Summer transfer window 2021.

[roversfan99]

On 27/07/2021 at 13:00, J*B said:

15m excluding add ons. He’s gone. 

Is he the player that you expect to be absent tomorrow night?

[magicalmortensleftpeg]

Won’t miss Rothwell if he goes. Too inconsistent. He’s had enough chances in various positions. 
 

Armstrong would be a shame but we can’t turn down that kind of money. As a club in the Championship, buying low and selling high is the only sustainable model to operate under. Look at how Dack’s value changed with one injury. £15m+ is reasonable. 

[islander200]

On 27/07/2021 at 10:48, Mike E said:

But it is them who've had 2 years to coach him on this aspect or drop him.

Well they have left him out loads of times.Even now I wouldn't call Rothwell a regular.

I'm not disputing he has talent but I certainly don't believe if he left us tomorrow all of a sudden his numbers would improve dramatically.His goals and assist record is poor and I don't think that all the blame can be layed at our management and coaching team.Rothwell has to take some responsibility, he does take the wrong option and he lacks discipline and intelligence when it comes to his positioning

 

 

[roversfan99]

https://www.rovers.co.uk/news/2021/july/Gallery-Leading-up-to-Leeds/

Pictures ahead of the Leeds game. Armstrong training, as is Travis which is good from a fitness perspective, and as are Gallagher, Brereton and Dolan. Limited pictures, no Nyambe, Rothwell or Chapman though.

[phili]

On 27/07/2021 at 13:51, islander200 said:

Well they have left him out loads of times.Even now I wouldn't call Rothwell a regular.

I'm not disputing he has talent but I certainly don't believe if he left us tomorrow all of a sudden his numbers would improve dramatically.His goals and assist record is poor and I don't think that all the blame can be layed at our management and coaching team.Rothwell has to take some responsibility, he does take the wrong option and he lacks discipline and intelligence when it comes to his positioning

 

 

So let's say he goes to Sheffield United and helps them get promoted with lets say 10 assists and 5 goals.

Would we then be allowed to say it is our training and utilisation of players that is the problem? I think a lot of it gets coached out of our players to play the supposed possession based football. I think players like Rothwell who thrive on confidence are just scared now to follow their natural game incase dropped or get the blame for trying to make things happen.

Look at Travis, when he broke through he was an impressive box to box player, very similar to Bryan Robson in many ways. In the past 2 years he has become a shadow of his former self, more in mold of Evans, pass it side ways at all costs and don't drive with the ball.

[islander200]

On 27/07/2021 at 14:04, phili said:

So let's say he goes to Sheffield United and helps them get promoted with lets say 10 assists and 5 goals.

Would we then be allowed to say it is our training and utilisation of players that is the problem? I think a lot of it gets coached out of our players to play the supposed possession based football. I think players like Rothwell who thrive on confidence are just scared now to follow their natural game incase dropped or get the blame for trying to make things happen.

Look at Travis, when he broke through he was an impressive box to box player, very similar to Bryan Robson in many ways. In the past 2 years he has become a shadow of his former self, more in mold of Evans, pass it side ways at all costs and don't drive with the ball.

Rothwell was in and out of League one Oxfords side before he came here.

I'm not claiming our coaching isn't as issue but in respect to Rothwell his decision making is still as poor as when he first joined.

If he left and joined another team and his numbers improved dramatically then I would hold my hands up and say I got it wrong.But I don't see that happening.He is 26 years old and am yet to see him being consistent

[Sparks Rover]

On 27/07/2021 at 14:04, phili said:

So let's say he goes to Sheffield United and helps them get promoted with lets say 10 assists and 5 goals.

Would we then be allowed to say it is our training and utilisation of players that is the problem? I think a lot of it gets coached out of our players to play the supposed possession based football. I think players like Rothwell who thrive on confidence are just scared now to follow their natural game incase dropped or get the blame for trying to make things happen.

Look at Travis, when he broke through he was an impressive box to box player, very similar to Bryan Robson in many ways. In the past 2 years he has become a shadow of his former self, more in mold of Evans, pass it side ways at all costs and don't drive with the ball.

One of the best posts for a while.

 

[Pedro]

On 27/07/2021 at 00:50, neophox said:

Rothwell haven't seen eye to eye with Rovers manager team.. 

This is the same with Travis, isn't it?

 

I don't blame them. I've had enough of their tinkering, gutless attitude, poor defensive set up and pratting about in their own half style.  Last season was the biggest missed opportunity since we had Bowyer in charge of a very decent squad.  Now, we are eleven players down.

[roversfan99]

On 27/07/2021 at 14:04, phili said:

So let's say he goes to Sheffield United and helps them get promoted with lets say 10 assists and 5 goals.

Would we then be allowed to say it is our training and utilisation of players that is the problem? I think a lot of it gets coached out of our players to play the supposed possession based football. I think players like Rothwell who thrive on confidence are just scared now to follow their natural game incase dropped or get the blame for trying to make things happen.

