Character (or lack of)

[MarkBRFC]

I saw Rich Sharpe point out a couple of interesting stats over the weekend, and after some digging found some of my own that show the "Character" of Rovers since Tony Mowbray took charge.

•  Rovers haven't scored an injury time equaliser/winner in a league game since Fulham away in March 2017, the only other one in Mowbray's tenure is against Cardiff at Ewood in the same month
• We are yet to score an injury time winner in the league since Mowbray took charge (Last one being in February 2017, under Coyle, against QPR at Ewood)
• We haven't come from behind to win a game since April 2018 against Peterborough
• We have only come from behind to win a game in the league 3 times since Mowbray was appointed, Bristol Rovers home, Peterborough home & away in 17/18.
• In the 58 games since we came from behind to win a game, we have conceded the first goal 25 times, losing 19 of them.
• We haven't come from behind to win a game at this level since November 2016 which was under Coyle, against Brentford.
• The last time we conceded at Ewood park and won was New Years Day last season.

Pretty damning stuff I would say, it generally means that if we go a goal behind, you might aswell go home as this lot aren't getting back into it.

The signings of Cunningham, Downing and Johnson have no doubt helped the side to see games out when we are in front, but the lack of response when we go behind is really concerning and something that needs addressing if we are ever going to improve beyond a lower mid table side.

Edited September 30, 2019 by MarkBRFC

[arbitro]

There are some damming numbers in this well researched post and gives a strong indication that we haven't had enough leaders during Mowbrays tenure. And probably as alarming is the fact that he hasn't really done anything about it. Hopefully the LT reporter (who allegedly reads this site) can ask Mowbray for his views on what is a big weakness.

[Amo]

Yeah but we played some scintillating stuff for 15mins against Luton, so put that in your pipe and smoke it.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

That tells you all you need to know about the mentality of everyone at the club. It's been a thorny issue with me for a long, long while. How many games against what you would consider as inferior opposition do we just basically get out enthused in ? I'd be interested in how many tackles we win as a team, how many second balls do we win , how many contested headers, who runs the furthest between the two teams.

I was spitting feathers at 5.00pm on Saturday. Then I turn on the radio to hear the manager talking like the worst thing that had happened that day was Mrs Mowbray had burnt the lemon drizzle cake he was having for his tea.

[47er]

I don't think TM could cope with players of strong character. Some of the changes he makes in terms of selections, substitutions and positioning would not be meekly accepted by the

likes of Keeley or Nelsen or Cole or Moran. They would have told him where to go-----and Mowbray would have been on his way.

That's why we have a character-less side.  Do as they're told and take the dosh.

[DE.]

You can't really argue with those stats. Suggests an extremely fragile and weak mentality. Would suggest these figures are put to Mowbray at the next press conference but more chance of Rothwell being picked as captain than local journalists asking the manager useful questions. 

[Stuart]

Interesting thread/research.

We do seem to lack a presence on the pitch.

Our captain is said to be “the voice of reason” in the dressing room who we hear more stories of apologising on social media rather than bouncing tea cups off changing room walls.

Our better quality players seem to be quiet or young. Dack, Downing, Travis, Graham. Don’t see any shouters there. Not sure that shouters are Mowbray’s style.

A lot was made of team spirit in the L1 season but that is easier to pull on when you are winning nearly every week. Not so easy when you are having to dig deep just to remain competitive. There are pockets of improvement but while the manager operates a rotation policy (that works when you have the best squad in the division, and keeps players fresh), I’m yet to be convinced that changing our midfield/attack every game helps when your squad is top 10 rather than top 2.

There is definitely a fight missing somewhere but I guess when you play well and still have to take your turn on the bench it could be difficult to stay motivated.

He needs to find his best team and stick with it until there are injuries. I thought it was interesting that he went back to the exact same starting line up that lost to West Brom despite back to back wins in between. Is it just completely random or is this Mowbray’s preferred XI? Tbf, it looks decent on paper but it’s clear that Graham should still be starting instead of Gallagher and on form, Rothwell should be playing ahead of Armstrong. Sadly Rothwell always seems to be the one to lose out with a knock or mysterious illness. Maybe he’s just not North East enough?

