Brockhall STC - planning permission application ?

[islander200]

2 hours ago, Ulrich said:

You are making assumptions, and assumptions are the mother of all.......

11 years of this crap and you think they will do the right thing? What on earth is that based on, previous actions? They will sell the club and keep it, build houses and make more money out of us.

Out of interest would you take losing the training ground to get rid of Venkys if that was the plan? To sell the club and then sell on the training ground?

There has been no suggestion whatsoever that they are looking to sell the club unfortunately

[tomphil]

3 hours ago, Ulrich said:

But we have sold it Rev BRFC no longer owns it, venkys do. They may own us but if they sell the club?

I wonder why this new company has 3 directors if it's just a vehicle to hold the asset for the Rao's on behalf of the club ?

[JBiz]

2 hours ago, Crimpshrine said:

I'm not sure there is a covenant on the STC but there may be on the lower / academy area.

Remember there are already detailed plans for 170 houses and an application for planning permission on the STC land. When the original plans were halted Waggott said they would not be following up on the plans 'in their current form'.

I doubt they would have done all that prep work if building on the land was not a real possibility. And they also fought the ACV proposal. I'm still worried.

I’m always worried with the Rao’s.

The planning permission included new football facilities, hence why it probably passed rules on its usage.

To me this just “concretes” how much money we’re losing to need such methods to avoid financial sanctions. 

 

[tomphil]

26 minutes ago, islander200 said:

Out of interest would you take losing the training ground to get rid of Venkys if that was the plan? To sell the club and then sell on the training ground?

There has been no suggestion whatsoever that they are looking to sell the club unfortunately

Could be a crafty way of transferring ownership bit by bit to new investors.

What if anything do we know about the new names on the new company ?

[perthblue02]

48 minutes ago, tomphil said:

Could be a crafty way of transferring ownership bit by bit to new investors.

What if anything do we know about the new names on the new company ?

Ketan S Ranade , company secretary of Venkateshwara Hatcheries PVT Limited appointed in 2016

Prashant L Gomashe , Accounts Manager Venky's India Ltd appointed May 2002

Rohan A Bhagwat, Company secretary Venky's India Ltd appointed Dec 2010

 

 

Edited October 29, 2021 by perthblue02

[tomphil]

9 minutes ago, perthblue02 said:

Ketan S Ranade , company secretary of Venkateshwara Hatcheries PVT Limited appointed in 2016

Prashant L Gomashe , Accounts Manager Venky's India Ltd appointed May 2002

Rohan A Bhagwat, Company secretary Venky's India Ltd appointed Dec 2010

 

 

The money go round.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

2 hours ago, tomphil said:

Could be a crafty way of transferring ownership bit by bit to new investors.

Hmmmmmmm🤔

[den]

6 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

1st point, as you say, Venky's own BRFC so in reality there's no practical difference.

2nd point, if the Club were ever sold I would expect that the STC would also be included in the sale free of any incumbrances I.e. any outstanding mortgage.

This is the point that the Fans Forum/ Trust/any other interested party need clarification and reassurances on.

There is a difference Rev.

1) Venkys have removed the STC completely from their BRFC company and placed it in a separate company. 

2) we have no idea if they would include the STC in the sale of the football club. Until and unless we know that to be true, the doubts and mistrust will continue.

3) what the club were to tell the trust or FF would be totally worthless anyway in the event of a sale.

Isnt that the crux of the problem?

Edited October 29, 2021 by den

[broadsword]

4 hours ago, islander200 said:

Out of interest would you take losing the training ground to get rid of Venkys if that was the plan? To sell the club and then sell on the training ground?

There has been no suggestion whatsoever that they are looking to sell the club unfortunately

I'd paint my clackersack with dayglo shellac and run from lands end to John ogroats in a dracula outfit 🧛‍♂️ if it meant getting rid of them Venky's. 

Edited October 29, 2021 by broadsword

[Ulrich]

10 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Glad to see you're not making any assumptions then!

We no longer own our training ground, of course that's a positive. Wake up Rev.

[Ulrich]

10 hours ago, islander200 said:

What would have stopped them just selling the STC directly to a developer down the line?

Why did they have to set up a new company ,inject 16.6 million into the club to use the site for housing?

Now they make all the money regardless of whether they own us or not. Perhaps the plan to build houses made them realise how much they could reap from building on that land, its hardly as if our staff don't have interests in property development is it?

Stop trying to see positives in venkys, there are none.

[Ulrich]

8 hours ago, tomphil said:

I wonder why this new company has 3 directors if it's just a vehicle to hold the asset for the Rao's on behalf of the club ?

Who knows, 3 way split on the millions the houses will make??

[Wheelton Blue]

5 hours ago, den said:

There is a difference Rev.

1) Venkys have removed the STC completely from their BRFC company and placed it in a separate company. 

2) we have no idea if they would include the STC in the sale of the football club. Until and unless we know that to be true, the doubts and mistrust will continue.

3) what the club were to tell the trust or FF would be totally worthless anyway in the event of a sale.

Isnt that the crux of the problem?

There's no difference whatsoever.

If the owners decide to sell the club, it's irrelevant if the STC is on the books of the club or the new company.

In the case of the former, they could have excluded the STC from any sale anyway, and just kept it for themselves.

Conversely, in the case of the latter, they could insist that the STC is part of a sale of the club.

At the end of the day, the Venkys still own the STC, irrespective of whether it's an asset of BRFC or an asset of the new company. It's their's to do with as they please either way.

