Stoke City v Rovers (a) Sat. 19th Dec. 3pm

[philipl]

Two big issues with Gallagher.

- first touch not good enough

- instinctive positioning/anticipation not there. Seems to me he has to make slow conscious decisions by which time opportunities are gone

Both faults militate against him using his obvious physical advantages to lead the line and I think Mowbray compensates for them by sending Gallagher wide where he gets a fraction more time to get in control of the ball and has less options to weigh up.

The problem is the nearer the touchline he is, the worse he plays.

The best of Gallagher is when he runs the inside right channel.

As has been pointed out, with a fully fit squad, it is debatable if he is in the 20 on merit and is some way of being an automatic starter. 

Armstrong, Dack, Brereton, Elliott cannot all start together and I challenge anyone to make a case for Gallagher starting ahead of anyone of those 4. Then I'd bring Dolan on as an impact sub before Sam. And we have Butterworth, Vale and Chapman to develop.

 

 

[TheRoversReturn]

20 hours ago, JBiz said:

I think anyone who would compare TMs impact with Steve Keans either doesn’t remember history or is simply a dingle on the wind up

Lol, heck of a straw man argument there...I'm impressed! 

The point was that a manager cannot be questioned because he has been in the game for a long time. Steve Kean has had three decades in the game, including working at Fulham in the premiership and Rovers under Allardyce. The exact words were "I don't pretend to know more about football than a guy who has been in the game over 40 years like some on here." If Mowbray is so infallible, then why wasn't he good enough for League One Coventry City? Why do Celtic fans consider him one of their worst ever managers? Mowbray's been a decent manager for us (promotion season, stablising us after years of haplessness, recruited many good 'uns) but to suggest we can't even question his playing Gallagher on the wing because he has some kind of papal infallibility due to those "40 years" in the game is just a logical fallacy. In fact, the name of that particular fallacy is called Appeal to Authority and was also a favourite of a certain Graeme Souness with his put your medals on the table jibe whenever football journalists had the temerity to do their job and ask him questions about the football.

As for the last ten or so words...if you say so. Sorry if you don't like other Rovers fans having different opinions than you, but it doesn't make them any lesser Rovers fans nor dingles nor history amnesiacs whatever you say or think.

Peace Out, fellow Roverite! 

Edited December 22, 2020 by TheRoversReturn

[47er]

21 hours ago, TimmyJimmy said:

My two pennies worth is that I like Gallagher. Like all players theres improvement to be made but he has a real drive and energy i like.

I think he is a confidence player. I bumped into him at Ewood after a match and said that I thought he'd played really well. He beamed like it meant so much to hear that and he thanked me. He looked really made up.

He's going to get goals if we play him in the right positions and feed him. Reading negative stuff on social media does I suspect affect him badly. Maybe thats why the other players were so protective of him after the newspaper article.

 

I agree with this. Why did so many fans bend over backwards to find good in Brereton but almost no-one minds writing off Gallagher.

To be consistent we should be postponing judgement until he's had a good run in the centre. No wonder if his confidence is shot playing out wide possibly for the only time in his life.

I watched him a few times for Southampton and thought he wasn't Premier League but he'd be alright for us as he was when he came on loan.

One feature no-one can deny---he works so hard for the team every game, never gives up. Something there for a good manager to build on.

Edited December 22, 2020 by 47er

[JBiz]

2 hours ago, TheRoversReturn said:

Lol, heck of a straw man argument there...I'm impressed! 

The point was that a manager cannot be questioned because he has been in the game for a long time. Steve Kean has had three decades in the game, including working at Fulham in the premiership and Rovers under Allardyce. The exact words were "I don't pretend to know more about football than a guy who has been in the game over 40 years like some on here." If Mowbray is so infallible, then why wasn't he good enough for League One Coventry City? Why do Celtic fans consider him one of their worst ever managers? Mowbray's been a decent manager for us (promotion season, stablising us after years of haplessness, recruited many good 'uns) but to suggest we can't even question his playing Gallagher on the wing because he has some kind of papal infallibility due to those "40 years" in the game is just a logical fallacy. In fact, the name of that particular fallacy is called Appeal to Authority and was also a favourite of a certain Graeme Souness with his put your medals on the table jibe whenever football journalists had the temerity to do their job and ask him questions about the football.

As for the last ten or so words...if you say so. Sorry if you don't like other Rovers fans having different opinions than you, but it doesn't make them any lesser Rovers fans nor dingles nor history amnesiacs whatever you say or think.

Peace Out, fellow Roverite! 

I’m sure we all knew what your point was.

Suggesting someone has experience in a certain role, is a bit different to (ironically a strawman) suggesting it’s the same as someone being “in the sport” .
 

It’s also absolutely stupid - since I could’ve been a kit man for 40 years and it wouldn’t make me suitable for anything but... being a good kit man? Sheesh.

As for your other “straw fire” questions; Coventry have been just “naturally shit” haven’t they, only the most average manager would’ve struggled with them (since the mid 90s 👀).. PS that’s sarcasm.

