England

[chaddyrovers]

5 minutes ago, K-Hod said:

Forget Foden? Why on earth would we do that?

I meant I forgot Foden. 

[Oldgregg86]

1 hour ago, Traviscon said:

I wouldn't be playing Gomez. He's looked absolutely shocking for Liverpool this season, and against Wales the other night, his confidence is shot atm. 

Actually questions who's our best player to replace him? We don't have any world class centre halves (I include Maguire in that list too). 

Gomez is the best CB England have by a country mile

[joey_big_nose]

Well fair play we won it, had a very good second half. Both our goals were fortunate but we got them and once we were ahead they had very little opportunity second half.

Calvert-Lewin looks the real deal. We haven't had a proper target man like that in a long long time.

I guess a concern is we are accumulating a lot of good players now but there is not a lot of natural width. A lot of quite narrow players.

But anyway strong win. What I like about the nation's league is now we need to go to Belgium very soon for another competitive game. 

[chaddyrovers]

Delighted how we played second half and deserved the win. 

Mount was excellent second half. 

Could this nations league replace the Euro championships in the long term I wonder? 

[SBlue]

9 minutes ago, joey_big_nose said:

Well fair play we won it, had a very good second half. Both our goals were fortunate but we got them and once we were ahead they had very little opportunity second half.

Calvert-Lewin looks the real deal. We haven't had a proper target man like that in a long long time.

I guess a concern is we are accumulating a lot of good players now but there is not a lot of natural width. A lot of quite narrow players.

But anyway strong win. What I like about the nation's league is now we need to go to Belgium very soon for another competitive game. 

The pure “winger” is a dying breed - the preference in the modern game for “wide forwards” that cut inside a la Robben and are the second striker when the ball is on the other flank has been around for a while.

I just don’t think they train young players to be that touch line hugging, goal line crossing winger anymore. Much more likely to find a striker who can put a shift in and press with decent technique out there now over someone who will stay wide and whip in ball after ball. 

I assume the statistics on how effective that type of player actually is in practice must back it up?

Edited October 11, 2020 by S8 & Blue

[TugaysMarlboro]

8 minutes ago, Oldgregg86 said:

Gomez is the best CB England have by a country mile

Wouldn't have argued with you before this season. But so far he's been very poor this season. 

[joey_big_nose]

8 minutes ago, S8 & Blue said:

The pure “winger” is a dying breed - the preference in the modern game for “wide forwards” that cut inside a la Robben and are the second striker when the ball is on the other flank has been around for a while.

I just don’t think they train young players to be that touch line hugging, goal line crossing winger anymore. Much more likely to find a striker who can put a shift in and press with decent technique out there now over someone who will stay wide and whip in ball after ball. 

I assume the statistics on how effective that type of player actually is in practice must back it up?

True, but even in that context England have some exceptionally narrow players at the moment. Sancho and Sterling are the only two who can go the outside of a full back if they want to, .

The best "wide forwards" are those who can go inside or out like Mane, Salah, Duff, Robben etc. If the full back always knows you are going inside it makes you far less effective.

Just think it will be a problem if the opposition sit deep against us.

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

Delighted how we played second half and deserved the win. 

Mount was excellent second half. 

Could this nations league replace the Euro championships in the long term I wonder? 

I hope not. The nations league is moderately more important than friendlies but it does not have the same importance and feel compared to Euros which are concentrated within a summer. Does anyone overly care about the Nations League?

[chaddyrovers]

10 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I hope not. The nations league is moderately more important than friendlies but it does not have the same importance and feel compared to Euros which are concentrated within a summer. Does anyone overly care about the Nations League?

I thinks more competitive than boring European championship qualifiers about poor nations. I would give rid of Euros now. 

So nothing to say about England winning game tonight and second half performance? You are very happy to over criticise about the line up and 1st half performance? Why not praise Southgate and his players for winning the game in the end? 

[roversfan99]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

I thinks more competitive than boring European championship qualifiers about poor nations. I would give rid of Euros now. 

