Tony Mowbray Discussion

[Mattyblue]

‘Slow build’ is always a nonsense in this league. It is far too fast moving and fluid with club’s gambling on promotion with a big turn over of playing staff.

A ‘slow build’ needs those gamble signings to actually come off and thus able to replace those dropping off at the other end - I.e Gallagher/Breteton for Danny Graham. That’s before seemingly having all FFP avoidance eggs in the basket of selling off one player (now sidelined and diminishing in value by the month) to offset.

But as they are gambles, they are just as likely to be expensive mistakes, hamstringing the club in an FFP world, that then has to sell off its assets, a fall down the table (or leagues) and the cycle begins again.

 

Edited December 31, 2019 by Mattyblue

[DE.]

9 hours ago, bigbrandjohn said:

Lest we forget. What an inspiration. #thankGodhewalked. 
 

Strong words from Ipswich manager Paul Lambert! 

“If they want to go and employ another manager, no problem. I’ll go, it’s not a problem for me to go. I’ll leave tomorrow or I’ll leave the next day, it’s not a problem.” ?️

?️ @twtduk 

#ITFC

He's been saying this more than once over the past few weeks. Seems to be daring Evans to sack him - he was doing it earlier in the season too. 

[Mashed Potatoes]

Just now, DE. said:

He's been saying this more than once over the past few weeks. Seems to be daring Evans to sack him - he was doing it earlier in the season too. 

Lambert has some qualities as a manager but unfortunately is his own worst enemy; these sorts of outbursts are reminiscent of what we had when he was manager with us.

[arbitro]

3 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Johnson's promotion to the first team set up was probably made in large part due to his background working with the young players but as he is now involved with the first team I can't see the logic of getting rid of the existing manager to bring in someone who is untested.

With his slow build and us treading water we are just going further into the abyss. Johnson has proved he can improve young players. As I said our only hope is selling young players as promotion is really out of the question given the playing squad we currently have. I would rather we were an average Championship club with youngsters rather than loans and one year deals for aging players. In my view we can keep our Championship status with the former. 

[tomphil]

6 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

‘Slow build’ is always a nonsense in this league. It is far too fast moving and fluid with club’s gambling on promotion with a big turn over of playing staff.

A ‘slow build’ needs those gamble signings to actually come off and thus able to replace those dropping off at the other end - I.e Gallagher/Breteton for Danny Graham. That’s before seemingly having all FFP avoidance eggs in the basket of selling off one player (now sidelined and diminishing in value by the month) to offset.

But as they are gambles, they are just as likely to be expensive mistakes, hamstringing the club in an FFP world, that then has to sell off its assets, a fall down the table (or leagues) and the cycle begins again.

 

Slow build is just a time buying exercise for the manager and his staff.  Gives license to expand behind the scenes and create more jobs for people and spend transfer monies in the way you want via who you want.  I think we've a few examples of that now.

Everything in football for your average clubs and managers tends to run in two or three year cycles without big changes or investment.  We are near the end of that with TM and his gang now so to shake things up will need big money.  That now obviously cannot happen so is there a plan B ?

[Mashed Potatoes]

Just now, arbitro said:

With his slow build and us treading water we are just going further into the abyss. Johnson has proved he can improve young players. As I said our only hope is selling young players as promotion is really out of the question given the playing squad we currently have. I would rather we were an average Championship club with youngsters rather than loans and one year deals for aging players. In my view we can keep our Championship status with the former. 

I agree with you that there is a decent chance of staying in this division without massive expenditure; I would rather keep an experienced manager at the helm  than throw in someone who has been involved at first team level for less than 6 months.

[47er]

23 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

I can't see the logic of getting rid of the existing manager

You mean you won't.

The logic is all around you on this thread, you simply don't want to know.

[47er]

Just now, Mashed Potatoes said:

I would rather keep an experienced manager

Experienced at what? Failing at other clubs after a couple of seasons and getting sacked? Creating teams who play boring and losing football?

Continually changing the team and playing players out of position? Consistently neglecting defence? And, in our Club at least, pissing millions up against the wall?

[Mashed Potatoes]

Just now, 47er said:

Experienced at what? Failing at other clubs after a couple of seasons and getting sacked? Creating teams who play boring and losing football?

Continually changing the team and playing players out of position? Consistently neglecting defence? And, in our Club at least, pissing millions up against the wall?

Mowbray has us much closer to the play offs than relegation - I don't regard that as failing. With the large losses reported today FFP constraints are going to mean that whoever is manager is not going to be able to spend significantly in the transfer market; I would rather see Mowbray stay in those circumstances as I can't see better managers being attracted to the club. It would be a very hard job indeed for someone inexperienced like Damien Johnson to come in to the club at the moment.

[JBiz]

12 minutes ago, 47er said:

Experienced at what? Failing at other clubs after a couple of seasons and getting sacked? Creating teams who play boring and losing football?

Continually changing the team and playing players out of position? Consistently neglecting defence? And, in our Club at least, pissing millions up against the wall?

