facilities and expenditure.  The Venky's have invested (pronounced wasted) even more money than ever Jack did during his time here and have got sod all to show for it.  

I could probably write an encyclopedia on mentality and Jack Walker.

[PeteJD13]

3 hours ago, Kamy100 said:

I can see why some fans want Mowbray replaced, while I don’t agree with that view, I do can understand and respect their view.

As some others have said, I fully expected a mid-table finish this season and we are on course to achieve that.  I never bought into the play off talk because the squad that we have isn’t good enough to get the points required to get into the top 6.

The transfer policy is something that does need to be questioned.  TM and his recruitment team are in full control of signing players and we have spent £12 million on strikers that don’t look capable of getting anywhere near 20 goals a season, so that has to be questioned as does the decision not to look at what we lack (particularly in wide areas) which is pace.  Teams find it easy to setup against us because we cannot really hit them on the break or disrupt their defensive shape because everything that we do is so slow.

I hope that Mowbray is given until the end of the season and then we can review where we are.  The other danger of making any change is that there are still outside influences that have access to Venky’s which always brings the danger that they end up listening to the wrong advice and appoint someone as bad as Coyle/Kean which would throw the club into freefall.

Surely we aren't actually expecting Venkys to make a change anyway? I don't think TM is under any pressure from.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

What an absolute bloody awful situation this is.It appears half our fans have had enough of Mowbray and the other half are shit scared of change because of past track record of recruiting by Venkys who most of us don't want in charge of the club...

Between a Rock and a hard place,hamstrung,up shit creek without a paddle...insert as you see fit.

[Exiled in Toronto]

8 hours ago, Amo said:

Don’t leave the house. You might get run over by a milk float or fall down a manhole. 

Stay indoors. It’s safe (for now) and who cares if you stagnate and rot away?

Don’t read the warning on the firework box. Go back to that lit one that seems to have fizzled out, have a good look right into the tube. Don’t be such a pussy just because you lost an eye last Nov 5th, three fingers, your eyebrows and an ear during the previous six years.

[Amo]

Just now, Exiled in Toronto said:

Don’t read the warning on the firework box. Go back to that lit one that seems to have fizzled out, have a good look right into the tube. Don’t be such a pussy just because you lost an eye last Nov 5th, three fingers, your eyebrows and an ear during the previous six years.

Does that mean we never get rid of our old banger? 

Edited January 2, 2020 by Amo

[Exiled in Toronto]

1 minute ago, Amo said:

Does that mean we never get rid of our old banger? 

Not while Mount Stromboli is erupting

[davulsukur]

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/18132325.mowbray-explains-rovers-rotation-policy-christmas/

Mowbray doesn't need to defend his mental rotation policy over Xmas, despite it providing abject performances and a poor points return.

[DE.]

Just now, davulsukur said:

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/18132325.mowbray-explains-rovers-rotation-policy-christmas/

Mowbray doesn't need to defend his mental rotation policy over Xmas, despite it providing abject performances and a poor points return.

Quote

“I don’t feel I should have to defend myself about the selection."

No Tony, you don't, but it would certainly gain you some good will if you did, rather than take the high and mighty route of "I know more than you so shut up". Even if it's true that's a pretty shitty way to deal with fan concern IMO.

Perhaps if we didn't sign so many f'ing crocks we wouldn't be in the position of having half of them in the treatment room. Just a thought.

[Athlete]

9 hours ago, Kamy100 said:

I can see why some fans want Mowbray replaced, while I don’t agree with that view, I do can understand and respect their view.

As some others have said, I fully expected a mid-table finish this season and we are on course to achieve that.  I never bought into the play off talk because the squad that we have isn’t good enough to get the points required to get into the top 6.

The transfer policy is something that does need to be questioned.  TM and his recruitment team are in full control of signing players and we have spent £12 million on strikers that don’t look capable of getting anywhere near 20 goals a season, so that has to be questioned as does the decision not to look at what we lack (particularly in wide areas) which is pace.  Teams find it easy to setup against us because we cannot really hit them on the break or disrupt their defensive shape because everything that we do is so slow.

I hope that Mowbray is given until the end of the season and then we can review where we are.  The other danger of making any change is that there are still outside influences that have access to Venky’s which always brings the danger that they end up listening to the wrong advice and appoint someone as bad as Coyle/Kean which would throw the club into freefall.

We've been in free fall since the Indians first rocked up 

[simongarnerisgod]

no tony,they don`t know their jobs because you play them everywhere,anywhere and in stupid formations,you`ve got no defenders cos you spunked 12 million quid on two strikers,one who is`nt even a footballer and the other one who you keep putting on the wing

[Stuart]

15 minutes ago, davulsukur said:

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/18132325.mowbray-explains-rovers-rotation-policy-christmas/

Mowbray doesn't need to defend his mental rotation policy over Xmas, despite it providing abject performances and a poor points return.

He doesn’t believe in having a best XI. That much is clear. He thinks that picking whomever trains best for the next game is the way to achieve his goals. To hell with consistency and form - despite that being the root of his recent success. He needs to have a re-think.

Interviews like this are exactly why I think he can’t take us any further.

[tomphil]

Just now, Stuart said:

He doesn’t believe in having a best XI. That much is clear. He thinks that picking whomever trains best for the next game is the way to achieve his goals. To hell with consistency and form - despite that being the root of his recent success. He needs to have a re-think.

Interviews like this are exactly why I think he can’t take us any further.

I just hope he retires at the end of the season it would save a lot of hassle and force the issue with no one to blame. Obviously the snowflakes amongst the support would have a breakdown and melt but we might end up with someone who'll role their sleeves up and get stuck in instead of winging it.