Tony Mowbray Discussion

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

To quote you about a keeper weve been tenously linked with, "he might just be happy to have a contract with this pandemic." Smallwoods been happy to sit on a contract for a year, if Mulgrew is settled in the area it sounds a bloody good life if you ask me! More fool us for giving him a long contract, same as Smallwood, Williams, Bennett etc.

See I rather be playing football and enjoying it

[LDRover]

Pay offs not play offs.

[roversfan99]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

See I rather be playing football and enjoying it

But then you recommend signing a keeper to sit on our bench...

[Atko's Engine]

22 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

He means well and I think unfairly but understandability, people are taking a swipe because he is baffling them with their decisions and we know there is no chance that he will leave.

You're giving Iain Dowie a run for his money there fella!

[chaddyrovers]

3 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

But then you recommend signing a keeper to sit on our bench...

I've talking about me. I rather take less money but enjoying playing then just training and collecting a wage. 

I havent recommended signing anyone tho. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

16 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Cos he might want to play and enjoy his football again. Cant be enjoying Rovers now

Tell me somebody at Rovers that is enjoying the football at the moment ?  Staff, players, fans - nobody has a smile on their face. At the moment everything about Blackburn Rovers is dull, drab, boring, tedious, uninspiring.

[chaddyrovers]

17 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

But no one knows these reasons chaddy. And those reasons were before 4 or 5 further games. 

 

[Atko's Engine]

On a more serious note, I think there were a lot of good points made in that article by Sharpe, anxious many of the posts above.

There's no doubt Mowbray has his flaws. Yesterday highlighted several of them,though I think some of the players' performances served to highlight them even more so, as too many were below par.

I think we have progressed under Mowbray. Not as much as I would've liked, but I also think there are some reasons for that which are beyond his control (restrictive club structure & injuries to key personnel being chief amongst them). That's not making excuses it's fact, and could have happened to any other hot seat incumbent.

It's a risk keeping Mowbray as he's certainly not guaranteed to succeed. But I believe he does have passion for this club, he's not just here for his pension, he does want it to succeed and he does have a plan for developing the squad further this summer.  Whether he is allowed to do so in the current climate is uncertain, but if he is forced to look for cheap / free incomings then his record in that dept is not too bad, and certainly better than his big-ticket shopping has been recently. In that context, maybe he's ideally placed to make the most of a sow's ear.

I don't know, keeping him could be a massive mistake, replacing him could be too. There's a lot to be said for stability over risk; fans of the likes of Ipswich & Sunderland will tell you that,but there's also surprise success stories from the past too.

We may never know unless we have a particularly good or bad season. Assuming he stays though, as seems likely, he definitely needs a good summer and a strong first half dozen games next season to maintain the goodwill of those supporting him & recover some credibility amongst the rest.

Ramble over, sorry!

[roversfan99]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

 

Thanks for pointing out the specific post. A big help. And a few points to follow:

1. You say we have improved, but our points tally is the same. We may artifically improve it ever so slightly now the season is over competitively for us. Is this ENOUGH progress?

2. Tactically, we seem to be becoming more and more confused? 1 false 9, 2 false 9s, strikers on the wing etc culminating in that shit show yesterday. Does this concern you at all?

3. You mention the European scouting network. Until this shows success im skeptical. But why cant another manager take advantage of this?

4. You mention his signings. Tbe only good ones are the temporary ones. Does it not reflect badly on Mowbray that we are in a worse position going into next season after this seasons business? (lost our goalkeeper and our signings on over 1 contracts have not really done much.) Again, is this progress?

5. Why do you think Mowbray is the man to sign all of these players we need? He didnt last season and you called him out for it when he spent the money on Gallagher over Jansson/Hector/Cooper I think you personally referenced. Now he has no money due to the pandemic. Whats going to change?

6. You say "we are so close" we have never broke into the top 6 and our season is mathematically over with 2 games to spare. Surely since you made this statement that impacts your view?

