Tony Mowbray Discussion

[Ewood Ace]

2 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Cos of a conversation that a friend of mine with Mowbray after the last supporters consultation meeting.

Actions speak louder than words.

[Hasta]

41 minutes ago, Eddie said:

We can't be overly dramatic. We had chances to take the lead in both matches, especially the Barnsley match, and it is clear that we will pick up points over the remainder of the season.

We certainly deserved at least a point or two from the last two fixtures, but that isn't me trying to ignore how bad the performances were in the context of us having a realistic chance at making the playoffs.

 

But the fact is the chances were not converted by a group of strikers that he has either brought or kept at the club at a significant cost. As much as I thought that Samuel might have more to his game (probably cos he is actually quite quick and mobile) he has always flattered to deceive. Gallagher we had already seen and knew what we were buying. To be fair he probably would have bagged a few more had he played up top, but he has been ruined by playing out wide. Brereton was a stupid amount of money for a nobody outside of Nottingham and that one Arsenal game. There's nothing in the lad that makes me think he will be a goalscorer.

Mowbray was obviously unlucky with losing the goals that Dack provides, but we had the chance to address that in January and once again didn't act.

Therefore the lack of goals in games which we created chances and had most of the possession isn't down to bad luck. Its down to bad recruitment. And that's been a problem all season. 

The keeper situation has swung a bit but ultimately has also been costly. It looked a disaster waiting to happen when we didn't replace Raya with anything other than a 3rd choice Prem keeper who Wigan fans were not sorry to see not return. He has had some decent spells but has been at fault (either by mistakes or by just not being good enough) for too many goals.

I think we would have coped with the defence and midfield that we have been playing had we sorted the goalkeeper and striker situation out, but that is where we have failed. 

 

[roversfan99]

3 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Cos of a conversation that a friend of mine with Mowbray after the last supporters consultation meeting.

He said at the one before that defenders are coming and yet a year on we are in exactly the same position that we were then. Judge on actions not on words. If Thompson cant even make a 20 man squad at this point with Bennett playing left back then he cant be that close.

[Gav]

30 minutes ago, oldjamfan1 said:

Controversial that one Gav ha ha.

For all that I despise Coyle I would still rate him above at least three others in my lifetime. Surely K**n has to be the worst? Jim Iley wasn't very good either. Ince, Kidd, etc etc

I'll give you K**n OJF, but I'm not having any of the others above Coyle, he was absolutely useless and a bullshitter. 

[Mercer]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

He said at the one before that defenders are coming and yet a year on we are in exactly the same position that we were then. Judge on actions not on words. If Thompson cant even make a 20 man squad at this point with Bennett playing left back then he cant be that close.

Spot on.

Mowbray is most unlikely to say anything untoward about any player to a fan at one of these events.

This 'man of integrity' really does get me because, IMO, it is not justified based on what I have seen / heard from Mowbray.  Actions speak louder than words and no more so than what DID NOT happen following Mowbray's words in Blues last Feb.  

[chaddyrovers]

26 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

He said at the one before that defenders are coming 

And defenders did come in. Adarabioyo and Cunningham. 

 

[roversfan99]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

And defenders did come in. Adarabioyo and Cunningham. 

 

And by the summer they will be gone again and we will be on the look out for more defensive sticky plasters despite blowing another 5m and big wages on a waste of space!

Still none the wiser as to how the fact that he "rates" our young players listed but has yet to successfully fully integrate any (the 2 he has given game time to mainly out of position) is further evidence to keep Mowbray. Nor that our scouting network has supposedly improved.

[J*B]

Tony is in the LT today saying we’re missing 7 starters for the Leeds game. Incredible really. His team selections didn’t lead me to believe he knew 7 of his strongest 11. 

[bluebruce]

I don't think I've seen a quote from Mowbray that sums up his managerial weakness better than the one used for the headline of the LT article today:

'We have to keep believing that what we're doing is right'

No Tony, you have to start accepting that certain things you are doing are wrong.

[rigger]

Just now, J*B said:

Tony is in the LT today saying we’re missing 7 starters for the Leeds game. Incredible really. His team selections didn’t lead me to believe he knew 7 of his strongest 11. 

Please let one of them be Bennett 

[rigger]

2 minutes ago, J*B said:

Tony is in the LT today saying we’re missing 7 starters for the Leeds game. Incredible really. His team selections didn’t lead me to believe he knew 7 of his strongest 11. 

He should concentrate on the players that are available.

