Rovers v Hull

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Sparks Rover said:

I wouldn't use Bennett as an example of anything, shit footballer, no physicality, no pace, but a mean fist pump eh? Working hard is a given

It's a given, but not all players do it 

[Bbrovers2288]

1 hour ago, DaveyB said:

Hull were poor, yes. And it's true to say that we might not have won so comfortably against a better side.

But last night could/should have been 5 or 6 nil, and I'm not sure what else Rovers could have done (except obviously taking a few more of their chances). Certainly very far from a 'very poor' performance as you described 

Were you happy at 70 minutes? Added to that the performance against Fulham and it’s happening again. Happy we got the win but now need to back that up against Charlton 

[neophox]

That was Waltons 10th clean sheet this season. If possible I would sign him in the summer. If not I would go for Rotherhams Daniel Iversen.Insert other media

[Inglorious basturk]

Just now, neophox said:

That was Waltons 10th clean sheet this season. If possible I would sign him in the summer. If not I would go for Rotherhams Daniel Iversen.Insert other media

He’s shown plenty of recent improvement ,  however he like raya has a mistake in him and unlike them I don’t have faith in our coaching to iron it out 

[Ewood Ace]

21 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

So the chairman's word isn't good enough for you? Mmm, ok then. I think you are the one refusing to acknowledge the issues. The fact he has ended up at Hull is telling. It was being made out he was a super player, I am sure if he sets the world alight at Hull, a few will be back on pointing out we should have signed him, Mowbray messed up etc etc. As things stand, he doesn't look anything .Unproven at this level and joining a club in free fall, not even a promotion chasing side. Very, very telling. 

I wouldn't pay to much attention to the Peterborough chairman he seems to love publicity and he is certainly fond of his own voice. Maddison has gone from being picked up on a free at a National League team 5 years ago to now being worth £2.5 Million and playing in the Championship. That say's to me that he's got something about him as plenty of talented players in the past have been released from a academy and ended up in the lower leagues and despite having plenty of ability they have not had the mentality to get themselves back up the leagues.

I wouldn't judge him too harshly on his performance last night he was playing just his third game in what looked a poor team. I thought Hull were the worst side we played last season and I think they have probably been as well this season. Bowen was what kept them away from the drop zone and they need Maddison to fill that void which is no easy task as I think Bowen was the best player in the division.

Edited February 12, 2020 by Ewood Ace

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Did he beat Bell repeatedly? Ya, I don't get people booing Maddison , because we were never really that interested. As for Bauer, well he straight up picked PNE so whilst I wouldn't do it myself, at least it makes a bit more sense. 

As for Maddison, did you not expect him to move to a better club? I recall you mentioning WBA. The way Hull look, he could be back in League 1 next season. 

He's a good player, didn't really get much chance to show it playing in that Hull side who had 30% possession...

[LeftWinger]

27 minutes ago, Inglorious basturk said:

If we turned down both Ronaldos due to their denim wear some would retrospectively say they were no good for us

I'm trying to work out if you genuinely meant denim wear or meant demeanour?

[roversfan99]

9 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

So the chairman's word isn't good enough for you? Mmm, ok then. I think you are the one refusing to acknowledge the issues. The fact he has ended up at Hull is telling. It was being made out he was a super player, I am sure if he sets the world alight at Hull, a few will be back on pointing out we should have signed him, Mowbray messed up etc etc. As things stand, he doesn't look anything .Unproven at this level and joining a club in free fall, not even a promotion chasing side. Very, very telling. 

 

16 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Debatable. Depends on his application. Bennett and Gallagher work very hard. If Maddison wouldn't match that output, plus the step up means he wouldn't have the goals or assists, then he wouldn't be much use. He is unproven at this level. 

What word? What specific thing did their chairman say that indicated that he had a really bad attitude? He might well do, but it just seems to be unsubstantiated myth that has escalated from very little. The only thing was an insinuation that his choice of Hull over Charlton was partly down to money as well as location. Is that a particularly bad thing? Do you think most footballers or indeed people in general are not influenced by money? If I had the choice of 2 lower Championship sides that I had no affiliation to, money would be a big deciding factor in my choice too. Doesn't affect the effort that I would go on to put in.

I dont think that Maddison was necessarily a specific individual that had to be signed, we just needed general reinforcements especially capable of playing in wide areas. But his track record albeit at a lower League is very, very impressive.

He has struggled to get a move away from Peterborough because he had a clause of 2.5m in his contract and their chairman refused to budge, and that is quite a lot of money for a League 1 player especially considering that the best teams in the League possibly would look elsewhere rather than into League 1.

There seems to be a lot of revisionism and desperation to justify not signing anyone, not even specifically him. Not only are you not assuming that he can make the step up (undoubtedly a big unknown at this point, I have never said otherwise) but now he also wouldnt be willing to put effort in either, and could be even less effective (I am not sure that its possible) than the likes of Bennett and Gallagher out wide, especially the latter who is being shunted there even though he is a striker, when neither offer any attacking threat at all, pretty important as a wide man.

