Rovers v Hull

[Bigdoggsteel]

I have a bad feeling about tonight

Very bad 

[Bigdoggsteel]

4 minutes ago, Mercer said:

Rankin-Costello, Buckley, Mols, Davenport - none have stood out in my eyes.  These lads are 20 / 21 year olds and, IMO, at best, they will never be better than average Championship players.

 

 

If Chapman is such a prat, and I don't think he is having watched him several times, then why the feck did Mowbray sign him having known the lad for years!!!  By the way, he's just 22 so hardly a veteran and only a year or two older than the likes of Rankin-Costello, Buckley, Mols, Davenport.

So, with your argument, if Mowbray hadn't of, IMO, spunked away £12million+ in fees and committed the club to big wages on Brereton and Gallagher, the pot would have been at least £20million bigger over a 4 year period.  I think he's had the resource, and even told us he only needs to ask for more!, and blown it!!! 

You optimise the resource you have - that is good management.  Sheff U and Brentford have shown the way probably with budgets less than ours.  IMO, Mowbray has failed and we need someone who knows the market and can work it.

 

Both spent more. 

[JacknOry]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

I have a bad feeling about tonight

Very bad 

Why?

[Mattyblue]

3 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Both spent more. 

Not so.

Brentford had a net spend of £-8 million in the summer, £-25 million the summer before.

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/brentford-fc/transfers/verein/1148/plus/0?saison_id=2018&pos=&detailpos=&w_s=

[Bigdoggsteel]

4 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

Why?

I think we are just going to hit a wall because of injuries and the affect said injuries must be having on the squad moral. Obviously it's an opportunity for some, who incidentally I don't think will be up to it, but imagine you are Armstrong and you think about all the creative players missing, he must be thinking "who is going to help me here?" 

[rigger]

26 minutes ago, benhben said:

The injuries mean we should be changing the formation to suit the players available...we all know this wont happen though. Id also be brave and play what ball players we have over the scrappers. Again Tony wont agree.

                        Walton

     Nyambe Lenihan Tosin Downing

Chapman Travis Davenport Armstrong

              Gallagher Graham

In reality Bennett will be back in on the wing alongside and Johnson in the middle. Bore fest. 

I would like to see that side

[tomphil]

2 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

It’s not a myth mate because ‘budget’ refers to fees plus wages. It’s everything combined. And our ‘budget’ is mid to lower table.

You can have a wage budget and transfer budget my friend.

[rigger]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

I think we are just going to hit a wall because of injuries and the affect said injuries must be having on the squad moral. Obviously it's an opportunity for some, who incidentally I don't think will be up to it, but imagine you are Armstrong and you think about all the creative players missing, he must be thinking "who is going to help me here?" 

What he should be thinking is how many am I going to score tonight.

[G Somerset Rover]

1 hour ago, Mattyblue said:

How blasé of him. ‘Ah well, £12 million down the toilet, I’ll have a look at Europe next.’

What's the betting our European scouting network produces bugger all in the summer as well? Nice jolly out to the Euros for them anyway.

I see a drab draw tonight. They're pretty awful and we're not much better without our flair players. 1-1.

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 minute ago, Mattyblue said:

Not so.

Brentford had a net spend of £-8 million in the summer, £-25 million the summer before.

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/brentford-fc/transfers/verein/1148/plus/0?saison_id=2018&pos=&detailpos=&w_s=

That's net spend, which is fair enough, but it doesn't change the fact they spent more on players. They have been able to go out and sign players for 5,6, 7 million. Yes, I know about Brereton  

Some business all the same when I look through it there. A conveyor belt of talent and players bought cheaply and sold at huge profits. They really are the model club in the Championship for who they do business. 

[Ewood Ace]

6 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Both spent more. 

Sheffield United spent less than us last season on transfer fees and they even had a minus net spend last season, as for that matter did Norwich. As for Brentford they have made over £50 Million in player sells over the last 2 seasons whereas Mowbray has been able to keep all his main players and spend money on top of that yet he still hasn't been able to get us ear the playoffs.

[neophox]

9 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I think we are just going to hit a wall because of injuries and the affect said injuries must be having on the squad moral. Obviously it's an opportunity for some, who incidentally I don't think will be up to it, but imagine you are Armstrong and you think about all the creative players missing, he must be thinking "who is going to help me here?" 

Hull are injury hit too.

[Paul Mani]

6 minutes ago, tomphil said:

You can have a wage budget and transfer budget my friend.

Yes, of course you can. But in the context of this conversation regarding our current budget against the rest of the championship we are talking about combined. 

 

[RevidgeBlue]

3 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

I don’t think it was pitched in a blasé way tbf. He is working with a budget and they decided to spend big-ish money on young players who they think will develop into top players.

I thought this was him accepting that if they could buy a player further into their development from Europe for half the price and stay within the wage structure then they would potentially be able to buy “a couple” and therefore benefit more in the short term. Seemed more like evolution. Whether it works or not remains to be seen.

It seems extremely odd that any manager in the modern era should consider scouting players from Europe as such a previously unthinkable prospect and a quantum leap. I know he likes the old jumpers for goalposts routine but it's not 1960 any more and Europe is hardly on the other side of the world is it?

Also without being completely au fait with the regulations could leaving the EU mean we are too late in belatedly seeking to get  involved in the European transfer market? Will players have to meet the minimum requirements for international appearances etc that non EU players have previously had to?

I'm not convinced TM has any real appetite for this, if he had the whole thing would have been set up eighteen months ago when we were promoted. In fact he doesn't have any real appetite for bringing in new players at all imo.  We'll wait and see but the promise of players suddenly flooding in from Europe when we can't even get one over the line from this Country seems a bit "jam tomorrow" and this always seems to be the case when discussing  Mowbray and "slow builds" etc and a sceptic might say it's merely another  ruse to keep him and his team in a job as long as possible.

