Tony Mowbray Discussion

[tomphil]

It needs a high profile decent pedigree named manager to come in after Mowbray and build on the good work he has done. Not an internal promotion, guy from the scrapheap or cheap lower league punt.  We've had all that and the only thing that has really worked under Venkys is someone with real experience ... Mowbray.

Now it is time for the next step and some real pedigree in the form of a guy who can come in and concentrate on the first team and first team only and its budget. Not building football clubs or fighting fires behind the scenes just a bona fide first team manager with the single aim of getting this club vying for promotion.

Anything else is just rinse and repeat.

[davulsukur]

11 minutes ago, K-Hod said:

I’m conflicted with Mowbray.

I'm not.

He's a poor manager. 

His transfer business, overall, has been poor. He's spent big money on poor players and ignored the defence entirely.

Question Mark's over selling our goalkeeper and replacing with a loan, our back up keeper is woeful also.

We have no real style of play, we have a good amount of possession without ever really hurting the opposition and our good moments of play only happen in patches. 

Constantly plays players out of position which is incredibly frustrating. Players like Rothwell seem to be going backwards and Chapman never gets a chance.

Oh, and the stats on us conceding goals are laughable.

Edited October 20, 2019 by davulsukur

[K-Hod]

Just now, davulsukur said:

I'm not.

He's a poor manager. 

His transfer business, overall, has been poor. He's spent big money on poor players and ignored the defence entirely.

Question Mark's over selling our goalkeeper and replacing with a loan, our back up keeper is woeful also.

We have no real style of play, we have a good amount of possession without ever really hurting the opposition and our good moments of play only happen in patches. 

Constantly plays players out of position which is incredibly frustrating. Players like Rothwell seem to be going backwards and Chapman never gets a chance.

Oh, and the stats on us conceding goals are laughable.

To be fair, quoting one line from quite a long post takes it somewhat out of context....

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

and still wouldn't have come. Rovers don't pay big wages. simple as. 

Tho the 12 million pounds should have spent much better. We should have bought a centre back over the last 3 windows. Webster was available at Ipswich before he moved to Bristol City then Brighton. Or John Egan last summer. Even this summer we could have got Jansson or Hector or many free transfers that was available

have you watch the training sessions Mercer? 

you constantly slagged Mowbray off but then back us to win everytime

Are you still of the opinion that you want the manager out?

[Hasta]

I'd now vote to sack Mowbray.  But before I do I want legislation passing which ensures the same funding for players which Mowbray has had continues on to the next manager, and that the next manager must have had a promotion on his CV in the last 6 years. 

In those circumstances, and following inevitable events at Preston next week, I'd vote for him to be out by October 31st.

[davulsukur]

49 minutes ago, K-Hod said:

To be fair, quoting one line from quite a long post takes it somewhat out of context....

It can do but I just meant there is no conflict with me with him.

 

I wasnt meaning to take anything out of context.

 

Edited October 20, 2019 by davulsukur

[chaddyrovers]

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

Are you still of the opinion that you want the manager out?

The question is much bigger than just sacking Mowbray for me. cos I want a plan in place like

1. who would pick the next manager? Will it just be Waggott

2. how they would do that whether advertise it for a couple of weeks and interview 4 or 5 of the best candidates for job, or have someone line up before we sack him? 

3. what type of structure are we going to have when a manager one or Sporting Director/head Coach(Which I would prefer) like Norwich and Villa have

4. Are we going to look for British head coach or foreign one

I would appreciated anyy feedback you have suggestions/post or answers. Thanks

3 hours ago, K-Hod said:

I’m conflicted with Mowbray. He’s obviously a nice bloke and the promotion season from league one was a great one (though we should never have been there in the first place). 

He’s done a lot of good for the club since coming here.

But increasingly, especially recently, he’s losing it.

He infuriates me with some of the decisions he makes.

What was the point in signing Chapman if he’s being wasted in the under 23s, when we are crying out for a player of that ilk?

