Oldham

[Stuart]

19 minutes ago, DE. said:

Nothing wrong with having a few versatile players in your team, but when you try to make the whole team into versatile jacks of all trades it just weakens everybody.

That’s the thing. In isolation Bennett at right back whilst not ideal would be tolerable if everyone else was a square peg in a round hole. Or even a right winger to frighten their full back to the point of doubling up. Playing Gallagher or even Rothwell in front of Bennett means another player out of their natural position and blunts their potential attacking threat because the need to be more defensive minded.

[USABlue]

I am certain Brereton's renewed follies are a direct result of mowbary confidence crushing and motivation deflating.  After an effective ore season when chasing a game Mowbary leaves him on the bench for a young mid fielder.  Done BB's head right in did that.I bet.

[stinny1]

How much protection  dose a right or left  back get from  a stricker playing has a winger . For me the last thing a striker wants too do when he loses the ball his to get back in and defend  . If a winger plays there he's frist  reaction  when out of ball his to tuck in and double up and stop the crosses . Thats one of the reason why we are letting in so many goals. The orther thing i don't  like his the way we back off and let teams have a free go at goal. We should be pressing  has a team from the back too front and it would make us hard too play through but i can't  see Tony doing it

[DE.]

5 minutes ago, Stuart said:

That’s the thing. In isolation Bennett at right back whilst not ideal would be tolerable if everyone else was a square peg in a round hole. Or even a right winger to frighten their full back to the point of doubling up. Playing Gallagher or even Rothwell in front of Bennett means another player out of their natural position and blunts their potential attacking threat because the need to be more defensive minded.

Honestly, I can't remember a manager who ever thought playing strikers on the wing was the ticket to success. Granted there are gaps in my footballing knowledge, but in modern times has there been any manager who has consistently played forwards on the wing rather than just bringing in recognised wide midfielders or wingers to do the job? It's one of the most baffling parts of Mowbray's mindset and despite underwhelming results for two years now he still persists with it. I figured at least even Mowbray had the sense to know Graham can't play out wide, the one striker who had never been put there, but then Tuesday night against Oldham happens. It's so bizarre that I just can't find any logical reason for it.

[bazza]

I feel sorry for BB. If he had gone to PNE he would have been banging the goals in regularly, now, working for a proper manager. TM has destroyed him as he seems to be destroying others like Nyambe and Rothwell.

Also, looking at the Oldham highlights, it's obvious to me that his heel got badly clipped.

[Stuart]

2 minutes ago, bazza said:

I feel sorry for BB. If he had gone to PNE he would have been banging the goals in regularly, now, working for a proper manager. TM has destroyed him as he seems to be destroying others like Nyambe and Rothwell.

Also, looking at the Oldham highlights, it's obvious to me that his heel got badly clipped.

It was right in front of us Bazza. He was too far out and knew he was never going to make it so he went down.

[callumrovers]

Did anyone notice Smallwoods reaction last night when he got subbed? Went off at the far side of the pitch, walked around at very slow pace and then straight down the tunnel. Was not happy at all.

Edited August 14, 2019 by callumrovers

[blondie]

Just now, callumrovers said:

Did anyone notice Smallwoods reaction last night when he got subbed? Went off at the far side of the pitch, walked around at very slow pace and then straight down the tunnel. Was not happy at all.

New rule now on subs, must leave pitch by nearest touchline.Tugay would not be amused.

[callumrovers]

Just now, blondie said:

New rule now on subs, must leave pitch by nearest touchline.Tugay would not be amused.

Didnt know that. Still think he was f*cked off. Straight down the tunnel...

[bazza]

Just now, Stuart said:

It was right in front of us Bazza. He was too far out and knew he was never going to make it so he went down.

I've just watched it over and over and I'm not convinced. If he dived, why did the ref not book him? His heel was clipped.

[DaveyB]

3 hours ago, Blue blood said:

The Graham as a left winger tactic is the oddest thing and the biggest sign he is losing it imo. All his other decisions are bad and wrong but not so left field (pardon the pun) as to be madness. 

