Season Tickets 2020-21

[Ben Frost]

46 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I still dont think you understand why that argument is a load of bollocks, because the club could never know.

They waited and then announced when they thought one thing, 7 days later, the situation is the total opposite. They were in the same position in terms of being SURE as they would have been had they announced them 2 months prior. That argument makes zero sense, and indeed was proven as such because even when they THOUGHT they were sure, the whole thing changed almost immediately after putting them on sale.

That uncertainty always would have been there and was always there, thats not a logical reason, even objectively, for a delay.

 

You're using the benefit of hindsight of the last 7-10 days to criticise the club (again) when over the last 2-3 months, the direction of travel had been very much towards opening things back up again and after holding the pilot events there had been genuine hope of getting fans back inside football grounds in the very near future.

The fact that this "second wave" (if that's what it is) became a thing just a week after STs going on sale clearly is going to stop sales in their tracks, but it's not fair to expect that the club should have been able to predict when and how Covid-19 cases would evolve, or how the government would respond specifically in relation to fans in grounds.

Also, whilst so keen to throw mud at BRFC, you neglect to mention that the argument all summer long for having STs on sale when those other clubs did was because they would have money to invest on signing players and we wouldn't. That is conveniently overlooked now that we have made signings despite not having had STs on sale.

And those much loved rival clubs who have sold thousands of Season Tickets - without being able to tell the people who were buying them what exactly they were paying for - will now be either having to hand the money back, defer, or invent some other method of refunding their fans.

At least those of us Rovers fans who have bought, knew exactly what it is we were getting. I can quite imagine the uproar on here had they put "something" on sale in June and then following last weeks government intervention said "sorry, you can't come to Ewood and we've spent all your ST money on a new goalkeeper so you can't have it back"

[Hasta]

59 minutes ago, rigger said:

Coverage on TV

They get coverage on TV anyway as part of the package they have signed up to, as well as visibility around Ewood on a match day and I presume some sort of corporate package. If the sponsorship deal was signed before everything went tits up I'd be asking for money back, not giving freebies out.

[Hasta]

26 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

We haven’t sold many because they were months later on sale than most clubs, went up in price by £50-£80 in the midst of a pandemic and recession, nobody had a clue when we’d be back in grounds and we went into a local lockdown about 3 days later.

51 pages summed up in 2 lines.

Edited September 25, 2020 by Hasta

[roversfan99]

20 minutes ago, Ben Frost said:

You're using the benefit of hindsight of the last 7-10 days to criticise the club (again) when over the last 2-3 months, the direction of travel had been very much towards opening things back up again and after holding the pilot events there had been genuine hope of getting fans back inside football grounds in the very near future.

The fact that this "second wave" (if that's what it is) became a thing just a week after STs going on sale clearly is going to stop sales in their tracks, but it's not fair to expect that the club should have been able to predict when and how Covid-19 cases would evolve, or how the government would respond specifically in relation to fans in grounds.

Also, whilst so keen to throw mud at BRFC, you neglect to mention that the argument all summer long for having STs on sale when those other clubs did was because they would have money to invest on signing players and we wouldn't. That is conveniently overlooked now that we have made signings despite not having had STs on sale.

And those much loved rival clubs who have sold thousands of Season Tickets - without being able to tell the people who were buying them what exactly they were paying for - will now be either having to hand the money back, defer, or invent some other method of refunding their fans.

At least those of us Rovers fans who have bought, knew exactly what it is we were getting. I can quite imagine the uproar on here had they put "something" on sale in June and then following last weeks government intervention said "sorry, you can't come to Ewood and we've spent all your ST money on a new goalkeeper so you can't have it back"

I am not using the benefit of hindsight, I said at the time more than once that the argument that they wanted to know what they were selling before starting was flawed. They would never know for sure, because at any point, there was the potential for any progress to be halted, it is such a fluid situation, no club could ever know.

