Brentford (A) - Saturday 5.12.20

[only2garners]

It was a straight red that was given, not a second yellow.

[Neal]

22 hours ago, joey_big_nose said:

 

Incidentally you can see from the way we were setup yesterday where Dack will fit in when he's back. He will play where Elliott was all game - straight through the middle with the strikers either side. Elliott seemed to struggle a bit for me in that role - probably the weakest performance we had out there - but I can see how it will be ideal for Dack who has more physically about him and a strikers instincts.

 

Sorry but this worries me more than anything, he's tried this before and it absolutely killed our season off. We should not, under any circumstances be moving Armstrong into any other position. 

[joey_big_nose]

54 minutes ago, Neal said:

 

Sorry but this worries me more than anything, he's tried this before and it absolutely killed our season off. We should not, under any circumstances be moving Armstrong into any other position. 

I'd rather have Dack central and Armstrong left than the other way around.

From what Ive seen this setup will be absolutely lethal.

                     Kaminski

Nyambe.   Lenihan.   Ayala.  Douglas. 

         Holtby.    Travis.    Rothwell

       Brereton.  Dack.    Armstrong.

Can't wait till we get there, probs not till Jan though. Top players in every position except left back where I think we look weak defensively.

Also to have the likes of Williams, Johnson, JRC, Elliott, Dolan and Gallagher on the bench is excellent. Also think Buckley and Davenport will offer more as the season progresses.

Edited December 7, 2020 by joey_big_nose

[roversfan99]

2 hours ago, joey_big_nose said:

I'd rather have Dack central and Armstrong left than the other way around.

From what Ive seen this setup will be absolutely lethal.

                     Kaminski

Nyambe.   Lenihan.   Ayala.  Douglas. 

         Holtby.    Travis.    Rothwell

       Brereton.  Dack.    Armstrong.

Can't wait till we get there, probs not till Jan though. Top players in every position except left back where I think we look weak defensively.

Also to have the likes of Williams, Johnson, JRC, Elliott, Dolan and Gallagher on the bench is excellent. Also think Buckley and Davenport will offer more as the season progresses.

I think the key question about that team would certainly be its balance rather than its quality. 

Im not sure there is enough defensive protection and discipline in that midfield as promising as it looks. Having Travis as the sitter does allow us to play an extra forward thinking midfielder but I think it could nullify Travis and restrict him, I do wonder if Johnson, Travis and Holtby or Rothwell is more likely.

I would also suggest that Elliott should be above Brereton in the pecking order and indeed I suspect that we have promised Liverpool that he will start most games when fit and available for us.

Fitting in and getting the best from our main 2 attackers will be the key question I think. Dack central and Armstrong left makes sense in theory but could also nullify both and it may take a change in shape to get them both central together.

Suppose there are some big questions but then again I suspect a best 11 may not be realistic for anyone this season with so many games and it may be about the squad which again may suit us.

[dingles staying down 4ever]

2 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I think the key question about that team would certainly be its balance rather than its quality. 

Im not sure there is enough defensive protection and discipline in that midfield as promising as it looks. Having Travis as the sitter does allow us to play an extra forward thinking midfielder but I think it could nullify Travis and restrict him, I do wonder if Johnson, Travis and Holtby or Rothwell is more likely.

I would also suggest that Elliott should be above Brereton in the pecking order and indeed I suspect that we have promised Liverpool that he will start most games when fit and available for us.

Fitting in and getting the best from our main 2 attackers will be the key question I think. Dack central and Armstrong left makes sense in theory but could also nullify both and it may take a change in shape to get them both central together.

Suppose there are some big questions but then again I suspect a best 11 may not be realistic for anyone this season with so many games and it may be about the squad which again may suit us.

Personally I think that Holtby and Rothwell will be the further forward of the midfield as one as the passing ability and the other has the ability to burst forward with the ball that neither Johnson or Travis has.

Dack has a long road back to fitness so I'd be amazed if it is anybody other than Chapman he will be replacing in the squad.  

[Neal]

4 hours ago, joey_big_nose said:

I'd rather have Dack central and Armstrong left than the other way around.

From what Ive seen this setup will be absolutely lethal.

                     Kaminski

Nyambe.   Lenihan.   Ayala.  Douglas. 

         Holtby.    Travis.    Rothwell

       Brereton.  Dack.    Armstrong.

Can't wait till we get there, probs not till Jan though. Top players in every position except left back where I think we look weak defensively.

Also to have the likes of Williams, Johnson, JRC, Elliott, Dolan and Gallagher on the bench is excellent. Also think Buckley and Davenport will offer more as the season progresses.

 

I just completely dislike anything that moves Armstrong out of where he's been performing, it's asking for trouble. He's quick on the counter and gives us an outlet, if Armstrong is out wide how much is he going to end up wasted in our own half tracking back? It suits him just staying up there. Dack simply doesn't have the pace, never mind after a serious injury. 

Also, we've watched Dack play false 9 and it was a disaster (Wigan & Preston Away). Maybe in this side it might work but based on the evidence, nah. 

