Summer Transfer Window

[Bigdoggsteel]

5 minutes ago, WacoRover said:

This should be the case. I was one who voted for Mowbray’s return; however, a lot of that was based on seeing what kind of talent he brings in this off-season...we’re still waiting on that. Adarabioyo will be difficult to replace, we know that already. A quality keeper is a must, as Walton was not as consistent as the guy he replaced. Left back, or the absence of a quality presence there, has haunted this team far too long. 

The way this team moves up the table is one way: improve the defending. If the off-season ends and we haven’t acquired talented players, this should be apparent sooner than later. Unfortunately, by then, any worthy manager will already be working. Tony will have to muddle through til the end of the season. 

Make or break season is right. Hopefully our “break” won’t take us back down to L1.

The problem with left-back is, we are only an injury like last season away from having Bell or Williams back in there, or JRC even. We probably need 2. 

[Exiled_Rover]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

Lucas Neill, although having lived there he isn't the worst and I have many Australian cousins! 

I was going to say, I just had him down as an Ozzie.

Emerton was v meek for an Ozzie.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Exiled_Rover said:

I was going to say, I just had him down as an Ozzie.

Emerton was v meek for an Ozzie.

He really was

[phili]

I must admit up until Venky's took over we have really always had a good goalkeeper and a settled back 4 with good defensive options on the bench. Which is what is making our current predicament even harder to take.

I admit i would take a Darren Peacok or Christian Dailly at the minute to improve our CB positions. We talk about how we improved the CB position last season and started playing out from the back, but we still conceded 60+ goals. So not really an improvement. Next season i still think we need at the minimum 2x GK, 2x CB's who do the basics well, and probably 1x Leftback, a winger or 2 and probably 1 CM and a new CF. 

[roversfan99]

Just now, Bigdoggsteel said:

The problem with left-back is, we are only an injury like last season away from having Bell or Williams back in there, or JRC even. We probably need 2. 

We surely cannot justify the expenditure already committed to Bell and Williams to be 3rd and 4th choice left backs.

Its not feasible to have so much natural cover in one position. That would make 4 left backs and only 1 right back.

We just need a first choice that is a significant upgrade on what we have. Cunningham did tick that box last season.

Not sure if Brad Smith is just a lazy suggestion by Rich Sharpe from rumours eminating from before Mowbray was even in charge. Questionable CV, most of his game time in the last 3 or 4 years has been in the MLS so difficult to know how he has done. If he is an upgrade on Bell, fair enough.

We shouldnt have extended Bells contract but now we have, we need to try and get an improvement on him to go straight into the team.

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 minute ago, roversfan99 said:

We surely cannot justify the expenditure already committed to Bell and Williams to be 3rd and 4th choice left backs.

Its not feasible to have so much natural cover in one position. That would make 4 left backs and only 1 right back.

We just need a first choice that is a significant upgrade on what we have. Cunningham did tick that box last season.

Not sure if Brad Smith is just a lazy suggestion by Rich Sharpe from rumours eminating from before Mowbray was even in charge. Questionable CV, most of his game time in the last 3 or 4 years has been in the MLS so difficult to know how he has done. If he is an upgrade on Bell, fair enough.

We shouldnt have extended Bells contract but now we have, we need to try and get an improvement on him to go straight into the team.

Well ideally we would sell them. My point was we are one injury at left back away from being back at square one if we only sign one. 

[briansol]

3 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

The problem with left-back is, we are only an injury like last season away from having Bell or Williams back in there, or JRC even. We probably need 2. 

I thought Bell improved after new year and can be used as a backup.  A first choice left-back of Cunningham standard would be great. Keeper, centre-back, left-back in that order would probably the most important ones. Probably needs someone to replace Graham and Whiteman might be a good option in midfield. He sounds a bit like Sherwood which we are missing. A proper box-to-box midfielder who can make the team tick. Travis is a very handy, but he's not going to control a game.

I also think the most important factor if we are aiming for play-offs is getting more consistency out of the current bunch. We need at least 2-3 players to have a breakthrough season like Armstrong to have any chance regardless on who we bring in. We are not solid enough and too few players contribute with enough goals. 

[tomphil]

As long as Bell is around he'll get games whoever we sign as it's clear TM sees in him some kind of attacking left back. So he'll plonk him in when he thinks the opposition will suit it.  

Williams told Mowbray he wanted only to be considered for CH from last summer not left back anymore. At most clubs that would have seen him consigned to 4th or 5th choice or sent through the door.  Not here though, here he gets his wish then after an ok start he begins to get found out, gets allegedly injured and disappears to pick up his pay from the shadows.