If you genuinely think that I am just using hindsight after the event, please read some of my comments at the start of this thread:

Page 9, August 4th, in response to you ironically: "We arent going to have clarity any time soon, even after the season has begun, we wont know say 5 months into the season whether fans will be there, so there will always be an element on uncertainty."

And this: "I would agree perhaps if there wasnt fans already and waiting to donate, who obviously know that the service that they will get is unclear.

That wont be clear at any point either really. So season tickets wont be able to go on sale until after the season has started, thats implied by your scenario. If fans arent allowed in from October onwards, then theyd be delayed again. And even if they are, theres a chance of a second spike or that fans will stop being allowed in again."

and this to chaddy: 

"Wait and see until when? Because as I said, the situation is obviously so fluid that there will never be a point when clarity is suddenly restored. If you wait and see, surely you wait until after the season starts as we at least know that at the start of the season, there will be no fans. So you wont have any clarity and thus income for 2 more months, for sure. Then the date could be pushed back further, again no clarity or income. Or best case scenario, fans will be allowed in from October. But from your logic, you cant still get any income in because what if theres a second spike and the gates are closed again?

So do you get the problem? You can say "wait and see" but there will never become a point when anyone knows for sure if its safe to start selling season tickets. 

Maybe state that refunds wont be allowed to make things totally transparent? More that any payments will be deferred until whenever it is when people are allowed back in."

So I was consistent months ago that they would never know what they were selling, and was proved right. I also said that they dont need to hand out immediate refunds, and indeed said that they could defer partial refunds, which they did, and which I praised the club for. So I am not using hindsight, these are all long held opinions.

In regards to your implications that I am just desperate to "throw mud" on the club, I have praised the club for the structure of the season tickets and the way that it is split, I have indeed purchased a season ticket myself, I have stated that no one can claim to have been sold something incorrectly because it was clear regarding uncertainty from the beginning, and indeed when chaddy said that he thinks that the club should have offered another alternative to suit those who will not watch ifollow, I defended the club  by saying that in terms of structure, I dont see how they could have done it any other way. 

We have signed 2 players for fees of a total of £450k having seen go quite a few players to significantly reduce the wage bill as a result, so its not as if we have been on a spending spree. Although to clarify, I am not saying that we should have. But the fact that we have signed a couple of players doesnt in anyway discredit the points I am making which in my opinion have limited the season ticket income and/or will have harmed the relationship between the club and its supporters. 

Edited September 25, 2020 by roversfan99

[Mattyblue]

’Throw mud at the club?’

As ‘99 is one of only 1,200 to actually buy a ST, you’ve got the wrong target there. 

We are the new ‘100 Club’, wonder if I’ll be getting a call from Waggott asking to fund a new bus for the Academy...
 

Edited September 25, 2020 by Mattyblue

[HowieFive0]

11 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

’Throw mud at the club?’

As ‘99 is one of only 1,200 to actually buy a ST, you’ve got the wrong target there. 

We are the new ‘100 Club’, wonder if I’ll be getting a call from Waggott asking to fund a new bus for the Academy...
 

You ll be driving it at this rate !

[rigger]

55 minutes ago, Hasta said:

They get coverage on TV anyway as part of the package they have signed up to, as well as visibility around Ewood on a match day and I presume some sort of corporate package. If the sponsorship deal was signed before everything went tits up I'd be asking for money back, not giving freebies out.

I would doubt that there is any mention in any contract, of a guarantee of the number of people attending Ewood 

[Hasta]

45 minutes ago, rigger said:

I would doubt that there is any mention in any contract, of a guarantee of the number of people attending Ewood 

Agree, but they ain't giving free gifts to the club either.

Edited September 25, 2020 by Hasta

[rigger]

16 minutes ago, Hasta said:

Agree, but they ain't giving free gifts to the club either.

But to make the best of a bad job, it might be a good move.

[Stuart]

2 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

We are the new ‘100 Club’, wonder if I’ll be getting a call from Waggott asking to fund a new bus for the Academy...

The 100 club were asked to stump up for a club bus? Please tell me thats satire.

