Tony Mowbray Discussion

[chaddyrovers]

1 hour ago, Stuart said:

Ultimately, the only real debate here is whether people think Mowbray can get us promoted before the plug is pulled, as it was with Bowyer. The longer the wrong person is given spending money the more chance of the next manager failing as well due to having zero money to spend and the best players being sold.

Plug is pulled? Doesn't need to happen  look at Brentford. They sell Maupay and Konsa last summer. But at are in the playoffs this season. Norwich sold James Maddison and Murphy in the summer before the season got promoted. All down to recruitment and structure. 

We are going the right way as a club and doing very well. 

 

 

[chaddyrovers]

11 minutes ago, AllRoverAsia said:

LT - fair to say I chucked up.

Why? 

[Mattyblue]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

Plug is pulled? Doesn't need to happen  look at Brentford. They sell Maupay and Konsa last summer. But at are in the playoffs this season. Norwich sold James Maddison and Murphy in the summer before the season got promoted. All down to recruitment and structure. 

We are going the right way as a club and doing very well. 

 

 

No it doesn’t NEED to happen if a club is run correctly with a strategy that is fit for purpose.

But we have been optimistic before, c2014.

We will see if we are a now a properly run club over the next season or two, or if the current execs are just talking a good game. As always we are at the whim of unpredictable owners with the added spectre of FFP.
 

 

[AllRoverAsia]

2 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Why? 

Spin doctoring has that effect on me. After a lifetime in Sales & Marketing, I know smarmy bullshite when I see it.

FFS give TM a Knighthoodm, he did get us up from L1 ......

[Paul Mani]

2 hours ago, Stuart said:

Ultimately, the only real debate here is whether people think Mowbray can get us promoted before the plug is pulled, as it was with Bowyer. The longer the wrong person is given spending money the more chance of the next manager failing as well due to having zero money to spend and the best players being sold.

I think there’s more to the debate than than that. Though promotion or the managers ability to deliver promotion is the number one factor. Also if we’re judging vs GB then TM is pretty far ahead. His results and league positions are increasing every year. Gaz couldn’t sustain improvements.

[Mattyblue]

Gaz actually kept a compete basket case up (The Season of Five Managers), then had us 8th and 9th. It fell away for Bowyer once the cash dried up. TM has had a much more stable club to operate  in.

So is TM ‘far ahead’ of GB?

Edited February 22, 2020 by Mattyblue

[RoverCanada]

Minor point from the article, but I hadn't seen confirmation before that the academy, and presumably the associated infrastructure, is costing £4m/year.

So, for future reference, that should put our FFP loss limit at £17m/year, or £51m over 3 years, rather than the headline limit of £13m/£39m.

So, League One loss of £17m, £20m last year, giving us a £14m loss to 'play' with this year. I suspect the Raya + Nuttall sales, which would've been pure profit, are what's keeping us just within the lines this year. Gallagher purchase will be amortized, so not as much of an issue this year. (Plus what our wages are at, income, etc etc, my posts go on long enough haha)

Edited February 22, 2020 by RoverCanada

[Scotland1]

4 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

Gaz actually kept a compete basket case up (The Season of Five Managers), then had us 8th and 9th. It fell away for Bowyer once the cash dried up. TM has had a much more stable club to operate  in.

So is TM ‘far ahead’ of GB?

Not for me Bowyer best manager we’ve had since Big Sam

[Amo]

Will 8th be the glass ceiling?

[Waggy76]

3 hours ago, Scotland1 said:

Not for me Bowyer best manager we’ve had since Big Sam

He had a far better squad than Tm King , Rhodes , Gestede ,Dunn , Cairney etc ....Probably in time both will be judged as not quite being savvy enough...

[47er]

4 hours ago, Waggy76 said:

He had a far better squad than Tm King , Rhodes , Gestede ,Dunn , Cairney etc ....Probably in time both will be judged as not quite being savvy enough...

He assembled a far better squad than Tony. There is a difference.

[Leonard Venkhater]

15 hours ago, 47er said:

He assembled a far better squad than Tony. There is a difference.

You have to subtract Dunn, Rhodes and King from his "assembly" though..

[Amo]

16 hours ago, 47er said:

He assembled a far better squad than Tony. There is a difference.

