Football League Suspended

[Mattyblue]

7 minutes ago, rigger said:

There are people saying they might not go to the Rovers because of a break to a habit.I don’t go to the Rovers out of habit. I go because I love the club.

I do, but I know many fans with much more of a transactional relationship with the club than I have. They certainly wouldn’t dream of coming somewhere like this to muse on the health of the club, they just aren’t that invested.

They will find it much easier to just not bother going back.

[rigger]

19 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

I do, but I know many fans with much more of a transactional relationship with the club than I have. They certainly wouldn’t dream of coming somewhere like this to muse on the health of the club, they just aren’t that invested.

They will find it much easier to just not bother going back.

Let’s hope we have the chance to see the Rovers live again, and you never know perhaps with less, but totally dedicated fans, the atmosphere might improve.

Edited June 7, 2020 by rigger

[Mattyblue]

6,000 rattling around a 31,000 all seater ground? I doubt it!

At least mid 80s Ewood had some terrace induced atmosphere to fall back on...

[Stuart]

7 minutes ago, rigger said:

Let’s hope we have the chance to see the Rovers live again, and you never know perhaps with less, but totally dedicated fans, the atmosphere might improve.

If there is to be a better atmosphere there needs to be more attacking endeavour on the pitch.

The last time we had a real atmosphere was when Mark Hughes was here and our brand of football was exhilarating.

Pinging diagonal balls from defence to the wing has been a feature of Mowbray’s approach and it certainly doesn’t generate excitement. Conversely Rothwell taking the ball forward 20 or 30 yards at pace certainly did and he got regularly made a scapegoat. Then he gets hooked because his style doesn’t fit with Mowbray’s.

Oh, for a manager with an attacking wing-led, two forward philosophy like Hughes or Souness. (It can be done!)

The atmosphere at Ewood has always been about what happens on the pitch, rather than terrace (or seating) “parties” where the football is almost incidental.

Interesting link from back when Rovers were ‘relevant’ to anyone but their own hardcore...

https://metro.co.uk/2009/08/10/blackburn-rovers-top-exhilaration-league-328324/

We are affected by what we see on the pitch, there’s an intensity with which we watch and react. I suspect across NW clubs who pay more of their % disposable income than most, so maybe more invested.

(Incidental unrelated stat: there have been as many managers in the 20 years between Don McKay leaving and Sam Allardyce, as there have been in the 10 years of Venkys - anyone know how many, without Google?)

[Rogerb]

11 minutes ago, Stuart said:

 

(Incidental unrelated stat: there have been as many managers in the 20 years between Don McKay leaving and Sam Allardyce, as there have been in the 10 years of Venkys - anyone know how many, without Google?)

Counting Tony Parkes as one only I would say 9 including sam

[Guest]

So a game on Thursday against Liverpool, should be an interesting result. Remember when we faced them and Everton in the 18/19 pre-season and we didn't get completely played off the park, in-fact we beat the Toffees 3-0. This game is much like a pre-season match, so obviously cannot read too much into it. But all the same it'll be interesting to see whether Rovers or Liverpool will be streaming it. I guess that also depends on the location. Currently reported as BCD, but whether that means BCD at Ewood or at Brockhall, who knows.

[Stuart]

1 hour ago, Rogerb said:

Counting Tony Parkes as one only I would say 9 including sam

I’ll give you that Roger. I wasn’t counting Tony.

[Ossydave]

21 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Just watching Bayer Leverkusen v Bayern Munich and they have crowd noises after a goal and I can honestly say that they sound ridicilious and make a further mockery of it all.

I thought it was decent during the Dortmund game 

[roversfan99]

10 minutes ago, Ossydave said:

I thought it was decent during the Dortmund game 

They said later during the game that they were trialling it this weekend ahead of the Premier League in which youll have the option to choose it or not. Im not a fan at all I think it sounds stupid considering you can see there are no fans there but a lot seem to be a fan.

[Ossydave]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

They said later during the game that they were trialling it this weekend ahead of the Premier League in which youll have the option to choose it or not. Im not a fan at all I think it sounds stupid considering you can see there are no fans there but a lot seem to be a fan.

Yeah I think it's a red button option going forward. I know what you're saying I just found it better than an echoing massive stadium though, felt more real.

I can absolutely guarantee a player is gonna end up in hot water for saying something he shouldn't during all this though ?

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, JoeH said:

So a game on Thursday against Liverpool, should be an interesting result. Remember when we faced them and Everton in the 18/19 pre-season and we didn't get completely played off the park, in-fact we beat the Toffees 3-0. This game is much like a pre-season match, so obviously cannot read too much into it. But all the same it'll be interesting to see whether Rovers or Liverpool will be streaming it. I guess that also depends on the location. Currently reported as BCD, but whether that means BCD at Ewood or at Brockhall, who knows.

