Summer transfer window 2021.

[lraC]

2 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Not sure where is best to put this, but Stewart Downing has a double part podcast with undr the cosh available on spotify.

Only within the last 10 minutes in the second episode does it mention us really, going back to when a pre-agreed contract offer was pulled 10 days before the season was pulled by the owners due to budgetary issues, Mowbray was embarrassed and frustrated to make the call apparently. Our owners pulling the rug out from under people again. Badly advised?

Just the same really as Warnock being lined up, as manager and then Coyle appointed at the last minute. The unstable nature of the club and the farcical nature, in which the owners make their decisions, go hand in hand.

Do not be too surprised if Mowbray is given a new contract at the last minute, if the owners realise, that paying someone who could manage the club and move us forward costs more than they are willing to pay.

The £20 million they supposedly pump in every year, may as well be donated to the local Indian children's home, as it will do more good there, than it ever will throwing it away at our club every year.

[Blue blood]

On 19/10/2021 at 19:41, chaddyrovers said:

We are only 5 loans in the match day squad. 

We can replace these players with similar quality players but for we need a new manager who can get them more consistence from them, fresh ideas and is tactical awareness. Someone like Gareth Ainsworth would be ideal for me, John Park running the recruitment side and finding these quality players on low fees, frees and loans

Erm no we can't. We can't pay the going rate for them when they are known and don't cost us a transfer fee, so the idea we can replace them with similar quality with the barriers of finance and locating them is implausible in the extreme. 

[chaddyrovers]

3 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Not sure where is best to put this, but Stewart Downing has a double part podcast with undr the cosh available on spotify.

Only within the last 10 minutes in the second episode does it mention us really, going back to when a pre-agreed contract offer was pulled 10 days before the season was pulled by the owners due to budgetary issues, Mowbray was embarrassed and frustrated to make the call apparently. Our owners pulling the rug out from under people again. Badly advised?

Did he say it was pulled the club owners cos I'm sure on a different podcast/interview he said it was Mowbray and Waggott over budget reasons cos we needed defensive signings first. 

But re-signing Downing for another season was a waste on money.

Edited October 21, 2021 by chaddyrovers

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, islander200 said:

He didn't play Downing anyway, more money wasted on Mowbrays recommendations

Not the point that I was making, which was that whilst Venkys are here, we will constantly be plagued by this sort of shit that has been here ever since they arrived. We can never thrive with them, as we will see at the end of the season when our best players leave.

Downing was excellent in his first season, so his recommendation in this instance overall was a wise one. He was always playing catch up without a pre season especially at his age, and he was only signed due to unavailability issues according to Downing himself in the second year.

32 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Did he say it was pulled the club owners cos I'm sure on a different podcast/interview he said it was Mowbray and Waggott over budget reasons cos we needed defensive signings first. 

But re-signing Downing for another season was a waste on money.

It was budgetary issues, but Downing was under the impression that the rug had been pulled out from Mowbray after a contract had been agreed prior.

Take a listen on spotify. Undr the Cosh, last 10 minutes of Part 2.

[islander200]

42 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Not the point that I was making, which was that whilst Venkys are here, we will constantly be plagued by this sort of shit that has been here ever since they arrived. We can never thrive with them, as we will see at the end of the season when our best players leave.

Downing was excellent in his first season, so his recommendation in this instance overall was a wise one. He was always playing catch up without a pre season especially at his age, and he was only signed due to unavailability issues according to Downing himself in the second year.

It was budgetary issues, but Downing was under the impression that the rug had been pulled out from Mowbray after a contract had been agreed prior.

Take a listen on spotify. Undr the Cosh, last 10 minutes of Part 2.

Mowbray brought 11 players to the club that summer.Pickering made it 12 in January.Up until this summer Mowbray can have absolutely no complaints over the backing he received.

Everybody knows the owners are a major problem, but you continue to suggest that Mowbray is working under terrible conditions and is hamstrung by budgets etc when the facts are up until this summer he was backed well and wasn't forced to sell a single player in that time, you won't find many managers with that backing in this division.

And as shown it would have been sensible if the owners kept to that and refused the signing of Downing.He hardly ever played.Mowbray seems to love paying people for nothing.Maybe Mulgrew needed help handing the bibs out before his move to Fleetwood 

Read chaddys post below direct quotes.Do you think Mowbray should have an unlimited budget?

