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Tony Mowbray Discussion


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3 hours ago, 47er said:

Even now he's asking about being "around Top 6"!

FFS---how long does he want?

Somebody should ask him what the point is in trying to be around the top 6.

I keep hearing this as our supposed target and wonder who has decided that. 

Last time I checked the only guarantee of promotion is first or second. You can guarantee that Warnock, Wilder, Santo, Bielsa weren't going round telling everyone that they wanted to challenge for the top six. Its all about promotion.

If Mowbray doesn't have the top two as his aim then he's in the wrong job.

Scraping 6th place and then getting walloped in the play offs is no use to me.

Can imagine Chris Hughton telling Marinakis at Forest that he's happy to survive this season then try and challenge for the top 6 next year. He wouldn't have got the job doing that. 

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48 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Somebody should ask him what the point is in trying to be around the top 6.

I keep hearing this as our supposed target and wonder who has decided that. 

Last time I checked the only guarantee of promotion is first or second. You can guarantee that Warnock, Wilder, Santo, Bielsa weren't going round telling everyone that they wanted to challenge for the top six. Its all about promotion.

If Mowbray doesn't have the top two as his aim then he's in the wrong job.

Scraping 6th place and then getting walloped in the play offs is no use to me.

Can imagine Chris Hughton telling Marinakis at Forest that he's happy to survive this season then try and challenge for the top 6 next year. He wouldn't have got the job doing that. 

Forest were most recently in the Premier League in 1999 - no doubt the 20 or so managers they have had since then talked a good game but results are what matter not throw away comments in interviews.

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Keep your ambitions vague and you can't be judged on them later. Self-preservation 101?

I genuinely would be interested if he does have targets each season? There was a lot of talk last pre-season about top 6 being the target and we seem to be hearing the same things again from the players (and manager). Someone at the club is obviously telling these new players that promotion is the goal and they obviously believe it (Trybull being the latest). 

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42 minutes ago, Crimpshrine said:

I never knew he had played for Burnley previously!

I only remember him at Stockport and Rovers. Was one of my favourites too. Sadly passed away at 51.

God, he was brilliant!

 I do have to confess I did have a little wince-only momentarily-at 16 years old, when my mate's Claret father proudly told me of JP's history.

Ah, but I was so much older then etc.....

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On 24/10/2020 at 06:55, JacknOry said:

In 18/19, they sold Dan Burn and Will Grigg for 4 mill a piece to pay for all that. Also sold off 4 or 5 players to League 1 for nominal fees.

in 19/20, admittedly they paid out about 7 million in fees but they did bring in a reported 1-2 million for Leonardo da SIlva Lopez to Hull. They also let go of quite a few high earners including Nick Powell, Callum Macmanananananaman, James Vaughn and Darren Gibson.

We spent 10 million in fees first season up and brought none in. Then had a net spend of 2 million last season with DR leaving and SG coming in. If you want to go down free transfers route, we have picked up some expensive ones in Johnson, Downing, Holtby, and Rodwell in that time.

if you were to break it all down, I would say we had double the net spend in that two year period. Sure, wages wont be hugely different but even when we shared league 1, only Nick Powell was on anything like what the likes of Mulgrew, Evans, and Graham were on.  So I think we pay a little better than them too.

Thanks, I really appreciate you taking the time to back your argument with a good factual case. I'll concede we had a greater net spend in transfer fees. 

But I would be very worried having Paul Cook at the helmet. Looking at his transfers over the last 3 seasons it's very poor. He's brought in 24 players, and I don't think one of them has increased in value. 

You'll have to give him credit for the run Wigan had after Covid, but I think there must be so many better candidates out there if the aim is promotion to PL

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2 minutes ago, briansol said:

Thanks, I really appreciate you taking the time to back your argument with a good factual case. I'll concede we had a greater net spend in transfer fees. 

But I would be very worried having Paul Cook at the helmet. Looking at his transfers over the last 3 seasons it's very poor. He's brought in 24 players, and I don't think one of them has increased in value. 

You'll have to give him credit for the run Wigan had after Covid, but I think there must be so many better candidates out there if the aim is promotion to PL

I dont like the bloke and wouldnt want him either. Just picked up on your statement that we have had similar budgets in recent seasons. 

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2 hours ago, briansol said:

Thanks, I really appreciate you taking the time to back your argument with a good factual case. I'll concede we had a greater net spend in transfer fees. 

