Watford v Rovers Wed 21st Oct 7.45pm

[yellowsubmarine]

Didn't catch the game as it was 3am here. But just saw the extended highlights.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oI1Mp4dze8k

Were we really that poor, we did had a few chances to score, but Foster made quite a few saves. Definitely much better than the last 2 games. Although the defence is worrying. Really not convinced by Lenihan so far this season. Ayala injury-prone. And wish we have gotten Kipre (and Ayala). Kipre is not even playing for Baggies.

Still optimistic once the key midfield comes back, Rothwell, Trybull and Travis, we will see less of Evans.

Wonder if Mowbray will look to find another free CB (from somewhere) instead of getting Downing in.

 

[Mattyblue]

Lenihan has always been fairly prosaic, but don’t know if it’s him playing on the left side to accomadate Ayala, but he’s looking very ponderous in possession and a mistake waiting fo happen.

[philipl]

I will take the positives.

We have more than competed with Bournemouth and Watford away despite the results.

Forest and Cardiff were two very poor performances. I know people are trying to say we were poor again last night but really..

In previous seasons we would see our best side play and lose like that occasionally and hope for a better window

This season, when fit, we have Dack, Travis, Rothwell, Trybull and Douglas already on the books who are an improvement on what we saw last night and Williams and JRC at least as good. The (probably forlorn) hope is Mowbray can pick the best team and knit them together.

Sorry but Johnson gives the ball away too much and failed to spot Elliott runs, Evans excellent performances are too rare and all the goals against came down Bell's side.

A word for Dolan. He didn't go past anybody because all opponents know to keep a pace back from him but he kept us in possession every touch. His passing is rock solid and I am now more confident of his development than I am in Buckley's who didn't even make the bench. Our players are not moving into positions to take advantage of the short passing opportunities opponents standing off Dolan are creating. Equally Mowbray asking Dolan to hug the touchline is missing the strength of Dolan to be able to go either way.

Wycombe won't be challenging, I don't think the much fancied Derby will be but would anybody be surprised if Bournemouth, Cardiff, Forest and Watford take 4 of the top 6 places this season? That said our record of D 1  L 3  against them is abysmal for a club with designs on promotion this season.

Coventry and Reading games now looking ridiculously important 

Edited October 22, 2020 by philipl

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

7 hours ago, DaveyB said:

That one was Brereton - the player that I keep reading on here offers no goal threat whatsoever 

You're right, he's prolific. 

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

42 minutes ago, yellowsubmarine said:

Didn't catch the game as it was 3am here. But just saw the extended highlights.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oI1Mp4dze8k

Were we really that poor, we did had a few chances to score, but Foster made quite a few saves. Definitely much better than the last 2 games. Although the defence is worrying. Really not convinced by Lenihan so far this season. Ayala injury-prone. And wish we have gotten Kipre (and Ayala). Kipre is not even playing for Baggies.

Still optimistic once the key midfield comes back, Rothwell, Trybull and Travis, we will see less of Evans.

Wonder if Mowbray will look to find another free CB (from somewhere) instead of getting Downing in.

 

1st goal was BB's fault for not tracking the runner.

Nyambe at fault for the 2nd for not tracking his runner. 

Utter shite from Lenihan for the 3rd.

If you can't do the basics away from home you've no chance. Shame because we look a very mobile unit going forward and we're going to play some good stuff this season. 

[Steptoe87]

7 hours ago, Sparks Rover said:

Fake news. He was and played like a 17 year old. Dolan too looked weak.  I'm worried about us relying on these 2...

Lenihan is a neanderthal of a footballer, no touch, no finesse...

The carthorse was a carthorse until he went lame again

Defence is fucked, teams like watford can waltz through.  Mowbray should go for this reason.

Really enjoyed watching Holtby, i take back any criticism and hope he stays fit.

Totally forgot Evans was on the pitch until he got subbed, i was open mouthed how he was so anonymous 

In the end, Mowbray makes the choices who he buys and how he spends his budget. Yet again we need to score 4 to win. 14th place is poor.

Mowbray out!