[tomphil]

Like i said last night the dour tepid scared of the opposition football he's trying to coach into them makes us look worse than we are. We've looked good when we are lively and get in faces and we've looked good on the counter against some sides who come at us.  It just doesn't suit the players or the purpose even Sharpe pointed out we are playing safety first right at the time we should be going for it.

A risk averse manager that would rather lose 1-0 than 4-3, at this stage of the season why the hell does it matter.

I'm sorry to be blunt but it's the work of a wuss, a guy thinking about the plod next season and resting and rotating players now because it'll be a short break instead of chasing what was on offer.

[Dreams of 1995]

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

But then you recommend signing a keeper to sit on our bench...

What else is a 2nd choice goalkeeper going to do?
 

Goalkeepers know their place, and those that play 2nd choice know full well what they’re going to. It’s not a normal position. Senior 2nd choice keepers are a must though, and having one you can depend upon is the difference between winning trophies and not in most cases. 

Edited July 15, 2020 by Dreams of 1995

[Mattyblue]

Why can’t the Chief Executive let go a subordinate employee?

Who sacked managers in the past? John Williams or the Walker Trust?

Maybe I answered my own question, who’s subordinate to who in this most odd set-up?

[philipl]

The more I reflect on this and last season, the more disillusioned with Mowbray I feel.

We have the players and squad.

We don't have the manager.

[chaddyrovers]

 

17 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Thanks for pointing out the specific post. A big help. And a few points to follow:

1. You say we have improved, but our points tally is the same. We may artifically improve it ever so slightly now the season is over competitively for us. Is this ENOUGH progress?

2. Tactically, we seem to be becoming more and more confused? 1 false 9, 2 false 9s, strikers on the wing etc culminating in that shit show yesterday. Does this concern you at all?

3. You mention the European scouting network. Until this shows success im skeptical. But why cant another manager take advantage of this?

4. You mention his signings. Tbe only good ones are the temporary ones. Does it not reflect badly on Mowbray that we are in a worse position going into next season after this seasons business? (lost our goalkeeper and our signings on over 1 contracts have not really done much.) Again, is this progress?

5. Why do you think Mowbray is the man to sign all of these players we need? He didnt last season and you called him out for it when he spent the money on Gallagher over Jansson/Hector/Cooper I think you personally referenced. Now he has no money due to the pandemic. Whats going to change?

6. You say "we are so close" we have never broke into the top 6 and our season is mathematically over with 2 games to spare. Surely since you made this statement that impacts your view?

1. We have improved in my opinion. Plus we have been without Dack for half a season and still reach the same points now with 2 games to go. Put Dack in this team we get top 6 In my opinion. If you took Grabban out of that Forest team they wouldn't be top 6 or WBA if they didn't have Pereira, or Fulham with Mitrovic.   Its enough for me. Might be different for other posters. 

2. The 1st half yesterday were awful. Too many long balls, no movement or quick tempo. Second half we were passing tempo wise and passing to feet. Rothwell had an impact. We moved to this boxed midfield with 2 strikers looking for space between their 3 man centre backs. Its didn't work. Am I concern? no

3. Its have taken time, hiring staff and money to bring this European Scouting Network that Mowbray wants. Its yourself who wants a replace Mowbray. So would you replacement want to use a European Scouting Network tho? That's a question for you. With the time and money Rovers have invested in bring this system into place surely this would be one of key questions you would asked of any managerial interview process? 

4. Loan signings are good thing at this level like WBA loan of Pereira or Leeds loan of Ben White. We aren't in a worst position then last summer but the same. Gallagher may come good next season or he may not. We have be over this Raya situation to death since last summer. Do we need to go over this again? 

