Tony Mowbray Discussion

[Stonesrick]

TM wants to play this possession based football apparently after watching Leeds be successful in getting out of the Championship playing that way. 
 

The obvious thing is that they don’t continue to play side to side, slow, back, side to side. They play with intensity through the lines from defence to midfield to forwards. 
 

Sadly, we are miles away from that.

[roversfan99]

9 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Because the season isn't over yet and we have our best players to come back.

How is the balance of risk v reward worth it when they have never made a decent managerial appointment apart from getting lucky with Bowyer and Mowbray? Nether of whom were signals of intent. Do you have that much faith in Waggot and or the owners to make a good appointment? Good for you. 

I never said that. If the mindset is that we expect the next appointment to be Coyle-esque then we may as well give up completely. Keeping Mowbray is surely only delaying the inevitable?

As I explained, the risk v reward comment was mainly surrounding what I feel is an exaggerated sense of what could happen if the next managerial choice is wrong. Coyle who was a particular bad appointment that we would struggle to match his ineptitude wasnt the sole reason for our relegation, it was a culmination of a 2 year spell in which we had hit a transfer embargo and sold all of our best players. Even if we did appoint a poor replacement, I wouldnt suspect much immediate danger because our squad is much better than a fair few in this league to stay up. Conversely, a good appointment and it isnt that far away to have a genuine promotion push, maybe much of the foundations are there, but the manager seems over a long period unable to push past that point. There is nothing to suggest that in the last 18 months under Mowbray, we have been going on an upward trajectory.

This notion of our best players all coming back and saving the day just has always seemed desperate and tenous to me, in this season, as they come back more injuries will happen. We have recently played plenty of teams with equal or worse injury problems, tonight Huddersfield are without 8 or 9 including their main defender in Schindler and their main attacking threat this season in Koroma. Hes had enough time up until now and indeed the mitigating circumstances of bad injuries are across the board to the extent that any idea that we will ever judge Mowbray on a fully fit first 11 is unreasonable.

I still dont get why a team underperforming on its own public top 6 target would have to be in a relegation scrap to "not be working out."

[RevidgeBlue]

2 hours ago, davulsukur said:

Not a great record for the calendar year.

1 more loss than wins. Less than half the available points have been picked up (56/126), a lot of goals conceded as well.

Leeds went up last season conceding just 35 goals from 46 games. We've shipped 61 from our last 42. 

The top 9 teams in the Championship conceded less goals across 46 games than that.

More evidence that Mowbray isn't the right man for the job. His disregard for our defensive frailties is constantly biting us in the arse.

Great Post, extremely damning and the stats speak for themselves.

And without having looked it up I'd imagine the stats for the calender year 2019 would be extremely similar.

[Bigdoggsteel]

2 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I never said that. If the mindset is that we expect the next appointment to be Coyle-esque then we may as well give up completely. Keeping Mowbray is surely only delaying the inevitable?

As I explained, the risk v reward comment was mainly surrounding what I feel is an exaggerated sense of what could happen if the next managerial choice is wrong. Coyle who was a particular bad appointment that we would struggle to match his ineptitude wasnt the sole reason for our relegation, it was a culmination of a 2 year spell in which we had hit a transfer embargo and sold all of our best players. Even if we did appoint a poor replacement, I wouldnt suspect much immediate danger because our squad is much better than a fair few in this league to stay up. Conversely, a good appointment and it isnt that far away to have a genuine promotion push, maybe much of the foundations are there, but the manager seems over a long period unable to push past that point. There is nothing to suggest that in the last 18 months under Mowbray, we have been going on an upward trajectory.

This notion of our best players all coming back and saving the day just has always seemed desperate and tenous to me, in this season, as they come back more injuries will happen. We have recently played plenty of teams with equal or worse injury problems, tonight Huddersfield are without 8 or 9 including their main defender in Schindler and their main attacking threat this season in Koroma. Hes had enough time up until now and indeed the mitigating circumstances of bad injuries are across the board to the extent that any idea that we will ever judge Mowbray on a fully fit first 11 is unreasonable.

I still dont get why a team underperforming on its own public top 6 target would have to be in a relegation scrap to "not be working out."