[chaddyrovers]

9 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

And by the summer they will be gone again and we will be on the look out for more defensive sticky plasters despite blowing another 5m and big wages on a waste of space!

Still none the wiser as to how the fact that he "rates" our young players listed but has yet to successfully fully integrate any (the 2 he has given game time to mainly out of position) is further evidence to keep Mowbray. Nor that our scouting network has supposedly improved.

And we sign defenders next seasons. You know my thoughts on how we spent the 5 mil. So why keep going over it time after time. 

You take your time integrate youngsters into the squad. You cannot just throw them in at the deep end. 

We see about the scouting network in the next few seasons. Your problem is you and others is that bringing in a new scouting system and network takes time to develop and get it work properly as any manager would tell you

[rigger]

If TM had picked teams to win the last two games, the Leeds selection wouldn’t have mattered so much.

[Vinjay]

2 hours ago, benhben said:

David Dunn odds on favourite for the Barrow job. Id take him to replace Mowbray...he might be awful but id take the risk at the moment. A blackburn lad in charge with an experienced no 2. Ill keep dreaming...

Be amazed if he succeeded there never mind at Ewood. He would fail for the exact same reason Woodgate did. 

[Mattyblue]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

 

We see about the scouting network in the next few seasons. Your problem is you and others is that bringing in a new scouting system and network takes time to develop and get it work properly as any manager would tell you

‘We see in the next few seasons’ ?!

We’ve been working on this new network for 18 months already, and you think it will be a few seasons more until we see some actual fruit with it?

Bloody hell, wish I could work for you!

 

[oldjamfan1]

54 minutes ago, Gav said:

I'll give you K**n OJF, but I'm not having any of the others above Coyle, he was absolutely useless and a bullshitter. 

You could be describing Ince there as well. For all he was a good player, Ince was a shocking manager. And I don't know if you remember Jim Iley or not but he didn't know his arse from his elbow.

[roversfan99]

1 minute ago, chaddyrovers said:

And we sign defenders next seasons. You know my thoughts on how we spent the 5 mil. So why keep going over it time after time. 

You take your time integrate youngsters into the squad. You cannot just throw them in at the deep end. 

We see about the scouting network in the next few seasons. Your problem is you and others is that bringing in a new scouting system and network takes time to develop and get it work properly as any manager would tell you

Because it is not a minor thing that can be brushed under the carpet!

I never said that they should all be in the team, but how does these players existence justify Mowbrays position is what im saying! A new manager would still have them at his disposal, just like the supposed scouting network. There is no evidence that Mowbray would use the extended scouting network well or poorly, and there is no evidence that these youngsters will all become key under Mowbray. The only 2 that have had game time have struggled mainly out of position. So neither strengthens his position at this point.

There is further irony that after the first game v Barnsley that we WON you were insistent on Mowbray being sacked. Following the humiliating defeat away leaving any slim play off hope extinguished with 6 games to go, and with many of Mowbrays flaws in plain sight, notably a lack of defensive reinforcement and a few of Mowbrays poor signings in sharp focus (Breretons petulance, Johnson barely able to move, Samuels inability to score goals etc) and you are now defending him often with illogical arguments.

[chaddyrovers]

1 minute ago, Mattyblue said:

‘We see in the next few seasons’ ?!

We’ve been working on this new network for 18 months already, and you think it will be a few seasons more until we see some actual fruit with it?

Bloody hell, wish I could work for you!

 

I expect to see some signings from the scouting network this summer. 

But you cant judge the scouting network on 1 window but over a medium or long term period

[Mattyblue]

This summer. Good, looking forward to seeing it.

So not a few seasons then, the club sounded incompetent and dysfunctional for a second there...

Edited July 2, 2020 by Mattyblue

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

Because it is not a minor thing that can be brushed under the carpet!

I never said that they should all be in the team, but how does these players existence justify Mowbrays position is what im saying! A new manager would still have them at his disposal, just like the supposed scouting network. There is no evidence that Mowbray would use the extended scouting network well or poorly, and there is no evidence that these youngsters will all become key under Mowbray. The only 2 that have had game time have struggled mainly out of position. So neither strengthens his position at this point.

There is further irony that after the first game v Barnsley that we WON you were insistent on Mowbray being sacked. Following the humiliating defeat away leaving any slim play off hope extinguished with 6 games to go, and with many of Mowbrays flaws in plain sight, notably a lack of defensive reinforcement and a few of Mowbrays poor signings in sharp focus (Breretons petulance, Johnson barely able to move, Samuels inability to score goals etc) and you are now defending him often with illogical arguments.