But I would be very worried having Paul Cook at the helmet. Looking at his transfers over the last 3 seasons it's very poor. He's brought in 24 players, and I don't think one of them has increased in value. 

You'll have to give him credit for the run Wigan had after Covid, but I think there must be so many better candidates out there if the aim is promotion to PL

I wouldn't want him anywhere near my helmet either !

Regarding Johnny Price I saw him play loads of times when he was at Stockport  County and he was always a handful. He never gave less than gave 100%. They had three really good players who kept Counties head above water at that time. Pricey, Alan Ogley in goal who was ex Man City and Freddie Goodwin who was ex Wolves and who later came to Rovers. They were all outstanding in the old Division 4.

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3 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I wouldn't want him anywhere near my helmet either !

Regarding Johnny Price I saw him play loads of times when he was at Stockport  County and he was always a handful. He never gave less than gave 100%. They had three really good players who kept Counties head above water at that time. Pricey, Alan Ogley in goal who was ex Man City and Freddie Goodwin who was ex Wolves and who later came to Rovers. They were all outstanding in the old Division 4.

Pricey was a little gem and chipped in with a fair few goals for us - think he was about a 1 in 5 man, pretty good for a winger.  Sadly, I think he passed away in his early fifties.

Remember Freddie quite well (think he'd left us when Pricey joined us) - thought he always gave 100% but felt he should have got a few more goals for us.  Last I heard, he'd followed Bonnie Tyler's lead and got 'Lost in France'!

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16 hours ago, Mercer said:

Pricey was a little gem and chipped in with a fair few goals for us - think he was about a 1 in 5 man, pretty good for a winger.  Sadly, I think he passed away in his early fifties.

Remember Freddie quite well (think he'd left us when Pricey joined us) - thought he always gave 100% but felt he should have got a few more goals for us.  Last I heard, he'd followed Bonnie Tyler's lead and got 'Lost in France'!

He did Merce, took his own life sadly :( 

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4 minutes ago, oldjamfan1 said:

He did Merce, took his own life sadly :( 

The Dingles had a conveyor belt of talent coming down from the North East at that time.  Johnny Price was one of them. What Newcastle and Sunderland were thinking  of I'll never know. I think the guy who took Shearer to Southampton was the guy responsible for all those players but he had a falling out and left them. The conveyor belt stopped right away. A lad I knew was in and around their reserve  and " A " team then and he told me the coach went up to Newcastle for a Saturday afternoon reserve team game with a full compliment and came back nearly empty because the Burnley lads were all Geordies and they were having a weekend at home. Stan Ternent was one of them.

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5 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

The Dingles had a conveyor belt of talent coming down from the North East at that time.  Johnny Price was one of them. What Newcastle and Sunderland were thinking  of I'll never know. I think the guy who took Shearer to Southampton was the guy responsible for all those players but he had a falling out and left them. The conveyor belt stopped right away. A lad I knew was in and around their reserve  and " A " team then and he told me the coach went up to Newcastle for a Saturday afternoon reserve team game with a full compliment and came back nearly empty because the Burnley lads were all Geordies and they were having a weekend at home. Stan Ternent was one of them.

You are right.

The guy in question was a Jack Hixon who Shearer remained friends with until Hixon's passing.  Hixon did work for Newcastle in his latter years but the recruitment game had changed and Newcastle had missed out on all Jack's earlier gems.

Off the top of my head, I think Jack found for Burnley up in the NE the likes of Ralph Coates, Dave Thomas, Stan Ternent, Arthur Bellamy, Brian O'Neill , Dave Merrington and Les Latcham who all excelled in the top flight.  At today's prices you've probably got about £250million of talent there.

A remarkable man.

 

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Just now, Mercer said:

You are right.

The guy in question was a Jack Hixon who Shearer remained friends with until Hixon's passing.  Hixon did work for Newcastle in his latter years but the recruitment game had changed and Newcastle had missed out on all Jack's earlier gems.

Off the top of my head, I think Jack found for Burnley up in the NE the likes of Ralph Coates, Dave Thomas, Stan Ternent, Arthur Bellamy, Brian O'Neill , Dave Merrington and Les Latcham who all excelled in the top flight.  At today's prices you've probably got about £250million of talent there.

A remarkable man.

 

I always remember Shearer speaking fondly of him.

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13 minutes ago, Mercer said:

You are right.

