Wigan Athletic (H) - Monday Night Football (urgh..)

[DE.]

2 hours ago, CharlesBronson said:

If we equal our first 23 games on the run in it'd be 70 points for the season. good enough for top 6?

It's unlikely as no team has gotten into the playoffs with less than 71 points since Leicester in the 2012/13 season. Blackpool also crept in on 70 points back in 09/10. 

Edited December 24, 2019 by DE.

[matt83]

12 minutes ago, Wing Wizard Windy Miller said:

Williams is a solid defender in an emergency but his passing is awful.  He just doesn't fit the style TM wants to play. 

Very interesting window coming up now.

Without exaggeration on the basis Tosin and Cunningham aren’t long term solutions I think we need an entire back 5 a proper striker to replace graham and now Dack. Impossible job I feel

[AllRoverAsia]

I watched the game live and have just now watched the extended highlights on iFollow.

Filling that time slot with shots and goalmouth action makes it look as if it was a great or at least good game to watch.

However, the highlights had been completely cleansed so no Morsy related incidents shown, or the injury to Bradley.

[bluebruce]

8 hours ago, Doug said:

When will you learn!

You can't play a derby with snowflakes!!

Pick a team taking into account your opposition!

I'm sure Bennett would have unlocked that Wigan defence............

[Doug]

7 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Tosin was injured 

That wasn't known when I posted my selection

Edited December 24, 2019 by Doug

[bluebruce]

Just now, Pedro said:

One thing that made me wince was a section of our own supporters chanting, "What's it like to win F### all?!"

...to the team that pipped us to the League One title and who are fairly recent FA Cup winners ??

...to the team who have literally only won that one major trophy ever.

Would have been nice to win League One but it's also just not that big a deal. Hell it was embarrassing to even be in that league.

[Stuart]

18 minutes ago, Pedro said:

A class-less, team, manager and support.  

Don’t get me started on their manager. A team built in his image.

[Doug]

Just now, bluebruce said:

I'm sure Bennett would have unlocked that Wigan defence............

Would he have done less than Armstrong?

[bluebruce]

Just now, Doug said:

Would he have done less than Armstrong?

I expect so, yes.

[Doug]

Just now, bluebruce said:

I expect so, yes.

Fair enough, I respect your opinion.

[bluebruce]

Just now, Doug said:

Fair enough, I respect your opinion.

I mean, we will never know. Not saying Bennett doesn't sometimes set up a goal, but by and large he isn't one to break through a stubborn defence.

Agree with you he's a real battler, his standout quality. Sometimes that galvanises a team enough to score.

[MarkBRFC]

58 minutes ago, Ricky said:

The commentator mentioned that Williams was back after missing 6 games with injury. That’ll be the 6 good games we’ve had without him near the starting 11. Need Tosin back for the Birmingham game.

The commentator also said that we signed him from Aston Villa, and also said that since winning the league in 95 we have spent the "majority" of our time since in the second tier.

[Pedro]

Just now, bluebruce said:

...to the team who have literally only won that one major trophy ever.

Would have been nice to win League One but it's also just not that big a deal. Hell it was embarrassing to even be in that league.

Define, "F### all" ? ?

 

Them winning the FA Cup against Man City was a massive achievement. I can't stand Wigan, but credit where it is due. Their memories of winning something are far more recent than our own.

 

[Doug]

Just now, bluebruce said:

I mean, we will never know. Not saying Bennett doesn't sometimes set up a goal, but by and large he isn't one to break through a stubborn defence.

Agree with you he's a real battler, his standout quality. Sometimes that galvanises a team enough to score.

Bennett is a very average player IMO and wouldn't normally make a starting 11 for me.

We can agree that he is a battler and my view on this game was always that we needed 11 players who could mix it and be involved.

[TBTF]

29 minutes ago, arbitro said:

I agree but would extend the criticisms about poor passing to the whole team. Simple passes were often misplaced, over or under hit or the wrong weight. And that is almost the polar opposite of how well we passed it at Bristol. To offer a slight defence I thought the pitch was too dry but that is is no way excusing the overall quality which was poor.