[Paul Mani]

1 minute ago, Ewood Ace said:

Sheffield United spent less than us last season on transfer fees and they even had a minus net spend last season, as for that matter did Norwich. As for Brentford they have made over £50 Million in player sells over the last 2 seasons whereas Mowbray has been able to keep all his main players and spend money on top of that yet he still hasn't been able to get us ear the playoffs.

Completely different models and by and large the exceptions to the rule. But I do think we need to ‘do’ a Norwich to get up. IE overachieve on a moderate budget.

This is why I worry about  us and Mowbray medium to long term.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

8 minutes ago, rigger said:

What he should be thinking is how many am I going to score tonight.

I never ever walked out onto the pitch without a picture in my head of my team winning. I've lost count of how many losing games I played in but I always started out with a positive attitude. That includes a 16-2 loss as a young lad.

[RevidgeBlue]

13 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I think we are just going to hit a wall because of injuries and the affect said injuries must be having on the squad moral. Obviously it's an opportunity for some, who incidentally I don't think will be up to it, but imagine you are Armstrong and you think about all the creative players missing, he must be thinking "who is going to help me here?" 

You're lining up the excuses for Tony in advance I see.

[Mercer]

26 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Both spent more. 

Think you need to cost in transfer receipts and wages!

[Paul Mani]

Just now, RevidgeBlue said:

It seems extremely odd that any manager in the modern era should consider scouting players from Europe as such a previously unthinkable prospect and a quantum leap. I know he likes the old jumpers for goalposts routine but it's not 1960 any more and Europe is hardly on the other side of the world is it?

Also without being completely au fait with the regulations could leaving the EU mean we are too late in belatedly seeking to get  involved in the European transfer market? Will players have to meet the minimum requirements for international appearances etc that non EU players have previously had to?

I'm not convinced TM has any real appetite for this, if he had the whole thing would have been set up eighteen months ago when we were promoted. In fact he doesn't have any real appetite for bringing in new players at all imo.  We'll wait and see but the promise of players suddenly flooding in from Europe when we can't even get one over the line from this Country seems a bit "jam tomorrow" and this always seems to be the case when discussing  Mowbray and "slow builds" etc and a sceptic might say it's merely another  ruse to keep him and his team in a job as long as possible.

I don’t think there’s a lot of clubs outside of the PL with strong foreign links to recruitment other than those already mentioned. It’s also important to understand that there wasn’t a scouting network of ANY note set up when he came in. This had been decimated long before.

From the meeting the picture was painted that they had planned to buy on potential out of the Championship and develop as well as finding nuggets in the lower division. From what was said the last 12 months have proven that their are no cheap league one players (Quoted £2.5m for Curtis) and most Chamionship players are already on better wages than ours. Tbf they set up the European scouting network a year ago and it hasn’t had a great impact yet other than Holtby (who was identified in terms of availability from the analysis). In the summer they doubled the recruitment budget and a lot of that went into the European network. As I said before it seems more like evolution.

Not sure about the legislation in relation to Brexit.

[Bigdoggsteel]

I would go

                   Walton

Nyambe  Lenihan Tosin  Bell

           Travis Downing

Bennett                        Armstrong

        Brereton Gallagher

Not easy.....

 

[Bigdoggsteel]

7 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

You're lining up the excuses for Tony in advance I see.

No, I am just giving my opinion. 

Why would I make excuse for him? I have better things to be doing. 

Not sure what you are seeing there 

[roversfan99]

We cant complain about injuries tonight too much considering that Hull are without a series of players through injury themselves. De Wijs, Burke, Pennington and Tafazoli are all out at CB. Lichaj is out at RB. Stewart and Kane are 2 important central midfielders that are out, their new signing Scott is out and a few other less influential players too. Throw in the loss of Bowen and Grosicki and they really are heavily depleted and nothing less than a win is acceptable. You do wonder if its a perfect night for Graham, horrible weather, go a bit more direct and take advantage of their heavily depleted defence.

Maddison is their stand out player now, they have a couple of big lumps in Eaves and Magennis and Wilks who scored at the weekend couldnt really get much game time at Barnsley earlier in the season.

 

[Prelude]

13 hours ago, Vilesinner said:

So defensive against such a poor side. 

And Williams is worse at left back than CB.

But agree with no Johnson and Bennett.

Whos defensive? Only Travis who gets forward more these days. Bell can be attacking when playing on the week but also makes us more solid defensively. Who would you pick?

I know it is all mute point as Tony will play league 1 level Bennett somewhere. Why is he still captain when he rarely starts? 

Give darragh the armband and downing as vice 

[Madon]

It's absolutely freezing out there now, it's going to be even worse come 7.45. 

Mowbray better play at least a half exciting team otherwise I'm going to be as stiff as a board come 9.40pm. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

15 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

We cant complain about injuries tonight too much considering that Hull are without a series of players through injury themselves. De Wijs, Burke, Pennington and Tafazoli are all out at CB. Lichaj is out at RB. Stewart and Kane are 2 important central midfielders that are out, their new signing Scott is out and a few other less influential players too. Throw in the loss of Bowen and Grosicki and they really are heavily depleted and nothing less than a win is acceptable. You do wonder if its a perfect night for Graham, horrible weather, go a bit more direct and take advantage of their heavily depleted defence.

Maddison is their stand out player now, they have a couple of big lumps in Eaves and Magennis and Wilks who scored at the weekend couldnt really get much game time at Barnsley earlier in the season.

 

This is true, but big lumps are our kryptonite at times. It's good to hear they have so many injuries and without doubt the loss of Grosicki and Bowen is arguably worse than us being without any 2 from Dack, Holtby and Rothwell.