Venkys do realise they said the would honour the club that Jack built and not the one he bought, right?

Billionaire owners have turned a proud club into a begging bowl!

[JHRover]

4 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

I dont think you understand my point.

They NEVER had or could have had a clear picture. Therefore, the only answer to not releasing them until we know for sure that we can attend, is NEVER to be able to sell season tickets, because they could NEVER be sure.

They released them still when there was no guarantee, which was proven because the situation changed totally within a week. There could never be a point when the club could have been confident that fans could go into grounds, because as was proven, even if the plan was to start allowing fans back in, there was always a strong chance that any day, the government could stop it.

So surely, the earlier they released them, still under the same element of jeopardy in terms of fans know the service is uncertain which is unavoidable, but they could have at least had more than a week of sales.

This is absolutely the whole issue explained perfectly.

All summer long Waggott and some fans have rubbished my suggestion to sell season tickets ASAP because 'the club didn't know what it was selling and couldn't guarantee entry'

So can anyone explain to me what the club is guaranteeing now they are selling tickets and what has changed since July other than the infection rate has significantly increased thus making admission less likely than months ago.

Reality is that Waggott has botched sales yet again with a fiasco of a price rise, late to the party and then putting them on sale as infections were getting out of control again 

When 4th division Notlob have sold 7000 by August and we're struggling to sell 2000 by October you know we have serious problems.

And before anyone says what Bolton do is irrelevant no it isnt. They've had exactly the same issues and uncertainty as we have but were proactive with their sales and have hit a respectable level.

[HowieFive0]

21 minutes ago, JHRover said:

This is absolutely the whole issue explained perfectly.

All summer long Waggott and some fans have rubbished my suggestion to sell season tickets ASAP because 'the club didn't know what it was selling and couldn't guarantee entry'

So can anyone explain to me what the club is guaranteeing now they are selling tickets and what has changed since July other than the infection rate has significantly increased thus making admission less likely than months ago.

Reality is that Waggott has botched sales yet again with a fiasco of a price rise, late to the party and then putting them on sale as infections were getting out of control again 

When 4th division Notlob have sold 7000 by August and we're struggling to sell 2000 by October you know we have serious problems.

And before anyone says what Bolton do is irrelevant no it isnt. They've had exactly the same issues and uncertainty as we have but were proactive with their sales and have hit a respectable level.

Nothings changed ..the shrewd conservative fan who didnt want to give his money up weeks ago whilst people like yourself who were crying for the Club to release tickets so you could chuck money at something blindly have simply sat tight and waited.. the situation is the same.

At the moment ..this turns out to be the right decision for those who have waited and who want  to watch football in the stadium.

 

[chaddyrovers]

6 minutes ago, JHRover said:

This is absolutely the whole issue explained perfectly.

All summer long Waggott and some fans have rubbished my suggestion to sell season tickets ASAP because 'the club didn't know what it was selling and couldn't guarantee entry'

So can anyone explain to me what the club is guaranteeing now they are selling tickets and what has changed since July other than the infection rate has significantly increased thus making admission less likely than months ago.

Reality is that Waggott has botched sales yet again with a fiasco of a price rise, late to the party and then putting them on sale as infections were getting out of control again 

When 4th division Notlob have sold 7000 by August and we're struggling to sell 2000 by October you know we have serious problems.

And before anyone says what Bolton do is irrelevant no it isnt. They've had exactly the same issues and uncertainty as we have but were proactive with their sales and have hit a respectable level.

and now look at the situation where fans can't enter the stadium so they got Ifollow now which doesn't suit every fan does it. I understand that it the best offer Rovers could offer at this time. 

Are you happy with Ifollow as a back up to not being allow back to Ewood Park? can understand why some fans aren't so haven't bought one? 

Plus people circumstances have changes in the last few months. People not back to work yet and still on furlough not willing to spend money they might need. Or people like myself who are in process of being redundant or have been so can't afford it to buy one 

[JHRover]

4 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

and now look at the situation where fans can't enter the stadium so they got Ifollow now which doesn't suit every fan does it. I understand that it the best offer Rovers could offer at this time. 