Because I would say we are still in contention and my preference is for giving a manager the season to fulfill his target. I know the trigger approach works at times, but we are another Coyle away from getting into serious trouble. We have some excellent palyers, but so have other clubs who have been dragged down there. 

We don't look far away to me either, I think Mowbray is holding a bit of that together. I obviously want us to be the play offs and the longer we are outside, the worse it looks. A few wins gets you right up there though and I hope we will be in the mix at the end. I have rarely if ever thought Mowbray has lost the players. If I saw that, then I would think he should go. 

[roversfan99]

5 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Because I would say we are still in contention and my preference is for giving a manager the season to fulfill his target. I know the trigger approach works at times, but we are another Coyle away from getting into serious trouble. We have some excellent palyers, but so have other clubs who have been dragged down there. 

We don't look far away to me either, I think Mowbray is holding a bit of that together. I obviously want us to be the play offs and the longer we are outside, the worse it looks. A few wins gets you right up there though and I hope we will be in the mix at the end. I have rarely if ever thought Mowbray has lost the players. If I saw that, then I would think he should go. 

I dont think that sacking a manager 4 years in can be referred to as the "trigger approach" and indeed I think as highlighted last time we went down, it took more than an inept appointment to cause it, of which even the current rabble would struggle to get someone on Coyle's level. If we was going to roll the dice with the manager a year down the line following an embargo and a lorry load of cheap replacements for Armstrong, Dack etc making up the squad, then maybe there would be more risk.

[Bigdoggsteel]

5 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I dont think that sacking a manager 4 years in can be referred to as the "trigger approach" and indeed I think as highlighted last time we went down, it took more than an inept appointment to cause it, of which even the current rabble would struggle to get someone on Coyle's level. If we was going to roll the dice with the manager a year down the line following an embargo and a lorry load of cheap replacements for Armstrong, Dack etc making up the squad, then maybe there would be more risk.

We don't know that any of that will happen. Dack and Armstrong are under contract and worth a considerable amount. I think every club is going to feel the pinch over the next few years. We might actually be in a better position than many if the owners continue to support the club financially. That's the unfortunate reality. I don't think waiting til the end of the season is that long anyway, barring a complete collapse.

[StevenSK]

Bring in Pulis. 
 

Will take a few weeks to get his shape into the team and set up. Won’t be pretty, but with the squad he will get them results and we may recover the season what is left for a PO spot. Then go from there at the end of the season. It’s the last shot before the squad gets dismantled in the summer and ffp cycle hits.
 

This can’t go own. 56 points all year in 2020, that’s relegation form. Tony just isn’t good enough and is now becoming a drain on everyone.

Edited December 29, 2020 by StevenSK

[Darwen Rover 007]

7 minutes ago, StevenSK said:

Bring in Pulis. 
 

Will take a few weeks to get his shape into the team and set up. Won’t be pretty, but with the squad he will get them results and we may recover the season what is left for a PO spot. Then go from there at the end of the season. It’s the last shot before the squad gets dismantled in the summer and ffp cycle hits.
 

This can’t go own. 56 points all year in 2020, that’s relegation form. Tony just isn’t good enough and is now becoming a drain on everyone.

We can do better than another Dinosaur 

[StevenSK]

1 minute ago, Darwen Rover 007 said:

We can do better than another Dinosaur 

Not sure there is anyone better than TP in the business of grinding out results and keeping a tight defence. Could see Gallagher improving under him. I’d take him on. A deal to the season and a PO winners bonus/long contract. 

[Darwen Rover 007]

1 minute ago, StevenSK said:

Not sure there is anyone better than TP in the business of grinding out results and keeping a tight defence. Could see Gallagher improving under him. I’d take him on. A deal to the season and a PO winners bonus/long contract. 

I would prefer to go for Bilic personally 

[G Somerset Rover]

One win in seven. We’ve fallen behind in our last six matches (not scoring ourselves in all of those six first halves). He has not, cannot and will never ever be able to sort the defence out. 

If you have an ounce of dignity about you Tony, then just go. You know very well that your number is up. Have you got the decency to do the right thing? I very much suspect not. 

From Josh on Twitter:

Update after 22 games...

18/19 - 31 points, 5 off the play offs. 
19/20 - 34 points, 1 off the play offs. 
20/21 - 29 points, 7 off the play offs. 

