Cardiff away

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, 4000Holes said:

At risk of getting pilloried and having to take a significant Amount of flak, I think that there is a footballer in Brereton.  Sure he has been disappointing in his earlier games, but he was being played out of position and in the main in very short cameos.  Not a situation a young lad trying to justify a hefty price tag (nothing to do with him) should have been put in that position.  He was badly managed.  Since the lockdown, I think he has played much better but in a better position, his petulance withstanding, but I think that was his age and frustration took hold. 
Samuel played well last evening and a quick look at Cardiff comments confirms that but that may have been down to Grahams influence therefore the jury is still out.  I thought Graham’s positioning and anticipation was superb but considering Samuel is coming back from a recent bad injury, there is hope.

Never understood why we re-signed Gallagher as he just doesn’t fit.  With a couple of wingers giving him reasonable service then maybe but we/Mowbray just don’t play that way.

I would agree on Brereton. I think he has more technical ability than Gallagher. 

[Lancs Rover]

9 hours ago, OldEwoodBlue said:

Last night I gave MOM to Travis but I think we need to forge a duplicate and give it to Graham.

 

Armstrong will take the plaudits but Travis created the goal - without even touching the ball.

Closed down and pressured the man to make a mistake.

We are all in thrall to Arma but for me that was Travis's goal - to quote, 'without Travis, Arma is nothing...'

[Lancs Rover]

57 minutes ago, WacoRover said:

Youth are characterized by extremes, both good & bad. I take Rankin-Costello, I think he will be a solid player for us.

 I asked the same thing about Wharton, he’s helped 3 teams to promotion. Hard worker, & surely, a winning attitude. 

Saw him at home in a couple of years ago in a Rovers shirt and bossed it.

Is he good enough? You  won't know until we try it,

Is Mowbray a risk taker, though?

That is the question.

[roversfan99]

57 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

I agree with your point that Rankin Costello will be a big player for us. 

I am very surprise you haven't mention that Sam Burns in your under 18's list. We haven't sign Wright-Philips yet from Man City but Rich Sharpe did say Rovers are looking to sign him if we can. 

I thoroughly enjoyed watching the under 23's and seeing potential players coming through. Vale will be good player for us if his development continues 

 

I think he would be good winger for us but I wouldn't be surprise if he ended up at right back if Nyambe does go. He has played the right wing back for under 23's in a number of games I watched when Damien Johnson was the under 23's team manager. 

If you had watch Rankin Costello from his time in our academy/under 23's to now, you would have seen why me and Joe think Rankin Costello will be a big player just I was a big fan of Travis 3 years ago. Last night was his best performance for us but to be say he was shaky against Bristol City is such what abit over the top. 

have you seen Wharton play in their 3 playoffs he played in? if so do you think he is ready to play a part in first team squad going forward?

My main point was that performances in the kids league is not necessarily indicative of a player having a successful career in the first team. For every Travis, there is a dozen others who dont make the transition. At the moment, the jury is out on the pair, but both have recently put in their best performances in a Rovers shirt where it matters in the first team. (Buckley at Charlton and Rankin Costello last night) We are weak in wide areas so I would like to see Rankin Costello there at some point.

I would agree that Rankin Costello had his best game yesterday, although was obviously somewhat handicapped, not necessarily at full back where he is not natural but wasnt really ever left one on one, but on his weak side, which as a full back expected to overlap, can be a big problem. Was quite underwhelmed in his 2 performances in attacking positions and felt that he looked our weakest link v Bristol City. I saw a bit more attacking intent when he went on a dribble at the start of last night.

And no I havent seen Wharton playing, I am just saying that if any of the young defenders is ready to compete around the first team, surely its the one who has played 80+ games and has had individual plaudits and team success, albeit at a lower standard but no doubt against physical, senior pros, rather than Grayson who was mentioned but who in his sole senior game v a League 2 side was well out of his depth. We still need to sign at least one centre back, but maybe Wharton can come back and be 3rd or 4th choice.

