Tony Mowbray Discussion

[tomphil]

2 minutes ago, JBiz said:

They don’t have the ability to invest like us or the quality youth coaching setup - that’s a basic reason for why both are less fancied clubs for promotion.

But as you rightly point out, £ isn’t fool proof for victory. In terms of last night though, I would suggest the fact we had a little more quality in the end (Elliott, Downing, Arma) probably won the points on that basis.

Certainly was no tactical change or style that won the day.

Yes we'll agree on Armstrong for sure pound for pound TMs best signing.  WE/he this season would be really knackered without him.

He clearly believes the points are always there to be won until the very death even if his boss doesn't.

[JBiz]

Just now, tomphil said:

Yes we'll agree on Armstrong for sure pound for pound TMs best signing.  WE/he this season would be really knackered without him.

He clearly believes the points are always there to be won until the very death even if his boss doesn't.

I don’t agree with your view that TM is trying to settle for points, for example Bristol would’ve been a draw on that basis. I think his intention is clear, but his tactical decisions (like starting Buckley because he’s more “physical” against Rotherham) are hindering his intention.

I would also give a huge slab of “benefit of the doubt” in  terms of selection and rotation, in a season that seems to be 8-10 games a month continuously. He sees their fitness first hand, and saving Holtby for Saturday might work out well if we get 6 points this week.

I do, however, agree on Armstrong being the main asset and reason for most of our success this season. Goal and assist last night again. No coincidence, his only real poor display I can remember this season was the Bristol defeat!

I worry that a 10th placed Rovers in January are a lot easier to purchase a player from than a 5th placed Rovers. We do have quality in Dack, Travis and Brereton et al to come back but Armstrong is now our most influential player.

[K-Hod]

5 hours ago, Wood26 said:

I’m assuming all you shouting for Mowbray out are the same lot who filled the rest of the seats for the Oxford game at Ewood in League one.

Good to see you again.

Hi, that’s the second baseless assumption you’ve made after assuming that the people that want Mowbray out also wanted Big Sam out.

Please can you either stop making such assumptions, or provide evidence to back up any claims? 
Thanks.

[JBiz]

2 minutes ago, K-Hod said:

Hi, that’s the second baseless assumption you’ve made after assuming that the people that want Mowbray out also wanted Big Sam out.

Please can you either stop making such assumptions, or provide evidence to back up any claims? 
Thanks.

Can you apply the same process of “stop or provide substance” to anyone who thinks long winded jokes about “the disciples of Jesus Mowbray” are in any way clever or funny?

Nice one 😉 

[Mashed Potatoes]

What I find extraordinary in this is that if last night had happened in reverse and we had lost to a team after having the better of the game - particularly if it was a team managed by Warnock or Bilic , or whoever the latest flavour of the month is - people would have been demanding that we get a manager who can chisel out results against the odds. Yet when we manage that with Mowbray people hold it against him.

[tomphil]

The need to manage players well in this crazy season speaks for itself. It is the same for every team and club.

Where I feel Mowbray differs is he likes to swap game to game. It's in his DNA you don't need a covid season for that.

The thing that stops me from giving a lot of benefit of doubt is he isn't letting a settled side find its feet then altering as players tire or struggle. He's just willy nilly changing for changes sake. 

Even admitting it's tactical not just to keep them fresh. In other words he has a good excuse for his tinkermon approach this season and he's damn well going to make the most of it.

It is and always has been his Achilles heel. A browse or conversation with any of his previous clubs supporters will confirm this.

At Rovers its often contributed to undoing his other good work. We are seeing it again this season but he's getting a free pass for it in some eyes because of the situation.

I challenge those to look a bit deeper.

[Sparks Rover]

6 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

What I find extraordinary in this is that if last night had happened in reverse and we had lost to a team after having the better of the game - particularly if it was a team managed by Warnock or Bilic , or whoever the latest flavour of the month is - people would have been demanding that we get a manager who can chisel out results against the odds. Yet when we manage that with Mowbray people hold it against him.

