Tony Mowbray Discussion

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

1 minute ago, DavidMailsTightPerm said:

I actually think the team is improving (on a player by player basis)  - and you have to give credit to TM for that. The fact that we aren't improving in terms of league position leaves only one conclusion - that we need to change manager to take that leap from mid-table under achievers to promotion candidates.

Looking at the players on an individual basis only takes you so far. I can't see how his signings have been made with a view to creating a team. Unless you're planning to play with 6 in midfield that is

[rigger]

5 minutes ago, DavidMailsTightPerm said:

I actually think the team is improving (on a player by player basis)  - and you have to give credit to TM for that. The fact that we aren't improving in terms of league position leaves only one conclusion - that we need to change manager to take that leap from mid-table under achievers to promotion candidates.

But are we improving player by player in relation to the teams we are vying with for promotion ?

[Blue blood]

36 minutes ago, phili said:

I fear we maybe this seasons Hull with how we are playing at the moment.

Our next set of fixtures look horrible, will he be able to sort it out or will he go down as our first manager to take us to League 1 twice in their tenure.

He just doesn't seem to know what to do anymore and it looks like he is desperate to be put out of his misery and sacked.

Thought about this and I think we are safe this season for a two key reasons. 

1 As we have proved this season we are still capable of playing badly and getting the odd result. Sure it's down to the inconsistency and dross in the league, as well as some individual brilliance from a few of our players but we will still pick up some points. 

2 We are (I think) about 10 points off relegation. This requires a three game swing where we get nothing and those in the relegation zone get wins. I'm sure we are capable of 3 losses but am equally sure that the teams in the relegation zone won't win 3 on the bounce before we pick up some points. 

Not a ringing endorsement of the team or manager and take away Armstrong's goals and you would be super worried. But until next season at least we are safe. 

[Ghost7]

It's a dangerous game when your manager hires your CEO.

A change should have been made in December, most fans could see it then and the season might have even been turned around.

Mowbray isn't the only person that needs to go.

[Boz]

I don't think that most right minded Rovers supporters take any delight in stating the blindingly obvious, that Tony's game is up. I agree that he sounds like a decent bloke, straight talking and did bring about the much needed stability, yet in football management there is in reality only a certain shelf life, before one becomes stale. Reconstructing teams is possibly one of the greatest challenges to any manager seeking longevity. 

Even he realises that there is no loyalty in football, those involved it's all about the money first and foremost, it's only us supporters who apply other criteria, like passion. He was able to see that the time was up for, Richie Smallwood, Charlie Mulgrew, Danny Graham, Craig Conway, Dom Samuel, so with a heavy heart he wished them well. 

So now it's his turn for someone to thank him and wish him well, to leave on the best possible terms, without further tarnishing his accomplishments at Rovers. Loyalty has it's place in engineering a successful team, yet can become cumbersome. I previously questioned whether his coaching team were up to it, yet he must consider that they are, despite the chaotic defending we have witnessed, especially on set pieces, so proposed he might be best to look for help. He is the man at the top, so his actions, or lack of, rest on his shoulders. 

Sadly he has never got to grips with our defence, he needed a big ugly experienced dominant centre half, yet failed, which I find surprising as that was exactly what he was as a player. Plus in my opinion, it's the easiest thing to accomplish, get it tight at the back and work forwards. We have a multitude of exciting and attacking options, save for the largest and strangest signing in SG. Added to this his various formations which only seem to confuse our players, remember footballers are young lads and not possibly the brightest, so perhaps err on trying to make your instructions fairly easy to follow? 

Now if Waggott, or whomever, do not act and soon, then regrettably they are culpable and need to be addressed. 

Edited February 18, 2021 by Boz

[Ewood Ace]

32 minutes ago, DavidMailsTightPerm said:

I actually think the team is improving (on a player by player basis)  - and you have to give credit to TM for that. 

Really? Lenihan hasn't improved for many years, Bell has been poor during his time here, Ayala and Douglas looks shadows of the players they have been previously at this level and Williams hasn't improved in 4 years.

Rothwell has been at the club 3 years and the only thing that has been consistent about him is his inconsistency. Gallagher is a worse player now than 4 years ago thanks to Mowbray's shocking use of him. Brereton has improved slightly in that he has gone from looking like a Northern League player to a National league player. Buckley looks like a lost little boy in every game he plays, Travis' progress looks to have stunted in the last 12 months. Corry Evans has been the Corry Evans we have had for the last 7-8 years, a waste of space.

