Tony Mowbray Discussion

[Rogerb]

14 minutes ago, Southside Rover said:

Of course it is about trust and clearly their is none from the majority. I'm in the minority I know that.

Losing cat 1 status would be a disaster but the club acknowledged that and I don't see that is the intention. I see a proposal that intends on retaining that status whilst generating funds and setting the club for the next 20 years by investing into the infrastructure. 

Time will tell, maybe I'll have to come back cap in hand, maybe I'll get some apologies when and if it happens and we know whether that trust was well placed or not.

We're you aware that not long after Mowbray arrived he stated that he didn't see the benefit of a cat 1 academy and would rather have the money for the first team?

[Roverall]

33 minutes ago, LDRover said:

Just seen an interview with Mowbray on Andy Bayes's twitter. Suddenly he's gone all Mr Motivator, passionate about the club, bigging us up as world famous Blackburn Rovers and how he's proud to manage us.

A complete u turn from the disrespectful shite he was peddling a couple of weeks ago. Looks like this is his Plan B to keep his job, he knows he's losing (lost) the fans and is on a charm offensive to woo back the weak and gullible (of which there are plenty). 

Shame he's got no Plan B on the pitch.

I would wager good money that Mowbray, Waggott et al are very aware of the chatter on this board. A few posters, myself included, used the very phrase about Blackburn Rovers being famous all over the world, and now he suddenly says that out of nowhere in a speech to Bayes that could be set to a melodramatic 'inspirational' Hollywood blockbuster soundtrack. 

Very odd. Whatever he may say, he clearly is worried about losing his job. 

[47er]

7 minutes ago, Southside Rover said:

but I don't think they intended to get us relegated,

That's exactly what I said. Wasn't their intent but it happened---twice!

So if their intent is to improve the Academy, on past record it will be a disaster.

As I said hapless and hopeless.

[Southside Rover]

2 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Don’t fall for the spin.

a) They are not 30 years old, the academy is only 20 for a start.

b) We have indoor pitches at Brockhall especially built for winter weather -that TM refused to use, ‘I don’t like artificial surfaces’ (so ripped up Ewood instead)- though nicely builds up a view that Brockhall is an antiquated place that needs modernising, doesn’t it?

Come on South, you seem a smart enough fella, wake up a bit and read between the lines in what you are being spun and why.

Ha ha don't invite me onto the poison chalice. I need positivity in life. 

I do understand the apprehension and I've seen it a club not far from me which incidentally is on BT next Tuesday but although a smaller club that was done brutally, completely different to what I see these days at Blackburn. Up until a few years ago I was completely aligned with what I read on here but I just see it differently to the majority with what I've seen over the past couple of years. I just see it from from a different angle. The failure on the pitch only makes things worse as the dark cloud grows. 

I know the answer but what would it take for fans to see things differently?

[matt83]

16 minutes ago, Southside Rover said:

How can it be. Anything built 30 years ago is going to need renovating to a level but football has changed massively in that time and 30 years in football may as well be dog years. Remember when Shearer went for 15 million and everyone stood back. Today that's 150 million plus which just shows how things change and that was less than 30 years ago.

I'm not saying it's a rusty wreck but let's remember we had frozen pitches and trained at Ewood a couple of times this year which we all know is not Premier League standard. The proposal mentioned in parts at addressing that kind of thing.

By how can it be, do you mean how can it be the highest category? If so 30 years old or 1 year old we are one of only 24 clubs to have a category one academy. Surely would be better modernising what we have than chuck out the baby with the bath water. Ultimately when there’s so many more areas of the club that need money chucking at it why bother with the one area we have that’s equal to any club in the country in terms of its status. Unless, some nefarious ceo and co stand to earn out of it. 

[tomphil]

46 minutes ago, LDRover said:

Just seen an interview with Mowbray on Andy Bayes's twitter. Suddenly he's gone all Mr Motivator, passionate about the club, bigging us up as world famous Blackburn Rovers and how he's proud to manage us.

