Tony Mowbray Discussion

[RevidgeBlue]

33 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Not sure what you are disagreeing about. Sam as a lower division manager would be all about getting promotion. Which he did at numerous clubs. That is only done by winning match after match.

As a club with limited resources in the PL, his remit was obviously different, all about keeping the club up, you can argue with his methods in doing that, but it’s apples and oranges with managing a team wanting promotion.

I was only disagreeing with your point that half the fans would moan about appointing the modern day HK.

I'd say not, as we'd be winning most weeks.

I compared and contrasted Allardyce as I presumed that was where the rationale for your point came from.

[Wheelton Blue]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

Rothwell and Travis won tackles and controlled the midfielder and Buckley stopped Grimes from playing. 

Wasn't it Grimes who repeatedly kept pinging balls out to their left side whilst we were backs to the wall for the second half?

[Mercer]

2 hours ago, Gav said:

The managerial bar is lower than I can ever remember it, all this talk of Neill and Hughton - Both abject failures whilst working under similar circumstances as Mowbray, why on earth would we want either of those 2 here?

I get the Wilder links, but I fear he's beyond on means, but these 2? doesn't make sense, you're replacing one failure with another.

 

Think Wilder in danger of thinking he's 'too big' - a number of clubs are understood to have had a nibble including us, WBA and Forest. 

[RevidgeBlue]

5 minutes ago, Mercer said:

Think Wilder in danger of thinking he's 'too big' - a number of clubs are understood to have had a nibble including us, WBA and Forest. 

Yep, you soon get forgotten when you're out of the game.

[jim mk2]

30 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

We'd have gone down with the Walkers and Allardyce eventually anyway. Not even he would have been able to keep us up with no budget.

Venky's did however hasten the process massively with their initial decision making.

What was required at the time was a better manager than Allardyce which was well within Venky's means at the time.

Known unknowns presented as fact in the first sentence. Who knows what would have happened if the Walkers had been unable to sell?

It was clearly beyond Venky's means to appoint a "better manager" because they hadn't a clue what they were getting in to. They didn't even adhere to the maxim of "if it ain't broke don't fix it".

Allardyce with Venky's money to spend would have been the best scenario of all

 

 

[chaddyrovers]

59 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Had that happened, then Kean could have come in sooner and got us relegated a season earlier.

Where Venkys in talks to even buy the club at that time. Not so sure of that but Kean might not had even been at the club if the new manager had sack him. 

Doesn't stop the fact that summer Allardyce wanted to quit the club for a Middle East Club. Simple as

21 minutes ago, Mercer said:

Think Wilder in danger of thinking he's 'too big' - a number of clubs are understood to have had a nibble including us, WBA and Forest. 

Forest never made a move for Wilder from what I understand. Cooper was their 1st choice and he fits in with the New CEO Dane Murphy statistical approach, younger players approach and bringing through Young players. 

Wilder held talks with WBA sporting director Luke Dowling but then their owner/CEO stop it and sacked Downing and appointed Ismael from Barnsley instead

[Gav]

1 hour ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Come off it Gav. 

I know our unexpectedly good start and Hughton's demise at Forest fits perfectly with your "no-one could possibly manage the Club as well as Mowbray routine" but to call Neill an abject failure is simply wrong.

He did at least as well as Mowbray if not better on a fraction of the budget at Preston. Yet you call Neill an abject failure whilst depicting Mowbray as doing the best he possibly can.

 

The only thing that fits perfectly well with my opinion and views is we need to get rid of the owners, you'll catch on one day Rev.

Wilder is a manager that gets the blood going, but he's way beyond the abilities of Waggot and Venkys, I'd be surprised if they even know he's on the market we're that far dumbed down these days.

As for Neill, he's just been sacked from Preston.......I'll let that settle in for a minute, Preston........Abject failure in anyone's book, is that actually the height of your ambition Rev?

[Gav]

1 hour ago, Mercer said:

Think Wilder in danger of thinking he's 'too big' - a number of clubs are understood to have had a nibble including us, WBA and Forest. 

Forest only had one target and they got him - Steve Cooper.

[chaddyrovers]

1 minute ago, Gav said:

Forest only had one target and they got him - Steve Cooper.

article in the Athletic and thats posted in the Championship thread back that up

[Jimmy612]

1 hour ago, RevidgeBlue said:

What was required at the time was a better manager than Allardyce which was well within Venky's means at the time.

😂😂😂

11 years and 9 managers later.... seems some still haven't learnt their lesson. 

[chaddyrovers]

4 minutes ago, Jimmy612 said:

😂😂😂

11 years and 9 managers later.... seems some still haven't learnt their lesson. 

And still people forget or want to ignore that the same Allardyce wanted out of Rovers that summer for a Middle East club? 

[oldjamfan1]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

And still people forget or want to ignore that the same Allardyce wanted out of Rovers that summer for a Middle East club? 

He’s only saying that now to save face Chaddy. Had the Vs stumped up the cash for signings at the point of takeover he would have been happy to stay. It was the Walker Trust he was pissed off at

[chaddyrovers]

11 minutes ago, oldjamfan1 said:

He’s only saying that now to save face Chaddy. Had the Vs stumped up the cash for signings at the point of takeover he would have been happy to stay. It was the Walker Trust he was pissed off at

I knew that summer he wanted out for a middle East as the media reported it. John Williams later that summer confirmed it. So it wasn't about saving face at all

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/9007986.allardyce-i-wanted-quit-blackburn-rovers/

He wanted out of Rovers long before Venkys turned up. His own biography backs this up.