I also am not convinced that there will be much of a market for Ryan Nyambe, and if there is, we are in a weak position in terms of a fee. You mentioned Palace, Hodgson loves experience and organisation and I am not sure he gets a game there. He isnt close to being a Premier League player at the moment and outside the club I am unsure if he is even a stand out Championship right back. He needs to work on his attacking game, not much going on when he approaches the final third. Hopefully he can do that in a Rovers shirt as hes one of our better players.

[JHRover]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

 

 

so you take a risk of losing a player for small fee instead of the fee we should get like we did with Josh King

 

Yes I would.

Why?

Because if we sell those players we have that other clubs want we end up on a slippery slope and as we saw in 2017 it could easily end in relegation. It will certainly ensure we don't win promotion which should be the sole ambition here. Forget the side show about player values, individual development or styles of play. It is all a distraction. The only thing on minds should be assembling a squad good enough for promotion. The first thing you do is not just sell anyone decent out of fear of losing money. If he stays another year and we do well and get promoted we are in profit.

Speculate to accumulate.

Living life in this league afraid of spending money and constantly looking to sell assets will ensure we don't get promoted.

We have enough work to do this window thanks to our flawed transfer strategy (which you repeatedly defended last summer) which means we have no keeper, one CB and no LB or wide men. Why create more problems?

 

[Rogerb]

Looking at the league table only five clubs have scored more goals than Rovers and that is with Dack missing for some time and lack of contribution from SG and BB. 

[rigger]

1 hour ago, 4000Holes said:

At risk of getting pilloried and having to take a significant Amount of flak, I think that there is a footballer in Brereton.  Sure he has been disappointing in his earlier games, but he was being played out of position and in the main in very short cameos.  Not a situation a young lad trying to justify a hefty price tag (nothing to do with him) should have been put in that position.  He was badly managed.  Since the lockdown, I think he has played much better but in a better position, his petulance withstanding, but I think that was his age and frustration took hold. 
Samuel played well last evening and a quick look at Cardiff comments confirms that but that may have been down to Grahams influence therefore the jury is still out.  I thought Graham’s positioning and anticipation was superb but considering Samuel is coming back from a recent bad injury, there is hope.

Never understood why we re-signed Gallagher as he just doesn’t fit.  With a couple of wingers giving him reasonable service then maybe but we/Mowbray just don’t play that way.

With reference to Brereton I hope you are right.

[tomphil]

4 hours ago, Sparks Rover said:

He's scored 2 since we've been back, should have had 4.  None for gally or Brereton and don't even look like scoring, so I'll stick with Dom.  On a different planet to both of them(neither should even be called pro footballers)  if he's given a run and faith is put in him.

Look at the bigger picture I'm judging him on his time here not last 2 games.

Always had a knack at getting himself in handy positions but remember at one point the lad who scored a few for the U23s was in front of him simply because he could finish better.

We are stuck with the other two but there's a chance to put a freed up wage to better use here.

[Rogerb]

I see Junior Hoilett is 30 now. His career never kicked on after he left.

[Leonard Venkhater]

Just now, Rogerb said:

I see Junior Hoilett is 30 now. His career never kicked on after he left.

Good!

[arbitro]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

So what happens if Nyambe refuse to sign a contract extension? sell or keep and risk a fee being decide by a tribunal?

We know about the club option in Bell contracts weeks before it happened. We knew about the club option back in February when the Lancashire Telegraph did an article on it. 

Who knows what club will pay and the players they want before the transfer window. Did you expect Brighton to Adam Webster for 20 million before last summer window for example?

You mention Prem Teams coming down will likely be happy with what they've get there. Well lets a look at it.

Norwich right back Max Aarons has been linked with a move to Spurs in the past. But what is Norwich financial situation currently and I think they will sell their 2 full backs Aarons and Lewis in the summer. So we see what they will do. 