Bennett has been past it for a long time, Johnson is well past his best, Holtby's performances have been poorer the longer he has been here. Now Graham has gone I don't think that Mowbray has a clue how to use Dack.

The only 2 players I would say have really improved under Mowbray are Armstrong and Nyambe although I believe that Nyambe may be more in spite of Mowbray rather than due to him.

Edited February 18, 2021 by Ewood Ace

[Mr. E]

I actually for some inexplicable reason had some slight, faint hope I would check the news this morning and find that lo and behold Venkys have sacked him. Something was just telling me even they must have had enough.

It must have been heartburn...

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

27 minutes ago, Ewood Ace said:

Really? Lenihan hasn't improved for many years, Bell has been poor during his time here, Ayala and Douglas looks shadows of the players they have been previously at this level and Williams hasn't improved in 4 years.

Rothwell has been at the club 3 years and the only thing that has been consistent about him is his inconsistency. Gallagher is a worse player now than 4 years ago thanks to Mowbray's shocking use of him. Brereton has improved slightly in that he has gone from looking like a Northern League player to a National league player. Buckley looks like a lost little boy in every game he plays, Travis' progress looks to have stunted in the last 12 months. Corry Evans has been the Corry Evans we have had for the last 7-8 years, a waste of space.

Bennett has been past it for a long time, Johnson is well past his best, Holtby's performances have been poorer the longer he has been here. Now Graham has gone I don't think that Mowbray has a clue how to use Dack.

The only 2 players I would say have really improved under Mowbray are Armstrong and Nyambe although I believe that Nyambe may be more in spite of Mowbray rather than due to him.

The bit you missed -

The fact that we aren't improving in terms of league position leaves only one conclusion - that we need to change manager to take that leap from mid-table under achievers to promotion candidates.

Player for player I would say our team is now better than it was when he joined. The fact that some players aren't consistent or achieving their potential is (IMO) partly down to the manager. To get that we need to change the manager.

[tina]

I didn't know or care we had a game last night. Slowbrain has to go and now

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

57 minutes ago, rigger said:

But are we improving player by player in relation to the teams we are vying with for promotion ?

I think we are. The loan players we got in were all sounded out by clubs vying for promotion - which one of them wouldn't take Elliott. I am sure any of these clubs would take Armstrong, Dack, Nyambe, Travis, Kaminski off our hands. Personally I think players like Rothwell would also attract interest - depends whether you think his inconsistency is down to him or the manager.

[Theaxe15]

In terms of on the pitch, all Mowbray has done is right the wrongs of the relegation which he still has to be partially responsible for, though I would lay more of the blame at Coyle's Irn Bru sponsored front door.

We're back where we were in the Bowyer/Lambert era and show absolutely no signs of pushing above that midtable mediocrity. It's all well and good accepting that over relegation but football will always have an element of risk and reward to it.

Totally appreciate the stability Mowbray has brought but maybe now is the time to take the risk. Personally I feel we'd be a good proposition for prospective managers. Good squad, great facilities, owners willing to spend and seemingly happy to not get involved too much. All the foundations are there, we just need a forward thinking manager who feels formations and tactics are a relevant part of management

[Ewood Ace]

5 minutes ago, DavidMailsTightPerm said:

Player for player I would say our team is now better than it was when he joined. 

And so it should be given the money that has been spent, when he joined we had sold all our best players and replaced them with freebies and loans. After spending what must be getting on for £20 Million and not having to sell any key players  you'd expect any manager would have an improved squad.

 

[roverandout]

I imagine if lambert had been given that much backing we would be in the premiership now

[tomphil]

There is a good squad there now, he and others deserve credit for putting it together. That's only half the job though it's clearly being mismanaged on the pitch in football terms.

Also factor in he still relies heavily on the older heads he inherited. Bennett always involved when fit as is Evans, Williams the same. Mulgrew would have been had they not fallen out.

Maybe we've missed them in terms of their influence rather than ability but what does that say ?

I always maintained it was dangerous creating that pecking order in terms of seniority at the club rather than ability and influence on the pitch.