He's one that needs trading off the payroll straight away imo but no doubt he's good for moral or something. Probably start this season as 3rd choice CH again and round and round we go.  Like the Samuel, Smallwood situation if you want to improve you must try and trade up from these guys somehow if possible.  It's difficult to get good creative players or goalscorers in unless you are bold but LB and one or two others are doable because the present bar isn't set very high.

[briansol]

17 minutes ago, phili said:

I must admit up until Venky's took over we have really always had a good goalkeeper and a settled back 4 with good defensive options on the bench. Which is what is making our current predicament even harder to take.

I admit i would take a Darren Peacok or Christian Dailly at the minute to improve our CB positions. We talk about how we improved the CB position last season and started playing out from the back, but we still conceded 60+ goals. So not really an improvement. Next season i still think we need at the minimum 2x GK, 2x CB's who do the basics well, and probably 1x Leftback, a winger or 2 and probably 1 CM and a new CF. 

Not Peacock or Dailly, but a proper defender and leader like Craig Short would do. Listened to Friedel on Roverschat podcast and he was very clear on how important it was to have a leader like him heading away balls in the Championship. He also said Gary Flitcroft was very undervalued for being a great leader put demand on the team as well as giving praise when needed. We've been missing a quality midfield enforcer for a long time. Maybe Travis can grow into the role, but the impression I get from the other players he might not be the brightest to have that respect from the others.

[phili]

Just now, briansol said:

Not Peacock or Dailly, but a proper defender and leader like Craig Short would do. Listened to Friedel on Roverschat podcast and he was very clear on how important it was to have a leader like him heading away balls in the Championship. He also said Gary Flitcroft was very undervalued for being a great leader put demand on the team as well as giving praise when needed. We've been missing a quality midfield enforcer for a long time. Maybe Travis can grow into the role, but the impression I get from the other players he might not be the brightest to have that respect from the others.

It's a good point that we don't have any leaders in the side at all now.

This is the one summer where we can pick up a lot of talent and players on free transfers or relatively cheaply and we really need to take it.

I noticed that Maddison was released by Peterborough a few weeks ago. I am not sure how he did at Hull but i always thought he had good potential to step up to the championship.

[roversfan99]

19 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Well ideally we would sell them. My point was we are one injury at left back away from being back at square one if we only sign one. 

There wont be a market for teams willing to pay a fee for Bell.

To be fair, assuming we got one in, we would have 3 left backs (compared to for example 1 right back) which is in terms of numbers, plenty.

We was unlucky to get both left backs injured at the same time, but its unrealistic to stock pile in case of things like that happening. 

[briansol]

2 minutes ago, phili said:

It's a good point that we don't have any leaders in the side at all now.

This is the one summer where we can pick up a lot of talent and players on free transfers or relatively cheaply and we really need to take it.

I noticed that Maddison was released by Peterborough a few weeks ago. I am not sure how he did at Hull but i always thought he had good potential to step up to the championship.

Maddison has ability, but did poorly for Hull and only played 7 games (4 starts) with one goal to show for it. He's also rumoured to be a poor character.

Might be worth a punt, but I think Mowbray will be reserved bringing in a player that might disrupt the dressing room.

[tomphil]

9 minutes ago, briansol said:

Not Peacock or Dailly, but a proper defender and leader like Craig Short would do. Listened to Friedel on Roverschat podcast and he was very clear on how important it was to have a leader like him heading away balls in the Championship. He also said Gary Flitcroft was very undervalued for being a great leader put demand on the team as well as giving praise when needed. We've been missing a quality midfield enforcer for a long time. Maybe Travis can grow into the role, but the impression I get from the other players he might not be the brightest to have that respect from the others.

This is the kind of thing they coach out of them these days though sadly they prefer defensive crablike midfielders. Travis has a host of qualities that should be being enhanced but the emphasis seems to be turn him into Evans.  

Evans himself has spent years here playing below he true capabilities but managers have just wanted him sat quietly in front of the back 4.

[phili]

Just now, briansol said:

Maddison has ability, but did poorly for Hull and only played 7 games (4 starts) with one goal to show for it. He's also rumoured to be a poor character.

Might be worth a punt, but I think Mowbray will be reserved bringing in a player that might disrupt the dressing room.

Possibly we need a few poorer characters to shake things up in the dressing room abit?

[Fraserkirky]

Bell was okay this year and played well in quite a few games, the Sheff Wed away I seem to remember in particular. We all agree we need a first choice LB, but as a back-up Bell is fine.

[briansol]

 

Just now, phili said:

Possibly we need a few poorer characters to shake things up in the dressing room abit?

