Summer Transfer Window

[Paul Mani]

2 minutes ago, Mellor Rover said:

Sam Gallagher was rumoured to be on 35-40k at Southampton before joining us. Tosin will be on at least 60k at Fulham. Anybody saying we should've signed him and/or Reed are on some strong stuff. Transfer fees yes, we could've done. Wages/signing on fees, appearances bonuses etc. there's fecking no chance of either.

Think you’re talking about Harrison Reed but your point stands. They’ll both (TA and HR) be on £60k+ per week now. 4yr contracts? They’re set for life. That’s the real difference.

Oppositely, SG took a considerable pay cut to join us.

Edited October 6, 2020 by Paul Mani

[JacknOry]

So window is shut. Can only sign freebies and loans now? More importantly, as PL teams can now only from the Championship and below, should we be worried about losing anyone? 

[philipl]

5 hours ago, bluebruce said:

It's not the point whether they are Premier League class. Not in the slightest. You don't need to be Premier League class to go up. You don't even need a squad, or even team, full of promotion class, let alone Prem class. Lest we not forget, Corry Evans got promoted with Hull, as a regular I believe, and I wouldn't call him Prem or promotion quality. If he was the only contract out next summer, or say him and Bennett, I wouldn't bat an eyelid about it.

But they're not. There are, as I already said and you may have read, too many players going out of contract next summer for us to feel relaxed. We absolutely do not have the resources to replace them all adequately at once. In that I include our finances, our youth team, and our slow approach recruitment system that has repeatedly proven it can't do large scale overhauls quickly. And again, we have existing gaps already before the contracts run down. We need to get a large chunk of those lads signed up or we will be facing a monumental task.

The bare minimum for me would be Nyambe, JRC, and at least 2 from Rothwell, Holtby and Chapman. We can afford to let Williams go if the youth CBs look good enough and Ayala proves up to the task right up to season's end, but if Del plays well through the season I'd (can't believe I'm saying this) consider extending him too. Even then we are still absolutely going to need at least one, probably a couple of CMs to replace Evans, Johnson and Bennett (who offers an emergency cover), and probably somewhat on the cheap. Losing Mulgrew makes no difference though other than a welcome wage saving.

This is before we consider the effect on team harmonics of a large exodus and influx, and the unknown (far as I've heard) effect of Brexit on future European business just as we seem to have got going with that.

It's also nearly irrelevant whether we go up with contracted Championship level players. Prem riches see to that. Further, Championship level players who just won a promotion have increased stock in the market and we would likely find loans or sales for most of them. But if they sit around drawing a wage we will barely feel it at that point.

Next summer is an aeon away when you are living hand to mouth with next to zero income coming in.

Which is where all football outside the Premier League is effectively until the next TV cheque arrives.

Can players walk out and get a much better deal?

Realistically, only at Premier League clubs and 50% of those are having to be very careful with the £££.

Pre-Covid thinking about player contract mostly does not apply any longer.

So nail down players who might interest Premier League clubs and be very polite, loving and cuddly towards the rest for the time being. But lose your Mont Blanc..

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

4 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

So window is shut. Can only sign freebies and loans now? More importantly, as PL teams can now only from the Championship and below, should we be worried about losing anyone? 

So EFL clubs can only loan from the Prem....but Prem teams can buy from the EFL?

[JHRover]

3 minutes ago, philipl said:

Next summer is an aeon away when you are living hand to mouth with next to zero income coming in.

Which is where all football outside the Premier League is effectively until the next TV cheque arrives.

Can players walk out and get a much better deal?

Realistically, only at Premier League clubs and 50% of those are having to be very careful with the £££.

Pre-Covid thinking about player contract mostly does not apply any longer.

So nail down players who might interest Premier League clubs and be very polite, loving and cuddly towards the rest for the time being. But lose your Mont Blanc..

But it isn't an aeon away. 

We haven't got zero income coming in. We are still getting the media money which constitutes the majority of our income, we've got similar merchandise on sale to previous years and are finally selling season tickets. Granted we don't have matchday revenue (or overheads) and sales of season tickets are currently around a third of last years. But let's not suggest there is no money coming in. 

Also remember we are currently around £70,000 a week down on wage commitments from last year which will go a long way to covering lost ticket income.

We've got to get these deals done and quickly. A club in our position cannot afford to lose prized assets on free transfers through dilly dallying.