I thought that about the pitch too, Arbitro. It seemed hard and a bit bouncy rather than slick but our passing and control was awful throughout the whole team. I really feared for us a bit when I saw Tosin was missing because he can bring the ball out and thread a pass. It seemed to affect Lenihan too though the way Derrick was giving it away in the first half can hardly have inspired confidence

It was the manner of the display that bothered me more than the result if i'm honest. The run that we are on will end up with points dropped somewhere along the line and possibly that would have been a game we lost late on in the past. They weren't an awful side either, i've certainly seen worse  and we have lost to worse teams. But the distinct lack of quality combined with a number of our players who simply aren't up to it leads me to believe we are quite a way short of being play off material. Not a night for singling just one out but Armstrong ….. I just don't see it with him. 

[bluebruce]

Just now, Pedro said:

Define, "F### all" ? ?

 

Them winning the FA Cup against Man City was a massive achievement. I can't stand Wigan, but credit where it is due. Their memories of winning something are far more recent than our own.

 

They haven't literally won fuck all. Relative to us though, they have.

Your initial post sounded to me like you felt differently just because of one FA Cup a bit more recently than our last trophy, and a piddly League One title.

Rather reserve the fuck all chant for clubs who haven't won anything (of note) for a good 30-40 years, agree, but I wouldn't consider it cringey to sing it to a tin pot outfit like Wigan. Was a stunning one off cup win for them though, sure.

Don't mind Wigan, personally. Hate Cook though.

[bluebruce]

Just now, Doug said:

Bennett is a very average player IMO and wouldn't normally make a starting 11 for me.

We can agree that he is a battler and my view on this game was always that we needed 11 players who could mix it and be involved.

I'd have gone for the 'unlock a stubborn defence' types for this one, with the battlers being at CM. Which we did, and it didn't work. I feel that owed a fair bit to Tosin being out. He's been so instrumental in starting moves with his excellent passing. Instead, our passing from the back was as bad as I can ever remember it being.

[Yonder12]

9 hours ago, Scotland1 said:

Was that the Chinese one?

Yeah,  disgusting. I hate Wigan and all they stand for. Disgraceful club. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

9 hours ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

Wigan came to fight and bully us, as they are entitled to do in their position, and we were lacking enough soldiers on the field. None of the front six seemed prepared to mix it, maybe with the exception of Travis.  At the end of the day, the two goalies were the best players on the pitch. 

Nobody told me they were sending their Rugby League team over ! Being honest they're always an ale house team, we should know what to expect by now,

Edited December 24, 2019 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[Pedro]

Just now, bluebruce said:

They haven't literally won fuck all. Relative to us though, they have.

Your initial post sounded to me like you felt differently just because of one FA Cup a bit more recently than our last trophy, and a piddly League One title.

Rather reserve the fuck all chant for clubs who haven't won anything (of note) for a good 30-40 years, agree, but I wouldn't consider it cringey to sing it to a tin pot outfit like Wigan. Was a stunning one off cup win for them though, sure.

Don't mind Wigan, personally. Hate Cook though.

I don't rate our time in League One, I'm ashamed to have been there too - I used that example to poke fun at the irony.

I do think it was a cringey/numpty moment though.  In truth, they are only one major honour shy of us in the 20th and 21st centuries and like plastic, they   weren't even around when we were filling our trophy cabinet in the 1800's 

[Crimpshrine]

After Bristol I read a comment in a newspaper that we were starting to look like the team most likely to break out of the chasing pack into the playoffs.

Last night in front of a decent crowd, on TV, at home to the bottom club we put the record straight. No chance of the playoffs if we have many more performances like that.

I think we can all see the problems. We have no leaders, no fight and little imagination. No real goal threat. Wigan nullified us and were probably better overall.

Morsy is one of those players everyone loves to hate but I'd have him in our team tomorrow. Their left back would walk into our team and probably their centre half. Windass wasn't great but he seemed to find space a lot better than any of our forwards. And Wigan are bottom with 1 away win in about 30 games or so!