Edited September 21, 2021 by chaddyrovers

[tomphil]

1 hour ago, Gav said:

The only thing that fits perfectly well with my opinion and views is we need to get rid of the owners, you'll catch on one day Rev.

Wilder is a manager that gets the blood going, but he's way beyond the abilities of Waggot and Venkys, I'd be surprised if they even know he's on the market we're that far dumbed down these days.

As for Neill, he's just been sacked from Preston.......I'll let that settle in for a minute, Preston........Abject failure in anyone's book, is that actually the height of your ambition Rev?

Neils Preston finished above Mowbrays Rovers every season he was there. Handing out a few beatings in the process. The guy also got Norwich promoted to the Prem well within the last decade not when adam was a lad.

He must have something about him and is easily in the same bracket as Mowbray, better in fact going off those stats.  

At end the day the Bowyers, Lamberts, Neils and Mowbrays are all in that middle rung of gaffers.  Sometimes the dice just needs rolling so he'd be far from the worst choice to land on.

[Mercer]

1 hour ago, tomphil said:

Neils Preston finished above Mowbrays Rovers every season he was there. Handing out a few beatings in the process. The guy also got Norwich promoted to the Prem well within the last decade not when adam was a lad.

He must have something about him and is easily in the same bracket as Mowbray, better in fact going off those stats.  

At end the day the Bowyers, Lamberts, Neils and Mowbrays are all in that middle rung of gaffers.  Sometimes the dice just needs rolling so he'd be far from the worst choice to land on.

I think there is much to 'come out in the wash' and when Mowbray does go, I think there will be some interesting readings!

[roversfan99]

12 minutes ago, Mercer said:

I think there is much to 'come out in the wash' and when Mowbray does go, I think there will be some interesting readings!

Are you going to divulge or is it more cryptic and meaningless speculation?

[K-Hod]

2 hours ago, Mercer said:

I think there is much to 'come out in the wash' and when Mowbray does go, I think there will be some interesting readings!

Is this speculation, or something you’ve heard? I can’t be bothered with carrot dangling and people asking loads of questions, so I’ll save them the job….

[47er]

10 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

How do you know he does?

Even if he does, it doesn't suit him there. His strength is running at players and committing them in the final third. In front of the back 4, he isn't going to dictate games, he leaves gaps in front of the defence and his main strength is totally subdued.

He's a number 10.

[roversfan99]

15 minutes ago, 47er said:

He's a number 10.

Number 10 is certainly a more suitable position compared to where he is now. I would play him there too.

Edited September 21, 2021 by roversfan99

[Gav]

13 hours ago, tomphil said:

Neils Preston finished above Mowbrays Rovers every season he was there. Handing out a few beatings in the process. The guy also got Norwich promoted to the Prem well within the last decade not when adam was a lad.

He must have something about him and is easily in the same bracket as Mowbray, better in fact going off those stats.  

At end the day the Bowyers, Lamberts, Neils and Mowbrays are all in that middle rung of gaffers.  Sometimes the dice just needs rolling so he'd be far from the worst choice to land on.

Neil joined Norwich in January 2015, they'd been relegated the season before having spent 3 years in the top flight, they were flush with Premiership money and had good players on big wages. They went up through the playoffs in May 15 and came straight back down again.

Thats his only achievement to date, hardly spectacular really when you put it into context. The first time he had to manage with limited resources he failed at Preston, why would he flourish here?

Don't get me wrong tomphil, I understand the sentiment, I agree with you in the main, but if anyone is going to push this club forward it needs to be someone with a proven track record, or someone leftfield, not a manager like Neil who has just failed miserably 10 miles down the road.

 

[Mattyblue]

I’m non plussed either way with AN, largely because well, not sure he’s markedly any better and it’s all moot as he won’t be coming here once TM signs a new deal, but not sure how having a club with one of the lowest budgets in the league finishing 7th, 13th, 9th, 14th in his full seasons is ‘failing miserably’.

Edited September 22, 2021 by Mattyblue

[1864roverite]

15 hours ago, Gav said:

As for Neill, he's just been sacked from Preston.......I'll let that settle in for a minute, Preston........Abject failure in anyone's book, is that actually the height of your ambition Rev?

A manager of a Preston team that finished above us and beat us more than we beat them ! (and all with supposedly inferior players!)

[RevidgeBlue]

15 hours ago, Jimmy612 said:

😂😂😂

11 years and 9 managers later.... seems some still haven't learnt their lesson. 

Venky's certainly haven't (yet) a top class manager is almost all that would be needed to transform our fortunes although it has to be said the sheer incompetence of Waggott means that a change of CEO would likely be necessary as well.

[Jimmy612]

17 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Interesting hypothetical, if you offered Allardyce the sort of salary and budget to try and get us promoted that he accepts annually to keep Clubs in the PL, would he take it?

Probably not, as he's already turned that chance down at WBA.

If you offered it to say Hughes, I'd wager you'd get a different response.

Not withstanding the fact Allardyce is 10 years older than Hughes.  In fact, about 10 years ago Allardyce took a fairly similar job... the West Ham one.  Got promoted first time of asking and stabilised them as a PL club again. 

[Jimmy612]

2 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Venky's certainly haven't (yet) a top class manager is almost all that would be needed to transform our fortunes although it has to be said the sheer incompetence of Waggott means that a change of CEO would likely be necessary as well.

Correct, and therein lies the problem.  Wouldn't trust them to find their arse with both hands, never mind a competent manager.  They stumbled upon Mowbray and he's been the best of a really poor bunch.