 

Agreed I said this when we signed Elliott and Dolan they will get found out neither of them put a decent cross in at all. Think it’s time for chapman to get a run of games every other player seems to have a run yet this kid doesn’t on tonight’s performance and the last few games I can’t see why not. 
mowbray is treading in thin ice a few more consecutive loses and he gets the sack he has taking the club as far as he can 

[Lancs Rover]

16 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

I agree...it’s not done and dusted mate. Far from it. But we haven’t been good enough to put that level of performance in for many years. Absolute domination away at a team like Watford with what 5 times our budget?

I’m just saying that with Dack, Rothwell, Trav, Trybull, Douglas to come back, I’m very excited to see where this team will finish. ??

In Elliott, Rothwell, Holtby and Dack we’ll have a better chance of beating teams who defend deep against us. There will be a few more after teams watch that tonight! 

Agreed. The sings are definitely there. I can understand people hesitating. 

But, I for one enjoyed watching us play. With better players to return and newbies looking the part, we're on the rise, watchable and an attacking mentality at last.

Dolan the only forward on the bench? There's a proven striker-shaped hole in our team. Without one, a tilt at promotion is much l ss likely.

We are going to see the measure of the V.s ambition in January, I think. 

[JacknOry]

We need Travis and Rothwell back and certainly Trybull in the team ASAP. Evans is Evans, half the player he is for his country (treats our games as warmups) and Johnson had two good games, one against the whipping boys, and another against his old team who he wanted to make a point to (who are in dire straits anyway) and since then he is back to what we know of him. Tbf, he works best in a midfield of Holtby and Rothwell who give the creativity and drive respectively but i'd still have Trybull in there for now until Travis gets back.

Douglas needs to be in next game (should have been this one as dont buy that he is not fit seeing as he has played in the PL this season and was part of the infamous Beisla training regimes). Lenihan has gone backwards, not sure if it is being partnered up with the outspoken (on the pitch at least) Ayala or the fact both are right-footed but so far it has not worked out between them.

Kaminski in the main has been OK but he has shown some weaknesses now. 

Elliott looked bright, intelligent and always trying to make something happen. Perhaps he tried a little too hard but I think he will be a good addition to our frontline. BB had a better game and that was a decent goal although not as fantastic as some made out. Bit of a howler from their keeper tbh. AA had another poor game. He has many of these but often pops up with a wonder goal out of nothing - which have dried up this season so far. 

Edited October 22, 2020 by JacknOry

[Bbrovers2288]

14 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

We need Travis and Rothwell back and certainly Trybull in the team ASAP. Evans is Evans, half the player he is for his country (treats our games as warmups) and Johnson had two good games, one against the whipping boys, and another against his old team who he wanted to make a point to (who are in dire straits anyway) and since then he is back to what we know of him. Tbf, he works best in a midfield of Holtby and Rothwell who give the creativity and drive respectively but i'd still have Trybull in there for now until Travis gets back.

Douglas needs to be in next game (should have been this one as dont buy that he is not fit seeing as he has played in the PL this season and was part of the infamous Beisla training regimes). Lenihan has gone backwards, not sure if it is being partnered up with the outspoken (on the pitch at least) Ayala or the fact both are right-footed but so far it has not worked out between them.

Kaminski in the main has been OK but he has shown some weaknesses now. 

Elliott looked bright, intelligent and always trying to make something happen. Perhaps he tried a little too hard but I think he will be a good addition to our frontline. BB had a better game and that was a decent goal although not as fantastic as some made out. Bit of a howler from their keeper tbh. AA had another poor game. He has many of these but often pops up with a wonder goal out of nothing - which have dried up this season so far. 

Good post 

[Exiled_Rover]

1 hour ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

1st goal was BB's fault for not tracking the runner.

Nyambe at fault for the 2nd for not tracking his runner. 

Utter shite from Lenihan for the 3rd.

If you can't do the basics away from home you've no chance. Shame because we look a very mobile unit going forward and we're going to play some good stuff this season. 

I knew someone would blame Brereton for the first goal. That's a team error.

The second goal - since when is Cleverley the RBs man? That's on our three CMs - one of them has to track the runner from midfield. It's why you can't play Evans and Johnson together - they're too immobile.