You want him sack and I dont..end of.

 

 

[arbitro]

44 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

And defenders did come in. Adarabioyo and Cunningham. 

 

That is pretty much what Mowbray said when he was challenged about his 'defenders are coming' quote at this years supporter consultation meeting, in fact he threw Waltons name into the mix as well. The bloke who asked the question quite rightly said that none of them were our players and there was no guarantee of them becoming our players. Mowbray answered that with something like 'that's a fair point'.

And now it looks like we will be in exactly the same position with having to buy or loan three players out of our back five for the first team. From that perspective we haven't moved on at all.

[Mattyblue]

One was quality, one got injured almost immediately, one is *at best* on a par with who we sold... all 3 will be gone in a few weeks.

Big risk having  60% of your defensive unit as loanees.

Edited July 2, 2020 by Mattyblue

[JHRover]

2 hours ago, Gav said:

Football fans have short memories, you're only as good as your last game, even the Utd fans started to turn on Ferguson towards the end, its the nature of the beautiful game.

Tony Mowbray arrived here taking over from probably the worst manager in Blackburn Rovers history and we've had some cr@p under Venkys. He inherited a squad on easy street, unfit, uninterested and not fit for purpose, we went down, not his fault. Behind the scenes we had a bean counter running the show, Mowbray helped bring Waggot to the club, a man that at the very least has experience of running a football club, exactly what we needed.

The following season was a good season for the fans, new grounds, full terraces, big fish in a small pond and promotion won away at Doncaster, great night for all concerned, will live long in the memory, back up at the first attempt, job done.

We are now coming to the end of his second season in the Championship, our league position tells us we are probably going to finish higher than last season, so progress is being made, but not as fast as some would like, me included. His star striker buys have been a disaster, some believe he was forced into the purchase of Brereton, I think he wilfully bought Gallagher, both have flopped so far and he will pay the price is they don't improve, no doubt about that. 

Looking towards next season, he needs to be given a chance until October/November time for me, see if he can't pull this Championship seasoned squad into shape. We have a decent first 11, but they're not good enough to make a sustained challenge for the playoffs, he needs to add some steel, some more experience that will complement the likes of Lenihan, Dack and dare I say it Gallagher.

You look at the football league as it stands, I'd much rather be in Blackburn Rovers shoes than Sunderland, Bolton, Sheff Weds and Wigan, so its not all doom and gloom, is it?

I think it is coming to the point where we need to stop harking back to the League One season. 

It was a good novelty season which saw us move in the right direction on and off the pitch for once. It was a good job done by Mowbray to get us straight back up albeit with all the tools needed to do so.

Of course others have failed to do it - Sunderland, Ipswich - but many others of a similar stature did do it - Bolton, Wolves, Leicester, Norwich, Southampton. 

Either way I don't think that success 2 years ago should entitle Mowbray to endless time and goodwill. 

I think people are concerned because the squad is a complete mess. That is a result of flawed business over previous windows. We do have a good XI when everyone is fit but they never all are, Mowbray loves to chop and change and several are on their way through loans or contract expiry. Add to that the spectre of Venkys cashing in again on a prized asset or two and rather than a few additions we could be facing a revolution.

The fact remains that 3 years into his tenure we are still reliant on players Mowbray inherited at the club - Williams, Mulgrew, Lenihan, Nyambe, Bennett, Travis, Evans, Graham. Other than Dack, Armstrong and Tosin the rest of those signed by Mowbray aren't really up to scratch. 

So really we have to ask if it is going to take us much further enduring another long transfer window to end up with more long term projects and non contributors. 

[JHRover]

2 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

One was quality, one got injured almost immediately, one is *at best* on a par with who we sold... all 3 will be gone in a few weeks.

Big risk having  60% of your defensive unit as loanees.

But unavoidable if the owners insist on investing only in attacking players and insist on 'leasing' the defensive positions.

But of course that's just a conspiracy theory. In reality every manager we've had has just not taken the defence seriously.....

[Mattyblue]

Just now, JHRover said:

But unavoidable if the owners insist on investing only in attacking players and insist on 'leasing' the defensive positions.

But of course that's just a conspiracy theory. In reality every manager we've had has just not taken the defence seriously.....

To double down on that, of the first choice 40% left  - Lenihan and Nyambe, they came through the academy ranks.