[JacknOry]

Rothwell on wing does not work - rothwell in cm is showing us what we have been missing since he has been played out of poition

 

[JacknOry]

perfect balance is Rothwell, a DM and a creator like Holtby. Not sure which of the three Travis fits into as he has a bit of all. 

[dingles staying down 4ever]

12 minutes ago, JacknOry said:

perfect balance is Rothwell, a DM and a creator like Holtby. Not sure which of the three Travis fits into as he has a bit of all. 

Travis hasn't got the vision of Holtby nor the ability to carry the ball of Rothwell I dont think

[JacknOry]

Just now, dingles staying down 4ever said:

Travis hasn't got the vision of Holtby nor the ability to carry the ball of Rothwell I dont think

Exactly, he has a bit of all of them but not good enough to excel in any. 

[JacknOry]

I think Travis is better in a 4 man midfield tbh - we have some headaches lol. Travis and Dack, not sure how they will fit.

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

Just now, JacknOry said:

Exactly, he has a bit of all of them but not good enough to excel in any. 

Yet, none of them can impose themselves on a game like Travis can, or win the ball back like he can. 

[JacknOry]

1 minute ago, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

Yet, none of them can impose themselves on a game like Travis can, or win the ball back like he can. 

So what would you do with him?

Do you drop the drive in midfield of Rothwell, or the creativity in Holtby? 

Edited December 7, 2020 by JacknOry

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

Just now, JacknOry said:

So what would you do with him?

Play him in the right of the 3 CM's in a 4-3-3. Or as 1 of the 2 in a 4-2-3-1. He'd be the first name on the team sheet for me and i'll be amazed if he's not straight back in the team as soon as he's fit. 

[JacknOry]

Just now, Hoochie Bloochie Mama said:

Play him in the right of the 3 CM's in a 4-3-3. Or as 1 of the 2 in a 4-2-3-1. He'd be the first name on the team sheet for me and i'll be amazed if he's not straight back in the team as soon as he's fit. 

You didnt say who you would drop for him.

[dingles staying down 4ever]

As you say I dont think Travis fits the present formation to be fair but out of the three Id say it would be Johnson to make way.

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

Just now, JacknOry said:

You didnt say who you would drop for him.

Every other one of them. First name on the team sheet like I said. 

I think he's consistently very good and can get around the pitch and win the ball back like no-one else in the midfield can. He's also better passer then he's given credit for. Big fan of Travis, proper player as Souey would probably call him. 

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

Just now, dingles staying down 4ever said:

As you say I dont think Travis fits the present formation to be fair but out of the three Id say it would be Johnson to make way.

He fits it perfectly.

[Mike E]

As good as Rothwell has been, he'd be who I drop for Dack tbh.

Mid 3 would be: Holtby Travis Dack

[only2garners]

There was a fascinating article in yesterday's Observer about the effect of crowds on home performance. The conclusion that having a crowd only improved a home team's result by 3%. But there was a significant increase in the number of cards given by the referee with a crowd compared to BCD

In our first game with fans in it for months on Saturday we committed 8 fouls and picked up 6 cards. Brentford committed 11 and got three yellows. The good news is that, unless the Tiers change, we won't be playing in front of a crowd away from home in the league until QPR on 6th Feb.

[roversfan99]

I much preferred the feeling of watching a game in front of the crowd, it felt like it meant a little bit more again and it was less of a case of going through the motions. It also made the late equaliser a little sweeter. It is a shame IMO that we wont see fans watching our games again until February, well hopefully especially at Ewood we will.

You look at the fouls we committed, Lenihan's first was as clear a professional foul as you will see and once the foul was given for the second the red was always coming. Douglas and Rothwell also committed cynical fouls and Kaminski was talking ages with his goal kick and quite clearly had no arguments when the yellow was brandished, the only one to which any controversy could be attached was Johnson's.

[SBlue]

Dack should play the Holtby role, but he’ll get in the box a bit more. Dack 1st choice.

Travis is one of the best defensive midfielders in the league - Johnno becomes 2nd choice.

We’re gonna need this strength in depth as we already know.

And we will piss the league.

[Neal]

22 hours ago, Mike E said:

As good as Rothwell has been, he'd be who I drop for Dack tbh.

Mid 3 would be: Holtby Travis Dack

Wow... I'd have a think about that Mike. The 5 games he missed for us, we lost 4 and won 1. Critical player for us. 

[Mike E]

27 minutes ago, Neal said:

Wow... I'd have a think about that Mike. The 5 games he missed for us, we lost 4 and won 1. Critical player for us. 

Oh I know but I think Dack still Trumps Rothwell.

If not Rothwell, then he has to take a wing spot (perhaps in place of Brereton).

[Neal]

1 hour ago, Mike E said:

Oh I know but I think Dack still Trumps Rothwell.

If not Rothwell, then he has to take a wing spot (perhaps in place of Brereton).

Think Rothwell is crucial to the way we want to play on the counter. Transitions will be a lot slower without him.