Bournemouth have Jack Stacey and Adam Smith at right back.But I read an article online on Sunday or Monday night saying their owner will make massive cutbacks there going forward so hopefully we get that King Windfall and that's will help the club. 

Aston Villa have 2 right backs but I would so no better than Nyambe and it is possible of squad overhaul with reports in media that their sporting Director is facing the sack over a number of poor signings. Dean Smith job as head coach there could come under threat. So it is a possible

I have mention that Palace could be possible club for Nyambe in the past week. 

 

so you take a risk of losing a player for small fee instead of the fee we should get like we did with Josh King

Graham played as false nine role has he was much deeper than I seen him before, with Samuel and Armstrong as wide strikers. The 4-3-3 system worked last night. 

How can it be a three up front when you say Graham was deeper. I just can't get my head around how you fit a false nine into a system. If it's as you say and Graham was a false nine (I disagree) then it should have been 4-3-1-2 to accommodate Graham being deeper. That's the nonsense of over complicating things for me.

[oldjamfan1]

4 minutes ago, arbitro said:

How can it be a three up front when you say Graham was deeper. I just can't get my head around how you fit a false nine into a system. If it's as you say and Graham was a false nine (I disagree) then it should have been 4-3-1-2 to accommodate Graham being deeper. That's the nonsense of over complicating things for me.

Football is - and always will be - a simple game Tony. I've never been able to get my head around this 'false nine' stuff. In my day if I had a fast strike partner I would simply play five or ten yards closer to the half way line and drag the centre half or halves out with me, leaving a lovely gap for my teammate to exploit. And if they didn't follow me out, I was the one with plenty of space to do what I wanted with the ball then. Its hardly a rocket science playing up front. 

Edited July 8, 2020 by oldjamfan1

[arbitro]

7 minutes ago, oldjamfan1 said:

Football is - and always will be - a simple game Tony. I've never been able to get my head around this 'false nine' stuff. In my day if I had a fast strike partner I would simply play five or ten yards closer to the half way line and drag the centre half or halves out with me, leaving a lovely gap for my teammate to exploit. And if they didn't follow me out, I was the one with plenty of space to do what I wanted with the ball then. Its hardly a rocket science playing up front. 

There is another punditism Andy that grinds my years - playing between the lines. WTF does that mean. My theory is that the condescending 'experts' make these silly things up to try and impress us mere mortals and justify their media work whilst imparting the professional opinion on us.

As you say football is such a simple game and should be treated as such.

[WacoRover]

Meanwhile, Boro playing like world beaters under warnock, made it look easy today. 
WBA beating the fightin Rooney’s 1-0 already... there’s an opening for Rovers! 

[LDRover]

9 minutes ago, arbitro said:

There is another punditism Andy that grinds my years - playing between the lines. WTF does that mean. My theory is that the condescending 'experts' make these silly things up to try and impress us mere mortals and justify their media work whilst imparting the professional opinion on us.

As you say football is such a simple game and should be treated as such.

'The transition' is another one.

What a load of crap.

[Mattyblue]

‘Playing between the lines’... a midfielder passing to an unmarked forward.

What an idea!

Edited July 8, 2020 by Mattyblue

[Sparks Rover]

57 minutes ago, tomphil said:

We are stuck with the other two but there's a chance to put a freed up wage to better use here.

Fair Point.  I agree a defence is more important,  but DS has mitigation with terrible injury.  The other two are fit for nothimg.  Mowbrays failings are haunting us. I can only hope a new manager gets a tune out of BB /SG

[Guest]

To be fair to TM; it’s not like the ‘false 9’ 4-3-3 doesn’t work... Liverpool and Barcelona have operated with it to unbelievable effect and Man City use Bernardo Silva up front in their ‘big’ away games. It’s just that the problem lies exactly there... we don’t have Firmino Salah and Mane; Messi Villa and Pedro or Bernardo Sterling and Mahrez. Leave the clever stuff for the big boys, let’s get 2 up top like most successful teams at this level over the last 10 years have had. Leicester got 100 points playing 442 ffs.