Are you happy with Ifollow as a back up to not being allow back to Ewood Park? can understand why some fans aren't so haven't bought one? 

Plus people circumstances have changes in the last few months. People not back to work yet and still on furlough not willing to spend money they might need. Or people like myself who are in process of being redundant or have been so can't afford it to buy one 

You haven't answered any of my points.

What changed in mid September to enable Rovers to put tickets on sale that prevented them being on sale in June, July or August? What was so special about Tuesday 15th September? I'm not aware that the club was suddenly authorised to let fans into Ewood. Infact anyone following the news would have had less confidence of fans being allowed back into Ewood as we went through August into September.

I dont have a problem with the package Rovers are currently selling. I accept it is probably the best that they can do. I'd just like to know what was stopping them doing the same thing back in July before cases spiralled again. I do have a problem with the price, the approach the club is using and the diamond club thing.

 

[chaddyrovers]

28 minutes ago, JHRover said:

You haven't answered any of my points.

What changed in mid September to enable Rovers to put tickets on sale that prevented them being on sale in June, July or August? What was so special about Tuesday 15th September? I'm not aware that the club was suddenly authorised to let fans into Ewood. Infact anyone following the news would have had less confidence of fans being allowed back into Ewood as we went through August into September.

I dont have a problem with the package Rovers are currently selling. I accept it is probably the best that they can do. I'd just like to know what was stopping them doing the same thing back in July before cases spiralled again. I do have a problem with the price, the approach the club is using and the diamond club thing.

 

Hasn't Waggott said why he delay the decision so why keep asking the same question? 

Government was allowing fans trials in stadiums only a week ago. 

Do you accept why Rovers fans won't buy a season ticket now for various reasons like dont want Ifollow as a back up, or people circumstances have change since last season

Edited September 25, 2020 by chaddyrovers

[roversfan99]

Has JHRover at any point not accepted or indeed even mentioned that some fans wont buy a season ticket?

[Mattyblue]

1 hour ago, Stuart said:

The 100 club were asked to stump up for a club bus? Please tell me thats satire.

Venkys do realise they said the would honour the club that Jack built and not the one he bought, right?

Billionaire owners have turned a proud club into a begging bowl!

https://www.blackburnrovers100club.co.uk/newsStory.aspx?storyID=4&sectionID=1

and gym equipment...

https://www.rovers.co.uk/news/2020/february/100-club-ensure-rovers-are-well-equipped/

Oh and doing up the lounges and new nets...

https://www.rovers.co.uk/news/2017/november/academy-nets-100-club-boost/

Edited September 25, 2020 by Mattyblue

[Stuart]

24 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

https://www.blackburnrovers100club.co.uk/newsStory.aspx?storyID=4&sectionID=1

and gym equipment...

https://www.rovers.co.uk/news/2020/february/100-club-ensure-rovers-are-well-equipped/

Oh and doing up the lounges and new nets...

https://www.rovers.co.uk/news/2017/november/academy-nets-100-club-boost/

Shameless.

We are being run like a community-funded club, in the third tier, in the 80s. If we didn’t have Venkys taking the piss and an administrator on £300k it would be fair enough. £300k... most Blackburn folk would have to work about 10-15 years to earn that!

Absolutely shameless.

[Stuart]

Email from the club today:

”As a valued Season Ticket Holder last season, we have adapted our package to ensure watching Rovers is as fair and safe as possible for everyone in what we know are uncertain times.”

Patronising AF.

And I only have one week to take them up on this generous offer. That’s how valued I am.

Steve Kean

Decimating our team - Ryan Nelsen in traction

Relegation

Shebby Singh and the Aggers and Shelvey pantomime

Selling off our best players while promising to “absolutely honour the legacy of Jack Walker”

Stagnation and regression disguised as stability under Bowyer - having blown our best chance with negative, ambitionless football

Jason Lowe as captain of this club

Owen Fucking Coyle and the Burnley fans’ wet dream of ruining us

A second relegation to the third tier

The manager ‘recommending’ his pal from his previous club - a third tier outfit where both failed - as the next CEO

Promotion but with another price hike (season ticket holders weren’t as valued then obviously).