If their chairman has specifically said that he had a bad attitude then please feel free to show me the tweets, or alternatively wherever else you have seen that he has attitude problems, and it isnt just an assumption. He was publically delighted when he ended up staying in the summer, saying how good he was, so you have to appreciate that he always has a PR spin in mind anyway, but I am still in the dark as to why he has this reputation as this disinterested, unmotivated coaster that we did well to avoid.

 

[Mashed Potatoes]

8 minutes ago, neophox said:

That was Waltons 10th clean sheet this season. If possible I would sign him in the summer. If not I would go for Rotherhams Daniel Iversen.Insert other media

Isn't Iversen on loan from Leicester ?

[tonygreenbank]

38 minutes ago, Hasta said:

Someone can quote you and then change the text within the quote. See the text added above.

Therefore someone could quote you, and then paste somebody else post into the quote box. Not sure why anyone would do that though.

Thanks Hasta for that. I do recognise the post which was attributed to me and I have a strong feeling it appeared after the Fulham game but I can’t remember who wrote it. Even weirder that it turned up in the Hull thread.

[Bigdoggsteel]

2 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

 

What word? What specific thing did their chairman say that indicated that he had a really bad attitude? He might well do, but it just seems to be unsubstantiated myth that has escalated from very little. The only thing was an insinuation that his choice of Hull over Charlton was partly down to money as well as location. Is that a particularly bad thing? Do you think most footballers or indeed people in general are not influenced by money? If I had the choice of 2 lower Championship sides that I had no affiliation to, money would be a big deciding factor in my choice too. Doesn't affect the effort that I would go on to put in.

I dont think that Maddison was necessarily a specific individual that had to be signed, we just needed general reinforcements especially capable of playing in wide areas. But his track record albeit at a lower League is very, very impressive.

He has struggled to get a move away from Peterborough because he had a clause of 2.5m in his contract and their chairman refused to budge, and that is quite a lot of money for a League 1 player especially considering that the best teams in the League possibly would look elsewhere rather than into League 1.

There seems to be a lot of revisionism and desperation to justify not signing anyone, not even specifically him. Not only are you not assuming that he can make the step up (undoubtedly a big unknown at this point, I have never said otherwise) but now he also wouldnt be willing to put effort in either, and could be even less effective (I am not sure that its possible) than the likes of Bennett and Gallagher out wide, especially the latter who is being shunted there even though he is a striker, when neither offer any attacking threat at all, pretty important as a wide man.

If their chairman has specifically said that he had a bad attitude then please feel free to show me the tweets, or alternatively wherever else you have seen that he has attitude problems, and it isnt just an assumption. He was publically delighted when he ended up staying in the summer, saying how good he was, so you have to appreciate that he always has a PR spin in mind anyway, but I am still in the dark as to why he has this reputation as this disinterested, unmotivated coaster that we did well to avoid.

 

I would say there is reverse revisionism too. For example if @chaddyrovers was saying Maddison would have been a great signing, I have a sneaky feeling some of you would be making the exact same points I am now to counteract him. 

Edited February 12, 2020 by Bigdoggsteel

[JacknOry]

3 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I would say there is reverse revisionism too. For example if @chaddyrovers was saying Maddison would have been a great signing, I have a sneaky feeling some of you would be making the exact same points I am now to counteract him. 

Tbh though, Chaddy thought BB was a steal, so him not rating Madisson after a single appearance means he will probably go on to do well. 

[roversfan99]

2 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I would say there is reverse revisionism too. For example if @chaddyrovers was saying Maddison would have been a great signing, I have a sneaky feeling some of you would be making the exact same points I am now to counteract him. 

You havent answered my question. If there is suggestions that Maddison is a bad character, he doesnt work hard etc, these assumptions surely have some sort of foundation. At the moment, they seem like wild assumptions made to justify not signing him, even though it was specifically Maddison that was suggested, we just needed a couple of attacking players notably a wide man in general.

[speeeeeeedie]

1 hour ago, Tom said:

Those weren’t boo’s aimed at Maddison, it was Tattooooooooooo - just letting him know why we didn’t sign him 

Sounds like it was job done last night. Beating a team at home who Rovers were supposed to beat.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

You havent answered my question. If there is suggestions that Maddison is a bad character, he doesnt work hard etc, these assumptions surely have some sort of foundation. At the moment, they seem like wild assumptions made to justify not signing him, even though it was specifically Maddison that was suggested, we just needed a couple of attacking players notably a wide man in general.

Well the not working hard piece is easy, obviously people get that from watching him. Is that fair enough?

The bad behavior, ya speculation pretty much, but it's not an accusation I have really made. 

Why has he ended up at Hull on loan with a potential free transfer in the summer if he is so good? Surely a team chasing promotion would have gone for him? Why do you think that is? 