 

Edited October 21, 2021 by islander200

[chaddyrovers]

51 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Downing was excellent in his first season, so his recommendation in this instance overall was a wise one. He was always playing catch up without a pre season especially at his age, and he was only signed due to unavailability issues according to Downing himself in the second year.

He was good but excellent is abit far fetch for me. After football return after the first lockdown Rovers were poor as team and Downing was part of it. 

Given that he had no proper pre-season under him he was always playing catch up and likely to be bit part player sadly. 

51 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

It was budgetary issues, but Downing was under the impression that the rug had been pulled out from Mowbray after a contract had been agreed prior.

Take a listen on spotify. Undr the Cosh, last 10 minutes of Part 2.

Here is his quote from the interview 

But the end of the campaign, with a new contract agreed, brought what the player describes as an embarrassing situation.

"First year I played nearly every game. We had a lot of injuries and I was playing everywhere and loving it. I felt fit, I didn’t feel I was 36," added Downing.

"Come the end of the season we agreed that we would get an extension. And then Covid had hit and we had 10 days before we were going back and I was waiting for the paperwork to come through to sign and they rang me and said that deal is getting pulled.

"It was 'we only have a certain amount of budget and I need six or seven players in and you are 37', an afterthought, and I need young players in.

"I don’t think it was Mogga, he said to me ‘I am actually embarrassed to make the phone call because they have made the decision but I have to do the phone call.'

"He could tell I was p****d off and I said ‘no s***, I have been keeping myself fit all summer and 10 days to go you are telling me there is no deal.’

 

Also @roversfan99can I just add the Mowbray has been financially backed by the owners in terms of transfer fees, loan deals and free transfers more then enough during the first 3 seasons in Championship to get us top 6 if not promote. You act like he hasn't been backed with any cash. Yes this summer he has the wage budget cut and to make do with few loan signings and 1 small cash signing. But he cannot complain one bit for me. Tho not sure the loan signings of Clarkson, Poveda and Van Hecke was correctly and will prove to be good signings tho let's hope they prove me wrong. Maybe we better signing Williams from Liverpool(on loan at Swansea), Molumby from Brighton(loan at WBA) and then right winger type. But Mowbray selected the players we signed. No one forced him to sign these players. Maybe if Mowbray had spent the money he was given in the first 2 seasons much better and spending on the squad not just 2 players we would maybe in a better position financially 

Edited October 21, 2021 by chaddyrovers

[roversfan99]

6 minutes ago, islander200 said:

Mowbray brought 11 players to the club that summer.Pickering made it 12 in January.Up until this summer Mowbray can have absolutely no complaints over the backing he received.

Everybody knows the owners are a major problem, but you continue to suggest that Mowbray is working under terrible conditions and is hamstrung by budgets etc when the facts are up until this summer he was backed well and wasn't forced to sell a single player in that time, you won't find many managers with that backing in this division.

And as shown it would have been sensible if the owners kept to that and refused the signing of Downing.He hardly ever played.Mowbray seems to love paying people for nothing.Maybe Mulgrew needed help handing the bibs out before his move to Fleetwood

The owners are not a major problem, they are THE major problem.

My post was not a defence of Mowbray, it was in fact nothing specifically to do with him. It is a reiteration that the wankers that own our club are continuing to and will continue to hinder this club as long as they own us.

I keep repeatedly stating that I want a change of manager, but ultimately the aforementioned owners lack the active interest in the club once described as "their baby" to make such a decision.

[islander200]

22 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

The owners are not a major problem, they are THE major problem.

My post was not a defence of Mowbray, it was in fact nothing specifically to do with him. It is a reiteration that the wankers that own our club are continuing to and will continue to hinder this club as long as they own us.

I keep repeatedly stating that I want a change of manager, but ultimately the aforementioned owners lack the active interest in the club once described as "their baby" to make such a decision.

I don't see how they let Mowbray down last summer(which is what your initial post was making out) when brought 11 players to the club including Downing.

With the money he had made available to him and not being being forced to sell players the squad should be in a lot better position than it is, that is on Mowbray and the people on the ground regardless of how shit our owners are.

[roversfan99]

15 minutes ago, islander200 said:

I don't see how they let Mowbray down last summer(which is what your initial post was making out) when brought 11 players to the club including Downing.