5. I felt Mowbray should have used the money more better to sign players we need not just on one player. Jansson's agent was in talks with Brentford very quickly after he was told he  could leave Leeds. But we can suggest player names after names but we have no idea of the cost of the overall wages, fees involved and other factors. You mention no money? well we don't know what the owners will do. We will find out in the coming weeks. Mowbray has made a number of good signings over his tenure whether it Armstrong(1.8 million) and Dack(750k) or loan signings like Antonsson, Reed, Adarabioyo or free signings like Smallwood(Did a good job for us in league 1), Downing. Plus bringing through Lewis Travis to now becoming a key player for our club after watching him development from Under 18's football. With Buckley and Rankin Costello coming through and will be good players for this club next season and beyond. Davenport looks a good player from his appearances so far. Hopefully he develops into a good player for us in the future. 

6. Like I said in Point 1 if we had Dack I feel we would top 6 IMO. People will say Injuries happen but other teams had their key player out with Injury would have top 6 probably not. 

[Amo]

Unfortunately the goodwill from the League One promotion, coupled with the dumbing down of expectations after a decade of Venky ownership has given him Brian Clough status at the club.

It should be a two-way street. He should be grateful we saved him from the managerial scrapheap after he tanked at Coventry.

Edited July 15, 2020 by Amo

[chaddyrovers]

15 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Why can’t the Chief Executive let go a subordinate employee?

Who sacked managers in the past? John Williams or the Walker Trust?

Maybe I answered my own question, who’s subordinate to who in this most odd set-up?

John Williams had the power from the Walker trust to hire and fire managers. tho didn't the Walker trust force John Williams to sack Paul Ince after the Wigan Game? In fear of going down that season. 

Venky's made those decisions on sacking our manager not the CEO. Don't you remember the Paul Hunt's Letter sent to Mrs D and it recommend sacking the manager?

[Mattyblue]

‘We’d have got top 6 if one of our players wasn’t injured’. Total conjecture that nobody could ever prove.

We weren’t close with Dack, we ain’t close now. There’s a chance we could finish 10 points away. We will only slightly improve on last years middling side’s points return (if we do at all).

Last season’s side wasn’t a promotion team, the points tally says this one isn’t either, and it is sheer delusion to think otherwise.

Edited July 15, 2020 by Mattyblue

[Mattyblue]

3 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

 

Venky's made those decisions on sacking our manager not the CEO. Don't you remember the Paul Hunt's Letter sent to Mrs D and it recommend sacking the manager?

I know how the club operates, I also know the club is a dysfunctional mess. Perhaps the two are linked?

Edited July 15, 2020 by Mattyblue

[roversfan99]

15 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

 

1. We have improved in my opinion. Plus we have been without Dack for half a season and still reach the same points now with 2 games to go. Put Dack in this team we get top 6 In my opinion. If you took Grabban out of that Forest team they wouldn't be top 6 or WBA if they didn't have Pereira, or Fulham with Mitrovic.   Its enough for me. Might be different for other posters. 

2. The 1st half yesterday were awful. Too many long balls, no movement or quick tempo. Second half we were passing tempo wise and passing to feet. Rothwell had an impact. We moved to this boxed midfield with 2 strikers looking for space between their 3 man centre backs. Its didn't work. Am I concern? no

3. Its have taken time, hiring staff and money to bring this European Scouting Network that Mowbray wants. Its yourself who wants a replace Mowbray. So would you replacement want to use a European Scouting Network tho? That's a question for you. With the time and money Rovers have invested in bring this system into place surely this would be one of key questions you would asked of any managerial interview process? 

4. Loan signings are good thing at this level like WBA loan of Pereira or Leeds loan of Ben White. We aren't in a worst position then last summer but the same. Gallagher may come good next season or he may not. We have be over this Raya situation to death since last summer. Do we need to go over this again? 

