Tony Mowbray Discussion

[Sparks Rover]

41 minutes ago, islander200 said:

There is absolutely no evidence to support the thought the owners are planning on putting us into admin or selling the club 

If any of that was a remote possibility at this time then they wouldnt be trying to work around ffp by selling the STC.

I'd say its more likely because now if we did go into admin the administrators can't touch the STC and sell it to someone of their choice for a fraction of its value.  We don't own it anymore.....its a sly move from the owners.

[Wheelton Blue]

40 minutes ago, Gav said:

My original point was getting rid of Mowbray and Waggott fixes nothing, the bigger picture must be to get rid of Venkys.

We've changed the manager 9 times in 10yrs, we've changed the CEO probably 5 times, it doesn't work, especially when we're using a small gene pool of washed up dregs owned by 1 agency. 

The longer these owners are here, the more damage they do.

I agree with with what you say re: the owners. They're the one constant in our decline.

I do believe that we can do better than Mowbray though, even with our owners.

[1864roverite]

33 minutes ago, Gav said:

I read what you wrote and now you're rowing back faster than Redgrave and Pinsent.

When Blackburn Rovers 2011 was sold, its was a club sat 11th in Premiership, punching well above its weight, with a boardroom full of footballing people and an experienced manager and very good players. 

2yrs later we had no boardroom structure, we sat firmly in league 1 having sacked many good people that worked day to day at the club, we had crooks filling deep pockets and a visit to the old bailey under our belts.

Are you telling me that was setup for success? I'm telling you that was setup to fail and it did just that.

Rowing back? Give your head a wobble Gav! I am waiting for you to provide tangible evidence that our team and club were deliberately sent out to get themselves relegated out of the league over the course of the season ! That is what you claim I simply dispute it and unless you do so then your argument fails miserably. Never through the history of football has a club gone out simply to achieve relegation it is as simple as that

[Riverside under the drip]

Haven't posted on this thread in a fair while.

My overall perspective remains unchanged. I don't think Mowbray is right for us and we need a new voice in the dressing room. Some of the square pegs stuff is truly mind-blowing. We need ugly, winning personalities like Diouf, Savage or Bellamy more than ever.

HOWEVER...

I, like many others on here, thought that this season would be a real battle to survive. I couldn't see where goals were coming from and thought injuries would see us too fragile at the back. They still might of course but we are waaaaaaaaaaay above where most of us expected right now. Diaz has been a revelation but Gallagher has also chipped in more handily than anticipated.

If we are going to scrape by until the summer with no funds for January then so be it. I still hope that the summer will see Mowbray departing and a hungrier manager with a bit of steel coming in. Major changes are obviously a necessity in terms of players as so many will be off. It makes sense that a new man would be the one to oversee this.

Do I think this is what will happen? Of course not; it's Rovers we're talking about! Mowbray to get a new contract and a fresh set of loans on their way...

Edited November 21, 2021 by Riverside under the drip

[islander200]

42 minutes ago, Sparks Rover said:

I'd say its more likely because now if we did go into admin the administrators can't touch the STC and sell it to someone of their choice for a fraction of its value.  We don't own it anymore.....its a sly move from the owners.

No it isnt the owners could have sold it externally at any time.They own the club and all its assets.

At the time it was done the club needed that money for ffp reasons.

If the owners sell the land on how much are they likely to get for it?I presume with your theory it will be a lot more than the 16.6 million they have already paid for it?

Whats changed from last year when they pulled out of building housing on it due to the locals opposing it?Is it likely housing will be built on that land?

If you can give an answer to these questions then maybe il start believing these nonsencical theories.

Edited November 21, 2021 by islander200

[Gav]

23 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

Rowing back? Give your head a wobble Gav! I am waiting for you to provide tangible evidence that our team and club were deliberately sent out to get themselves relegated out of the league over the course of the season ! That is what you claim I simply dispute it and unless you do so then your argument fails miserably. Never through the history of football has a club gone out simply to achieve relegation it is as simple as that

Exhibit A - The past 10yrs of Venkys control, if you can't join those dots you're not looking hard enough.

[Hasta]

3 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Why would Venkys put the club into administration when most of debt is owed to them? Meaning they get nothing back money wise

If Venkys ever decide they don’t want to put £15mill a year into the club, but no-one is willing to pay money for a business which is losing £15mill a year, what do they do?

And if the club is put into administration in that circumstance, the training ground is conveniently separate.

