Tony Mowbray Discussion

[JacknOry]

8 hours ago, briansol said:

Well in 18/19 they bought Joe Garner for 1,25m + McManaman, Kipre, Windass, Lee Evans, Daniel Fox + 5 or 6 free transfers

They finished 18, we finished 15.

in 19/20 they bought highly rated Jamal Lowe, Kieffer Moore, Joe Williams and Tom Pearce. + 2 free transfers.

They finished 23 (would've been 13 if not points deducted), we finished 11.

Paul Cook brought in 18 players in his 2 championship seasons.

I think the transfer sums might not be that different, the wage budget is certainly similar. They had a large decifit like us, the difference being their owners didn't want the bill.

In 18/19, they sold Dan Burn and Will Grigg for 4 mill a piece to pay for all that. Also sold off 4 or 5 players to League 1 for nominal fees.

in 19/20, admittedly they paid out about 7 million in fees but they did bring in a reported 1-2 million for Leonardo da SIlva Lopez to Hull. They also let go of quite a few high earners including Nick Powell, Callum Macmanananananaman, James Vaughn and Darren Gibson.

We spent 10 million in fees first season up and brought none in. Then had a net spend of 2 million last season with DR leaving and SG coming in. If you want to go down free transfers route, we have picked up some expensive ones in Johnson, Downing, Holtby, and Rodwell in that time.

if you were to break it all down, I would say we had double the net spend in that two year period. Sure, wages wont be hugely different but even when we shared league 1, only Nick Powell was on anything like what the likes of Mulgrew, Evans, and Graham were on.  So I think we pay a little better than them too.

[martonrover]

10 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

his pension pot will suffice? what a bizarre comment to make. 

You ever spoken to the manager and spent time listening to our manager in none match day setting. cos it a great listening to his experience and different situations he has been part of,

Like the other guy, you have interpreted my comment to literally. To clarify again, I don't think Tony is milking Rovers, (as has been the case with certain other managers). 

All I meant is that he is under very little pressure and, barring a very long and sustained run of poor results, he is safe with us sitting around in midtable, which on all the evidence is his ceiling.

He is in the comfort zone.

[47er]

Even now he's asking about being "around Top 6"!

FFS---how long does he want?

[chaddyrovers]

2 hours ago, martonrover said:

Like the other guy, you have interpreted my comment to literally. To clarify again, I don't think Tony is milking Rovers, (as has been the case with certain other managers). 

All I meant is that he is under very little pressure and, barring a very long and sustained run of poor results, he is safe with us sitting around in midtable, which on all the evidence is his ceiling.

He is in the comfort zone.

I disagree that he is under very little pressure at the club or in any comfort zone

[rigger]

3 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

I disagree that he is under very little pressure at the club or in any comfort zone

could you explain a little more how you have come to these feelings ?

[roversfan99]

The owners are disinterested and the CEO is his mate. Probably the ideal environment in terms of comfort.

[Sparks Rover]

6 minutes ago, rigger said:

could you explain a little more how you have come to these feelings ?

He hasn't,  just likes to stoke the flames. If you flick back 12 months he will have been saying exactly the same thing.  Some things never change 

[JHRover]

3 hours ago, 47er said:

Even now he's asking about being "around Top 6"!

FFS---how long does he want?

Somebody should ask him what the point is in trying to be around the top 6.

I keep hearing this as our supposed target and wonder who has decided that. 

Last time I checked the only guarantee of promotion is first or second. You can guarantee that Warnock, Wilder, Santo, Bielsa weren't going round telling everyone that they wanted to challenge for the top six. Its all about promotion.

If Mowbray doesn't have the top two as his aim then he's in the wrong job.

Scraping 6th place and then getting walloped in the play offs is no use to me.

Can imagine Chris Hughton telling Marinakis at Forest that he's happy to survive this season then try and challenge for the top 6 next year. He wouldn't have got the job doing that. 

[Sparks Rover]

47 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Somebody should ask him what the point is in trying to be around the top 6.

To me thats saying he's happy with 7th or 8th...

We are being taken for a ride.

[Mashed Potatoes]

48 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Somebody should ask him what the point is in trying to be around the top 6.

I keep hearing this as our supposed target and wonder who has decided that. 

Last time I checked the only guarantee of promotion is first or second. You can guarantee that Warnock, Wilder, Santo, Bielsa weren't going round telling everyone that they wanted to challenge for the top six. Its all about promotion.