More “stability”

The unsackable manager despite the club’s worst EVER run of form

The CEO allegedly (and I believe the poster who said he heard it first hand) saying that the only way Mowbray is leaving is by his own volition.

“Defenders are coming” but they’ll be on the bench for a few weeks while they re-learn how to play football (if they don’t choose PNE first).

No STs available with a narrative that it’s because they don’t want to be unfair to fans. A last minute change of tack, a price increase and a guilt trip. And now, not only not having a rethink but doubling down on pursuing fans to take up this very poor offer under the pretence that it’s a great deal and that if I don't it will harn the club.

Every Summer I’ve renewed.

This Summer I feel that we have all been lied to and treated like fools happy to be parted with their money.

Enough is enough.

I wonder what the tipping point is for other fans. No discount next season? Or will people just “understand” and hand over their money.

Tell you what Steve: Leave or at the very least take a pay cut. I’ll renew as soon as you do.

#arewetogether

[RevidgeBlue]

2 hours ago, Stuart said:

Email from the club today:

”As a valued Season Ticket Holder last season, we have adapted our package to ensure watching Rovers is as fair and safe as possible for everyone in what we know are uncertain times.”

Patronising AF.

And I only have one week to take them up on this generous offer. That’s how valued I am.

Steve Kean

Decimating our team - Ryan Nelsen in traction

Relegation

Shebby Singh and the Aggers and Shelvey pantomime

Selling off our best players while promising to “absolutely honour the legacy of Jack Walker”

Stagnation and regression disguised as stability under Bowyer - having blown our best chance with negative, ambitionless football

Jason Lowe as captain of this club

Owen Fucking Coyle and the Burnley fans’ wet dream of ruining us

A second relegation to the third tier

The manager ‘recommending’ his pal from his previous club - a third tier outfit where both failed - as the next CEO

Promotion but with another price hike (season ticket holders weren’t as valued then obviously).

More “stability”

The unsackable manager despite the club’s worst EVER run of form

The CEO allegedly (and I believe the poster who said he heard it first hand) saying that the only way Mowbray is leaving is by his own volition.

“Defenders are coming” but they’ll be on the bench for a few weeks while they re-learn how to play football (if they don’t choose PNE first).

No STs available with a narrative that it’s because they don’t want to be unfair to fans. A last minute change of tack, a price increase and a guilt trip. And now, not only not having a rethink but doubling down on pursuing fans to take up this very poor offer under the pretence that it’s a great deal and that if I don't it will harn the club.

Every Summer I’ve renewed.

This Summer I feel that we have all been lied to and treated like fools happy to be parted with their money.

Enough is enough.

I wonder what the tipping point is for other fans. No discount next season? Or will people just “understand” and hand over their money.

Tell you what Steve: Leave or at the very least take a pay cut. I’ll renew as soon as you do.

#arewetogether

Good stuff Stuart.

But apart from that, you're fairly happy?

?

 

[RevidgeBlue]

8 hours ago, Hasta said:

51 pages summed up in 2 lines.

Yep.

[Stuart]

8 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Good stuff Stuart.

But apart from that, you're fairly happy?

?

If I don’t think about Waggott’s ST strategy, yes, good thanks.

[JHRover]

Does anyone know what happens after 2nd October? No more season tickets on sale? 

Where's the logic in a sales window lasting just over 2 weeks? 

[J*B]

1 hour ago, JHRover said:

Does anyone know what happens after 2nd October? No more season tickets on sale? 

Where's the logic in a sales window lasting just over 2 weeks? 

If I know this club, they’ll turn the single game iFollow pass off...

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

Just now, J*B said:

If I know this club, they’ll turn the single game iFollow pass off...

and sell Armstrong.