Why would I care what Celtic fans think secondly? I think Mark Hughes is / was a great manager but I’m not sure City, QPR or Southampton fans agree. Equally you mention Souness - why not ask Newcastle about his abilities.

Why are you apologising by the way? You don’t have to be sorry for your opinion, just accept that I have a low opinion of anyone who thinks playing a player on the wing is akin to ostracising a whole fanbase through being over promoted and a “wee crook”

[Tom Stinny]

I don't know Mowbray on any personal level so there's no like or dislike but how long does a slow build take. The only question that should ever be asked of a manager is can they hit a target set. Our has to be promotion because Venkys surely won't continue to run at huge losses forever and Rovers are in massive debt. 

 

It's promotion or bust for me and I can confidently say Mowbray won't ever get us promoted. He doesn't have it in him.

[TheRoversReturn]

46 minutes ago, JBiz said:

I’m sure we all knew what your point was.

Suggesting someone has experience in a certain role, is a bit different to (ironically a strawman) suggesting it’s the same as someone being “in the sport” .
 

It’s also absolutely stupid - since I could’ve been a kit man for 40 years and it wouldn’t make me suitable for anything but... being a good kit man? Sheesh.

As for your other “straw fire” questions; Coventry have been just “naturally shit” haven’t they, only the most average manager would’ve struggled with them (since the mid 90s 👀).. PS that’s sarcasm.

Why would I care what Celtic fans think secondly? I think Mark Hughes is / was a great manager but I’m not sure City, QPR or Southampton fans agree. Equally you mention Souness - why not ask Newcastle about his abilities.

Why are you apologising by the way? You don’t have to be sorry for your opinion, just accept that I have a low opinion of anyone who thinks playing a player on the wing is akin to ostracising a whole fanbase through being over promoted and a “wee crook”

Crap, I've been busted!

You win, you sage you. That's EXACTLY what I meant. When I mentioned Kean as a riposte to the assertion by a poster that Mowbray's having 40 years in the game meant that fans on here shouldn't question his decisions as it's not like playing "FIFA 20 on your Playstation" I thought I'd get away with it. But no, you understood perfectly...I was secretly suggesting that playing Gallagher "on the wing is akin to ostracising a whole fanbase through being over promoted and a “wee crook”. You're good. I was comparing their personalities, their hairstyles, their dodgy sides, their nationalities. Everything. Then again, as I'm someone who "doesn’t remember history or is simply a dingle on the wind up" - in fact, I'm both! - so, I suppose it could be worse as I'll forget it the next time I'm walking to the Dingledome with my sister.

I'd type more but I'm a bit too depressed now. Can't think of much worse than being on the end of a JBiz low opinion. Talk about hitting rock bottom in life.  

[JBiz]

8 minutes ago, TheRoversReturn said:

Crap, I've been busted!

You win, you sage you. That's EXACTLY what I meant. When I mentioned Kean as a riposte to the assertion by a poster that Mowbray's having 40 years in the game meant that fans on here shouldn't question his decisions as it's not like playing "FIFA 20 on your Playstation" I thought I'd get away with it. But no, you understood perfectly...I was secretly suggesting that playing Gallagher "on the wing is akin to ostracising a whole fanbase through being over promoted and a “wee crook”. You're good. I was comparing their personalities, their hairstyles, their dodgy sides, their nationalities. Everything. Then again, as I'm someone who "doesn’t remember history or is simply a dingle on the wind up" - in fact, I'm both! - so, I suppose it could be worse as I'll forget it the next time I'm walking to the Dingledome with my sister.

I'd type more but I'm a bit too depressed now. Can't think of much worse than being on the end of a JBiz low opinion. Talk about hitting rock bottom in life.  

One thing I do enjoy is sarcasm 😆 

[Bigdoggsteel]

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11938/12169590/jose-mourinho-tottenham-boss-urges-authorities-to-look-into-stoke-away-dressing-room-ahead-of-carabao-cup-clash

 

This is interesting. I didn't hear any comments from Rovers on it 

[philipl]

3 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11938/12169590/jose-mourinho-tottenham-boss-urges-authorities-to-look-into-stoke-away-dressing-room-ahead-of-carabao-cup-clash

 

This is interesting. I didn't hear any comments from Rovers on it 

I cannot remember who but Championship clubs have complained about it.

[Bigdoggsteel]

3 minutes ago, philipl said:

I cannot remember who but Championship clubs have complained about it.

In a way I think Stoke are dead right. This is commonly done for GAA and it's intentional. Coming to your ground should be difficult for the opposition. 

I would be interested to see how bad it was. Not very I would wager. 

[philipl]

https://www.ft.com/content/c85a6be0-533d-4c57-b5c7-a6084a139a77?segmentId=bf7fa2fd-67ee-cdfa-8261-b2a3edbdf916

You won't be surprised to learn it was Neil Warnock criticising the portacabin as a pig stye.

It does sound unhygenic and disgusting from the description.

[Bigdoggsteel]

9 minutes ago, philipl said:

https://www.ft.com/content/c85a6be0-533d-4c57-b5c7-a6084a139a77?segmentId=bf7fa2fd-67ee-cdfa-8261-b2a3edbdf916

You won't be surprised to learn it was Neil Warnock criticising the portacabin as a pig stye.