A complete u turn from the disrespectful shite he was peddling a couple of weeks ago. Looks like this is his Plan B to keep his job, he knows he's losing (lost) the fans and is on a charm offensive to woo back the weak and gullible (of which there are plenty). 

Shame he's got no Plan B on the pitch.

Another sickening PR job that's barely left a dry eye on some social media platforms. Polar opposite to what he was trotting out the other day, i'm not sure he's devious i just think he's muddled again.

Right from when he walked in the door i thought he looked like a man caught between two minds. That's probably why he's never been a top end championship manager because he does have his good points. Something though is lacking and i'm convinced it's the conflict within his own mind.

His stuff on the pitch and in recruitment screams it loud and clear.

[Southside Rover]

8 minutes ago, 47er said:

Well have a guess! Venkys who are responsible for it all! Its not going to come from a whip-round in the pubs is it?

Why should they do that? Because their lunacy caused it and, should they carry on, the debt will only double. Its a debt of honour if you lie. Its accepting responsibility

No way of recouping it other than promotion and settled status in The Premier League.

We all know they are incapable of achieving that.

By the way, I'm always wary of people who come on here at crisis times with virtually no posting history and support the owners/ Ewood hierarchy. I always suspect some skullduggery!

These are business people, they aren't going to just accept 200 million losses and walk away are they? I'm not protecting their mistakes but if we were in business, got it wrong, inherited huge debts as a result, would we walk away or reevaluate and step back trust in who we see as capable, I know not an opinion shared to get stability and then build to get back to where it needs to be to recover those losses.

Clearly that takes time and might not ever get there but I don't know why anyone would walk away with a 200 million loss. 

As for my skullduggery my first post explained my presence but it was exactly the crisis that gave me the nudge to share my thoughts here although that was towards Mowbray. I've been on here for just over a week so my posting history will take time to build up to those acceptable levels.

A difference of opinion isn't skullduggery though.

[chaddyrovers]

3 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

If I were the owners and Waggott made that sort of ultimatum I also wouldn't  be able to believe my luck either.

"I say you sack one, you get one free!"

Do you not think they would accept that sort of ultimatum from an employee of the club? 

[RevidgeBlue]

28 minutes ago, matt83 said:

Don’t buy this 30 years old antiquated training ground bullshit. It’s currently the highest category it can be. They’re making it sound like a dusty relic from the 1920s. But why? Ask the question who stands to earn out of this particularly as waggott is claiming any money generated will go into redeveloping the training ground. So nothing suggested will reduce debt or improved the playing side of things. When the stadium is crumbling, £200 million in debt, no defenders, why would you waste money on “improving” something to the same standard it already is. It’s illogical unless someone pushing it stands to earn out of it. 

That's it in a nutshell. 

Superp post which should be forwarded to the LT and Lancs Life.

[47er]

11 hours ago, Southside Rover said:

These are business people,

Ha! Well how do you imagine these "business people" will react as the losses keep piling up then?

I think I know----flog off what's saleable-----like Brockhall!

Your turn now.

Possibly more posts on this one topic from you than in your posting history. I smell a rat!

Edited February 27, 2021 by 47er

[RevidgeBlue]

38 minutes ago, Southside Rover said:

Of course it is about trust and clearly their is none from the majority. I'm in the minority I know that.

Losing cat 1 status would be a disaster but the club acknowledged that and I don't see that is the intention. I see a proposal that intends on retaining that status whilst generating funds and setting the club for the next 20 years by investing into the infrastructure. 

Time will tell, maybe I'll have to come back cap in hand, maybe I'll get some apologies when and if it happens and we know whether that trust was well placed or not.

Can you not read what Waggott said today?

He appeared to be claiming that the cost of building the new facility would be the same as or would more likely exceed the sale proceeds which the owners would have to make up.

How does that "generate funds?"

[47er]

7 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Do you not think they would accept that sort of ultimatum from an employee of the club? 

Once again Chaddy, I don't think that reads as you intended.