We had a high turnover of players during Bowyer's time but you can't deny that he plucked some absolute gems. I've heard that his dad takes a lot of credit for that. 

That said, with the talent at his disposal it's criminal that we never broke into the top six. We were undone by a conservative, unambitious manager who was too loyal to certain players. Hmmmm.

[Paul Mani]

On 22/02/2020 at 10:42, Mattyblue said:

Gaz actually kept a compete basket case up (The Season of Five Managers), then had us 8th and 9th. It fell away for Bowyer once the cash dried up. TM has had a much more stable club to operate  in.

So is TM ‘far ahead’ of GB?

Really? Yes I accept your points about the five managers but Mowbray took over from Coyle with a smaller budget and worse squad.

Whichever way you cut it, we are splitting hairs on how bad they had it. Certainly not as cut and dry as you suggest.

 

 

[Mattyblue]

Splitting hairs? I take it you’ve forgotten the 2012/2013 version of Blackburn Rovers?

[Paul Mani]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

Splitting hairs? I take it you’ve forgotten the 2012/2013 version of Blackburn Rovers?

Nah, I remember that season. It was piss poor and very sad to see. We had some dross but we also had Robbo, Hanley, Dann, Olsen, Givet, MGP, Dunn, Rhodes, King...Types of quality Mowbray could’ve only dreamt about. 

Are you forgetting how shit Owen Coyle really is / was? Forgetting about Akpan, Greer, Wes Brown, Luke Steele?

Like I said, I’m not saying that either manager had it easy but I don’t think there was much difference between the two scenarios. Both walked into a sinking, rotten ship. If anything Gaz had a better quality squad and a bigger budget to start with.

[Mattyblue]

I wasn’t particularly a big Bowyer fan.

But by his third full season he had to flog pretty much any player of decent quality, Mowbray has spent £12million in his third season. GB started with a basket case, ended in an embargo.

I probably rate Mowbray higher, but how is the job TM’s done ‘far ahead’ of GB?

Edited February 23, 2020 by Mattyblue

[Amo]

 

31 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

If anything Gaz had a better quality squad and a bigger budget to start with.

Bowyer spent marginally more than Mowbray in their first full seasons.

[Paul Mani]

3 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

I wasn’t particularly a big Bowyer fan.

But by his third full season he had to flog pretty much any player of decent quality, Mowbray has spent £12million in his third season. GB started with a basket case, ended in an embargo.

I probably rate Mowbray higher, but how is the job TM’s done ‘far ahead’ of GB?

I didn’t say that. You said TM walked into a ‘much more stable’ club than GB had and I don’t think he did. My point was that both managers walked into very bad situations and if anything GB had it slightly better because he had a bigger budget and better players.

The two of them share many traits in terms of the types of people they are but I don’t think there’s much doubt that Mowbray is doing a better job than Bowyer did.

[Mattyblue]

No I said he’s had a more stable club to operate in, which those first months aside, he has.

[47er]

Bowyer didn't waste £12M on 2 players.

[roverandout]

If he gets rovers promoted,  I would seriously consider binning him and bringing in a proven manager. It worked for Southampton when they got rid of Adkins for pocettino.  No good going up and struggling like villa have done

Edited February 23, 2020 by roverandout

[islander200]

1 hour ago, 47er said:

Bowyer didn't waste £12M on 2 players.

Can't argue it looks 12 million wasted but flip it round he bought Dack for 750k who we rejected a 15 million bid for in January 2019 and Armstrong for 1.75 million and if he keeps up his current form we could be looking at at least 10 million if we were open to selling 

[Bbrovers2288]

For the first time in mowbrays tenure I actually seen some sort of style on Saturday, I mean it was a give up possession and hit on the break kind of style which goes against his supposed keep ball good football style everyone seems to suggest he brings but a style and method all the same. 

[chaddyrovers]

5 hours ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

For the first time in mowbrays tenure I actually seen some sort of style on Saturday, I mean it was a give up possession and hit on the break kind of style which goes against his supposed keep ball good football style everyone seems to suggest he brings but a style and method all the same. 

Brentford are always to have more of the possession at home so playing on the counter makes sense. 

Expect us to have more of the possession against Stoke at Home