The Contract Situation

[Exiled in Toronto]

I really don’t understand why the only two possible reasons for the three not having re-signed so far are ludicrously low offers and Mowbray.

For Lenihan and Rothwell, this the the last chance, IN THEIR ENTIRE LIVES, to substantially boost their income - no one will be offering them more next time round when they are in their early 30s. IMO they would be borderline insane to not test the market, and we would be borderline insane to offer them so much that they don’t even look.

[chaddyrovers]

Surprise this hasn't been posted anywhere but Right back James Brown has signed a new contract until 2024

https://www.rovers.co.uk/news/2022/march/02/brown-earns-new-deal-/

[47er]

9 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Will it rankle in Pune? Even if there is an element of public politics, im sure the main driver is money and the way we could have a much better chance of signing them is with more financial flexibility to be able to protect the assets.

They don't seem to care about losing assets for free, Mowbray suggested that he was open minded to selling Rothwell to avoid him going for free and bringing in a couple of players with that money, yet Venkys stubbornly prevented that scenario. 

Also, Buckley, Wharton, Carter and Rankin Costello all signed new deals in the last year as academy lads.

Venkys decided not to strengthen Bournemouth if you recall. No-one else was in for him.

[47er]

On 03/03/2022 at 04:42, JBiz said:

I was under the impression they’d been offered deals but rejected.

I think yuo missed this bit:

"In other news Pickering offered a contract offer as a reward for his progress"

[roversfan99]

27 minutes ago, 47er said:

Venkys decided not to strengthen Bournemouth if you recall. No-one else was in for him.

Venkys shouldnt be overruling the manager on transfer matters.

[47er]

11 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Venkys shouldnt be overruling the manager on transfer matters.

Bit late for that!

[Southside Rover]

Was there not a bid from America we rejected too?

[davulsukur]

11 hours ago, Southside Rover said:

Was there not a bid from America we rejected too?

Yer it was reported that there was interest from America, can't remember the club, Chicago River Fire?

[Miller11]

On 03/03/2022 at 16:56, chaddyrovers said:

You just got to look at the amount of players who are out of contract this summer and alot of players want to test the market and see what is out there. 

We are led to believe that the club have decided to operate with a model wherein we invest in the academy and/or “polish up”, in Mowbray’s own words, cheap signings, and sell them on at a profit.

Any comparisons to PSG or anyone else are irrelevant. The situation we are currently in represents a fundamental failure for us as a club to execute the basics of our supposed long term strategy. Again.

If we lose three of our best prospects for nothing while still stuck in the Championship we can’t just shrug it off.

Edited March 5, 2022 by Miller11

[chaddyrovers]

1 hour ago, Miller11 said:

We are led to believe that the club have decided to operate with a model wherein we invest in the academy and/or “polish up”, in Mowbray’s own words, cheap signings, and sell them on at a profit.

Any comparisons to PSG or anyone else are irrelevant. The situation we are currently in represents a fundamental failure for us as a club to execute the basics of our supposed long term strategy. Again.

If we lose three of our best prospects for nothing while still stuck in the Championship we can’t just shrug it off.

Aren't we investing in our academy every seasons and bringing through players like Buckley, Travis, Wharton, Carter, etc under Mowbray over the last couple of seasons? Maybe you missed that bit. 

Best prospects? Lenihan and Rothwell are in the last 20's and have one good contract leave or move to another club for bigger wages. 

We have been in talks with Lenihan, Rothwell and Nyambe for near 2 years where we have made them improve contracts and they have decide to not sign them. Nyambe and his agent have stop engaging with the club over new contract talks. If his agent think he can get him a better deal and club elsewhere then thats Nyambe's decision to make. 

[Miller11]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

Aren't we investing in our academy every seasons and bringing through players like Buckley, Travis, Wharton, Carter, etc under Mowbray over the last couple of seasons? Maybe you missed that bit. 

Best prospects? Lenihan and Rothwell are in the last 20's and have one good contract leave or move to another club for bigger wages. 

We have been in talks with Lenihan, Rothwell and Nyambe for near 2 years where we have made them improve contracts and they have decide to not sign them. Nyambe and his agent have stop engaging with the club over new contract talks. If his agent think he can get him a better deal and club elsewhere then thats Nyambe's decision to make. 

Find a narrative you like and relentlessly repeat. It’s all you ever do.

No, I hadn’t missed the fact we’ve brought players through from the academy. Being aware of the fact was pretty central to the point I’m making - A point you seem determined to miss.

Whatever the reasons for the current situation with Nyambe, Lenihan and Rothwell, the fact is if we lose them for nothing our “model” has failed badly.