Why was Bennett playing at left back yesterday?

Why does he play at right back over Nyambe?

Why does he play so many players out of position? 

Why are some players seemingly immune to being dropped for having poor games, but others are dropped for the exact same thing? 

Why have we spent £7 Million on Brereton without ever really picking him?

Why did we sign Sam Gallagher for so much money when he seldom scores? 

Why say defenders are coming, then fail to sign enough, leaving us short?

 

I feel like that about Mowbray as I feel like he done so much for this club and rebuilt it after the Coyle mess

But he needs to question on the Brereton(who I think Mowbray has mismanaged) and Gallagher when we could have used the money better. For example this summer instead of signing Gallagher we could have sign the experience keeper and centre back we needed plus a right back. 

why did it take all summer to get rid of Mulgrew? it should have been one of the 1st decision he should have made. 

I think it was clear why Bennett played left back yesterday with 3 left backs all injured.

Cos Chapman as been poor in the under 23's according to regular watches of under 23's. Rankin Costello has been performed every time. I would have brought him on yesterday

Edited October 20, 2019 by chaddyrovers

[J*B]

Is it time to take this back to the vote..?

[DE.]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

why did it take all summer to get rid of Mulgrew? it should have been one of the 1st decision he should have made. 

I firmly believe that was a last second decision, made because we either desperately needed to free up funds to bring in Cunningham or because Mulgrew and Mowbray had a falling out of some kind. It makes no sense to me otherwise to let our captain leave on loan in the final minutes of the window to a divisional rival with no replacement. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, J*B said:

Is it time to take this back to the vote..?

I'm still puzzled as to why it was removed in the first place.

[rigger]

Well it wasn’t clear to me why Bennett was played at left back. I would have thought a better formation would have been 3 centre-halves.Bennet right-wingback, Downing left-wingback

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, J*B said:

Is it time to take this back to the vote..?

Not for me. Dont see why we one. 

I think the question is too simple but @Stuart thread on the club ambition is a very good thread and asking some good questions and some excellent points. Well done Stuart ?

[JHRover]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

The question is much bigger than just sacking Mowbray for me. cos I want a plan in place like

1. who would pick the next manager? Will it just be Waggott

2. how they would do that whether advertise it for a couple of weeks and interview 4 or 5 of the best candidates for job, or have someone line up before we sack him? 

3. what type of structure are we going to have when a manager one or Sporting Director/head Coach(Which I would prefer) like Norwich and Villa have

4. Are we going to look for British head coach or foreign one

I would appreciated anyy feedback you have suggestions/post or answers. Thanks

I feel like that about Mowbray as I feel like he done so much for this club and rebuilt it after the Coyle mess

But he needs to question on the Brereton(who I think Mowbray has mismanaged) and Gallagher when we could have used the money better. For example this summer instead of signing Gallagher we could have sign the experience keeper and centre back we needed plus a right back. 

why did it take all summer to get rid of Mulgrew? it should have been one of the 1st decision he should have made. 

I think it was clear why Bennett played left back yesterday with 3 left backs all injured.

Cos Chapman as been poor in the under 23's according to regular watches of under 23's. Rankin Costello has been performed every time. I would have brought him on yesterday

At a club with serious ambitions and a determination to achieve those ambitions the first choice is on the structure.

Traditional manager or 'head coach' with a director of football above him. Either way can work, but a decision needs to be made and then every effort to make that structure work needs to made. In our position with clueless owners on the other side of the world I firmly believe our best and probably only chance of putting in place a winning structure is with a director of football with a track record of expertise in that position elsewhere leading the operation, acting as the link between owners and team. That person would be given a target, run with a budget, request extra funds, hire and fire coaches, sanction transfers in conjunction with his chosen head coach. 

The old school manager running everything can still work - Dyche at Burnley - but it is becoming less common - and even he works with a Sporting Director to delegate work out. They also have owners and a board in the local area who know a bit about football. 