[islander200]

8 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

So window is shut. Can only sign freebies and loans now? More importantly, as PL teams can now only from the Championship and below, should we be worried about losing anyone? 

We can still make permanent signings from the premier league and EFL clubs up until the 16th

[islander200]

1 minute ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

So EFL clubs can only loan from the Prem....but Prem teams can buy from the EFL?

No we can make permanent signings from premier league and EFL clubs

[JacknOry]

1 minute ago, islander200 said:

No we can make permanent signings from premier league and EFL clubs

Ok, so was just shut for the PL? Except they can buy from EFL? Bloody confusing this year.

[philipl]

1 minute ago, JHRover said:

But it isn't an aeon away. 

We haven't got zero income coming in. We are still getting the media money which constitutes the majority of our income, we've got similar merchandise on sale to previous years and are finally selling season tickets. Granted we don't have matchday revenue (or overheads) and sales of season tickets are currently around a third of last years. But let's not suggest there is no money coming in. 

Also remember we are currently around £70,000 a week down on wage commitments from last year which will go a long way to covering lost ticket income.

We've got to get these deals done and quickly. A club in our position cannot afford to lose prized assets on free transfers through dilly dallying.

It is very obvious you have never managed a business under severe cash flow problems. 

That £70k a week in saving will have been banked, probably triple banked!

Even Friday this week feels like an aeon away.

Most non Premier League clubs are in precisely this position.

Waggott at least has the luxury of trying to manage down the size of the next Capital injection he asks for from Pune. But he is utterly hamstrung while the FFP rules remain in place unaltered.

 

So the choice for Rovers right now could well be between letting the highest earners walk for free and a nine point deduction this season.

[Paul Mani]

5 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

So window is shut. Can only sign freebies and loans now? More importantly, as PL teams can now only from the Championship and below, should we be worried about losing anyone? 

I don’t think so mate. Tbf we’ve set our stall out now and they haven’t sold anyone from under Mowbray yet. My guess is that we’ll only sell for BIG money and if we have replacements lined up.

Watkins form in the PL won’t be going unnoticed for admirers of Arma. Young, English and prolific at Championship level...but I’d want the same as Brentford got for Watkins and then at least £15m to reinvest.

[Therm]

10 hours ago, Bbrovers2288 said:

Bonus points for first to answer our last Greek signing 

Nikos Giannakopoulos

[MarkBRFC]

5 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

Ok, so was just shut for the PL? Except they can buy from EFL? Bloody confusing this year.

Seems to be a lot of overthinking for this transfer window, it's not really that confusing.

Deals between domestic based clubs and clubs overseas - Deadline 5th October

Deals between domestic clubs loan or permanent - Deadline 16th October

[philipl]

Just now, Paul Mani said:

I don’t think so mate. Tbf we’ve set our stall out now and they haven’t sold anyone from under Mowbray yet. My guess is that we’ll only sell for BIG money and if we have replacements lined up.

Watkins form in the PL won’t be going unnoticed for admirers of Arma. Young, English and prolific at Championship level...but I’d want the same as Brentford got for Watkins and then at least £15m to reinvest.

Totally agree with your observation about the lack of sales by Rovers. Indeed if you accept (and there is no evidence to contradict this) Mowbray and the Raos (pre-Covid) were/are building long term then Kaminski and 2017's boy wonder (assuming we get him) are together a dramatic advance in the goal keeping department over the Raya/Leuitweiler combination.

However, Watkins is a level of fabulous beyond Arma with the best will in the world.

There is a reason why Benarama is still at Brentford (found out in my view) and Watkins is tearing apart the Liverpool defence.

Arma is not remotely in the Watkins class- hope he proves me wrong but...

[JHRover]

9 minutes ago, philipl said:

But he is utterly hamstrung while the FFP rules remain in place unaltered.

 

So the choice for Rovers right now could well be between letting the highest earners walk for free and a nine point deduction this season.

If you or Waggott seriously believe that a 9 point penalty this season for FFP issues is going to happen then we've no hope. 

It isn't going to happen. And it certainly won't be the reason we will lose players on free transfers.

Infant quite the opposite. Our biggest shield against FFP issues is to ensure our promising homegrown players are secured for the long term. 

Our failure to do this will cost us millions of pounds and contribute more to FFP risk than anything else.