[chaddyrovers]

11 hours ago, Miller11 said:

Find a narrative you like and relentlessly repeat. It’s all you ever do.

If you saying that about myself then myself look at yourself who is similar at blaming the club for these 3 players not signing new contract here given that 2 of those in late 20's and will have one more move in them to get to PL and potential bigger pay day

11 hours ago, Miller11 said:

Whatever the reasons for the current situation with Nyambe, Lenihan and Rothwell, the fact is if we lose them for nothing our “model” has failed badly.

No its ain't a failure of the model at all. 3 players have decide to test the free agent market which is their right. We have been in talks for nearly 2 years over new contracts and we have failed to agree terms. 

Given that for last 2 years barely any club has been linked with any of the 3 of them so why is that? 

[Mattyblue]

Crap then, are they?

[JHRover]

I find it incredible the lengths some will go to try and find a narrative, excuse or explanation they can settle on that will absolve the owners, club or staff of any responsibility or wrongdoing

At least 3 good players are set to leave the Club in a couple of months for £0. 3 players we have invested a lot of time, money and patience in improving and getting to a stage where other Championship clubs would love to have them in their ranks.

I personally believe this is just the latest stage in a monumental cock up overseen by neglectful, disinterested, unfit owners and cowboys installed to run the club on their behalf. 

I could almost accept the shambles that is coming our way this summer - most of the squad out of contract/loan - if:
a) The people responsible for it also left

b) It was going to get the club to a break even or profitable level

c) Lessons were learned and new contracts resolved very quickly for the others who will follow next year

I don't think any of those 3 things will happen and come the end of the year it will still be Waggott here, still telling people talks are ongoing with players, some people still swallowing his crap and somehow the club still losing bucket loads of cash.

Its like in January. They want us to believe that any significant expenditure on fees or loans would have compromised our FFP position. Yet I simply don't accept that when we sold Armstrong last summer for £15 million and will sell Brereton this summer for at least the same amount. They could have invested in proven players to get us over the line. Chose not to and now we are seeing the results of it. The only shame is the ease with which they have hoodwinked people into believing 'we did all we could'. They didn't. Just like they didn't on the contracts, just like they haven't on tickets and attendances.

Edited March 6, 2022 by JHRover

[chaddyrovers]

3 hours ago, JHRover said:

I find it incredible the lengths some will go to try and find a narrative, excuse or explanation they can settle on that will absolve the owners, club or staff of any responsibility or wrongdoing

At least 3 good players are set to leave the Club in a couple of months for £0. 3 players we have invested a lot of time, money and patience in improving and getting to a stage where other Championship clubs would love to have them in their ranks.

Some people could say that turn around on people who will look to blame the club at every opportunity available

3 hours ago, JHRover said:

Its like in January. They want us to believe that any significant expenditure on fees or loans would have compromised our FFP position. Yet I simply don't accept that when we sold Armstrong last summer for £15 million and will sell Brereton this summer for at least the same amount. They could have invested in proven players to get us over the line. Chose not to and now we are seeing the results of it.

We did made bids for Barnsley Midfielder Callum Styles for 1.5 million which bid was accepted by them but he wanted to stay at Barnsley to help them survived. I can respect that decision actually. We also had a bid accepted by Peterborough for Dembele for 1.5 million and we held talks with him but he went to Bournemouth. Can Rovers be blame for either of those situation? 

[JHRover]

14 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Some people could say that turn around on people who will look to blame the club at every opportunity available

We did made bids for Barnsley Midfielder Callum Styles for 1.5 million which bid was accepted by them but he wanted to stay at Barnsley to help them survived. I can respect that decision actually. We also had a bid accepted by Peterborough for Dembele for 1.5 million and we held talks with him but he went to Bournemouth. Can Rovers be blame for either of those situation? 

The club is at least in part responsible for all the issues though. You seem incapable of apportioning any responsibility on Venkys, Rovers or Waggott.

I'm not interested in retrospective claims of big money being thrown around. I think you are falling for the same old trap Waggott and Mowbray have laid every transfer window. 

Could have, should have, would have. Didn't.

There is a long old queue of names of players and supposed bids that have been made or contract offers made that ultimately fail to come to anything. 

Another reminder that you don't get points, prizes or results for trying and failing. You get it for doing.

You don't get credit for trying to sign someone from bottom club Barnsley. You get credit by signing them and them making a difference to the team. 

We didn't sign him, end of story. Might as well have bid for Messi because the outcome is the same. It costs nothing to be interested in a player. 

Yes we can be blamed for it - if we were so keen on Dembele we would have made an acceptable offer and got him, or moved on and got another target. Not waited until the last day of the window when there's no time to do anything else and Bournemouth's interest was probably already known.