[Blue blood]

Just now, Stuart said:

Interesting thread/research.

We do seem to lack a presence on the pitch.

Our captain is said to be “the voice of reason” in the dressing room who we hear more stories of apologising on social media rather than bouncing tea cups off changing room walls.

Our better quality players seem to be quiet or young. Dack, Downing, Travis, Graham. Don’t see any shouters there. Not sure that shouters are Mowbray’s style.

A lot was made of team spirit in the L1 season but that is easier to pull on when you are winning nearly every week. Not so easy when you are having to dig deep just to remain competitive. There are pockets of improvement but while the manager operates a rotation policy (that works when you have the best squad in the division, and keeps players fresh), I’m yet to be convinced that changing our midfield/attack every game helps when your squad is top 10 rather than top 2.

There is definitely a fight missing somewhere but I guess when you play well and still have to take your turn on the bench it could be difficult to stay motivated.

He needs to find his best team and stick with it until there are injuries. I thought it was interesting that he went back to the exact same starting line up that lost to West Brom despite back to back wins in between. Is it just completely random or is this Mowbray’s preferred XI? Tbf, it looks decent on paper but it’s clear that Graham should still be starting instead of Gallagher and on form, Rothwell should be playing ahead of Armstrong. Sadly Rothwell always seems to be the one to lose out with a knock or mysterious illness. Maybe he’s just not North East enough?

I think this is his preferred first 11 and worryingly it's missing 2 of our best players and arguably 2 other superior options. No one can doubt Graham and Rothwell on performance have out performed Armstrong and Gally. I'd also say Nayambe and Adabyaro (sp?) are better defensive options. In fact both seem better right backs than Bennett. 

Linked to this and on topic how many of that first 11 really could grab the game by the scruff of the neck? Gally struggles to bully a defender much less grab the game, and there are very few leaders. A former age but in the relegation scrap Hughes added in Moko, Nelson and Savage who as well as being good players all had a hell of a lot of leadership about them. Throw in Oojer, Brad, Todd, perhaps even Reid and you had a lot of grit and determination. 

Now that type of quality is way out of reach these days. But that type of character? Looking at that 11 - maybe Johnson? Struggling to name others. Perhaps a few more leaders would mean games like Luton go very differently. 

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, Stuart said:

Our better quality players seem to be quiet or young. Dack, Downing, Travis, Graham. Don’t see any shouters there. Not sure that shouters are Mowbray’s style.

why do you need shouters in the dressing room. I see people like Dack, Graham, Johnson, Lenihan, Bennett, Williams has our leaders and talkers in the dressing room. People with opinions and willing to voice them! 

Just now, Stuart said:

He needs to find his best team and stick with it until there are injuries. I thought it was interesting that he went back to the exact same starting line up that lost to West Brom despite back to back wins in between. Is it just completely random or is this Mowbray’s preferred XI? Tbf, it looks decent on paper but it’s clear that Graham should still be starting instead of Gallagher and on form, Rothwell should be playing ahead of Armstrong. Sadly Rothwell always seems to be the one to lose out with a knock or mysterious illness.

You need to look at the words Mowbray has used about Rothwell today. Article on LT website right now. 

I believe you pick the right team for the game. We have loads of options in this squad. 

 

[Stuart]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

why do you need shouters in the dressing room. I see people like Dack, Graham, Johnson, Lenihan, Bennett, Williams has our leaders and talkers in the dressing room. People with opinions and willing to voice them! 

You need to look at the words Mowbray has used about Rothwell today. Article on LT website right now. 

I believe you pick the right team for the game. We have loads of options in this squad. 

Then you will get what Mowbray gets: inconsistency and as many defeats as wins. ??‍♂️
 

And nobody to bollock the players when they need it. All too nice.

[Stuart]

Just now, Blue blood said:

I think this is his preferred first 11 and worryingly it's missing 2 of our best players and arguably 2 other superior options. No one can doubt Graham and Rothwell on performance have out performed Armstrong and Gally. I'd also say Nayambe and Adabyaro (sp?) are better defensive options. In fact both seem better right backs than Bennett. 