Edited October 29, 2021 by Wheelton Blue

[islander200]

6 hours ago, Ulrich said:

Now they make all the money regardless of whether they own us or not. Perhaps the plan to build houses made them realise how much they could reap from building on that land, its hardly as if our staff don't have interests in property development is it?

Stop trying to see positives in venkys, there are none.

Im not trying to see positives.

Everything points towards it being done for FFP yours is just a theory that it is some underhand way of making money backed up with no evidence.Despite the fact in their whole time here there is nothing to suggest here for a quick buck.141 million.

They have spent money that is a fact wether you like it or not.

That is all im stating not trying to see positives you condacending fool i want them out as much as anyone!

 

[islander200]

9 hours ago, Ulrich said:

We no longer own our training ground, of course that's a positive. Wake up Rev.

The owners could have done what they wanted with the STC regardless of them selling it to their own company

[Mike E]

I'm one of the first people to highlight the bad things Venkys have done, and by no means is selling the training ground even close to a good thing. It was also entirely avoidable!

HOWEVER. In the circumstances, I think it's actually one of the least bad things they've done.

I don't actually believe this is anything to do with gain for themselves, and it is just an accountancy trick.

But I'm still pissed off we're in a position where this managed decline may have been necessary, and that is of their own making.

Edited October 30, 2021 by Mike E

[RevidgeBlue]

9 hours ago, Wheelton Blue said:

There's no difference whatsoever.

If the owners decide to sell the club, it's irrelevant if the STC is on the books of the club or the new company.

In the case of the former, they could have excluded the STC from any sale anyway, and just kept it for themselves.

Conversely, in the case of the latter, they could insist that the STC is part of a sale of the club.

At the end of the day, the Venkys still own the STC, irrespective of whether it's an asset of BRFC or an asset of the new company. It's their's to do with as they please either way.

Just about sums it up.

[RevidgeBlue]

8 minutes ago, Mike E said:

I'm one of the first people to highlight the bad things Venkys have done, and by no means is selling the training ground even close to a good thing. It was also entirely avoidable!

HOWEVER. In the circumstances, I think it's actually one of the least bad things they've done.

I don't actually believe this is anything to do with gain for themselves, and it is just an accountancy trick.

But I'm still pissed off we're in a position where this managed decline may have been necessary, and that is of their own making.

That's fair as well. Shouldn't have got to that stage in the first place. Mowbray and Waggott shouldn't have mismanaged the finances and the owners should have kept a much closer eye on them and nipped it in the bud at an earlier stage.

[Gav]

6 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

That's fair as well. Shouldn't have got to that stage in the first place. Mowbray and Waggott shouldn't have mismanaged the finances and the owners should have kept a much closer eye on them and nipped it in the bud at an earlier stage.

We were under a transfer embargo due to FFP in 2015, Mowbray and Waggot were nowhere near the club.

The buck stops with the owners.

I'd be interested to know if this new era that yourself and others have alluded to over recent months had wind of this sell off? 

 

Edited October 30, 2021 by Gav

[CrouchingNunhiddenCucumber]

7 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

That's fair as well. Shouldn't have got to that stage in the first place. Mowbray and Waggott shouldn't have mismanaged the finances and the owners should have kept a much closer eye on them and nipped it in the bud at an earlier stage.

Essentially, what you're saying is that you're pro Steve Kean.

[RevidgeBlue]

4 minutes ago, Gav said:

I'd be interested to know if this new era that yourself and others have alluded to over recent months had wind of this sell off?

 

Hi Gav, 

I wasn't aware of this development until it broke this week.

However I'm as certain as I can be at this point that it is merely an accounting exercise.

I think it's an indication of the owners continuing commitment to the Club. I'm particularly pleased that Brockhall is still under Club ownership and I don't see any way it will ever be transferred to an external  3rd party or Housing Development Company now.

If people want to take it the opposite way that's up to them.

[RevidgeBlue]

5 minutes ago, CrouchingNunhiddenCucumber said:

Essentially, what you're saying is that you're pro Steve Kean.

What? 

Why?

[CrouchingNunhiddenCucumber]

Just now, RevidgeBlue said:

What? 

Why?

By placing most of the blame of our current plight on Mowbray, you're alluding to everything being tickety boo before he turned up. 

[Gav]

2 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Hi Gav, 

I wasn't aware of this development until it broke this week.

However I'm as certain as I can be at this point that it is merely an accounting exercise.

I think it's an indication of the owners continuing commitment to the Club. I'm particularly pleased that Brockhall is still under Club ownership and I don't see any way it will ever be transferred to an external  3rd party or Housing Development Company now.

If people want to take it the opposite way that's up to them.

After a failed attempt to sell off half the training ground, 6 months later we now find the facility moved to a bogus company for creative accounting and nobody was aware of the move until it happened? 

The true test of everything that these bonkers owners do is, would John Williams and Jack Walker have done the same, I don't need to answer that for anyone I'm sure.

I just hope that the lack of investment in the team, the lack of contract offers to key players and the general downgrading of everything that is Blackburn Rovers, signals some sort of shift in the Venky position, a shift towards the exit door and pronto.

Before anyone asks how will we survive, I couldn't care less, we die as a club with this lot at the top, I'd roll that dice today If I could. 

Venkys out.

 

[tomphil]

Presumably the money for this went into VLL seeing as that owns and funds the club ?

How do we know it all gets put into the club ?

Is it even a cash transaction or just the owners taking it back as personal security for funds already spent on the club ?

There are loads of scenarios that could apply here even if they aren't remotely dodgy.

Edited October 30, 2021 by tomphil