I think it was more the poor performance.  We got lucky.  Against 4th from bottom I expect more if we are to push for top 6.

Edited December 17, 2020 by Sparks Rover

[tomphil]

9 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

What I find extraordinary in this is that if last night had happened in reverse and we had lost to a team after having the better of the game - particularly if it was a team managed by Warnock or Bilic , or whoever the latest flavour of the month is - people would have been demanding that we get a manager who can chisel out results against the odds. Yet when we manage that with Mowbray people hold it against him.

Did you actually watch the game ? Have you been watching them this season ?

Genuine question because if you had surely you'd realize last night had very little to do with him chiseling anything out. 

Most of what we saw from him last night appeared to hinder the team. It was another abject performance.

Swapping a raw weak kid who's struggled from the first min for a solid 36 year old ex Prem/ England int who can put his foot on the ball for the last 10 mins is in no way rocket science or a tactical masterstroke.

Tony was settling for a draw last night make no mistake. I'm delighted we snatched the win but for 97 mins I was seething.

That's the reaction you are seeing from people here. 

Edited December 17, 2020 by tomphil

[Mashed Potatoes]

9 minutes ago, tomphil said:

Did you actually watch the game ? Have you been watching them this season ?

Genuine question because if you had surely you'd realize last night had very little to do with him chiseling anything out. 

Most of what we saw from him last night appeared to hinder the team. It was another abject performance.

Swapping a raw weak kid who's struggled from the first min for a solid 36 year old ex Prem/ England int who can put his foot on the ball for the last 10 mins is in no way rocket science or a tactical masterstroke.

Tony was settling for a draw last night make no mistake. I'm delighted we snatched the win but for 97 mins I was seething.

That's the reaction you are seeing from people here. 

It's a results business - we got the result.

[gumboots]

I think all managers have a shelf life. Eventually it must get almost impossible to get the same group of players to perform to the max. Rich clubs get round this by changing players. Poor clubs settle for where they are and cut their cloth accordingly. Clubs with ambition but not much spare cash change manager. You can do it any time,  it costs less than changing 4 or more players, and the potential rewards are high. Mind you, so is the potential risk so you, as a club and as fans, have to be prepared to fail if you want to get 9n.

[JBiz]

8 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

It's a results business - we got the result.

I can’t understand how anyone could’ve watched the last ten minutes and thought the tactic was to hold onto a point.

[tomphil]

45 minutes ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

It's a results business - we got the result.

He's a performance related manager he told you so 

He said the last performance - in which we lost - was alright. That's no doubt played a part in following it up with an even worse one. How does he explain that then seeing as he's just told us he's a ' performance manager ' ?

He owes Adam Armstrong big time this season. Last night he pulled Mr Performance right out the mire..... again.

Edited December 17, 2020 by tomphil

[tomphil]

18 minutes ago, JBiz said:

I can’t understand how anyone could’ve watched the last ten minutes and thought the tactic was to hold onto a point.

8 of those last 10 was time added on, the last sub was on 89 mins and for all anyone knew there was 3 mins left.

The settle for a point subs were made way before the end of normal time.

Edited December 17, 2020 by tomphil

[SBlue]

Is there a gas leak in here or something?

We’ve lost two out of our last ten.

[Hasta]

Mowbrays problem is stubbornness. Even his disciples, sorry, people who think he is doing very well, must surely admit that Gallagher on the wing very rarely bears fruition. Every time he got the ball wide last night it was held up and laid back to whoever was supporting him, thus ending of the impetus of the move. The couple of times he did try to go at the full back he lost it. When Elliot, Nyambe, Dolan or even Brereton get the ball in that position there's a chance we will actually keep the impetus going. 

Yet it took until the 90th minute before Mowbray decided this wasn't working and brought Dolan on. I'd be amazed if Gally isn't back out there come Saturday.

 

Edited December 17, 2020 by Hasta

[tomphil]

Or won 1 in the last 4 and only taken 4 points out of a possible 12.

Classic midtable stuff.