Edited December 29, 2020 by Gavlar Somerset Rover!

[dingles staying down 4ever]

He has to go now!!

Nothing else to say! 

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Enough is enough..time for new ideas and tactics.This side is massively underperforming and the buck stops with you Mowbray.

Tired of this crap.

[RV Blue]

Got to go Tony.

[Mr. E]

He's been given a job for life, that much is clear. The sinking thing is he seems to have no intention of leaving. Mediocrity is our sentence. 

[TheRoversReturn]

If you can listen to the iFollow commentators at the end of the game, then you'll be able to hear a manager being savaged by the most optimistic sources you can find.

When even the cheerleaders have nothing to cheer, then you know that time's up.

As for those Rovers fans who want to give him time, the question is...why don't you want the best for your club? As there ain't no way in hell that this is the best Rovers can be doing. 

[Ossydave]

Season can still be saved if action is taken NOW.

Wtf were them subs tonight. Look at the state of the teams above us now too. Teams who would love the resources TM has had.

Cap in hand to Billic now, pay him whatever he wants.

Although tbh I think the season will be canned for at least a few weeks after tomorrow's games anyway if not more....

[Mattyblue]

The Warren Lucy comments were interesting, obviously checked himself just in time from saying what he actually wanted to say, though maybe an insight into what folk working at the club are feeling behind the scenes...

[StevenSK]

2 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

The Warren Lucy comments were interesting, obviously checked himself just in time from saying what he actually wanted to say, though maybe an insight into what folk working at the club are feeling behind the scenes...

What was he saying?

[Mattyblue]

‘Don’t know where we go from here’ .

‘It’s not good enough.

‘Something needs to change’.

[Ewood Ace]

What can you say really, everyone can see that he has taken the club as far as he can but nothing is going to change. Tonight with some of his bizarre decisions he reminded me of Souness when his tenure was coming to an end. Thankfully with Souness we got lucky and Newcastle did us a favour no other clubs are coming in for this chump and even if they did he wouldn't leave his cushy number here where his mate is CEO.

He will still be here this time next year only we won't be bouncing around mid table with him we will be in a fight for survival after many of our better players have left for clubs and managers with some ambition.

[K-Hod]

I’d just love to know what the justification was for the Buckley sub, in particular.

Saw a tweet from Rich Sharpe which indicated even he was confused about that.

Why do we ship so many goals, why do we make so many mistakes at the back and why have we been defensively suspect in all of your time here?

He’s had good backing this summer and he’s underachieving in a big way.

Bet Mowbray isn’t asked about any of these things by the good folks at the LT though.

[rigger]

There was a quote on one of the threads about crowds dropping down to 7/8000. With Mowbray still here, we will be lucky if the crowds go up to 7/8000 

[Stuart]

75 points is generally the target for a top 6 finish.

We are on 29 so need 46 points from the next 24 games. That’s 1.91 points per game.

Simply put its WWL all the way, with only one D allowed to upset that winning sequence.

On the current trajectory we should reach 60 points. Lower-midtable.

The question is, assuming Venkys continue servicing (and adding to) our debt, is the faux-security of another midtable finish enough for us to continue watching football as bad as that for the foreseeable future?

It’s becoming stunningly awful to watch, with selection problems, misuse of substitutions, no clear game plan or style of play (I think Lucy called it ‘possession-based football’ today), no plan B, and watching us criminally waste the young talent that we have in our squad. The football is dire.

It’s lose-lose in my view. We play poor football and don’t get the necessary results.

After the game, in the iFollow interview, Mowbray bemoaned us not taking our chances.

Some Mowbray pearls of wisdom after the game...

“We shouldn’t have lost having equalised”

“Huddersfield put their bodies on the line”

“It was a decent game of football”

“1-1 would have been a fair result”

“We have to take it on the chin”

 Blaming individual an mistake for the goal.

“I don’t want to moan about referees but...”

“Add the injuries to the list “

“Struggling with defenders”

“We has a midfielder playing right back “ (!)

“Disappointed and we move on “

[SamTheShrew]

Twitter 95% against Mowbray in replying to @rovers full time except some guy who wants to raise a statue to Mowbray 🤷‍♂️🤦