[philipl]

I am 100% serious.

We are desperately close to the edge- in fact probably over it now- on FFP.

It is a day to day hand to mouth issue.

And it might force the sale of Williams if an offer comes in. 

[tomphil]

1 hour ago, magicalmortensleftpeg said:

How times have changed..?

Regardless of Fulham’s stature as a club, they’re in the PL. Since when have we been able to compete for signings with a PL club?

Suggesting that if players play well for us on loan they may get a move to a PL club is hardly a new line.

Clearly i'm saying we used to be a very similar club to them and we can be again there's no need for Fulham to be light years ahead of us.

They are now our role models not the likes of Brentford.

[Exiled_Rover]

2 hours ago, tomphil said:

Great move for player and club in the Tosin deal although i bet they are paying a right whack in wages. Be really interesting to see how he steps up, not sure he's ready for that yet but we'll see.

New pitch line for Tony and Mark now to potential signings - come and showcase yourself here and if you're lucky Fulham will sign you !

How times have changed, that's why we really need promotion or to be in the mix for it regularly at least. 

The fact City have let a 20 something year old English player leave for peanuts tells you everything you need to know about how good they think he is.

[tomphil]

4 minutes ago, Exiled_Rover said:

The fact City have let a 20 something year old English player leave for peanuts tells you everything you need to know about how good they think he is.

He's obviously not what they are looking for but when you weigh it up he probably hasn't cost them much. 1.5 million fee now, an alleged 1 million loan fee from Rovers and probably similar from West Brom the season before.

Not bad when you can operate like that, the agents and player will still be quids in and the club have gone some way to covering their experiment.

[unsall]

40 minutes ago, philipl said:

I am 100% serious.

We are desperately close to the edge- in fact probably over it now- on FFP.

It is a day to day hand to mouth issue.

And it might force the sale of Williams if an offer comes in. 

Quite a few on hear dismiss FFP not sure why, I know we are very close, possible saving grace is they might make it a 4 year rolling due to this pandemic. What’s the point on gambling we will get away with it because others have, others haven’t and if we end up up having a decent season, and then get a deduction of points it would be a disaster. Let us stick to the rules and others break them,,,

[JacknOry]

30 minutes ago, Exiled_Rover said:

The fact City have let a 20 something year old English player leave for peanuts tells you everything you need to know about how good they think he is.

In last year of his contract, wants to play and probably made it clear he will not be renewing. Unless you are truly special at City, there is no pathway into that first team. 

At the end of the day, it is hardly that they do not think he is good, just that he is not good for the first team right now. Basically because they just go out and buy ready made superstars. 

[philipl]

3 minutes ago, unsall said:

Quite a few on hear dismiss FFP not sure why, I know we are very close, possible saving grace is they might make it a 4 year rolling due to this pandemic. What’s the point on gambling we will get away with it because others have, others haven’t and if we end up up having a decent season, and then get a deduction of points it would be a disaster. Let us stick to the rules and others break them,,,

Thinking about it, FFP could be what lies behind the otherwise difficult to justify season ticket offer.

[philipl]

I am getting rather worried about our Boy Wonder.

I know I am ahead of you timewise but I was hoping for an announcement early this morning..

[islander200]

1 hour ago, JacknOry said:

Ok, so was just shut for the PL? Except they can buy from EFL? Bloody confusing this year.

Nixon said on twitter one of the reasons for the window being the way it is this year, is if clubs lower down than the prem are struggling and need to sell a player to cover a bill can still be offered to premier league clubs.

[MarkBRFC]

5 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

In last year of his contract, wants to play and probably made it clear he will not be renewing. Unless you are truly special at City, there is no pathway into that first team. 

At the end of the day, it is hardly that they do not think he is good, just that he is not good for the first team right now. Basically because they just go out and buy ready made superstars. 

Sort of player you could see them buying back in 2 or 3 years for £50m or something, if he adapts to the top flight well enough of course.

Edited October 6, 2020 by MarkBRFC

[JacknOry]

1 minute ago, MarkBRFC said:

Sort of player you could see them buying back in 2 or 3 years for £50m or something, if he adapts to the top flight well enough of course.

Yeah, like Pogba at Utd. 

Just think its a little much to say he must be shit because City are letting him go. Who knows how good he could become with some PL matches under his belt.