[BlackburnEnd75]

On Nyambe's crossing. He has actually vastly improved in this area in the last 6-12 months. 

The issue is he rarely actually crosses the ball. Could be many reasons for that though, I think if he was a left back with Gallagher or Samuel on the other side he would probably put the ball in more often. 

I remember last year thinking he was literally the worst crosser of the ball i'd even seen at ewood, he could barely get the ball off the ground and when he did his technique was shocking. When he does cross it now it's to a much higher standard.

[Mattyblue]

Remember reading that he’s been spending extra time at the training ground with Damien Johnson working on his weak points, I.e crossing.

Edited July 8, 2020 by Mattyblue

[tomphil]

Ironic because i always thought Johnsons weak point was crossing when they had him as a right winger. Found his niche at Brum mostly as a tenacious midfielder i think.

I hope he's mentoring Travis i see him being best in a similar way not another manufactured crab type.

[Blue blood]

35 minutes ago, Mellor Rover said:

To be fair to TM; it’s not like the ‘false 9’ 4-3-3 doesn’t work... Liverpool and Barcelona have operated with it to unbelievable effect and Man City use Bernardo Silva up front in their ‘big’ away games. It’s just that the problem lies exactly there... we don’t have Firmino Salah and Mane; Messi Villa and Pedro or Bernardo Sterling and Mahrez. Leave the clever stuff for the big boys, let’s get 2 up top like most successful teams at this level over the last 10 years have had. Leicester got 100 points playing 442 ffs.

Even accounting for the drop in quality between these teams and us, we have very different types of forwards. In fact I don't think there are many false 9s who aren't very technically gifted and therefore within our price range. Trying to play this system with the wrong players is asking for trouble. 

[Admiral Nelsen]

1 hour ago, Rogerb said:

I see Junior Hoilett is 30 now. His career never kicked on after he left.

Didn't realise he was quite as old as that until last night. I've been totally perplexed by how ordinary his career has been. He wasn't the complete player at Rovers but he seemed so threatening when on song.

I would have put my house on him being at least a good level premier league player in his late 20s, if not an elite one. Certainly not slumming it at a mid-table second tier team.

[Guest]

6 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

You was in terms of that Graham should play, but nothing to do with any relationship he has with the fans because no one was there! He scored and played well not because he was desperate to impress back in Wales, to aggravate the Cardiff fans or anything like that, he did because he is a clever player and a good striker.

I wasn't suggesting he would aggravate the fans in the stadium. Not my intention at all. More that players against former sides (where they're usually booed by opposition fans - obviously not on this occasion) tend to score against those teams. I was proven correct there.

[Guest]

6 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Whilst it is admirable that you go to watch the under 23s, you should never lose sight of the fact that it is a reserve/kids league and not representative of senior football. The acid test is in the first team.

You say that "Rankin-Costello proved yet again last night that he will be a very big player for us" and I think that is very much hyperbole at this point.

I agree.. I was responding to the point made by someone who claimed our academy was underperforming/overhyped which I think is absurd. The claim that we've nothing decent coming out of the Under 18's or the 23's is quite clearly proven to be false by the numerous former youth team players in our first team, and some of the quality we have at 18's and 23's level. It's not a huge personal opinion based on my viewing.

I don't see how these factual points are a sign of my lack of sight for the context of their play at youth level at all. I know what that league is like, I know that Callum Hudson-Odoi was tosh at Leyland and scored his first England senior goal just 6-months later. Players perform and underperform at that level and at that age consistently very inconsistently.

I'm not claiming that we have the most amazing academy in the world, but I think the original claim (the one I was responding to) is absurd and outside of personal opinion, there's many factually unavoidable variants proving so.