[Southside Rover]

9 minutes ago, matt83 said:

By how can it be, do you mean how can it be the highest category? If so 30 years old or 1 year old we are one of only 24 clubs to have a category one academy. Surely would be better modernising what we have than chuck out the baby with the bath water. Ultimately when there’s so many more areas of the club that need money chucking at it why bother with the one area we have that’s equal to any club in the country in terms of its status. Unless, some nefarious ceo and co stand to earn out of it. 

Yes I meant how can it be highest standard possible after 20 years. Times moved on so I'm sure there will be more that can be done. If we want to bench mark against the championship clubs then I completely agree, leave it alone but I don't get that impression. If a local kid has a choice of playing for Blackburn youth or a Premier League youth team, does he want to be part of the championship bench mark or part of a Premier league standard. Category 1 is of course in our favour, our record of blooding youngsters is in our favour but whilst we are mid table plodders in the Championship year after year and that facility is ageing when the Premier League clubs have category 1 but at the very highest level and continue to pump money into it because the finance at the top allows them to, I think we get left behind and for me, that's what the proposal is out to address whilst also raising much needed funds through the housing and enabling the ground to generate money daily not just on match days.

Essentially it's sweating the assets which all clubs outside of the Premier League these days have to do, whether it's Yoga classes, a Hotel, Cinema or Retail complex.

 

[tomphil]

25 minutes ago, Roverall said:

I would wager good money that Mowbray, Waggott et al are very aware of the chatter on this board. A few posters, myself included, used the very phrase about Blackburn Rovers being famous all over the world, and now he suddenly says that out of nowhere in a speech to Bayes that could be set to a melodramatic 'inspirational' Hollywood blockbuster soundtrack. 

Very odd. Whatever he may say, he clearly is worried about losing his job. 

I certainly think the club have PR people reading and feeding stuff back. The number of times it's sounded like he's answering stuff directly that's been mentioned on here is noticeable.  Might just be coincidence but there's been quite a bit of it.

 

[booth]

1 hour ago, Southside Rover said:

Ask his wife. What kind of a question is that? No one on this forum would know or have any business knowing.

It’s a question based on this.

“Do we think Waggott would come to a club in millions of pounds of debt and slipping into obscurity just to sell off some land for some houses? I think there would be much more attractive options than where the club was when they came in and more importantly where it was heading.”

I just didn’t see clubs queuing up to sign SW up as their chief executive, nor am I aware of any previous successes that would lead me to believe he’s the man to lead the club. So I was wondering which better or equal options than taking over as CEO of “a club in millions of pounds of debt and slipping into obscurity.”

It must be well documented for you to be so sure. Unless you’ve spoken to his wife?

[Southside Rover]

28 minutes ago, Rogerb said:

We're you aware that not long after Mowbray arrived he stated that he didn't see the benefit of a cat 1 academy and would rather have the money for the first team?

Yes and in that moment maybe that's what he thought. Have you ever said anything 3 years ago that maybe you felt differently about after?

If the proposal was to end cat 1 status I'm on board but it's not the suggestion. I get it's trust and trust has to be earnt, maybe at the end of this there will be some trust and harmony...

[RevidgeBlue]

8 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Do you not think they would accept that sort of ultimatum from an employee of the club? 

Hi Chaddy.

Well, if such an ultimatum was made, they haven't acted on it so far have they?

The poster claimed they haven't acted because they don't have an immediate replacement for Waggott.

If results don't improve and they're still both here in the summer something would even more amiss than it already appears.

[47er]

15 minutes ago, Southside Rover said:

I've been on here for just over a week so my posting history will take time to build up to those acceptable levels

Won't take long at this rate mate but I'm done with you. Anyone expecting positive outcomes from this lot of chancers and spivs is naive at best.

[47er]

2 minutes ago, Southside Rover said:

at the end of this there will be some trust and harmony...

My fear is that at the end of this I will have no club to support.

[47er]

19 minutes ago, Southside Rover said:

I don't know why anyone would walk away with a 200 million loss. 