[chaddyrovers]

42 minutes ago, JHRover said:

The club is at least in part responsible for all the issues though. You seem incapable of apportioning any responsibility on Venkys, Rovers or Waggott.

I'm not interested in retrospective claims of big money being thrown around. I think you are falling for the same old trap Waggott and Mowbray have laid every transfer window. 

Could have, should have, would have. Didn't.

There is a long old queue of names of players and supposed bids that have been made or contract offers made that ultimately fail to come to anything. 

Another reminder that you don't get points, prizes or results for trying and failing. You get it for doing.

You don't get credit for trying to sign someone from bottom club Barnsley. You get credit by signing them and them making a difference to the team. 

We didn't sign him, end of story. Might as well have bid for Messi because the outcome is the same. It costs nothing to be interested in a player. 

Yes we can be blamed for it - if we were so keen on Dembele we would have made an acceptable offer and got him, or moved on and got another target. Not waited until the last day of the window when there's no time to do anything else and Bournemouth's interest was probably already known.

Well if that's your attitude and reaction I will leave it there, 

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

Some people could say that turn around on people who will look to blame the club at every opportunity available

We did made bids for Barnsley Midfielder Callum Styles for 1.5 million which bid was accepted by them but he wanted to stay at Barnsley to help them survived. I can respect that decision actually. We also had a bid accepted by Peterborough for Dembele for 1.5 million and we held talks with him but he went to Bournemouth. Can Rovers be blame for either of those situation? 

Is the Styles bid now a fact?

Even with Dembele, their chairman did come out (unprofessionally again) and say that we had a bid accepted, but we don't know the details. 1.5m, is that true, or was it less? We don't know. Plus was it a deal lined up if Rothwell was to leave? We don't know.

Fact of the matter is we spent around 700k, thats it. Don't focus on ifs but and maybes, judge on what we do, not what we could have done.

[chaddyrovers]

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

Is the Styles bid now a fact?

I'm posted the article last week in the forum. Do you have any information that Styles bid is not true? 

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

Even with Dembele, their chairman did come out (unprofessionally again) and say that we had a bid accepted, but we don't know the details. 1.5m, is that true, or was it less?

The Peterborough Chairman was open and honest with people and their fanbase something you seem to have a problem with. 

Considering that we have a bid accepted by Peterborough Confirmed by him that they accepted 3 bids for him why would it be less than 1.5 million price mentioned in the media? Considering that Birmingham and Bournemouth bids were 1.5 million pounds

[RoversClitheroe]

3 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Some people could say that turn around on people who will look to blame the club at every opportunity available

We did made bids for Barnsley Midfielder Callum Styles for 1.5 million which bid was accepted by them but he wanted to stay at Barnsley to help them survived. I can respect that decision actually. We also had a bid accepted by Peterborough for Dembele for 1.5 million and we held talks with him but he went to Bournemouth. Can Rovers be blame for either of those situation? 

Yeah so effectively the management failed to replace Armstrong again?! 

In my opinion, we had an absolute stinker in the transfer window. 

Huge over reliance on Brereton, we were obviously desperate for another striker and we did sweet FA. 

[roversfan99]

Weird how its solely down to management incompetence that Armstrong was never replaced rather than budget constraints, yet even if it was merely a case of the management not getting deals over the line, that money never seems to get spent in subsequent windows.

[Waggy76]

25 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Weird how its solely down to management incompetence that Armstrong was never replaced rather than budget constraints, yet even if it was merely a case of the management not getting deals over the line, that money never seems to get spent in subsequent windows.

What is Hedges doing ???

A very odd , transfer that one .

[roversfan99]

10 minutes ago, Waggy76 said:

What is Hedges doing ???

A very odd , transfer that one .

I would certainly have liked to have seen him more. That being said, suppose you are limited trying to improve a Championship attack with 200k.

[islander200]

10 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I would certainly have liked to have seen him more. That being said, suppose you are limited trying to improve a Championship attack with 200k.

He wasnt limited to 200k though was he?

Bid confirmed for Dembele and that bid that was accepted must have been the fee Bournemouth paid for him as they were hardly going to pay more than the fees agreed with us and Birmingham.

[tomphil]

Unfortunately as this league now seems to show most seasons you won't get promotion on the cheap. Having got yourselves right in the mix on the cheap however, surely not asking much to invest a bit and try and get over the line.

I don't want any spiel about breaking the bank or ffp either as we aren't talking about 10 million. Just a few quid in wages for a proven player on loan, they are out there. Our lot just aren't bold enough though it's literally just been bring a few in to boost numbers and hope something clicks.

So so predictable we'd end up in the situation we are in now so we just have to pray we plunder the odd goal and continue collecting clean sheets.