Summer transfer window 2021.

[Sparks Rover]

15 minutes ago, JoeH said:

They're two totally different footballers playing in different positions... For someone who works within the sport you do baffle me sometimes! 

No they aren't, both play in the middle.  We miss that biting midfielder to compliment Travis and Rothwell, so it is a viable question to pose.   No need for a personal dig my friend.  Only a message board and it's only a question of which youngster is better....

[J*B]

26 minutes ago, JoeH said:

- I don't think the Venky's were actively trying to sell Brockhall, I think the CEO was. I don't think they care enough or are informed enough to have orchestrated that at all.
- I don't think they would know that Ewood Park is covered in rust. If somebody called them and asked for £3,000 to pay a company to clean the stadium and surrounding areas they'd probably be surprised anybody bothered to enquire at such a tiny figure. But I highly doubt that call/request has been made.
- I don't think the Venky's take direct control over staffing numbers, I think the CEO does.
- Same as above.
- The club programme doesn't make us any money. It's sadly a dying art, and whilst I sympathise with those who will miss it, I can understand why the shift to digital is happening. Again I don't think the Venky's will even know about it though. If someone made a call/request to continue to fund this, at a small cost in the grand scheme of things, I don't think they'd say no - but again, I highly doubt that call has been made.

All in all, my response to every point you make here is that I don't think it's the Venkys who the anger should be aimed at. All of those issues are day-to-day running issues, which are managed by other people. Whenever the management at the club have gone to Venkys and asked for something, they seem to have got it. £7m for Ben Brereton a month or two after coming up from League One? "Sure", they say. £5m on Sam Gallagher after not getting near promotion? "Why not?" they respond. 

Every point you make is valid, frustrating and correct. However, they're not the direct result of an unwillingness to spend from the owners though in my mind. I really just don't think they a) are aware enough b) care enough and c) are kept informed enough.

They are billionaires with money to burn. £22m a season in losses is a drop in the ocean to them. 

Venkys employ one of their own people (Pasha) to keep them aware and informed of what is going on. I don’t care who you are, no CEO in the world can sell a businesses biggest asset without telling the owner of the business. I just can’t buy that. So that just leaves option B - they don’t care, in which case, why bother?

At best it’s neglect. At worst it’s corruption. Wherever this sits on a sliding scale between neglect and corruption, the management, board and owners all need to go. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, J*B said:

Venkys employ one of their own people (Pasha) to keep them aware and informed of what is going on. I don’t care who you are, no CEO in the world can sell a businesses biggest asset without telling the owner of the business. I just can’t buy that. So that just leaves option B - they don’t care, in which case, why bother?

At best it’s neglect. At worst it’s corruption. Wherever this sits on a sliding scale between neglect and corruption, the management, board and owners all need to go. 

None of this in any way relates to the topic of the conversation though? We're talking about Venky's willingness to spend money and I think there's far too much evidence of them throwing money at Rovers to suggest that they've suddenly turned off the tap for no explained reason.

[Sparks Rover]

1 minute ago, J*B said:

Venkys employ one of their own people (Pasha) to keep them aware and informed of what is going on. I don’t care who you are, no CEO in the world can sell a businesses biggest asset without telling the owner of the business. I just can’t buy that. So that just leaves option B - they don’t care, in which case, why bother?

At best it’s neglect. At worst it’s corruption. Wherever this sits on a sliding scale between neglect and corruption, the management, board and owners all need to go. 

Yes, it will have been sold to them by Tesco and fluffed up as best for footballing reasons whilst pocketing a few quid at rhe same.time, consolidating staff roles and getting rid of a few....Mogadon and his mate will have got rhe nod

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Sparks Rover said:

No they aren't, both play in the middle.  We miss that biting midfielder to compliment Travis and Rothwell, so it is a viable question to pose.   No need for a personal dig my friend.  Only a message board and it's only a question of which youngster is better....

I certainly don't mean a personal dig, I like to think we can have a jest at each other. Apologies. Garrett and Buckley don't play in the same position, and aren't in any way playing the same role. How can they be compared?

[Sparks Rover]

Just now, JoeH said:

None of this in any way relates to the topic of the conversation though? We're talking about Venky's willingness to spend money and I think there's far too much evidence of them throwing money at Rovers to suggest that they've suddenly turned off the tap for no explained reason.

Yep, I believe a new manager comes in and they'll go for it again...there's money but just misguided to feck.

[J*B]

1 minute ago, JoeH said:

None of this in any way relates to the topic of the conversation though? We're talking about Venky's willingness to spend money and I think there's far too much evidence of them throwing money at Rovers to suggest that they've suddenly turned off the tap for no explained reason.

It absolutely does relate to spending money though - because if they ARE aware of the financial issues, they would be able to solve at least some of them without having any effect on FFP whatsoever. 

“You want to sell the training ground to raise funds? We can’t do that, find us another way in which we can invest without suggesting this.”

[Guest]

Just now, Sparks Rover said:

Yep, I believe a new manager comes in and they'll go for it again...there's money but just misguided to feck.

There's always been money. I don't think they've suddenly turned off the tap. I think we're close to failing FFP so we've self-embargoed. They forked out on Brereton, they forked out on Gallagher, they keep pumping in the funds and converting loans to shares and whatnot. The evidence suggests they're happy to keep throwing money into the bottomless pit. Next summer, with the FFP wiggle room, I expect they'll give whoever replaces Mowbray a few million at least to spend.

[Sparks Rover]

4 minutes ago, JoeH said:

I certainly don't mean a personal dig, I like to think we can have a jest at each other. Apologies. Garrett and Buckley don't play in the same position, and aren't in any way playing the same role. How can they be compared?