Occasionally we can look quite good ( Bristol, Brentford ) but often we look terrible. Averaged out over the season mid table is probably our realistic position.  Good to see Walton have a good game and Holtby was decent but overall very disappointing team performance.

[roversfan99]

8 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

well lets just foriett the season and not bothered with the rest of the season. Its pointless cos Dack isn't available to play. 

We have to find a way to win games without him. Having your attitude we might aswell not bothered playing any more games cos Dack missing. Grow up man. 

We have a squad that we need to use. We could play 4-4-2 now or keep playing 4-2-3-1. We have different players who can fit either system. 

You simple just don't get it do you? We just cant keep signings for players in forwards areas. We have too many as the manager has said. but just signed the 3 positions we need players in as I have already stated to you. 

Stop being so childish. 

I do get that its not prudent to sign another attacker but them forward signings havent improved us and now we need them to score goals regularly now we cannot rely on Dack. If Bowen at Hull, Grant at Huddersfield, Grabban at Forest etc got a serious injury they would be similarly goosed because they are also similarly reliant on getting their goals mainly from one man. Theres no point pretending that having our main man getting a serious injury like this isnt a catastrophic blow, and for a team who had an outside chance of a play off place, it only massively reduces that chance to be without our best player for half of the season. That doesnt mean we should "forfeit" the season but I am being realistic.

I am not saying that we cant name a team anymore, just that whoever comes in we will really struggle to cover Dacks goals internally. Have Gallagher and Brereton done anything to suggest that they could either individually or even between them start scoring goals at an increased rate to cover our top scorer? Will Rothwell and Bennett be able to start doing something quite sudden and cover a man with almost a goal every other game, considering they have 3 between them since we came back to the Championship? Its all unlikely. Its like me saying we dont need a left back we have Bell and Williams. Which is true but you want a new LB because you acknowledge that they cant do the job at the standard we need or at the standard another injured player set in Cunningham.

[1864roverite]

1 hour ago, Stuart said:

Wigan is still in Lancashire*. As are Liverpool and Manchester.

Unless you also believe that Backburn isn’t in Lancashire either.  
 

*doesn’t make their fans any less scrote-like (oh the shit I was given for calling Wigan fans scrotes  )

Wigan are bounded by the greater Manchester boundaries so that takes them out of Lancashire a bit like Bolton, mank u and mank c and add bury Rochdale and Salford to the list. They might previously have been but the boundaries changed a good few years ago Stu

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just now, Crimpshrine said:

After Bristol I read a comment in a newspaper that we were starting to look like the team most likely to break out of the chasing pack into the playoffs.

Last night in front of to that. The centrea decent crowd, on TV, at home to the bottom club we put the record straight. No chance of the playoffs if we have many more performances like that.

I think we can all see the problems. We have no leaders, no fight and little imagination. No real goal threat. Wigan nullified us and were probably better overall.

Morsy is one of those players everyone loves to hate but I'd have him in our team tomorrow. Their left back would walk into our team and probably their centre half. Windass wasn't great but he seemed to find space a lot better than any of our forwards. And Wigan are bottom with 1 away win in about 30 games or so!

Occasionally we can look quite good ( Bristol, Brentford ) but often we look terrible. Averaged out over the season mid table is probably our realistic position.  Good to see Walton have a good game and Holtby was decent but overall very disappointing team performance.

I agree, the left back looked a class act. He matched both Nyambe and Armstrong for pace and they'd no answer to him after that. The blond centre half played like a centre half should. Morsy is what we're short of, the sort of player that has you looking over your shoulder on and off the ball. We've got too many nice guys. You can see why they are where they are though - absolutely no cutting edge in front of goal, luckily for us.

Edited December 24, 2019 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I agree, the left back looked a class act. He matched both Nyambe and Armstrong for pace and they'd no answer to him after that. The blond centre half played like a centre half should. Morsy is what we're short of, the sort of player that has you looking over your shoulder on and off the ball. We've got too many nice guys. You can see why they are where they are though - absolutely no cutting edge in front of goal.

I would take Travis or Johnson over Morsy, he's a donkey. Rough housing is all he is good for. We should have started Johnson, he would have won that battle.