The centre back situation is stupid - especially with Lenihen's record - but there is a very miniscule chance no more than one CB gets injured. (Actually I don't think there is on reflection but it is theoretically possible that the injuries won't coincide.) 

Bennett has played a couple of games at RB as cover before so whilst appalling again there is a bit of previous - it's not totally new. Again, you'd like to thing performances and more than the occasional game there would factor into the decision but still. 

Graham at left mid though? Why? We've a few players who can play there instead. Graham has to my knowledge never played there before. His main ability is his areal prowess and holding up the ball. He has no pace and isn't really creative. Graham has been great foil for the person in the hole role. So why on earth randomly stick him on the wing, nullifying his strengths, highlighting his weaknesses in a complely new position. At best it is an experiment. But with the raft of players who can play left mid and a host of strikers more suited than Graham to left mid (although not that suited at all, just better than Graham) and Graham being our best target man what's the point in the experiment? It's the most inappropriate badly thought through idea since... Well since the 3 centre backs only idea. This isn't bad judgement but plain stupidity. 

You keep making this claim about Graham playing on the left wing, but he didn't. He was up front with Brereton - Buckley and Downing were the wide players, albeit tucked in with Nyambe and Cunningham overlapping.

Graham played slightly to the left, with Brereton to the right, but they were essentially a front two. He certainly wasn't playing as a left winger, or left mid - I just don't know why you seem to think he was

[Blue blood]

Just now, DaveyB said:

You keep making this claim about Graham playing on the left wing, but he didn't. He was up front with Brereton - Buckley and Downing were the wide players, albeit tucked in with Nyambe and Cunningham overlapping.

Graham played slightly to the left, with Brereton to the right, but they were essentially a front two. He certainly wasn't playing as a left winger, or left mid - I just don't know why you seem to think he was

A number of posters at the match say that's where he began playing in the first half before later moving inside to be a two with Bereton later on. If he didn't (although several posters were said that he was) then I'm glad because that would be utter madness. 

Still doesn't change the fact he losing the plot albeit I would be slightly less worried if such a clanger wasn't made. 

[Ozz]

18 minutes ago, DaveyB said:

You keep making this claim about Graham playing on the left wing, but he didn't. He was up front with Brereton - Buckley and Downing were the wide players, albeit tucked in with Nyambe and Cunningham overlapping.

Graham played slightly to the left, with Brereton to the right, but they were essentially a front two. He certainly wasn't playing as a left winger, or left mid - I just don't know why you seem to think he was

Correct.

[AllRoverAsia]

37 minutes ago, bazza said:

I've just watched it over and over and I'm not convinced. If he dived, why did the ref not book him? His heel was clipped.

He dived or his feet are too big and he just fell over as he is so clumsy. He knew he had made a useless first touch and was not going to win the foot race.

I think if Brereton had appealed for a foul then the Ref would have done him for diving.

How did he miss that earlier cross? 

I know its bad when I feel sorry for the player.

He's also not lucky in front of goal, if he could just fluke one it may help him get going.

Having said that and whilst I blame Mowbray for any lack of development I have to say Brereton looks an awful prospect.

[Atko's Engine]

A few of my of observations from comments & highlights.

We cannot play Evans & Smallwood together ever again. One or both need shipping out by hook or by crook, with a "thanks for your service" in Smallwood's case and a "well that's been a waste of talent" in Evans' case. 

Grayson sounds the more promising of the two CBs, but made an awful error for Oldham's second goal. Boy we need to cut out individual schoolboy errors in defence.

Cunningham sounds promising.

Buckley is not ready for first team football, too lightweight.

Downing needs not to play on the right. He looks like he's determined to succeed here though, his reaction to scoring was pleasing.

Nyambe needs game time at RB to get his confidence, same with BB as striker who needs a fluke to get going. But its doubtful they'll get that without injuries to Bennett or Gallagher.

Dack and Graham are immense for us, but i do agree with TM that we do need to find a way to move on from the "get it to Graham to knock down for Dack" approach, even though it worked again last night. We need more fluency, incisiveness & variety in our approach play. Rothwell & Chapman key to that.