This is just a list of all negatives hence why some might think it’s a view that lacks any objectivity.

Im sure it would be tedious to hear someone constantly harping on about the positives; the turnaround from relegation to back into a position to push for the playoffs, the huge improvement in team spirit, the development of key young players, the investment in the sports analysis stuff, the work in the u23s, the improvement of scouting potential in Europe, the short term direction of the club being turned round from backwards / downward is ultimately all at TMs feet.

He has made many mistakes along the way but it’s not “an opinion” to say he has done a very good job for rovers in less than 3 years. Could’ve / should’ve done better? Well tbf I’m sure 99% of football fans would think that about nearly all their managers.

[JBiz]

11 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Mowbray has us much closer to the play offs than relegation - I don't regard that as failing. With the large losses reported today FFP constraints are going to mean that whoever is manager is not going to be able to spend significantly in the transfer market; I would rather see Mowbray stay in those circumstances as I can't see better managers being attracted to the club. It would be a very hard job indeed for someone inexperienced like Damien Johnson to come in to the club at the moment.

Another positive of the TM era - we seem to be developing a replacement too, someone I think many of us would appreciate giving a chance.

[jim mk2]

Just now, Harry The Bass said:

This is just a list of all negatives hence why some might think it’s a view that lacks any objectivity.

Im sure it would be tedious to hear someone constantly harping on about the positives; the turnaround from relegation to back into a position to push for the playoffs, the huge improvement in team spirit, the development of key young players, the investment in the sports analysis stuff, the work in the u23s, the improvement of scouting potential in Europe, the short term direction of the club being turned round from backwards / downward is ultimately all at TMs feet.

He has made many mistakes along the way but it’s not “an opinion” to say he has done a very good job for rovers in less than 3 years. Could’ve / should’ve done better? Well tbf I’m sure 99% of football fans would think that about nearly all their managers.

 

All of those things are good, Mowbray deserves credit for them and perhaps he could stay in some sort of development role. He just shouldn't be in charge of the first team any more. 

[Roverthechimp]

39 minutes ago, Harry The Bass said:

This is just a list of all negatives hence why some might think it’s a view that lacks any objectivity.

Im sure it would be tedious to hear someone constantly harping on about the positives; the turnaround from relegation to back into a position to push for the playoffs, the huge improvement in team spirit, the development of key young players, the investment in the sports analysis stuff, the work in the u23s, the improvement of scouting potential in Europe, the short term direction of the club being turned round from backwards / downward is ultimately all at TMs feet.

He has made many mistakes along the way but it’s not “an opinion” to say he has done a very good job for rovers in less than 3 years. Could’ve / should’ve done better? Well tbf I’m sure 99% of football fans would think that about nearly all their managers.

Very good post.

[47er]

1 hour ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

With the large losses reported today FFP constraints are going to mean that whoever is manager is not going to be able to spend significantly in the transfer market; I would rather see Mowbray stay in those circumstances 

The same Mowbray whose paid £12M for Brereton and Gallagher? Madness!

[47er]

1 hour ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

Mowbray has us much closer to the play offs than relegation -

Currently 13th!

and sliding.....

[47er]

20 minutes ago, Roverthechimp said:

its not “an opinion” to say he has done a very good job for rovers in less than 3 years.

Yes it is!

And a very bad one.

Edited December 31, 2019 by 47er

[Leonard Venkhater]

Just now, 47er said:

The same Mowbray whose paid £12M for Brereton and Gallagher? Madness!

...not to mention "fees" paid for Samuel, Whittingham, Chapman, Caddis etc

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, 47er said:

Currently 13th!

and sliding.....

And 3 points of the top 6 tho. Notice you don't mention that. Would add more balance to your post if you include both points

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, Leonard Venkhater said:

...not to mention "fees" paid for Samuel, Whittingham, Chapman, Caddis etc

Whittingham and Caddis were free transfers. Samuel was 350k and Chapman I don't know. 

 

[47er]

Just now, Leonard Venkhater said:

...not to mention "fees" paid for Samuel, Whittingham, Chapman, Caddis etc

and contract extensions to raid the coffers further.

Edited December 31, 2019 by 47er

[tomphil]

Can't managers be recruited and paid for directly by owners therefore being exempt from FFP ?

[47er]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

And 3 points of the top 6 tho. Notice you don't mention that. Would add more balance to your post if you include both points

No, your mate already made that point so I provided the balance!

Anyway, you've changed your tune (big surprise there!),you wanted him sacked a while back! Remember?

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, 47er said:

and contract extensions to rain the coffers further.

You have hatred for Mowbray don't you? 

You don't respect the job he has done in rebuilding this club and uniting the club with the fans

[LDRover]

Probably too cynical to suggest wasting 12 million on 2 duds has actually strengthened his position due to FFP.

[47er]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

You have hatred for Mowbray don't you?

Grow up! Quite Trumpian there Chaddy!