[unsall]

23 minutes ago, Inglorious basturk said:

He’s shown plenty of recent improvement ,  however he like raya has a mistake in him and unlike them I don’t have faith in our coaching to iron it out 

Thing is, every keeper has a mistake in them inc most premier league keepers, Man U, Liverpool etc, the difference is, if they make one mistake the team is good enough to win the game, and it’s forgotten.

[Ewood Ace]

5 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Well the not working hard piece is easy, obviously people get that from watching him. Is that fair enough?

To go from being released from Newcastle's academy to playing in the National League to 5 years down the line be playing in the Championship takes plenty of hard work. In the National League system or even lower down than that in the Northern Premier or Northwest Counties, there are plenty of talented players who have like Maddison have been released from good academies but very few make it back up the league. To do that takes commitment, hard work and a good attitude.

Edited February 12, 2020 by Ewood Ace

[Bigdoggsteel]

2 minutes ago, Ewood Ace said:

To go from being released from Newcastle's academy to playing in the National League to 5 years down the line be playing in the Championship takes plenty of hard work. In the National League system or even lower down than that in the Northern Premier or Northwest Counties, there are plenty of talented players who have like Maddison have been released from good academies but very few make it back up the league. To do that takes commitment, hard work and a good attitude.

Ya, I just think his ability is being exaggerated because we didn't sign him. 

[Mattyblue]

Think it says more about how far we’ve fallen as a club that there is such a song and dance over a journeyman from Peterborough every window...

[roversfan99]

7 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Well the not working hard piece is easy, obviously people get that from watching him. Is that fair enough?

The bad behavior, ya speculation pretty much, but it's not an accusation I have really made. 

Why has he ended up at Hull on loan with a potential free transfer in the summer if he is so good? Surely a team chasing promotion would have gone for him? Why do you think that is? 

But even his work rate, I doubt people have seen him play very much, me included, which is why I have never said he WILL be a good signing for us, I just think his record is impressive, I have seen him a couple of times and hes technically good and he gets goals and assists.

I think you are massively over exaggerating what I and others are saying in terms of his ability. I dont think that "he is so good." Like I said, Peterborough were unwilling to budge on his release clause, 2.5m is quite a lot of money, and I have never said that teams at the top of the league should or will have been interested, and teams a bit further down may struggle to pay that sort of money. Its a similar amount to what we were reportedly quoted for Ronan Curtis whose record is far less impressive.

In regards to our team in that position, I think it is our weakest area (along with maybe left back) and when we have strikers playing there, the benchmark for improvement is very low there and I feel that he may have been one potential option to do that and said that prior to him going to Hull. I am not going to start making wild exaggerations and assumptions now to justify not signing us by making out that we dont need him or shouldnt want him.

[gumboots]

1 hour ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

Were you happy at 70 minutes? Added to that the performance against Fulham and it’s happening again. Happy we got the win but now need to back that up against Charlton 

I wasnt happy at 70 mins but I was delighted at 94. You can only beat what's in front of you and, despite not playing great football, we did it handsomely in terms of the score by the end. Football matches last around 95- 96 minutes most weeks and at the end, good performance or not, if you win, you celebrate. Yes, Rovers still need to do much better. They looked slow for most of the first half and passes were going astray. Theres always stuff to work on. And yes, I'd like better players to have come in to lift us a bit in January. But we didn't so we do what Souness told us we'd have to do. And last night they got 3 points. That's the bit that counts in the end.

Edited February 12, 2020 by gumboots

[Bigdoggsteel]

2 hours ago, RV Blue said:

Embarrassing performance for 73 minutes against what was the worst side I’ve ever seen at Ewood.

Controlled the game, had more shots and should have scored. Anyway, I would prefer to play badly and win, rather than well and lose. 

I just wonder if we played amazingly for 73 minutes and then conceded, would you be on lauding how well we did for the first 73 min? Or would it all be about the result. 

[EgyptianPete]

So how did Brereton do when he came on,  sounds like he made an impact according to mowbray and others,  i missed the game by being in Newcastle on business.

 

[oldjamfan1]

4 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I just wonder if we played amazingly for 73 minutes and then conceded, would you be on lauding how well we did for the first 73 min? Or would it all be about the result. 

There you have it, in a nutshell. Its a bit like the other poster who reckons Hull had a few chances and counts it as a negative against us but doesn't count the markedly better chances Rovers didn't take as a positive. The Raya/Walton discussion is exhibiting similar traits. The rules of engagement in these arguments get grotesquely twisted constantly. Some people can't see the wood for the trees.

[had.e.nuff]

5 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Controlled the game, had more shots and should have scored. Anyway, I would prefer to play badly and win, rather than well and lose. 

I just wonder if we played amazingly for 73 minutes and then conceded, would you be on lauding how well we did for the first 73 min? Or would it all be about the result. 

Its seems normal on here if we win the opposition were rubbish if we loose we were rubbish never any credit to any side , thought last night we played ok it allways hard to play a side that does not want to attack no matter how experienced a side they put out, a wins a win  and move on to the next game.