Because its less than a 400 million loss?

[matt83]

2 minutes ago, Southside Rover said:

Yes I meant how can it be highest standard possible after 20 years. Times moved on so I'm sure there will be more that can be done. If we want to bench mark against the championship clubs then I completely agree, leave it alone but I don't get that impression. If a local kid has a choice of playing for Blackburn youth or a Premier League youth team, does he want to be part of the championship bench mark or part of a Premier league standard. Category 1 is of course in our favour, our record of blooding youngsters is in our favour but whilst we are mid table plodders in the Championship year after year and that facility is ageing when the Premier League clubs have category 1 but at the very highest level and continue to pump money into it because the finance at the top allows them to, I think we get left behind and for me, that's what the proposal is out to address whilst also raising much needed funds through the housing and enabling the ground to generate money daily not just on match days.

Essentially it's sweating the assets which all clubs outside of the Premier League these days have to do, whether it's Yoga classes, a Hotel, Cinema or Retail complex.

 

Not sure but think you misunderstand. There is always work that can be done but our current training facility even untouched as it is and 30 years old is still better than modern premier league facilities, such as Burnley’s, which is brand new pumped full of premier league money but still falls short of the level we set 3 decades ago by the category status awarded in the present day.

Also I’d be curious to know how much money they’ll make from this housing development. Ultimately, I reckon it’ll cost risking the category one status for effectively the cost of another Sam Gallagher.  

[Southside Rover]

30 minutes ago, 47er said:

That's exactly what I said. Wasn't their intent but it happened---twice!

So if their intent is to improve the Academy, on past record it will be a disaster.

As I said hapless and hopeless.

Apologies I thought you felt it was their intention and meant it as wasn't it their intention.

I don't defend the majority of their tenure, I think I've been clear on that. It should never have happened but it can't be changed. They got promotion if you look at it the same way as getting relegated and that's more recent so perhaps now hapless and we lose the hopeless until Premier League status is restored?

At the risk of repeating, since stepping back their is no coincidence that things have stopped sliding as they were. That coincides with the appointments we've debated to death. A promotion followed, consolidation in the Championship and up until February there was a quiet optimism of being around the play offs. 

I don't like the lack of action in removing Mowbray and it concerns me how long it could go on for but the general direction based on the facts we actually know for certain and the world we live in I'm not so concerned about. If and when someone announces the loss of cat 1 status I will be as upset as the rest I just don't see it happening, not for now anyway.

[booth]

30 minutes ago, Southside Rover said:

I know the answer but what would it take for fans to see things differently?

A proper club management structure with the power to make changes based on what’s happening on the pitch.

A proper recruitment of future first team managers and assistants and acknowledgement that the manager is of primary, not secondary importance. 

A clear intent to get the club into the Premier League to try and rectify the financial burden caused by the mistakes of the owners.

That would be a great start.

[Southside Rover]

9 minutes ago, 47er said:

My fear is that at the end of this I will have no club to support.

I get that and the club I mentioned before left many of my work friends without a club. I can only imagine how it would feel and its gut wrenching

[RevidgeBlue]

47 minutes ago, Southside Rover said:

How can it be. Anything built 30 years ago is going to need renovating to a level but football has changed massively in that time and 30 years in football may as well be dog years. Remember when Shearer went for 15 million and everyone stood back. Today that's 150 million plus which just shows how things change and that was less than 30 years ago.

I'm not saying it's a rusty wreck but let's remember we had frozen pitches and trained at Ewood a couple of times this year which we all know is not Premier League standard. The proposal mentioned in parts at addressing that kind of thing.

You've obviously never been to Brockhall I take it?

The current facilities are superb. Especially the indoor pitches. We're not talking Luton 1975 here, they're as smooth as silk to the touch.

With the benefit of hindsight the previously incomprehensible decision to train on a pitch that was already knackered seems part of a cunning plain to paint the indoor training facilities as outdated or unusable.

I thought we only did it to ensure the game got called off.