With the money he had made available to him and not being being forced to sell players the squad should be in a lot better position than it is, that is on Mowbray and the people on the ground regardless of how shit our owners are.

My point was not relevant or specific to Mowbray, solely to do with how badly our club has been and is continuing to be run.

[islander200]

11 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

My point was not relevant or specific to Mowbray, solely to do with how badly our club has been and is continuing to be run.

The owners don't care about us and know nothing about football.Mowbray was given a budget last summer , a budget that allowed him to bring in 11 players so it wasn't the Venkys saying "no you can't sign Downing" it was his decision to not pursue it at the time because like the quotes Chaddy posted tells us he wanted 6 or 7 in beforehand.

[Southside Rover]

I don't think Downing comes out of it with much credibility.

No one else signed him after his first season so the fact we gave him something when no one fancied it is a bit rum to complain in my opinion. Not like he was turning up for free?

A professional footballer not retired doesn't train for 4 weeks? Says more about him than us. I get it must be hard and demoralising but as a free agent you've got to prove yourself. With that attitude I'm not surprised he didn't get a chance. Everyone knows, until its signed anything can happen so yes it wasn't handled in the best way but that's the life of a footballer. Happens in our every day lives as well whether it be work, moving house etc.

I also think he misses the point about his mate Mogga, he picks the team and didn't play him so why all the comments about the owners.

Given all of Moggas lies and twisting of words we've seen through many interviews, I would wonder if this was the owners or good honourable Tony just not able to do the honourable thing....again.

[Fraserkirky]

Martin Boyle, pacy right winger from Hibs, Australian international. 
 

Should be top of our January target list

[bluebruce]

On 22/10/2021 at 00:49, Southside Rover said:

I don't think Downing comes out of it with much credibility.

No one else signed him after his first season so the fact we gave him something when no one fancied it is a bit rum to complain in my opinion. Not like he was turning up for free?

A professional footballer not retired doesn't train for 4 weeks? Says more about him than us. I get it must be hard and demoralising but as a free agent you've got to prove yourself. With that attitude I'm not surprised he didn't get a chance. Everyone knows, until its signed anything can happen so yes it wasn't handled in the best way but that's the life of a footballer. Happens in our every day lives as well whether it be work, moving house etc.

I also think he misses the point about his mate Mogga, he picks the team and didn't play him so why all the comments about the owners.

Given all of Moggas lies and twisting of words we've seen through many interviews, I would wonder if this was the owners or good honourable Tony just not able to do the honourable thing....again.

Agreed. We handled the situation a bit sloppily, but he still got his contract in the end, and earned, for very little work and little benefit to the club, an amount that would probably take me a bare minimum of 10 years to earn, probably a lot more. Boo fucking hoo.

[rigger]

1 hour ago, Fraserkirky said:

Martin Boyle, pacy right winger from Hibs, Australian international. 
 

Should be top of our January target list

Mowbray doesn't play with wingers

[47er]

8 minutes ago, rigger said:

Mowbray doesn't play with wingers

or formations!

[Bigdoggsteel]

On 21/10/2021 at 20:13, islander200 said:

The owners don't care about us and know nothing about football.Mowbray was given a budget last summer , a budget that allowed him to bring in 11 players so it wasn't the Venkys saying "no you can't sign Downing" it was his decision to not pursue it at the time because like the quotes Chaddy posted tells us he wanted 6 or 7 in beforehand.

So Mowbrays budget for transfers includes re-signing our own players to deals you reckon? I would think that would be seperate for managers really. I have heard a lot say they don't deal with that side of things, including Mowbray himself. 

[islander200]

4 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

So Mowbrays budget for transfers includes re-signing our own players to deals you reckon? I would think that would be seperate for managers really. I have heard a lot say they don't deal with that side of things, including Mowbray himself. 

Our owners are over in india and id be surprised if they take much interest in what is happening over here unless absolute neccessity.I dont see how he can get lucrative deals for some but none for others.In agreement this summer funding has been cut back but you dont let your players get to one year left.

There was enough money wasted last summer to have at least got Nyambe done.

Offers on contracts should have been pushed harder by the manager and if they didnt sign them or the owners wouldnt pay them what they wanted then you recommend that they be sold  and get as much as you can and replace them.Lenihen would have got a few quid with 2 years left.