To be fair, we were a couple of weeks ahead in pre season and it was just after the world cup if I remember correctly. Liverpool didnt have Salah, Van Dijk, Alisson, (just signed that day) Mane, Arnold, Firmino etc, and both played 22 players, Liverpool gave games to players like Lazar Markovic who scored and loads of kids, and Everton gave a game to players like Sandro and Niasse.

You can never take anything from pre season really. Liverpool conversely will be slightly ahead of us I think, they already played a intra squad friendly so suspect it might be a bit different.

[Stuart]

34 minutes ago, Ossydave said:

Yeah I think it's a red button option going forward. I know what you're saying I just found it better than an echoing massive stadium though, felt more real.

I can absolutely guarantee a player is gonna end up in hot water for saying something he shouldn't during all this though ?

Wouldn’t be surprised if the broadcast was ‘just behind live’ or even delayed up to a minute for that reason: to mute... inconsiderate language.

[HowieFive0]

1 minute ago, Stuart said:

Wouldn’t be surprised if the broadcast was ‘just behind live’ or even delayed up to a minute for that reason: to mute... inconsiderate language.

I bloody hope not ..nowt worse than Bet 365 ..a mate ..or worse still a dingle mate texts you to tell you your already one down !!

[roversfan99]

2 hours ago, Stuart said:

If there is to be a better atmosphere there needs to be more attacking endeavour on the pitch.

The last time we had a real atmosphere was when Mark Hughes was here and our brand of football was exhilarating.

Pinging diagonal balls from defence to the wing has been a feature of Mowbray’s approach and it certainly doesn’t generate excitement. Conversely Rothwell taking the ball forward 20 or 30 yards at pace certainly did and he got regularly made a scapegoat. Then he gets hooked because his style doesn’t fit with Mowbray’s.

Oh, for a manager with an attacking wing-led, two forward philosophy like Hughes or Souness. (It can be done!)

The atmosphere at Ewood has always been about what happens on the pitch, rather than terrace (or seating) “parties” where the football is almost incidental.

Interesting link from back when Rovers were ‘relevant’ to anyone but their own hardcore...

https://metro.co.uk/2009/08/10/blackburn-rovers-top-exhilaration-league-328324/

We are affected by what we see on the pitch, there’s an intensity with which we watch and react. I suspect across NW clubs who pay more of their % disposable income than most, so maybe more invested.

(Incidental unrelated stat: there have been as many managers in the 20 years between Don McKay leaving and Sam Allardyce, as there have been in the 10 years of Venkys - anyone know how many, without Google?)

I am not sure how much of a responsibility a manager carries towards envigorating the supporters but its an interesting debate. For me the results are always the most important thing, indeed Big Sam was always criticised for his style of play, harshly IMO. Our home form has been decent under Mowbray. His football is not particularly entertaining and we dont tend to beat anyone convincingly and improvements can be made but I am not sure if it is fair to expect those tailored towards improving the atmosphere although I take your point about entertaining the fans.

I appreciate what you say about certain tactics he employs which are not effective but I suspect that it really a different topic of conversation. Rothwell is the type of player who splits people but flatters to deceive and gets better when he doesnt play and frustrates more when he does. Im not sure he can be defined as a scapegoat considering how ineffective he often is despite his all action style. That being said his limited effectiveness is still more than Gallagher out wide could ever offer. 

I still think that whilst I concede that its a difficult task to improvr our atmosphere with a limited fan base, Waggott and co who have managed to double their remuneration in the latest set of accounts published are still at the best of times totally clueless in terms of improving atmosphere and attendances. @Mattyblue is right about some fans potentially breaking a habit but for me the primary additional difficulty will be getting those back who up until now were guaranteed regardless of what they did, who now have to be convinced of their safety to return and may be particularly reluctant at first. That could be fighting almost a losing battle even without the lack of dynamism Waggott and co have shown to date.

[Sparks Rover]

38 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

 Liverpool conversely will be slightly ahead of us I think, they already played a intra squad friendly so suspect it might be a bit different.

Liverpool could have 6 month off, us carry on and they'd still be fitter than our mob.

[HowieFive0]

Talking of atmosphere at our games ..anyone else remember when the club piped in crowd noise and songs through the tannoys during a game or two ? Late 80s possibly early 90s ...that went down like a lead balloon amongst those that were actually there. Crowd just booing instead of making their own noise!

At least Waggott hasnt resorted to ridiculous ideas like that ..although after Sky have been doing it for their TV broadcasts ...anythings possible at future games in stadiums .

[Stuart]

2 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I am not sure how much of a responsibility a manager carries towards envigorating the supporters but its an interesting debate. For me the results are always the most important thing, indeed Big Sam was always criticised for his style of play, harshly IMO. Our home form has been decent under Mowbray. His football is not particularly entertaining and we dont tend to beat anyone convincingly and improvements can be made but I am not sure if it is fair to expect those tailored towards improving the atmosphere although I take your point about entertaining the fans.