If Mowbray doesn't have the top two as his aim then he's in the wrong job.

Scraping 6th place and then getting walloped in the play offs is no use to me.

Can imagine Chris Hughton telling Marinakis at Forest that he's happy to survive this season then try and challenge for the top 6 next year. He wouldn't have got the job doing that. 

Forest were most recently in the Premier League in 1999 - no doubt the 20 or so managers they have had since then talked a good game but results are what matter not throw away comments in interviews.

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

Keep your ambitions vague and you can't be judged on them later. Self-preservation 101?

I genuinely would be interested if he does have targets each season? There was a lot of talk last pre-season about top 6 being the target and we seem to be hearing the same things again from the players (and manager). Someone at the club is obviously telling these new players that promotion is the goal and they obviously believe it (Trybull being the latest). 

[tomphil]

Just like in the transfer windows TM is very good at changing the narrative as the season goes on.  He knows how to play the game.

[Leonard Venkhater]

On 22/10/2020 at 22:50, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

We'd three ex-Dingles playing in the same team for us back in the day - Blacklaw, Joyce, Connelly. I suppose Chaddy would have been boycotting a team like that.

I loved Johnny Price above all of them!

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

3 minutes ago, Leonard Venkhater said:

I loved Johnny Price above all of them!

Yeah, I liked Pricey a lot. When I first saw Alan Judge I thought Johnny Price Mk 2. Blacklaw and Connelly had both seen better days and Walt Joyce was only really a squad filler standard player.

[rigger]

17 minutes ago, Leonard Venkhater said:

I loved Johnny Price above all of them!

On the left wing we've got Tony Field,

On the right wing Johnny Price

[Crimpshrine]

55 minutes ago, Leonard Venkhater said:

I loved Johnny Price above all of them!

I never knew he had played for Burnley previously!

I only remember him at Stockport and Rovers. Was one of my favourites too. Sadly passed away at 51.

[Leonard Venkhater]

42 minutes ago, Crimpshrine said:

I never knew he had played for Burnley previously!

I only remember him at Stockport and Rovers. Was one of my favourites too. Sadly passed away at 51.

God, he was brilliant!

 I do have to confess I did have a little wince-only momentarily-at 16 years old, when my mate's Claret father proudly told me of JP's history.

Ah, but I was so much older then etc.....

[briansol]

On 24/10/2020 at 06:55, JacknOry said:

In 18/19, they sold Dan Burn and Will Grigg for 4 mill a piece to pay for all that. Also sold off 4 or 5 players to League 1 for nominal fees.

in 19/20, admittedly they paid out about 7 million in fees but they did bring in a reported 1-2 million for Leonardo da SIlva Lopez to Hull. They also let go of quite a few high earners including Nick Powell, Callum Macmanananananaman, James Vaughn and Darren Gibson.

We spent 10 million in fees first season up and brought none in. Then had a net spend of 2 million last season with DR leaving and SG coming in. If you want to go down free transfers route, we have picked up some expensive ones in Johnson, Downing, Holtby, and Rodwell in that time.

if you were to break it all down, I would say we had double the net spend in that two year period. Sure, wages wont be hugely different but even when we shared league 1, only Nick Powell was on anything like what the likes of Mulgrew, Evans, and Graham were on.  So I think we pay a little better than them too.

Thanks, I really appreciate you taking the time to back your argument with a good factual case. I'll concede we had a greater net spend in transfer fees. 

But I would be very worried having Paul Cook at the helmet. Looking at his transfers over the last 3 seasons it's very poor. He's brought in 24 players, and I don't think one of them has increased in value. 

You'll have to give him credit for the run Wigan had after Covid, but I think there must be so many better candidates out there if the aim is promotion to PL

[JacknOry]

2 minutes ago, briansol said:

Thanks, I really appreciate you taking the time to back your argument with a good factual case. I'll concede we had a greater net spend in transfer fees. 

But I would be very worried having Paul Cook at the helmet. Looking at his transfers over the last 3 seasons it's very poor. He's brought in 24 players, and I don't think one of them has increased in value. 

You'll have to give him credit for the run Wigan had after Covid, but I think there must be so many better candidates out there if the aim is promotion to PL

I dont like the bloke and wouldnt want him either. Just picked up on your statement that we have had similar budgets in recent seasons. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

2 hours ago, briansol said:

Thanks, I really appreciate you taking the time to back your argument with a good factual case. I'll concede we had a greater net spend in transfer fees. 