It does sound unhygenic and disgusting from the description.

I'm not posh enough to have a subscription to the FT 😂😔

[simongarnerisgod]

to give them a sense of reality,opposition teams should be forced to change in the nearest pub and walk to the ground

[philipl]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I'm not posh enough to have a subscription to the FT 😂😔

https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/sport/18924455.stoke-city-1-middlesbrough-0/

That is what the attachment should have been.

[Exiled in Toronto]

30 minutes ago, philipl said:

https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/sport/18924455.stoke-city-1-middlesbrough-0/

That is what the attachment should have been.

Carbon copy of our match report.

[Bigdoggsteel]

2 hours ago, philipl said:

https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/sport/18924455.stoke-city-1-middlesbrough-0/

That is what the attachment should have been.

My god. Sounds familiar. Interesting the reaction of the Boro players to their antics ,far more fiery than us. As if they really give a damn. Also representitive of their manager. The opposite of us in the game against Rotehrham when we were losing and the ball went out for a throw and nobody would get it. 

Edited December 22, 2020 by Bigdoggsteel

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

Bollox to Stoke, let's batter the Wendies! 

Edited December 22, 2020 by Hoochie Bloochie Mama

[Exiled in Toronto]

50 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

My god. Sounds familiar. Interesting the reaction of the Boro players to their antics ,far more fiery than us. As if they really give a damn. Also representitive of their manager. The opposite of us in the game against Rotehrham when we were losing and the ball went out for a throw and nobody would get it. 

But being fiery and giving a damn didn’t stop them and their fiery manager losing by exactly the same score we did.

[tomphil]

Fair play to Stoke they have a style, a real ugly one but it's theirs they know what they are doing. They appear to be good at it and so far it's beginning to pay off.

Lets see where they finish, no doubt if they finish above us it'll be put down to budget in some quarters.

[Bigdoggsteel]

3 minutes ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

But being fiery and giving a damn didn’t stop them and their fiery manager losing by exactly the same score we did.

No,indeed it didn't ,but I bet you over a season having that attitude will lead to battling to more points. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 minute ago, tomphil said:

Fair play to Stoke they have a style, a real ugly one but it's theirs they know what they are doing. They appear to be good at it and so far it's beginning to pay off.

Lets see where they finish, no doubt if they finish above us it'll be put down to budget in some quarters.

He's certainly capitalising on having no crowd. If we got into the play offs playing like that, I wouldn't care, but I'm sure some fans would. 

[tomphil]

13 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

He's certainly capitalising on having no crowd. If we got into the play offs playing like that, I wouldn't care, but I'm sure some fans would. 

I think they are used to it down there Stoke have been an ugly team as long as i can remember.  They'd tried to get away from it a bit i think but this guy has got them back to what they are used to. 

As for here yes damn right fans would moan but winning would keep a lid on it. Being pragmatic wouldn't work now though with what we have we are far too powder puff under Tony nice guys.  

[TheRoversReturn]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

He's certainly capitalising on having no crowd. If we got into the play offs playing like that, I wouldn't care, but I'm sure some fans would. 

Not sure if most of our fans would complain at all. When Hughes and Allardyce came in we were staring down the barrel at relegation. Both focused on making us hard to beat and hard to score against. It was only when we were safe and able to bring in some signings that we started to play more. O'Neill's doing the same. In a year he's taking them from the relegation zone to the play offs and the quarter final of the cup. They have just as many injuries than us but aren't 'waiting for Dack and Trav to rescue our season'.

While that has been happening, Mowbray has had us standing still despite half a dozen players being brought in. We had some who wanted Allardyce out even when he took us from the brink of relegation to tenth in the Premiership the next season, but most fans were happy enough by then. We were also showing some signs of improving as a team to watch.

Needs must. 

 

 

[Bigdoggsteel]

On 22/12/2020 at 23:43, TheRoversReturn said:

Not sure if most of our fans would complain at all. When Hughes and Allardyce came in we were staring down the barrel at relegation. Both focused on making us hard to beat and hard to score against. It was only when we were safe and able to bring in some signings that we started to play more. O'Neill's doing the same. In a year he's taking them from the relegation zone to the play offs and the quarter final of the cup. They have just as many injuries than us but aren't 'waiting for Dack and Trav to rescue our season'.

While that has been happening, Mowbray has had us standing still despite half a dozen players being brought in. We had some who wanted Allardyce out even when he took us from the brink of relegation to tenth in the Premiership the next season, but most fans were happy enough by then. We were also showing some signs of improving as a team to watch.

Needs must. 

 

 

Ya, but what Stoke do is way more grim than we played under Hughes or Allardyce. What would their fans be singing if they were watching them? 

Look,as I said , if we played it , it would be all about the result and they are currently the ones outside the play offs on goal difference. We aren't too far behind though 

[roversfan99]

Is watching Stoke that bad? Cant say I watch them every week but against us, they scored an early goal and with an injury ravaged team and amidst a hectic schedule, they did what they needed to do and we never looked like scoring as a result.