I appreciate what you say about certain tactics he employs which are not effective but I suspect that it really a different topic of conversation. Rothwell is the type of player who splits people but flatters to deceive and gets better when he doesnt play and frustrates more when he does. Im not sure he can be defined as a scapegoat considering how ineffective he often is despite his all action style. That being said his limited effectiveness is still more than Gallagher out wide could ever offer. 

I still think that whilst I concede that its a difficult task to improvr our atmosphere with a limited fan base, Waggott and co who have managed to double their remuneration in the latest set of accounts published are still at the best of times totally clueless in terms of improving atmosphere and attendances. @Mattyblue is right about some fans potentially breaking a habit but for me the primary additional difficulty will be getting those back who up until now were guaranteed regardless of what they did, who now have to be convinced of their safety to return and may be particularly reluctant at first. That could be fighting almost a losing battle even without the lack of dynamism Waggott and co have shown to date.

It’s not just results though. I though Big Sam was exactly the right manager for us at that time. We needed to stay in the PL. As it turned out the windfalls were just about to land when Venkycide happened.

But...

The football was extremely dull for long long periods, and consequently the atmosphere while he was here was utterly dreadful. Granted, we won a lot of home games so you went away from Ewood happy or at least with bragging rights but not a lot else.

Entertainment is goals, then near misses, then chances, then great attacking build up play - a long ball into the box was only good if it ended with a goal. Allardyce just got enough balls into the box to play the stats. It is also the saves and near misses at the opposite end but entertainment for a different reason. I think some greatly underestimate the impact of a manager and his preferred style of play. Particularly as exciting players can incur the wrath of a more negativity-minded manager creating a double bubble: a manager actively preventing excitement in favour of game management.

I should point out that the match excitement debate is completely different to the results debate. Mourinho being the classic example. In those situations the excitement is about the league table in between games rather than in-play enjoyment.

[Mattyblue]

Depends what you want from your club.

Some fans have an expectation that they should see ‘entertaining’ football (mid table Championship level entertainment, at least), as well as winning matches.

Me? Honestly, I really only care about winning, though the more games you win, the more entertaining the football becomes anyway as the team grows in confidence.

I get the most pleasure in seeing a win, looking at the table, reading the reports, watching the highlights etc, plotting where we’ll be if we win the next few etc. It’s wins for the first team that improves a club over everything else, the whole point of the operation. 

We don’t win and I feel only frustration, especially if we ‘played well’.

I’d say our crowd is a fairly even mixture of the two stools - as proven with the fractured fanbase under Sam.

[chaddyrovers]

4 hours ago, Stuart said:

The last time we had a real atmosphere was when Mark Hughes was here and our brand of football was exhilarating.

I totally agree with you that When Hughes was here is the last time we have a real atmosphere in Stadium and the Football was good to watch. 

Mowbray's style isn't exciting and Hughes like but Since he became manager it probably the most happy and positive I have been since Hughes's tenure. I didn't mind Big Sam's tenure until the last 6 months of reign when I got fed up with his style and also that he wanted out in the summer to move to a club in the middle east. Just didn't sit well with me. 

Kean and Coyle time is should be erased from memory. 

I like Bowyer as a person and I felt he was good fit for the club and bought calm to the job. But in his second season he should have took us up with the squad he had at his disposal. 

I was happy with Lambert's appointment as he had promotion on his CV from this division. He got the players on side very quickly and made 3 or 4 good signings in his 1st window. Also like he appointed Irvine and Kelly on his staff. Was disappointed when he went but he never trusted Venkys and it appear they never did as they didn't make a public statement on them being disappointed he was leaving.  

[rigger]

5 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

6,000 rattling around a 31,000 all seater ground? I doubt it!

At least mid 80s Ewood had some terrace induced atmosphere to fall back on...

That is pretty much what we have now, but with another 2000 or so sitting in silence. What a difference at away games.

Edited June 7, 2020 by rigger

[Mattyblue]

Just now, rigger said:

That is pretty much what we have now, but with another 2000 or so sitting in silence.

So no change then?

[rigger]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

So no change then?

But if the 6000 are passionate and show it, the atmosphere will be better.

[Mattyblue]

That ain’t happening with Mowbray’s football. 

As Stuart says, the atmosphere only gets going at Ewood with exciting play - and that’s true with 6,000 or 16,000 in attendance.

[roversfan99]

Or as you said earlier, football whereby the result is really important.

For the 18 months leading into the pandemic we never came particularly close to the bottom 3 and never have got into the top 6. Weve just been muddling in the middle. Chuck in a CEO incapable or unwilling to really push the boat out to get the numbers in the ground up and its not a mix to provoke atmosphere. There were a few games in the second half of our season in League 1 that werent particularly well attending but were more atmospheric IMO.

[Mattyblue]

Oh definitely, a decade of largely bobbing around second division mid table, with no real sniff of being involved in anything post new year sucks the life out of everyone.