Venkys are not footballing people.Mowbray repeatedly said he had told the owners his "plan" that we are on a "journey" etc

 

 

 

[Bigdoggsteel]

10 hours ago, islander200 said:

Our owners are over in india and id be surprised if they take much interest in what is happening over here unless absolute neccessity.I dont see how he can get lucrative deals for some but none for others.In agreement this summer funding has been cut back but you dont let your players get to one year left.

There was enough money wasted last summer to have at least got Nyambe done.

Offers on contracts should have been pushed harder by the manager and if they didnt sign them or the owners wouldnt pay them what they wanted then you recommend that they be sold  and get as much as you can and replace them.Lenihen would have got a few quid with 2 years left.

Venkys are not footballing people.Mowbray repeatedly said he had told the owners his "plan" that we are on a "journey" etc

 

 

 

I think you are overplaying Mowbrays role in contract negotiations and the budget for said contracts. It's between the players agents and someone else at the club 

[islander200]

8 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I think you are overplaying Mowbrays role in contract negotiations and the budget for said contracts. It's between the players agents and someone else at the club 

The manager still makes recommendations over who gets a new deal.Im not suggesting he crunches the numbers.

My point is offers should have been made to the players with two years left last summer.If a deal couldnt be done then you look to move them on and replace them.

Not let their contracts run down and then moan about it when they only have a year left and hold all the cards.

Who else other than Mowbray would have recommended  lenghty deals for Smallwood and Bennett?

Edited October 28, 2021 by islander200

[unleaded]

Mowbray Giving his pals son Pears a 4 year contract doesn’t help ! Venkys are half asleep as well as is there man on the ground …. History repeating itself …. 

[Sparks Rover]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I think you are overplaying Mowbrays role in contract negotiations and the budget for said contracts. It's between the players agents and someone else at the club 

Mowbray talks money with prospective players.

[Bigdoggsteel]

2 hours ago, islander200 said:

The manager still makes recommendations over who gets a new deal.Im not suggesting he crunches the numbers.

My point is offers should have been made to the players with two years left last summer.If a deal couldnt be done then you look to move them on and replace them.

Not let their contracts run down and then moan about it when they only have a year left and hold all the cards.

Who else other than Mowbray would have recommended  lenghty deals for Smallwood and Bennett?

And you think he didn't recommend Nyambe , Lenihan and Rothwell should have been offered new deals? Bennett and Smallwood would have been on peanuts, so that's why they were easier to sort out. 

If the deals couldn't be done "we move on and replace them?" Yes, in an ideal world, but you have surely noticed that he hasn't been given money in the last few windows, even when we sold Armstrong. So there is no guarantee he would have been given the money from the sales of Nyambe, Lenihan and Rothwell and we would have ended up in a weaker position on the field. 

As I said, the issue on finances runs above Mowbrays head. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

56 minutes ago, Sparks Rover said:

Mowbray talks money with prospective players.

Roughly I would imagine. He doesn't deal with agents as far as I understand , when it comes to getting down to the contracts proper. 

[islander200]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

And you think he didn't recommend Nyambe , Lenihan and Rothwell should have been offered new deals? Bennett and Smallwood would have been on peanuts, so that's why they were easier to sort out. 

If the deals couldn't be done "we move on and replace them?" Yes, in an ideal world, but you have surely noticed that he hasn't been given money in the last few windows, even when we sold Armstrong. So there is no guarantee he would have been given the money from the sales of Nyambe, Lenihan and Rothwell and we would have ended up in a weaker position on the field. 

As I said, the issue on finances runs above Mowbrays head. 

Bennett wouldnt have been om peanuts at all.If you want to believe that Ryan Nyambe wouldnt have been happy with the money Bennett was on ,then thats up to you.

You will have noticed we COULDNT spend the Armstrong money due to ffp.

Like i said he has brought in absolutely loads of players in his time here.Would you have me believe he doesnt speak to the players about their contract situation?

He brought in 12 players last season 

 

[Gone to seed]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Roughly I would imagine. He doesn't deal with agents as far as I understand , when it comes to getting down to the contracts proper. 

Aye, so who does provide oversight on these contracts, as part of the fiduciary duty required in running a business in the UK (it's a legal requirement ya know)?