One thing is for sure you do not 'advertise' the position of manager. At any given time the powers that be should have a rough list of individuals in mind to approach in the event a replacement is needed. The minute a decision is made to make a change those people are contacted and things go from there. Sitting around waiting for applicants and then working out which to offer interviews for is amateurish stuff but seemingly not far off what we were doing after Lambert quit and Cheston was talking to the likes of Russell Slade and Warren Joyce. 

There is no room for sentiment in this game. We've had good out of Mowbray in bouncing us straight back and stabilising us last season. He's had a good salary, 2.5 years of employment and has rebuilt his reputation at a time when he was finished at this level before we gave him a chance. So the events of 2017-18 and even 2018-19 really shouldn't count for much other than concerning league form going back to November/December last year.

I think it is quite clear now that the decision to release Mulgrew was a last minute attempt to free up funds on wages so we could bring in a couple on deadline day. The move clearly wasn't on the horizon even as we kicked off v Charlton and Mulgrew was captain. In the end we got Cunningham on loan who is now out for the season whilst Mulgrew has just kept a clean sheet for Wigan - i think time will show this to be another poor decision in a long line of poor decisions made here. 

Correct. Chapman has in the main been poor in the u23s. I'm not going to speculate on potential reasons why. In the end it doesn't matter. Fact is it is another signing made by this manager that hasn't yet worked out and hasn't seen any meaningful contribution to the team. Another waste. 

[davulsukur]

10 minutes ago, DE. said:

I firmly believe that was a last second decision, made because we either desperately needed to free up funds to bring in Cunningham or because Mulgrew and Mowbray had a falling out of some kind. It makes no sense to me otherwise to let our captain leave on loan in the final minutes of the window to a divisional rival with no replacement. 

Has to be one or the other.

Possibly both.

[arbitro]

4 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

I heard no anger towards Mowbray yesterday from my seat in the Blackburn End. Do you? 

Have you not seen @OldEwoodBlue posts last week?

I think Coleman suggest Kean to Big Sam and I think some fans would have problem with him over that

Hughton has turned down 2 manager jobs this season including Sheff Wed and Stoke who both would pay bigger wages than us. So why would he come here? 

I didn't say there was anger. I was implying there should be, that he gets an easy ride.

[Leonard Venkhater]

Just now, arbitro said:

I didn't say there was anger. I was implying there should be, that he gets an easy ride.

Anger is coming!

[Mattyblue]

Anger? No, but far more grumbling about him in the second half and at full time then I’d ever heard before.

That is usually a sign of a fan base beginning to turn.

[Rogerb]

Until the spine of this team is sorted out there's little prospect of progress. He's had 32 months to sort it out and we are a long way off.

[roversfan99]

41 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

The question is much bigger than just sacking Mowbray for me. cos I want a plan in place like

1. who would pick the next manager? Will it just be Waggott

2. how they would do that whether advertise it for a couple of weeks and interview 4 or 5 of the best candidates for job, or have someone line up before we sack him? 

3. what type of structure are we going to have when a manager one or Sporting Director/head Coach(Which I would prefer) like Norwich and Villa have

4. Are we going to look for British head coach or foreign one

I would appreciated anyy feedback you have suggestions/post or answers. Thanks

I feel like that about Mowbray as I feel like he done so much for this club and rebuilt it after the Coyle mess

But he needs to question on the Brereton(who I think Mowbray has mismanaged) and Gallagher when we could have used the money better. For example this summer instead of signing Gallagher we could have sign the experience keeper and centre back we needed plus a right back. 

why did it take all summer to get rid of Mulgrew? it should have been one of the 1st decision he should have made. 

I think it was clear why Bennett played left back yesterday with 3 left backs all injured.

Cos Chapman as been poor in the under 23's according to regular watches of under 23's. Rankin Costello has been performed every time. I would have brought him on yesterday

Your questions are in the main irrelevant to my question of do YOU want Mowbray out. Who will choose is irrelevant, if its left to Waggott he will keep his mate Mowbray in, I want you to choose what you want. Do you want Mowbray out? If yes, who would be your number 1 choice as manager?