Look at Travis, when he broke through he was an impressive box to box player, very similar to Bryan Robson in many ways. In the past 2 years he has become a shadow of his former self, more in mold of Evans, pass it side ways at all costs and don't drive with the ball.

Has Travis ever been a box to box player in the mould of Bryan Robson? He has always been a rather industrious and energetic player with technical limitations, he was off the pace last season having struggled to get match fit after a serious injury, but I have always found this notion that he was once box to box and is now like a crab afraid of being blamed for being too expressive a little strange.

That is one hell of an if regarding Rothwell too. Last season, he played almost every game that he was available for, from the start and in a central position that he desired. He still produced very little even with many of the excuses that he hid behind prior to be removed.

I am not defending our coaching in that it may well not be the best by any stretch of the imagination, but neither of these examples could I put with any certainty down to poor coaching. Maybe both could go on to do better at other clubs with better coaching and a better calibre of team mates but I don't think that either is an obvious case of mismanagement. 

[alex l]

Re the £15m Watford reported offer, I interpreted that as £15m inclusive of the value of Gray, who quite frankly would smash our wage structure. If it was £15m cash up front, I'd say take it and leave Gray out of it. 

[phili]

On 27/07/2021 at 14:38, roversfan99 said:

Has Travis ever been a box to box player in the mould of Bryan Robson? He has always been a rather industrious and energetic player with technical limitations, he was off the pace last season having struggled to get match fit after a serious injury, but I have always found this notion that he was once box to box and is now like a crab afraid of being blamed for being too expressive a little strange.

That is one hell of an if regarding Rothwell too. Last season, he played almost every game that he was available for, from the start and in a central position that he desired. He still produced very little even with many of the excuses that he hid behind prior to be removed.

I am not defending our coaching in that it may well not be the best by any stretch of the imagination, but neither of these examples could I put with any certainty down to poor coaching. Maybe both could go on to do better at other clubs with better coaching and a better calibre of team mates but I don't think that either is an obvious case of mismanagement. 

To be honest i am not sure if any of our players have actually improved since Mowbray has been here and i would class most players as mismanaged as none of them suit a possession based game plan. Ours fit a quick/counterattacking based system.

We used to be so good at signing the likes of Rothwell (probably as close to Bentley as we now get) and turning them into world beaters that it really is depressing when we are having these discussions.

If you look at how good our coaching team used to be and yet now we have a League Two based setup. Even MK Dons and Oxford have more qualified and experienced coaches than we have and i never thought i would write that down. Look how well Ainsworth coached his League One/Two players last season at Wycombe to within 1 point of staying up. Ours just don't have a clue.

[roversfan99]

On 27/07/2021 at 14:55, phili said:

To be honest i am not sure if any of our players have actually improved since Mowbray has been here and i would class most players as mismanaged as none of them suit a possession based game plan. Ours fit a quick/counterattacking based system.

We used to be so good at signing the likes of Rothwell (probably as close to Bentley as we now get) and turning them into world beaters that it really is depressing when we are having these discussions.

If you look at how good our coaching team used to be and yet now we have a League Two based setup. Even MK Dons and Oxford have more qualified and experienced coaches than we have and i never thought i would write that down. Look how well Ainsworth coached his League One/Two players last season at Wycombe to within 1 point of staying up. Ours just don't have a clue.

I totally agree that our tactics make no sense, our team is not technically anywhere near the best in this league so it makes no sense

Bentley was a really well regarded talent at Arsenal so whilst I appreciate that you wasnt trying to directly compare, it is all about the individuals. Rothwell in the first year had the excuse that he didnt play enough, and in the second year that he wasnt playing centrally. Last season he played regularly and centrally but was no more productive. Could he have been coached better? Perhaps but maybe the player is not as good as we think, one of many with some excellent attributes but lacks perhaps the footballing brain/intelligence to ever put it together regularly and consistently. Mind you, with a squad so short, he is a sure fire starter for the opening day should he stay.

[JHRover]

I don't think £15 million is a good deal for Armstrong. It may be the best we can get, but it isn't a good deal and I really hope the revisionists and rose tinted spectacle wearers out there don't start making out like it is.

Armstrong should be £20 million minimum. He ticks just about every box there is to tick when it comes to totting up the value of a player: young, pace, excellent fitness record, no major injuries, knows where the back of the net is and perhaps most importantly English.

The fact that he is English, he is good at his job of scoring goals and has at least 8-10 years left in the tank adds a massive premium on his price (or at least should). 

Unfortunately we've wiped that premium out by allowing this situation to unfold. 

So much for buying low and selling high - this policy only works if you ensure that when the players come good you are protected and can maximise your return. Allowing millions of pounds to slip through your fingers - money that could ensure FFP compliance, enable a rebuild or replace the pitch at Ewood - is criminal. 

[roversfan99]

On 27/07/2021 at 15:02, JHRover said:

I don't think £15 million is a good deal for Armstrong. It may be the best we can get, but it isn't a good deal and I really hope the revisionists and rose tinted spectacle wearers out there don't start making out like it is.

Armstrong should be £20 million minimum. He ticks just about every box there is to tick when it comes to totting up the value of a player: young, pace, excellent fitness record, no major injuries, knows where the back of the net is and perhaps most importantly English.