So nothing to say about England winning game tonight and second half performance? You are very happy to over criticise about the line up and 1st half performance? Why not praise Southgate and his players for winning the game in the end? 

International football is all about summer tournaments. All of the mid season breaks including nations league games are purely an ends to a means, a boring and unwelcome break to domestic football. 

Fair play to England, a good result, still dont think quite a few bits of the team including the formation are correct going forward but aided by a very lucky deflection its a impressive result.

[chaddyrovers]

6 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

 

Fair play to England, a good result, still dont think quite a few bits of the team including the formation are correct going forward but aided by a very lucky deflection its a impressive result.

Dont shoot dont score.

Mount impressive second half. 

[Mattyblue]

Get rid of the European Championships for this convoluted mess?!

You get rid of ‘boring friendlies’ by... not playing boring friendlies!

[Paul Mani]

Great result. Second half very strong...

individual comments - I like the formation because I don’t think we have 2 x cb’s that can do the job. I’d also play Coady over Dier. I don’t know what Rice brings to the party at all...reminds me of Keith Andrews as every game seems to pass him by. We need a CM who’s willing to pass forwards. Winks? Chilwell and Saka capable on the left and TAA on the right.

Excited with the forward options in Sancho, Kane, Sterling, Rashford, DCL, Grealish, Foden, Greenwood, Hudson Odoi etc ??

England have the potential to Dominate international football for a decade if they can find / develop a top CB (Terry / Ferdinand) and a top CM (Scholes / Gerrard)...I think Gomez and Maguire have potential to be excellent. Not sure on the CM options tbh...hopefully something coming through.

[philipl]

Didn't see the second half.

Was amazed when I saw the score based on the first half so all credit for the HT talk from Southgate.

[Mattyblue]

5 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

 

England have the potential to Dominate international football for a decade if they can find / develop a top CB (Terry / Ferdinand) and a top CM (Scholes / Gerrard)...I think Gomez and Maguire have potential to be excellent. Not sure on the CM options tbh...hopefully something coming through.

A golden generation, you could say?

Edited October 12, 2020 by Mattyblue

[Paul Mani]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

A golden generation, you could say?

I don’t think I’d ever want to use that term again after the Beckham, Scholes Lampard etc era which promised so much and delivered very little...

But yeah, I think we’re as close to being a top International side as we’ve been in 20yrs. The results indicate that too. You can’t imagine many international teams enjoy playing against our forwards now.

I feel we’re a couple of players off being the best and because of how young the group is, they’d be able to sustain it for a long time?

[Paul Mani]

10 minutes ago, philipl said:

Didn't see the second half.

Was amazed when I saw the score based on the first half so all credit for the HT talk from Southgate.

It was the tactical change which was most impressive. He tucked the wingbacks in which released the likes of mount and Rashford. Southgate is astute. Had Pep done that in a match and turned the result around the media would be drooling over him...

[Mattyblue]

I think we’ll do what we did under Sven, get to the business end of tournaments... but actually win them and ‘dominate for a decade?’

Not a chance, for me.

Edited October 12, 2020 by Mattyblue

[chaddyrovers]

7 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

It was the tactical change which was most impressive. He tucked the wingbacks in which released the likes of mount and Rashford. Southgate is astute. Had Pep done that in a match and turned the result around the media would be drooling over him...

Exactly Paul. 

Southgate is the best manager we had since Terry Venables. Best tournament result since 1996. 

Wasted millions Capello and Eriksson 40 million on them

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

25 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

 

England have the potential to Dominate international football for a decade if they can find / develop a top CB (Terry / Ferdinand) and a top CM (Scholes / Gerrard)...I think Gomez and Maguire have potential to be excellent. Not sure on the CM options tbh...hopefully something coming through.

Maguire is a carthorse. If world domination is dependant on him we're fooked. 

[RoverDom]

2 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

It was the tactical change which was most impressive. He tucked the wingbacks in which released the likes of mount and Rashford. Southgate is astute. Had Pep done that in a match and turned the result around the media would be drooling over him...

English managers don't get the same praise as foreign managers who are more exotic. 