I dont see the need to box off whether he is British or not either. We shouldnt only focus on one or the other, our choice should simply be the best man for the job, not the best nationality.

Agreed on the failure of the Brereton and Gallagher signings. We currently cant defend and lack a goalscorer. With 12m you would think some would be allocated to each problem area. As he has blown it all up top, you would think he could have at least solved that problem area. As it is, he has signed 2 total duds which is unforgivable.

We saw yesterday who is the natural full back, and who is the senior player and managers favourite who was given a torrid time, lost his bearings for the penalty, sadly we know who will start in that position when we have someone for LB. As it is, even now I would go Downing left, Nyambe right.

Chapman is a weird one, scored again midweek, was up for player of the month last month, I know I am speaking from an ignorant position having not attended but I struggle to accept he has been as bad as people say.

[tomphil]

Frustration is building even some of those on twitter and FB who usually jump straight on any form of questioning the gaffer are now asking what the hell is he playing at.

Like iv'e said before this fella could confuse Einstein with some of the piddling about he does weekly with the team and subs so it's no wonder we often look so disjointed. Yesterday was a great example of what's really wrong here, he came up with something a bit different with the team and it looked like a good idea. Some good stuff played for a period but as soon as the other side get to grips with it or suss it out we are straight back in our shells and of course we ship poor goals again. 30 odd different plan A's but no real plan B so it nearly always ends up resembling the same thing.

On another note why does Mulgrew look so comfortable and committed in the Wigan back line than he ended up being here ?

Edited October 20, 2019 by tomphil

[arbitro]

16 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Anger? No, but far more grumbling about him in the second half and at full time then I’d ever heard before.

That is usually a sign of a fan base beginning to turn.

On the bus going to the game yesterday we never spoke once about the impending game at all which I think is symptomatic of the fact that interest in Rovers is on the wane. The was lots of grumbling in the JW Upper where I sit particularly with his unfathomable substitutions particularly taking Holtby off. 

I really think the club is coming to a crossroads and a big decision needs to be made.

[chaddyrovers]

45 minutes ago, JHRover said:

At a club with serious ambitions and a determination to achieve those ambitions the first choice is on the structure.

Traditional manager or 'head coach' with a director of football above him. Either way can work, but a decision needs to be made and then every effort to make that structure work needs to made. In our position with clueless owners on the other side of the world I firmly believe our best and probably only chance of putting in place a winning structure is with a director of football with a track record of expertise in that position elsewhere leading the operation, acting as the link between owners and team. That person would be given a target, run with a budget, request extra funds, hire and fire coaches, sanction transfers in conjunction with his chosen head coach. 

The old school manager running everything can still work - Dyche at Burnley - but it is becoming less common - and even he works with a Sporting Director to delegate work out. They also have owners and a board in the local area who know a bit about football. 

One thing is for sure you do not 'advertise' the position of manager. At any given time the powers that be should have a rough list of individuals in mind to approach in the event a replacement is needed. The minute a decision is made to make a change those people are contacted and things go from there. Sitting around waiting for applicants and then working out which to offer interviews for is amateurish stuff but seemingly not far off what we were doing after Lambert quit and Cheston was talking to the likes of Russell Slade and Warren Joyce. 

There is no room for sentiment in this game. We've had good out of Mowbray in bouncing us straight back and stabilising us last season. He's had a good salary, 2.5 years of employment and has rebuilt his reputation at a time when he was finished at this level before we gave him a chance. So the events of 2017-18 and even 2018-19 really shouldn't count for much other than concerning league form going back to November/December last year.