I see them both as central midfielders so in my view they are competing for a place.

Garret looks to have a definition to his game, a destroyer, breaks things up, likes a tackle.  Buckley doesn't do that nor does he score goals or really have much attacking play to his game.....my view is that the midfield would look more balanced with a water carrier like Garret, or one like him than Buckley who doesn't really give much either way.  To say they don't play in the same position  is just trying to be clever.

Edited August 5, 2021 by Sparks Rover

[Guest]

1 minute ago, J*B said:

It absolutely does relate to spending money though - because if they ARE aware of the financial issues, they would be able to solve at least some of them without having any effect on FFP whatsoever. 

How can the Venkys pump more money in without us failing FFP? There's not many ways of fiddling anymore that don't see you end up in Derby County's situation, with the EFL royally forking you at every turn.

[Guest]

Just now, Sparks Rover said:

I see them both as central midfielders so in my view they are competing for a place.

 

But they're not competing for a place? Garrett, Travis, Davenport, Johnson are competing - Buckley, Rothwell, Dack are competing for a different place. 

[Sparks Rover]

1 minute ago, JoeH said:

How can the Venkys pump more money in without us failing FFP? There's not many ways of fiddling anymore that don't see you end up in Derby County's situation, with the EFL royally forking you at every turn.

The Venky Arena

[Sparks Rover]

1 minute ago, JoeH said:

But they're not competing for a place? Garrett, Travis, Davenport, Johnson are competing - Buckley, Rothwell, Dack are competing for a different place. 

Buckley isn't an attacking midfielder,  well not a good one....hardly any goals or shots or assists in his career....the goals he scored are fluke and there's only a couple altogether. 🤷‍♂️

Edited August 5, 2021 by Sparks Rover

[Exiled in Toronto]

3 minutes ago, Sparks Rover said:

I see them both as central midfielders so in my view they are competing for a place.

Garret looks to have a definition to his game, a destroyer, breaks things up, likes a tackle.  Buckley doesn't do that nor does he score goals or really have much attacking play to his game.....my view is that the midfield would look more balanced with a water carrier like Garret, or one like him than Buckley who doesn't really give much either way.  To say they don't play in the same position  is just trying to be clever.

As were Dunny and The Axe?

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Sparks Rover said:

The Venky Arena

Could you imagine 🤣 "this was a difficult decision but it allowed us to get Adam Idah over the line".

[roversfan99]

30 minutes ago, JoeH said:

Doesn't work that way. Squad numbers given to those with minutes last season & then the goalkeepers. Just a blanket policy to avoid upsetting anyone. Hence why Carter gets one and Pike doesn't.

I may be wrong but I think Pike had the number 40 last season, and was in a matchday squad against Birmingham. Vale has also had a squad number before.

[Sparks Rover]

Just now, Exiled in Toronto said:

As were Dunny and The Axe?

Again, Dunny was always a defined midfielder,attacking going at player....you just can't compare Buckley, he doesn't do that....neither does he do what the axe did....

[roversfan99]

Just now, JoeH said:

Could you imagine 🤣 "this was a difficult decision but it allowed us to get Adam Idah over the line".

I bet many would still defend it!

Also, you mention throwing money in to offset the debt. Essentially that is just them not putting in the correct care and effort into one of their businesses to make it as efficient as possible, hence the avoidably large losses they make.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Sparks Rover said:

Buckley isn't an attacking midfielder,  well not a good one....hardly any goals or shots or assists in his career....the goals he scored are fluke and there's only a couple altogether. 🤷‍♂️

He's not a goalscorer, I'll grant you that. He's a playmaker. He's a great passer of the ball. He works in the right system and won't play every week because not every game fits what he offers you. Which is fair. I don't group Rothwell, Dack and Buckley because they're attacking, but more because they're the midfielders we look to for creation. I group Garrett, Travis, Davenport and Johnson because they're the midfielders you look to for aggression, playing deeper, breaking up play.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, roversfan99 said:

I may be wrong but I think Pike had the number 40 last season, and was in a matchday squad against Birmingham. Vale has also had a squad number before.

Neither played minutes last year though. I'm 90% sure that's how it has worked over the years.

[Sparks Rover]

Just now, JoeH said:

He's not a goalscorer, I'll grant you that. He's a playmaker. He's a great passer of the ball. He works in the right system and won't play every week because not every game fits what he offers you. Which is fair. I don't group Rothwell, Dack and Buckley because they're attacking, but more because they're the midfielders we look to for creation. I group Garrett, Travis, Davenport and Johnson because they're the midfielders you look to for aggression, playing deeper, breaking up play.

He has touches here and there...he's never set up a goal directly in the championship from what I can remember....too many young lads getting free passes.  Very passive

[LDRover]

33 minutes ago, JoeH said:

Doesn't work that way. Squad numbers given to those with minutes last season & then the goalkeepers. Just a blanket policy to avoid upsetting anyone. Hence why Carter gets one and Pike doesn't.

Butterworth?

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Sparks Rover said:

He has touches here and there...he's never set up a goal directly in the championship from what I can remember....too many young lads getting free passes.  Very passive

You're remembering wrong. 1:56 onwards https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1hC5BphPzE

Edited August 5, 2021 by JoeH

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, LDRover said:

Butterworth?

Been 1st team for a while. Just had the injury sadly. Got a proper squad number the year before last because he'd had minutes against Bolton in the Champ. 

[Sparks Rover]

2 minutes ago, JoeH said:

You're remembering wrong

I'm sure there will be one