[BlackburnEnd75]

1 hour ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

 

Nyambe at fault for the 2nd for not tracking his runner.  

Naaaa not having that. Not his man.

Keeper got into a bad position, was backpedaling and not set when the initial shot comes in, thus he pushes the shot into a bad area.

[Sparks Rover]

1 hour ago, Tabula Rasa said:

With better players to return and newbies looking the part, we're on the rise,

We are actually on the downward slide mare, 14th last time I looked and still needing to score 4 to win.  

Which newbie looked the part? 

Same as the last few seasons but the happy clappers are happy cos theyve got new players...yay! Freebies and loans gets you nothing.

Edited October 22, 2020 by Sparks Rover

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

21 minutes ago, Exiled_Rover said:

I knew someone would blame Brereton for the first goal. That's a team error.

The second goal - since when is Cleverley the RBs man? That's on our three CMs - one of them has to track the runner from midfield. It's why you can't play Evans and Johnson together - they're too immobile.

BB didn't follow his man. Basic error.

Watch Holtby and Lenihan bollock Nyambe. They knew who's fault it was. 

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

18 minutes ago, BlackburnEnd75 said:

Naaaa not having that. Not his man.

Keeper got into a bad position, was backpedaling and not set when the initial shot comes in, thus he pushes the shot into a bad area.

Holtby and Lenihan were having it. They both bollocked Nyambe. 

[BlackburnEnd75]

9 minutes ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

Holtby and Lenihan were having it. They both bollocked Nyambe. 

Keeper more at fault for me 

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

9 hours ago, RoversClitheroe said:

3 in midfield is obviously what I meant.

We must have watched different games, all I watched was Evans and Johnson doing nothing.

Holtby creating and Lenihan and Ayala passing it between themselves and Kaminski.

Amazing we ended up these stats after passing it around the defence all night. Personally I thought we played well - except when it really counted.

Armstrong should have had a hat trick, Lenihan and Ayala should have both scored. Ultimately it was like the Bournemouth match - where we played well, but the extra quality in the final third (that only Premiership money can buy) undid us.

Edited October 22, 2020 by DavidMailsTightPerm

[LeftWinger]

Quite a lot of over-reactions on here as normal. Too many people seem to have extreme reactions to one result - win and we're getting promoted, lose and it's time for Mowbray to go.

Worth noting that we played pretty well against a fairly expensive side. Sarr cost them around £30m - and scored twice when they hammered a Liverpool side 3-0 at home earlier this year. A side that hadn't lost a domestic league game in 14 months. 

There's a long way to go yet.

Norwich had 5 points from their opening 6 games in 2018/19. They got 89 from their next 40 and finished 11 points above 3rd placed Leeds.

I'm not saying we'll achieve that, but we should be pushing for the play-offs. 

 

[Mercer]

2 hours ago, philipl said:

The (probably forlorn) hope is Mowbray can pick the best team and knit them together.

A word for Dolan. He didn't go past anybody because all opponents know to keep a pace back from him but he kept us in possession every touch. His passing is rock solid and I am now more confident of his development than I am in Buckley's who didn't even make the bench. Our players are not moving into positions to take advantage of the short passing opportunities opponents standing off Dolan are creating. Equally Mowbray asking Dolan to hug the touchline is missing the strength of Dolan to be able to go either way.

IMO, so true.

A ballsy decision needed very soon on Mowbray should the scores on the doors not rack up very soon otherwise it could be another season of treading water. 

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

10 hours ago, Ewood Ace said:

Sides will watch that, along with our other games this season and come to the same conclusion that Watford did. Sit back, let them have the ball and then take them apart on the counter.

Because League 1 is his level.

If that was their plan - it would have rebounded on them big style if we had taken our chances. We could have been 1 up before they scored.

[MarkBRFC]

9 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

I haven’t lauded the result. I’ve lauded the performance which as @Bbrovers2288 so eloquently put shows we have “the ingredients for a top season”

The ‘football man’ comment was a direct lift from his post...I just flipped it. Won’t have gone down too well but he’s a big boy.