Edited November 21, 2021 by Hasta

[1864roverite]

22 minutes ago, Gav said:

Exhibit A - The past 10yrs of Venkys control, if you can't join those dots you're not looking hard enough.

That’s not evidence of what you have claimed let’s have it from you otherwise it’s just utter rubbish 

 

[Gav]

12 hours ago, Upside Down said:

That's where we were when the takeover happened, relegation was deliberate and there has been no attempt to get back there.

Unacceptable. 

 

Tony Mowbray is no where near the level of manager we should have. He is a symptom of the ownership. With competen people running thigs we'd have a manager with ambition.

 

6 hours ago, 1864roverite said:

Relegation deliberate ? Don’t be so ridiculous we were relegated because of the incompetent managers at the time 

 

 

10 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

That’s not evidence of what you have claimed let’s have it from you otherwise it’s just utter rubbish 

 

It wasn't me that claimed relegation was deliberate originally, if you can't even recall who you're having the debate with we're struggling 1864.

Edited November 21, 2021 by Gav

[Sparks Rover]

38 minutes ago, islander200 said:

No it isnt the owners could have sold it externally at any time.They own the club and all its assets.

If the club owned the STC and went into admin it would be the first thing the administrator would sell, surely.  Just like Boltons did when they sold Euxton for peanuts to Wigan.  The fact that its no longer owned by the club means that the administrator cannot touch it.

Edited November 21, 2021 by Sparks Rover

[Sparks Rover]

26 minutes ago, Hasta said:

If Venkys ever decide they don’t want to put £15mill a year into the club, but no-one is willing to pay money for a business which is losing £15mill a year, what do they do?

And if the club is put into administration in that circumstance, the training ground is conveniently separate.

That what I'm trying to say @islander200

[booth]

1 hour ago, Gav said:

I read what you wrote and now you're rowing back faster than Redgrave and Pinsent.

When Blackburn Rovers 2011 was sold, its was a club sat 11th in Premiership, punching well above its weight, with a boardroom full of footballing people and an experienced manager and very good players. 

2yrs later we had no boardroom structure, we sat firmly in league 1 having sacked many good people that worked day to day at the club, we had crooks filling deep pockets and a visit to the old bailey under our belts.

Are you telling me that was setup for success? I'm telling you that was setup to fail and it did just that.

 

1 hour ago, 1864roverite said:

Rowing back? Give your head a wobble Gav! I am waiting for you to provide tangible evidence that our team and club were deliberately sent out to get themselves relegated out of the league over the course of the season ! That is what you claim I simply dispute it and unless you do so then your argument fails miserably. Never through the history of football has a club gone out simply to achieve relegation it is as simple as that

As I see it two individuals were set up to succeed as a result of the takeover. Was relegation deliberate? It certainly wasn't a hindrance to either of them in terms of becoming much more wealthier. And that's that.

[islander200]

32 minutes ago, Sparks Rover said:

If the club owned the STC and went into admin it would be the first thing the administrator would sell, surely.  Just like Boltons did when they sold Euxton for peanuts to Wigan.  The fact that its no longer owned by the club means that the administrator cannot touch it.

Yes but they have just paid 16.6 million into the club for it.For it to be something underhand i presume the owners would be making a significant profit on that 16.6 million if they were to sell it on?

[chaddyrovers]

1 hour ago, Hasta said:

If Venkys ever decide they don’t want to put £15mill a year into the club, but no-one is willing to pay money for a business which is losing £15mill a year, what do they do?

And if the club is put into administration in that circumstance, the training ground is conveniently separate.

They have spent over 200 million on Rovers and don't see to want to leave or sell. Plus just bought the training ground. 

Rovers don't need to lose 15 million a season if we had a better ticketing policy and prices. Plus sell a key player each season.

[Wheelton Blue]

1 hour ago, Hasta said:

If Venkys ever decide they don’t want to put £15mill a year into the club, but no-one is willing to pay money for a business which is losing £15mill a year, what do they do?

And if the club is put into administration in that circumstance, the training ground is conveniently separate.

They could simply just fold the business; pay off anyone they owe money to and flog what's left.

[Sparks Rover]

1 hour ago, islander200 said:

Yes but they have just paid 16.6 million into the club for it.For it to be something underhand i presume the owners would be making a significant profit on that 16.6 million if they were to sell it on?

But they've not paid the 16.6 to anyone else....just moved it out of the grasp of administrator.  Its irrelevant the figure. Moving fixed assets from one business to the other.  The 16.6 will be paid over a few years or something...they'll have fiddled it believe me.