 

I agree with your comment that the structure need sorting at the club and I would prefer Scouting Director with head coach below him. I look at how successful its been at Norwich, Villa, Brentford and its something I would like to see us. Obviously you need the right Sporting Director to be appoint to right head coach. I agree with the second paragraph. I would look at someone like Brentford Sporting Director Philip Giles or someone like Andy Scott who was Watford Sporting Director last season now at Swansea as head of recruitment

Isn't Mike Rigg there at Burnley? 

I'm just trying to remember who we interviewed after Lambert. Wasn't it Neil Warnock and Neil Redfearn aswell? 

Good Post JHRover

Just now, roversfan99 said:

Your questions are in the main irrelevant to my question of do YOU want Mowbray out. Who will choose is irrelevant, if its left to Waggott he will keep his mate Mowbray in, I want you to choose what you want. Do you want Mowbray out? If yes, who would be your number 1 choice as manager?

I dont see the need to box off whether he is British or not either. We shouldnt only focus on one or the other, our choice should simply be the best man for the job, not the best nationality.

Agreed on the failure of the Brereton and Gallagher signings. We currently cant defend and lack a goalscorer. With 12m you would think some would be allocated to each problem area. As he has blown it all up top, you would think he could have at least solved that problem area. As it is, he has signed 2 total duds which is unforgivable.

Chapman is a weird one, scored again midweek, was up for player of the month last month, I know I am speaking from an ignorant position having not attended but I struggle to accept he has been as bad as people say.

I'm sorry to say this but what I posted was all relevant and look at JHRover reply talking about structure and what we need here. 

I have repeating spoken about us having a sporting director/head coach structure at the club. 

I have told you that Damien Johnson would be my 1st choice at the minute but I have spoken about other people I would interview. Would you like my List? I have been impressed by Forest head coach Sabri Lamouchi so far and they will be other foreign coaches who could be good choices. 

I would suggest you go and watch the under 23's games then cos several people have told you the same thing. 

[roversfan99]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

I agree with your comment that the structure need sorting at the club and I would prefer Scouting Director with head coach below him. I look at how successful its been at Norwich, Villa, Brentford and its something I would like to see us. Obviously you need the right Sporting Director to be appoint to right head coach. I agree with the second paragraph. I would look at someone like Brentford Sporting Director Philip Giles or someone like Andy Scott who was Watford Sporting Director last season now at Swansea as head of recruitment

Isn't Mike Rigg there at Burnley? 

I'm just trying to remember who we interviewed after Lambert. Wasn't it Neil Warnock and Neil Redfearn aswell? 

Good Post JHRover

I'm sorry to say this but what I posted was all relevant and look at JHRover reply talking about structure and what we need here. 

I have repeating spoken about us having a sporting director/head coach structure at the club. 

I have told you that Damien Johnson would be my 1st choice at the minute but I have spoken about other people I would interview. Would you like my List? I have been impressed by Forest head coach Sabri Lamouchi so far and they will be other foreign coaches who could be good choices. 

I would suggest you go and watch the under 23's games then cos several people have told you the same thing. 

Simple question, Mowbray out, yes or no.

[chaddyrovers]

1 hour ago, arbitro said:

I didn't say there was anger. I was implying there should be, that he gets an easy ride.

I think alot of fans will back him until the end. 

Like I said I'm torn cos I really grateful for the job he done here and how he rebuilt the fanbase and club together but I wanted promotion this season or next. 

31 minutes ago, arbitro said:

On the bus going to the game yesterday we never spoke once about the impending game at all which I think is symptomatic of the fact that interest in Rovers is on the wane. The was lots of grumbling in the JW Upper where I sit particularly with his unfathomable substitutions particularly taking Holtby off. 

I really think the club is coming to a crossroads and a big decision needs to be made.

I agree on the Holtby sub and I think taking Downing off aswell. I understand the Travis one cos it felt like he was going to another booking

[chaddyrovers]

9 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Simple question, Mowbray out, yes or no.

Clearly you haven't read a thing I've posted today on this thread. 

It isn't simple as yes or no questions cos of the number of reasons I've posted. Please read the number of posts I've done in this thread today then you don't ask me the question you did.