[Bigdoggsteel]

50 minutes ago, tomphil said:

8 of those last 10 was time added on, the last sub was on 89 mins and for all anyone knew there was 3 mins left.

The settle for a point subs were made way before the end of normal time.

Ah we weren't settling for a point. Lenhan and Ayala were up for the winning goal. If you are settling for a point you would leave at least 1 of your centre halves back. Plus we played with more urgency in extra time than we did in normal time. I think Downing got things going, along with Holtby and Trybull. 

[tomphil]

7 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Ah we weren't settling for a point. Lenhan and Ayala were up for the winning goal. If you are settling for a point you would leave at least 1 of your centre halves back. Plus we played with more urgency in extra time than we did in normal time. I think Downing got things going, along with Holtby and Trybull. 

That's what i'm saying though they only showed any real urgency when the board went up showing 8 mins.

Otherwise it's likely the game would've petered out at 1-1, the subs were already done then. He didn't 'go for it' in injury time via any tactical switch. Dolan looked a late time wasting sub nothing more.

Edited December 17, 2020 by tomphil

[Exiled_Rover]

Honestly he's not the man to take us up.

He's somehow bumbled into assembling a decent squad, but he's still not using them correctly - and we're still shocking at LB.

That said, and I hate to say it, but it's almost 'better the devil you know'. The lack of organisational structure at this football club is terrifying. For all his faults, Mowbray has at least got us feeling / operating like a football club again - but it's only skin deep.

If he goes the transition of power isn't going to be seamless. The next manager has a hell of a job on his hands.

[Dreams of 1995]

I can't for the life of me justify the sacking of a manager on the back of 2 losses in 10 games, regardless of what some desktop managers think can be done better.

Last night we ground a win out of a truly terrible performance (they happen) and it is now time "we look at the performance, not the result".

We play exceptionally well against Watford and Bournemouth and we "have to look beyond the performance and at the result".

Contradictory. Simple as that. Take a position and stick with it. If you don't like Mowbray and want him gone then fine, but say that instead of trying to make it out like it is those that want him to stay are the ones overlooking the facts. In reality it is just difficult to keep up with the everchanging measuring stick.

Call me a disciple if it makes you feel better about my disagreement. Could not care less. The catchphrases that come out of this thread are plain silly.

 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

My beef with Mowbray is we just look like a collection of players. Some good not, so good. Most of the time our pattern of play is dull, uninspiring, lacklustre, easy to play against. We see teams like Rotherham come to Ewood and have the better of the game and manage to keep us at arms length without too much trouble. Teams were you might think one or two of their players are better than what we have. They can do that because they do have a pattern of play, they have players playing in roles that are suited to their abilities.  You can look at them and you can see who's supposed to be doing what.

We lack that cohesive team set up. Half of the games we've played in and not done well most of this board are calling for half the team to be dropped. Two games down the line the new guys need dropping and the usual suspects are being selected. We haven't got a best team or way or playing. I accept that with the amount of games keeping the same 11 is almost impossible but the way of playing should stay the same.

[tomphil]

When the manager himself tells everyone in public that a poor performance in which we lost was 'alright'.  Then goes on to label himself a performance based manager he is somewhat setting himself up for scrutiny by the desktop managers.

We've had 2 back to back poor efforts. lost one, won one. Probably similar to come on Saturday and we might draw.

It is what it is but don't cry about it being forcibly debated we can't just cancel out the cons to suit the pros.  Even though we are in that culture, debate is healthy and if it feeds back to the gaffer or players and they pull their fingers out it's no bad thing.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

1 hour ago, S8 & Blue said:

Is there a gas leak in here or something?

We’ve lost two out of our last ten.

That'll be the smell of the shit we played last night.

[SBlue]

1 minute ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

That'll be the smell of the shit we played last night.

Must be toxic fumes. Feel like I'm sniffing glue reading some of this.

[K-Hod]

2 minutes ago, S8 & Blue said:

Must be toxic fumes. Feel like I'm sniffing glue reading some of this.

Certainly explains a few things 😏