Linked to this and on topic how many of that first 11 really could grab the game by the scruff of the neck? Gally struggles to bully a defender much less grab the game, and there are very few leaders. A former age but in the relegation scrap Hughes added in Moko, Nelson and Savage who as well as being good players all had a hell of a lot of leadership about them. Throw in Oojer, Brad, Todd, perhaps even Reid and you had a lot of grit and determination. 

Now that type of quality is way out of reach these days. But that type of character? Looking at that 11 - maybe Johnson? Struggling to name others. Perhaps a few more leaders would mean games like Luton go very differently. 

Having Bennett as captain has set the tone. And gave us another long-service-award to a midfielder who now must play and is being shoehorned in at right back. Mediocrity is ok as long as you put a shift in and ‘care’.

Last time that happened was when Coyle did exactly the same trick with Jason Lowe and de facto relegated us. You couldn’t make it up that Mowbray has repeated history.

You don’t necessarily need your best quality player as captain but you really need it not to be a fifth choice midfielder played at full back and struggling. We are thin on the ground with leaders as you point out. Who is undroppable right now and puts a shift in as a quality player. In the absence of anyone else why not Dack?

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, Stuart said:

Then you will get what Mowbray gets: inconsistency and as many defeats as wins. ??‍♂️
 

And nobody to bollock the players when they need it. All too nice.

You dont need bollocks the players Stuart. Blimey they arent a bunch of babies. 

No Stuart what you get is 13 points in the last 7 games including 4 clean sheets. 

You need different ways of playing like Plan B or C. 

[Stuart]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

You dont need bollocks the players Stuart. Blimey they arent a bunch of babies. 

No Stuart what you get is 13 points in the last 7 games including 4 clean sheets. 

You need different ways of playing like Plan B or C. 

Of course players need a bollocking. Even from each other. Not least because most of them are overgrown school kids.

That aside you, can’t argue that we aren’t inconsistent by only referring to the positives.

[jim mk2]

Horses for courses with players; some need a bollocking, others need encouragement. The skill for the manager is doing both when necessary.  All teams need bawling out when they've played badly. Bruce will have done after Newcastle's debacle this week. I can't imagine nice guy Tony doing it though after Saturday's non-performance. 

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, Stuart said:

Of course players need a bollocking. Even from each other. Not least because most of them are overgrown school kids.

That aside you, can’t argue that we aren’t inconsistent by only referring to the positives.

I rather talk and discuss things to players with them then go in shouting and balling. 

 

[Stuart]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

I rather talk and discuss things to players with them then go in shouting and balling. 

With respect Chaddy, you aren’t a professional footballer.

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, Stuart said:

With respect Chaddy, you aren’t a professional footballer.

With respect Stuart neither are you either. 

[1864roverite]

Great post with some great research. The proof will be in the pudding tomorrow evening!

[Stuart]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

With respect Stuart neither are you either. 

Ha! Got me there.

But if you still don’t think that professional footballers need bollocking from time to time then you are deluded.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Leadership on the pitch comes in different forms. Some players don't say a lot but lead by example. Alan Shearer being the one that stands out for me. Their attitude inspires, or shames depending which way you look at it, other players to raise their game. I don't think there's any doubt that we lack leaders of either type.

Edited September 30, 2019 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[JacknOry]

The greatest British manager of all time was famed for his hairdryer treatment that he gave to players. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

It sounds like Steve Bruce had the " Hairdryer " out yesterday.

[oldjamfan1]

13 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Leadership on the pitch comes in different forms. Some players don't say a lot but lead by example. Alan Shearer being the one that stands out for me. Their attitude inspires, or shames depending which way you look at it, other players to raise their game. I don't think there's any doubt that we lack leaders of either type.

Can't argue with the gist of your post TS but by all accounts big Al was anything but quiet on the field (as well as leading by example).

[arbitro]

4 minutes ago, oldjamfan1 said:

Can't argue with the gist of your post TS but by all accounts big Al was anything but quiet on the field (as well as leading by example).

I'll vouch for that Andy. He was anything but quiet and could tear a strip of his teammates or the match officials.

[toogs]

On 30/09/2019 at 09:22, MarkBRFC said:

We haven't come from behind to win a game at this level since November 2016 which was under Coyle, against Brentford.

That's an absolute shocker of a stat.