But genuinely, only a layman looks at the result of a match...appreciate your opinion. We lost, it’s disappointing but WOW that was a very good performance and one that 9/10 times results in a convincing win. I’d have been disappointed with a draw!!

Not sure about that, I'd say we have played like that 5 times this season, Bournemouth, Newcastle, Wycombe, Derby & Watford, we won two of them and lost three. So we don't win playing like that 9/10 times at all. I also think you will be saying that exact same thing a few more times this season yet.

Still, it's the "best football ever played by a Rovers side" apparently.

 

 

9 hours ago, JHRover said:

My view of the game was it was a typical Rovers-Mowbray effort. Having experienced this sort of thing now for over 2 years at this level it is tiring and predictable. I had absolutely no belief or expectation we would get anything out of the game from the moment we went 1-0 down. At 2-0 it was game over and most of us knew it, deep down. 

The shed load of possession and nice play after that was in part afforded to us by Watford who had probably watched similar efforts from us v Cardiff and Forest and knew they could let us do it with little end product. 

All the possession and pressure and yet other than the penalty save and shot from outside the area Foster didn't have much to worry about in the second half.

Hand on heart time - if we had made it back to 2-2 or 3-3 does anyone genuinely believe we'd have come away with a point or all 3? I don't. I reckon it is more likely they'd have applied some pressure and we'd have crumbled at the first sign of it - see Bournemouth away when we contrived to lose despite twice doing the hard part and fighting back.

If your idea of enjoyment is watching us play pretty football, plenty of possession, passes, being easy on the eye, a few talented lads having a right good go then fine, enjoy away. We will get loads of plaudits in the press and from rival clubs because it goes down well with the purists who like to tune in and watch sides 'have a go'. We are also a team full of nice men. A nice bloke in the dugout who won't upset anyone, a team in his image of nice boys who all get on together and do things the "right way". Won't get promoted that way though. Ever.

My idea of enjoyment is watching us get points on the board whatever way necessary, being a well drilled hard to break down and beat unit, and show some semblance of a strategy and some adaptability in our approach to deal with the opposition - just a shame that we seem no nearer to such an approach.

I'd have enjoyed tonight 100x more if we had turned up, put 10 men behind the ball and ground out a 0-0 or 0-1 win playing with no ambition other than to ensure we didn't concede.

That might sound crazy to some but crazy to me is turning up at a side with Watford's quality and defensive record and thinking we are going to outscore them. They've had issues scoring goals - so start from there, build from a clean sheet and frustrating them. Instead we let them in with their first venture forward with acres of room to run into, followed by defensive clangers for their 2nd and 3rd. 

Mowbray thinks he is above all that sort of thing though so it won't change. So instead we will lurch from one extreme to the other with no consistency.

I'm tired of the ludicrous suggestion that we only conceded 3 times due to individual errors. The better teams don't make errors like that. They are coached out of it.

 

 

 

 

This is how I look at it, I can't really understand enjoying possession stats that don't go anywhere and end up losing the game.

Give me the bit in bold every time over last night.

[Mercer]

2 hours ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

1st goal was BB's fault for not tracking the runner.

Nyambe at fault for the 2nd for not tracking his runner. 

Utter shite from Lenihan for the 3rd.

If you can't do the basics away from home you've no chance. Shame because we look a very mobile unit going forward and we're going to play some good stuff this season. 

It's all about organisation and coaching and players understanding their roles.  It does not take almost four years to get this across - look at Big Sam, wherever he went, defensive issues were mitigated within days (remember his first match for us against Stoke).

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

Just now, MarkBRFC said:

Still, it's the "best football ever played by a Rovers side" apparently.

who on earth said that?!

[MarkBRFC]

1 minute ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

who on earth said that?!

@Paul Mani will be able to answer this one ?

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

The way reactions on here go from one extreme to the other - usually depending on result rather than performance has led me to one conclusion. TM needs to adopt a tag line of "Get Promotion Done" and the vast majority of fans on the forum will fall into line ?

[Sparks Rover]

15 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

I'm not saying we'll achieve that, but we should be pushing for the play-offs. 

We are closer to the bottom than top.  We let goals in for fun.  No way are we gong to push for promotion as it stands.  Defence is toilet