You have a point, but I think we need more leaders and stronger characters. The dressing room seems united and everybody gets on. I would worry that it is "too nice" if you don't have the characters that will not accept defeat and demand more from teammates. The championship team was filled with captains. Hendry, Berg, Sherwood, Shearer, Batty etc

[Bigdoggsteel]

24 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

There wont be a market for teams willing to pay a fee for Bell.

To be fair, assuming we got one in, we would have 3 left backs (compared to for example 1 right back) which is in terms of numbers, plenty.

We was unlucky to get both left backs injured at the same time, but its unrealistic to stock pile in case of things like that happening. 

Again,nobody is saying stockpile. You have a habit of answering things I don't say. As someone has said, Williams wants to be considered for CH only. Bell could be loaned out. We need guaranteed quality in that position. 

Whether you like it or not we have 3 for the RB role. Nyambe, JRC and Bennett. I would trust Nyambe or JRC there. Left back is the major problem. We need 2. If one is bought and the other loaned ,that's fine with me. 

Edited August 6, 2020 by Bigdoggsteel

[Bigdoggsteel]

Please, not Madison the Messiah again. 

[roversfan99]

4 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Again,nobody is saying stockpile. You have a habit of answering things I don't say. As someone has said, Williams wants to be considered for CH only. Bell could be loaned out. We need guaranteed quality in that position. 

Whether you like it or not we have 3 for the RB role. Nyambe, JRC and Bennett. I would trust Nyambe or JRC there. Left back is the major problem. We need 2. If one is bought and the other loaned ,that's fine with me. 

Why would we extend Bells contract to loan him out? Not feasible really.

I think a competent first choice left back, with Bell as back up as a second natural left back and Williams in an emergency (a player who has played most of his career there) and if all THREE got injured, potentially Downing, I think is more than enough. 

All 4 of whom can play that position far more competently than Bennett can play right back. Rankin Costello is a wide man, but again could play either full back position but only ideally in an emergency.

Personally think a first choice left back would very much be enough in that position.

We was unfortunate to suffer both of our left backs being injured at the same time. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

Why would we extend Bells contract to loan him out? Not feasible really.

I think a competent first choice left back, with Bell as back up as a second natural left back and Williams in an emergency (a player who has played most of his career there) and if all THREE got injured, potentially Downing, I think is more than enough. 

All 4 of whom can play that position far more competently than Bennett can play right back. Rankin Costello is a wide man, but again could play either full back position but only ideally in an emergency.

Personally think a first choice left back would very much be enough in that position.

We was unfortunate to suffer both of our left backs being injured at the same time. 

One isn't a left back anymore! Not would I want to see him there again. 

JRC is a wide man? Well ,that's going to have to change! 

Agreed on Bennett, but can't see any movement on that issue. 

[bluebruce]

58 minutes ago, briansol said:

I thought Bell improved after new year and can be used as a backup.  A first choice left-back of Cunningham standard would be great. Keeper, centre-back, left-back in that order would probably the most important ones. Probably needs someone to replace Graham and Whiteman might be a good option in midfield. He sounds a bit like Sherwood which we are missing. A proper box-to-box midfielder who can make the team tick. Travis is a very handy, but he's not going to control a game.

I also think the most important factor if we are aiming for play-offs is getting more consistency out of the current bunch. We need at least 2-3 players to have a breakthrough season like Armstrong to have any chance regardless on who we bring in. We are not solid enough and too few players contribute with enough goals. 

Eh? If we have Dack back at anything like his former self, solidify our defence and 2-3 players have an Arma level breakthrough we would absolutely storm this league nevermind have a chance.

[rigger]

21 minutes ago, Fraserkirky said:

Bell was okay this year and played well in quite a few games, the Sheff Wed away I seem to remember in particular. We all agree we need a first choice LB, but as a back-up Bell is fine.

Bell is that good, that he cannot get his place at left back before two right footed midfielders.

[tomphil]

1 minute ago, rigger said:

Bell is that good, that he cannot get his place at left back before two right footed midfielders.

Defensively he's a liability all it needs is a watch back of his games.  More often that not a player taking him on goes past him easily or crosses don't get cut out or he gives a foul away.  Worst bit is when they stroll past him he just stands their hands on hips instead of trying to get back.

Long way to go before i'll even consider him competent cover he's only in because he offers something a bit different going forwards, i.e he's quite quick.  Maybe he'll just put it all together all of a sudden and look the part but i think it's unlikely. He was signed for lge 1 as an attacking full back, thats been and gone.

[bluebruce]

16 minutes ago, rigger said:

Bell is that good, that he cannot get his place at left back before two right footed midfielders.

Although tbf he was injured 

[rigger]

47 minutes ago, bluebruce said:

Although tbf he was injured 

With what?