Edited November 21, 2021 by Sparks Rover

[Hasta]

2 hours ago, Wheelton Blue said:

They could simply just fold the business; pay off anyone they owe money to and flog what's left.

That’s a lot of footballing contracts they would need to pay off though.

[Hasta]

2 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

They have spent over 200 million on Rovers and don't see to want to leave or sell. Plus just bought the training ground. 

Rovers don't need to lose 15 million a season if we had a better ticketing policy and prices. Plus sell a key player each season.

I’m only pointing out that if they decided to put the club into administration (of which there is no real sign that’s on the horizon), the fact they owe most of the debt to themselves is irrelevant. Plus in order to get any money out of it in that scenario, they have now removed the major asset out of the club.

But I agree the annual loss could be managed better with a better management structure. 

Edited November 21, 2021 by Hasta

[Wheelton Blue]

41 minutes ago, Hasta said:

That’s a lot of footballing contracts they would need to pay off though.

Not really. Make everyone redundant.

Edited November 21, 2021 by Wheelton Blue

[Bigdoggsteel]

2 minutes ago, Wheelton Blue said:

Not really. Make everyone redundant.

You have to pay staff to make them redundant and I have never heard of a team making their playing staff redundant

They aren't going anywhere and are continuing to put money in. We might not give them any credit for that, but tis how it is 

[Wheelton Blue]

13 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

You have to pay staff to make them redundant and I have never heard of a team making their playing staff redundant

They aren't going anywhere and are continuing to put money in. We might not give them any credit for that, but tis how it is 

I'm not saying that they would. If fact, I doubt very much that they would.

I'm just saying, in answer to a previous question, that they could.

[Upside Down]

7 hours ago, Riverside under the drip said:

Haven't posted on this thread in a fair while.

My overall perspective remains unchanged. I don't think Mowbray is right for us and we need a new voice in the dressing room. Some of the square pegs stuff is truly mind-blowing. We need ugly, winning personalities like Diouf, Savage or Bellamy more than ever.

HOWEVER...

I, like many others on here, thought that this season would be a real battle to survive. I couldn't see where goals were coming from and thought injuries would see us too fragile at the back. They still might of course but we are waaaaaaaaaaay above where most of us expected right now. Diaz has been a revelation but Gallagher has also chipped in more handily than anticipated.

If we are going to scrape by until the summer with no funds for January then so be it. I still hope that the summer will see Mowbray departing and a hungrier manager with a bit of steel coming in. Major changes are obviously a necessity in terms of players as so many will be off. It makes sense that a new man would be the one to oversee this.

Do I think this is what will happen? Of course not; it's Rovers we're talking about! Mowbray to get a new contract and a fresh set of loans on their way...

That's the nail being hit on the head right there.

[lraC]

8 hours ago, Gav said:

I read what you wrote and now you're rowing back faster than Redgrave and Pinsent.

When Blackburn Rovers 2011 was sold, its was a club sat 11th in Premiership, punching well above its weight, with a boardroom full of footballing people and an experienced manager and very good players. 

2yrs later we had no boardroom structure, we sat firmly in league 1 having sacked many good people that worked day to day at the club, we had crooks filling deep pockets and a visit to the old bailey under our belts.

Are you telling me that was setup for success? I'm telling you that was setup to fail and it did just that.

It could be argued that relegation was not deliberate, but if I set off on a journey of 800 miles with a tank of petrol and no money, chances are my neglect to plan to fill the tank back up, would mean I would not complete my journey. The club was badly neglected by a group of chancers.

[Armchair supporter supremo]

When else would it even be a news worthy story outside of the clubs(hibs in this case) local rag and fan base that a club has signed a new Accedmy coach!

The fact that it got so much publicity is telling enough. 

I couldn't even tell you 1 Accedmy coach of any Premier league club let alone a cruddy spl team (although all spl teams and Scottish professional football in general is absolute 💩 to me) 

Edited November 21, 2021 by Armchair supporter supremo

[47er]

8 hours ago, 1864roverite said:

Rowing back? Give your head a wobble Gav! I am waiting for you to provide tangible evidence that our team and club were deliberately sent out to get themselves relegated out of the league over the course of the season ! That is what you claim I simply dispute it and unless you do so then your argument fails miserably. Never through the history of football has a club gone out simply to achieve relegation it is as simple as that

I notice you have completely ignored 2 posts on Kean's contract! What's your explanation?

Why would a manager be offered a bonus to take his club to the Championship and a further one to Div 1?