Edited February 18, 2021 by tomphil

[rigger]

10 minutes ago, DavidMailsTightPerm said:

I think we are. The loan players we got in were all sounded out by clubs vying for promotion - which one of them wouldn't take Elliott. I am sure any of these clubs would take Armstrong, Dack, Nyambe, Travis, Kaminski off our hands. Personally I think players like Rothwell would also attract interest - depends whether you think his inconsistency is down to him or the manager.

Sounded out and rejected. Of the five players you have named, in the form they are in, maybe Kaminski. Rothwell is inconsistent. It doesn't matter whose fault it is. 

[roversfan99]

2 hours ago, TheRoversReturn said:

Is this until our next lucky win gets you to go back on this and be a happy clapper once again? Either Mowbray is the right man or he isn't. 

Time for people to make up their minds. It's this flip-flopping that's had us wasting the last 18 months at least...

 

To be fair, whilst it is frustrating, it is irrelevant, Mowbray is in a safe bubble with mates around him and disinterred owners above him.

1 minute ago, roverandout said:

I imagine if lambert had been given that much backing we would be in the premiership now

No chance. A fraud of a manager as his record since suggested. Talked the talk but cant walk the walk.

[Butty]

He’s not going anywhere any time soon is he 😞 

[davulsukur]

3 minutes ago, Butty said:

He’s not going anywhere any time soon is he 😞 

No and his comment "we'll judge it at the end of the season" (if we are falling short) suggests he knows it too.

[gumboots]

But things can change. Will they? Probably not. But they just might 

[Displaced Rover]

Worst thing about this is the total lack of any rumours of him being under the slightest pressure.

We're essentially united in wanting him gone but he's here to stay and there's nothing we can do.

[phili]

1 hour ago, Blue blood said:

Thought about this and I think we are safe this season for a two key reasons. 

1 As we have proved this season we are still capable of playing badly and getting the odd result. Sure it's down to the inconsistency and dross in the league, as well as some individual brilliance from a few of our players but we will still pick up some points. 

2 We are (I think) about 10 points off relegation. This requires a three game swing where we get nothing and those in the relegation zone get wins. I'm sure we are capable of 3 losses but am equally sure that the teams in the relegation zone won't win 3 on the bounce before we pick up some points. 

Not a ringing endorsement of the team or manager and take away Armstrong's goals and you would be super worried. But until next season at least we are safe. 

I hope you are right, as I don't think we have the players to roll their sleaves up for a relegation battle, the two young lads from Everton and City will crack under the pressure of a relegation battle. 

I think your comments would have been echoed last season by Hull who had 39 points after 26 games. To only get 3 draws and a win in the last 20 games was horrifying for them. 

Looking at our next 9 games, we are likely to get a few draws so the last 8 games will be tight. Having said that when the pressure is on, TM always seems to conjure up a few wins so we should be ok.

[StevenSK]

3 minutes ago, Displaced Rover said:

Worst thing about this is the total lack of any rumours of him being under the slightest pressure.

We're essentially united in wanting him gone but he's here to stay and there's nothing we can do.

Relax he won’t become a burden and will walk before that happens.......

some dignity he’s got. I wouldn’t have had the gall to do what he’s doing 

[G Somerset Rover]

1 hour ago, Boz said:

Sadly he has never got to grips with our defence, he needed a big ugly experienced dominant centre half, yet failed, which I find surprising as that was exactly what he was as a player.

Indeed. He has consistently talked about needing 'men' in the side, particularly at the back. Yet where do we find ourselves? A back three comprised of a rapidly regressing Lenihan, and two on loan kids who are here to play week in week out regardless of their performances. He can't even seem to take his own advice on board.

Edited February 18, 2021 by Gavlar Somerset Rover!

[speeeeeeedie]

Mowbray does seems to have lost something. Don Said's old posts yesterday were eye opening. Mowbray isn't a Prem manager because of his flaws. These flaws are being exaggerated at present. 

Why does he keep changing formation? Pick one and go with it. Personnel may change but their roles once playing shouldn't change. 

I got a text of a Boro supporting mate last night. He asked how Rovers did. I told him we lost and are sitting in Championship purgatory. His reply; "Ah, mid-table Mowbray. That's what he does.".

[RoversClitheroe]

Has Mowbray lost the dressing room? 

Have a feeling after yesterday's result and performance he has.