Didnt big sam say if he was called Sam Allardici he'd be have managed a big club. He might have a point considering Toon fans hated him but loved Rafa.

[joey_big_nose]

2 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

Great result. Second half very strong...

individual comments - I like the formation because I don’t think we have 2 x cb’s that can do the job. I’d also play Coady over Dier. I don’t know what Rice brings to the party at all...reminds me of Keith Andrews as every game seems to pass him by. We need a CM who’s willing to pass forwards. Winks? Chilwell and Saka capable on the left and TAA on the right.

Excited with the forward options in Sancho, Kane, Sterling, Rashford, DCL, Grealish, Foden, Greenwood, Hudson Odoi etc ??

England have the potential to Dominate international football for a decade if they can find / develop a top CB (Terry / Ferdinand) and a top CM (Scholes / Gerrard)...I think Gomez and Maguire have potential to be excellent. Not sure on the CM options tbh...hopefully something coming through.

I think you are getting a bit carried away here! We've got a fantastic crop of attackers and midfielders - but then so have France, Italy, Belgium, Spain, Portugal, Germany, Netherlands. I wouldn't say there is much between any of those top countries. If you had to pick one as the strongest France is the obvious nation.

We've got some obvious weaknesses we need to sort out - Goalkeeper, Centreback both look weaker than the other top nations. And we also look vulnerable to what happened with the "golden generation" where we had a lot of good attacking players - Scholes, Gerrard, Lampard, Rooney, Joe Cole etc - but they all ultimately wanted to play in the central 10 role and ended up crowding each other out and we never looked a balanced team.

That said I have to agree England looked much much better after half time. It was tactically very clever switching the full backs inside. So huge credit to Southgate. Looking forward to the game in Brussels.

I thought this was a good summary of the half time tactical changes : https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skysports.com/amp/football/news/11096/12102076/england-2-1-belgium-how-gareth-southgates-half-time-tactical-changes-completed-comeback

Edited October 12, 2020 by joey_big_nose

[matt83]

Credit where it’s due much better 2nd half. That was only the 2nd time beaten a top ranked side with Spain the other. Still think that 4-3-3 used to play pre World Cup looked loads better. Personally I’d go something like 

                     Pope

T a-a    Coady    Gomez      saka

          Henderson        winks 
                         Foden 

              Sancho        Sterling
                            Kane

Pickford
McGuire
Chilwell
Trippier
Rice
Grealish
Rashford
Calvert-lewin

Depending who’s fit. 

[Paul Mani]

Just now, matt83 said:

Credit where it’s due much better 2nd half. That was only the 2nd time beaten a top ranked side with Spain the other. Still think that 4-3-3 used to play pre World Cup looked loads better. Personally I’d go something like 

                     Pope

T a-a    Coady    Gomez      saka

          Henderson        winks 
                         Foden 

              Sancho        Sterling
                            Kane

Pickford
McGuire
Chilwell
Trippier
Rice
Grealish
Rashford
Calvert-lewin

Depending who’s fit. 

I like that team and I think the players prefer 433 as it’s the formation they play mostly at club level.

Id pick Pope over Pickford and Chilwell over Saka but the main issue I have is at CB and I don’t see two who can adequately fill those positions. Gomez and Maguire most likely.

Having said that, I do think those three in midfield look very good, though I’d be tempted to play them as a flat 3 as Rovers do..

Front 3 is as good as any in world football imo.

[matt83]

8 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

I like that team and I think the players prefer 433 as it’s the formation they play mostly at club level.

Id pick Pope over Pickford and Chilwell over Saka but the main issue I have is at CB and I don’t see two who can adequately fill those positions. Gomez and Maguire most likely.

Having said that, I do think those three in midfield look very good, though I’d be tempted to play them as a flat 3 as Rovers do..

Front 3 is as good as any in world football imo.

There’s a few positions I could go any way on. But in terms of 4-3-3 I’d like to see it again. If we took the shackles off and took an almost Kegan at Newcastle from the 90s approach I think we could beat any side home or away. The trade off of course is could lose to anyone. But as a spectacle I reckon more would rekindle their interest in the national team