The fact that he is English, he is good at his job of scoring goals and has at least 8-10 years left in the tank adds a massive premium on his price (or at least should). 

Unfortunately we've wiped that premium out by allowing this situation to unfold. 

So much for buying low and selling high - this policy only works if you ensure that when the players come good you are protected and can maximise your return. Allowing millions of pounds to slip through your fingers - money that could ensure FFP compliance, enable a rebuild or replace the pitch at Ewood - is criminal. 

Yeah it definitely wouldn't be a good deal in general, it would be an unfortunately reduced deal due to a self inflicted weak negotiating position.

That being said, one thing that can not be allowed to happen under any circumstances is that he leaves for free.

[Sparks Rover]

On 27/07/2021 at 14:45, alex l said:

Re the £15m Watford reported offer, I interpreted that as £15m inclusive of the value of Gray, who quite frankly would smash our wage structure. If it was £15m cash up front, I'd say take it and leave Gray out of it. 

He was twice the player Armstrong is when I last saw him...and has scored a few at PL level. And he was an England player not long ago.....I've not seen him for a season or so, has something happened to him...?

Edited July 27, 2021 by Sparks Rover

[roversfan99]

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/19471899.blackburn-rovers-running-make-adam-reach-first-signing/

Contract offer in for Adam Reach. Would be mixed on this one, good age with experience at this level, has the technical ability to score goals and create goals, but not well thought of at his previous club amid suggestions of cowardice and bottling tackles in a relegation fight! Certainly a downgrade on Elliott but at least he would be a permanent signing.

Could be a bit of an acid test, if this one slips away as well then it really would not look good.

[roversfan99]

On 27/07/2021 at 15:09, Sparks Rover said:

He was twice the player Armstrong is when I last saw him...and has scored a few at PL level. And he was an England player not long ago.....I've not seen him for a season or so, has something happened to him...?

He has played for England C, which I think is non-league only, certainly not a full England player. Currently at the Gold Cup with Jamaica although I think they may have been knocked out.

[windymiller7]

On 27/07/2021 at 15:14, roversfan99 said:

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/19471899.blackburn-rovers-running-make-adam-reach-first-signing/

Contract offer in for Adam Reach. Would be mixed on this one, good age with experience at this level, has the technical ability to score goals and create goals, but not well thought of at his previous club amid suggestions of cowardice and bottling tackles in a relegation fight! Certainly a downgrade on Elliott but at least he would be a permanent signing.

Could be a bit of an acid test, if this one slips away as well then it really would not look good.

For once, just once could we not just sign a player who has no previous connections to either Mowbray or Boro (or both!)!!

[davulsukur]

On 27/07/2021 at 15:24, windymiller7 said:

For once, just once could we not just sign a player who has no previous connections to either Mowbray or Boro (or both!)!!

Got to that part of the article, rolled my eyes and scrolled straight past.

[toogs]

On 27/07/2021 at 13:41, magicalmortensleftpeg said:

He’s had enough chances in various positions

Which could well be why he hasn't succeeded here due to terrible management by his manager.

I'm wondering who we can afford that are better.

 

[RoversClitheroe]

Imagine swapping Rothwell for Reach 😂 awful business.

[roversfan99]

The Rothwell one is very much the result of a random guessing game, but even if he did leave, surely Reach is more of a replacement for the void filled by Elliott.

[islander200]

On 27/07/2021 at 15:45, roversfan99 said:

The Rothwell one is very much the result of a random guessing game, but even if he did leave, surely Reach is more of a replacement for the void filled by Elliott.

 

On 27/07/2021 at 15:43, RoversClitheroe said:

Imagine swapping Rothwell for Reach 😂 awful business.

Reach has better numbers than Rothwell anyway.Yeah he has had a poor couple of seasons and the Sheffield Wednesday fans don't rate him,but a lot was going on at the time, players not getting paid their wages etc.

Pre the last two years Reach was rated in this division,did enough to secure a 5 million move whilst we would be lucky to get £500k for Rothwell

[Tugayisgod]

On 27/07/2021 at 15:14, roversfan99 said:

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/19471899.blackburn-rovers-running-make-adam-reach-first-signing/

Contract offer in for Adam Reach. Would be mixed on this one, good age with experience at this level, has the technical ability to score goals and create goals, but not well thought of at his previous club amid suggestions of cowardice and bottling tackles in a relegation fight! Certainly a downgrade on Elliott but at least he would be a permanent signing.

Could be a bit of an acid test, if this one slips away as well then it really would not look good.

WBA must be considered favourites if they are seriously in for him, both in terms of salary and Premier league ambition. So wouldn't be a shock if he signed for them, but a pleasant surprise if he chose us

[bluebruce]

On 27/07/2021 at 16:07, Tugayisgod said:

WBA must be considered favourites if they are seriously in for him, both in terms of salary and Premier league ambition. So wouldn't be a shock if he signed for them, but a pleasant surprise if he chose us

Then they can never play him like with Kipre.