5. I felt Mowbray should have used the money more better to sign players we need not just on one player. Jansson's agent was in talks with Brentford very quickly after he was told he  could leave Leeds. But we can suggest player names after names but we have no idea of the cost of the overall wages, fees involved and other factors. You mention no money? well we don't know what the owners will do. We will find out in the coming weeks. Mowbray has made a number of good signings over his tenure whether it Armstrong(1.8 million) and Dack(750k) or loan signings like Antonsson, Reed, Adarabioyo or free signings like Smallwood(Did a good job for us in league 1), Downing. Plus bringing through Lewis Travis to now becoming a key player for our club after watching him development from Under 18's football. With Buckley and Rankin Costello coming through and will be good players for this club next season and beyond. Davenport looks a good player from his appearances so far. Hopefully he develops into a good player for us in the future. 

6. Like I said in Point 1 if we had Dack I feel we would top 6 IMO. People will say Injuries happen but other teams had their key player out with Injury would have top 6 probably not. 

1. The Dack point is an excuse, and total conjecture as pointed out by others. We hadnt been in the play offs all season when Dack was fit either. Surely the 12m worth of strikers should help with that? But I suspect your response will be "do we need to go over this again" as if its a minor issue.

2. Second half, I think we had as many shots on target as in the first half. Millwall obviously were less bothered about attacking but we NEVER looked like scoring. The false 9's and inside forwards arent a one off and they clearly dont work. Is there any reason why you are so blaze and unconcerned? Do you think these tactics will work eventually? And if so, why?

3. This European scouting network seems to be a huge thing to you without actually having seen how its going to work. I know that Mowbrays recruitment up to now has gone from being hit and miss in League 1 (more successful than his Championship record but reliant on successfully getting the players already at the club onside) to really poor since promotion. But no, if I owned the club I would not demand to a new manager that he has to sign x or y, or players from x or y. He can sign whoever he wants, improved scope for transfers is only going to be beneficial but if he signed players that are good, I dont care if they are British or from abroad, and likewise if they are shite. Its not a valid reason to keep a manager on.

4. Loan signings are very valuable but the problem is that for us they have put us a bit up the league but still nowhere close, whereas at those sides, both finished top 6 last year, both also added permanent players of quality whereas we did neither. And again, the goalkeeping situation is not one to be dismissed, not unless it conflicts with your view that Mowbray should stay of course.

5. Again, a flimsy excuse to suggest that "we dont know" the reasons why he didnt sign certain players. It also makes no sense as to why he signed who he did sign, which is all we can ever judge on. Which is a below par striker who he doesnt know how to use.

6. Again, conjecture.

[Amo]

Why do you bother @roversfan99? 

[Mattyblue]

I know, I suggest he just reads chaddy’s complete reading list before commenting in future.

Edited July 15, 2020 by Mattyblue

[darrenrover]

Stuart Harvey is in charge of recruitment at Ewood, so I guess in charge of the setting up of the European scouting network. I'll tell you right here and now, if anyone is pinning their hopes on that bearing fruit, if it's even happened at all, prepare to be disappointed.

[Scotland1]

8 minutes ago, darrenrover said:

Stuart Harvey is in charge of recruitment at Ewood, so I guess in charge of the setting up of the European scouting network. I'll tell you right here and now, if anyone is pinning their hopes on that bearing fruit, if it's even happened at all, prepare to be disappointed.

Stuart Harvey who is he exactly?

[tomphil]

I expect they'll root out a token signing from foreign lands at the very least. Something will have to justify the outlay and the bluster.

[simongarnerisgod]

4 minutes ago, darrenrover said:

Stuart Harvey is in charge of recruitment at Ewood, so I guess in charge of the setting up of the European scouting network. I'll tell you right here and now, if anyone is pinning their hopes on that bearing fruit, if it's even happened at all, prepare to be disappointed.

is stuart harvey the man responsible for brereton then???i don`t believe any statement of intent that comes out of ewood anymore,like you said,it more than likely does`nt exist,the one time excellent spurs manager keith burkenshaw  said about his departure from the club due to boardroom interference" there used to be a football club here you know" very much relevant to our situation here,only difference is that mowbray won`t resign cos he`s part of the ******* problem