But I would be very worried having Paul Cook at the helmet. Looking at his transfers over the last 3 seasons it's very poor. He's brought in 24 players, and I don't think one of them has increased in value. 

You'll have to give him credit for the run Wigan had after Covid, but I think there must be so many better candidates out there if the aim is promotion to PL

I wouldn't want him anywhere near my helmet either !

Regarding Johnny Price I saw him play loads of times when he was at Stockport  County and he was always a handful. He never gave less than gave 100%. They had three really good players who kept Counties head above water at that time. Pricey, Alan Ogley in goal who was ex Man City and Freddie Goodwin who was ex Wolves and who later came to Rovers. They were all outstanding in the old Division 4.

[Mercer]

3 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I wouldn't want him anywhere near my helmet either !

Regarding Johnny Price I saw him play loads of times when he was at Stockport  County and he was always a handful. He never gave less than gave 100%. They had three really good players who kept Counties head above water at that time. Pricey, Alan Ogley in goal who was ex Man City and Freddie Goodwin who was ex Wolves and who later came to Rovers. They were all outstanding in the old Division 4.

Pricey was a little gem and chipped in with a fair few goals for us - think he was about a 1 in 5 man, pretty good for a winger.  Sadly, I think he passed away in his early fifties.

Remember Freddie quite well (think he'd left us when Pricey joined us) - thought he always gave 100% but felt he should have got a few more goals for us.  Last I heard, he'd followed Bonnie Tyler's lead and got 'Lost in France'!

Edited October 25, 2020 by Mercer

[oldjamfan1]

16 hours ago, Mercer said:

Pricey was a little gem and chipped in with a fair few goals for us - think he was about a 1 in 5 man, pretty good for a winger.  Sadly, I think he passed away in his early fifties.

Remember Freddie quite well (think he'd left us when Pricey joined us) - thought he always gave 100% but felt he should have got a few more goals for us.  Last I heard, he'd followed Bonnie Tyler's lead and got 'Lost in France'!

He did Merce, took his own life sadly  

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

4 minutes ago, oldjamfan1 said:

He did Merce, took his own life sadly  

The Dingles had a conveyor belt of talent coming down from the North East at that time.  Johnny Price was one of them. What Newcastle and Sunderland were thinking  of I'll never know. I think the guy who took Shearer to Southampton was the guy responsible for all those players but he had a falling out and left them. The conveyor belt stopped right away. A lad I knew was in and around their reserve  and " A " team then and he told me the coach went up to Newcastle for a Saturday afternoon reserve team game with a full compliment and came back nearly empty because the Burnley lads were all Geordies and they were having a weekend at home. Stan Ternent was one of them.

[Mercer]

5 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

The Dingles had a conveyor belt of talent coming down from the North East at that time.  Johnny Price was one of them. What Newcastle and Sunderland were thinking  of I'll never know. I think the guy who took Shearer to Southampton was the guy responsible for all those players but he had a falling out and left them. The conveyor belt stopped right away. A lad I knew was in and around their reserve  and " A " team then and he told me the coach went up to Newcastle for a Saturday afternoon reserve team game with a full compliment and came back nearly empty because the Burnley lads were all Geordies and they were having a weekend at home. Stan Ternent was one of them.

You are right.

The guy in question was a Jack Hixon who Shearer remained friends with until Hixon's passing.  Hixon did work for Newcastle in his latter years but the recruitment game had changed and Newcastle had missed out on all Jack's earlier gems.

Off the top of my head, I think Jack found for Burnley up in the NE the likes of Ralph Coates, Dave Thomas, Stan Ternent, Arthur Bellamy, Brian O'Neill , Dave Merrington and Les Latcham who all excelled in the top flight.  At today's prices you've probably got about £250million of talent there.

A remarkable man.

 

Edited October 26, 2020 by Mercer

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

Just now, Mercer said:

You are right.

The guy in question was a Jack Hixon who Shearer remained friends with until Hixon's passing.  Hixon did work for Newcastle in his latter years but the recruitment game had changed and Newcastle had missed out on all Jack's earlier gems.

Off the top of my head, I think Jack found for Burnley up in the NE the likes of Ralph Coates, Dave Thomas, Stan Ternent, Arthur Bellamy, Brian O'Neill , Dave Merrington and Les Latcham who all excelled in the top flight.  At today's prices you've probably got about £250million of talent there.

A remarkable man.

 

I always remember Shearer speaking fondly of him.