I don't think we can or should read too much into that game. Wholesale personnel changes (like most managers) render that pointless. But the never-give-up attitude is nice to see, people bemoaning a lack of late goals from us should be pleased.

Other Champs teams struggled last night, we were not alone. And since time immemorial we've struggled in this type of game against inferior opposition. Think at home to Crewe Alex years ago or, even worse, Trelleborgs... (sorry to remind folk).

We got the win; move on, huge game on Sat against a demoralised Boro, let's show our mettle against them & get 3 points.

[Bbrovers2288]

1 hour ago, Atko's Engine said:

A few of my of observations from comments & highlights.

We cannot play Evans & Smallwood together ever again. One or both need shipping out by hook or by crook, with a "thanks for your service" in Smallwood's case and a "well that's been a waste of talent" in Evans' case. 

Grayson sounds the more promising of the two CBs, but made an awful error for Oldham's second goal. Boy we need to cut out individual schoolboy errors in defence.

Cunningham sounds promising.

Buckley is not ready for first team football, too lightweight.

Downing needs not to play on the right. He looks like he's determined to succeed here though, his reaction to scoring was pleasing.

Nyambe needs game time at RB to get his confidence, same with BB as striker who needs a fluke to get going. But its doubtful they'll get that without injuries to Bennett or Gallagher.

Dack and Graham are immense for us, but i do agree with TM that we do need to find a way to move on from the "get it to Graham to knock down for Dack" approach, even though it worked again last night. We need more fluency, incisiveness & variety in our approach play. Rothwell & Chapman key to that.

I don't think we can or should read too much into that game. Wholesale personnel changes (like most managers) render that pointless. But the never-give-up attitude is nice to see, people bemoaning a lack of late goals from us should be pleased.

Other Champs teams struggled last night, we were not alone. And since time immemorial we've struggled in this type of game against inferior opposition. Think at home to Crewe Alex years ago or, even worse, Trelleborgs... (sorry to remind folk).

We got the win; move on, huge game on Sat against a demoralised Boro, let's show our mettle against them & get 3 points.

Trelleborg, gee thanks for reminding me of that one. One of only two nights I was deeply hurt by a rovers defeat 

[Exiled in Toronto]

17 hours ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

Trelleborg, gee thanks for reminding me of that one. One of only two nights I was deeply hurt by a rovers defeat 

Only two? Jeez. How about almost every cup tie against Div 1 teams and Boxing Day home games in the 70/80s, the replayed Chesterfield game, Sheffield Weds home semi-final, Sheffield Utd home quarter final, Man Yoo 94/95....

[Vinjay]

1 hour ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

Only two? Jeez. How about almost every cup tie against Div 1 teams and Boxing Day home games in the 70/80s, the replayed Chesterfield game, Sheffield Weds home semi-final, Sheffield Utd home quarter final, Man Yoo 94/95....

Pretty much any defeat to that lot though last one strangely enough was one of only positive things that season. Due to performance and not getting a thrashing though I actually suggested fans get the game abandoned for maximum publicity against Venkys. Plus it sealed the end for Coyle though surely that decision had already been made before the game. 

It's strange too that the night of relegation in 1999 at least showed some fight (and didn't help United's title hopes though of course they won it anyway) unlike the Wigan game. 

Edited August 16, 2019 by Vinjay17

[bazza]

The second Chesterfield home game. Yes, that was a real downer for me.

[Bbrovers2288]

13 hours ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

Only two? Jeez. How about almost every cup tie against Div 1 teams and Boxing Day home games in the 70/80s, the replayed Chesterfield game, Sheffield Weds home semi-final, Sheffield Utd home quarter final, Man Yoo 94/95....

More meaning games that I was full of confidence we would win and wanted us to win badly. The Celtic Eufa cup game was the other as I’m from Glasgow and I was wanting bragging rights so bad. Special mention to the Newcastle fa cup defeat replay when Lee Clark broke my heart too