The guy in question was a Jack Hixon who Shearer remained friends with until Hixon's passing.  Hixon did work for Newcastle in his latter years but the recruitment game had changed and Newcastle had missed out on all Jack's earlier gems.

Off the top of my head, I think Jack found for Burnley up in the NE the likes of Ralph Coates, Dave Thomas, Stan Ternent, Arthur Bellamy, Brian O'Neill , Dave Merrington and Les Latcham who all excelled in the top flight.  At today's prices you've probably got about £250million of talent there.

A remarkable man.

 

I think the likes of Ray Pointer, John Angus, John Talbut, Jimmy Robson, Gordon Harris etc were all Geordies. Maybe they were before your time. Brian O'Neill was some player, if he hadn't have been such a bad lad he would have played for England. Bob Lord got fed up with bailing him out in the end and got rid of him.

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2 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I think the likes of Ray Pointer, John Angus, John Talbut, Jimmy Robson, Gordon Harris etc were all Geordies. Maybe they were before your time. Brian O'Neill was some player, if he hadn't have been such a bad lad he would have played for England. Bob Lord got fed up with bailing him out in the end and got rid of him.

I did say off the top of my head - we are gong back some 60 years or so now and reaching the periphery of my recollections!

Anyhow, good shouts!

Think I'm right in that Pointer, Angus and Harris were all capped by England at full international level though none of them became regulars in the England team.

Remember also seeing Pointer playing in his thirties for Pompey in his latter career where he was still banging them in but not quite the same force.  Didn't Angus stay at Burnley all his career - a top class full back.  'Bomber' Harris was not to be trifled with (could be nasty even with his own team mates!) and and always got his fair share of goals whether it be from the wing or midfield - recall him going back to the NE to finish his career at Sunderland.  Friend in Blackpool told me Jimmy Robson still lives there and I also remember seeing him play for the Tangerines when he left Burnley.  Talbut not quite in the same league as the others and ended up at WBA - seem to recall reading he died from dementia (perhaps football related, like Jeff Astle, heading all those heavy balls as a centre half).  Yep, spot on about O'Neill and a 'real hard bastard' (if I'd a pound for every time I heard someone call him that).

My best mate at the time was a Burnley fan and his dad also took me along if Rovers weren't at home - what an upbringing!

 

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1 minute ago, Mercer said:

I did say off the top of my head - we are gong back some 60 years or so now and reaching the periphery of my recollections!

Anyhow, good shouts!

Think I'm right in that Pointer, Angus and Harris were all capped by England at full international level though none of them became regulars in the England team.

Remember also seeing Pointer playing in his thirties for Pompey in his latter career where he was still banging them in but not quite the same force.  Didn't Angus stay at Burnley all his career - a top class full back.  'Bomber' Harris was not to be trifled with (could be nasty even with his own team mates!) and and always got his fair share of goals whether it be from the wing or midfield - recall him going back to the NE to finish his career at Sunderland.  Friend in Blackpool told me Jimmy Robson still lives there and I also remember seeing him play for the Tangerines when he left Burnley.  Talbut not quite in the same league as the others and ended up at WBA - seem to recall reading he died from dementia (perhaps football related, like Jeff Astle, heading all those heavy balls as a centre half).  Yep, spot on about O'Neill and a 'real hard bastard' (if I'd a pound for every time I heard someone call him that).

My best mate at the time was a Burnley fan and his dad also took me along if Rovers weren't at home - what an upbringing!

 

Angus had a nasty streak as well. We were playing the dingles at Ewood and I was stood at the Blackburn End at the front near the wall towards the corner flag. Mike Harrison and Angus had been involved in a tackle right in front of me were they both went to ground. The ball was quickly cleared downfield and as Mike was getting to his feet Angus kicked his legs right from under him. Not many people saw it because most were watching the play down field so he got clean away with it. No TV then. I think he knew Mike wasn't keen on the rough stuff and was trying to intimidate him.

Brian O'Neill was a good little player, in the later games he was usually marking Dougie. I remember him ripping Dougie's shirt right down the middle in one game at the Turf. I heard he'd had women trouble and Bob Lord had told him to leave town !

John Talbut played for the same England school boys team as a one time drinking partner of mine, Tony Street,  with Barry Bridges, Willie Carlin, Warwick Rimmer and the old West Brom goalie John Osbourne who actually was an outfield player as a schoolboy.

 

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